Reminder: Apple says it's only streaming 4K iTunes movies, not offering downloads

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 51
    tmay said:
    jbdragon said:
    If you paid for the 1080P, Blu=Ray version of movies, and get 4K upgrade of them for FREE, STOP COMPLAINING!!!!

    Right now, I don't get a crap about 4K. I don't have a 4K TV. Really though, most people that have a 4K TV, they're too small. They may have already had a too small 1080P HDTV, then Upgraded to a 4K TV of the same size, when it really should be even larger than that 1080P TV, that was already to small.

    That's the thing, if you're around 8 feet from the screen, you should be looking at, at least a 80-90" 4K TV!!! You do what to see the better resolution you're paying for right? That is really the problem with 4K. What people will notice far more is HDR. (High Dynamic Range) I know you think that size 4K TV is crazy and HUGE, but not really!!! At 8 feet, 65" is the bare minimum of size you would need for 4K!!! This is one of the reasons why Streaming is so popular. because the quality of the stream is so much lower than from a Blu-Ray Disc, that HD streaming looked just fine to people because of having to small of a HDTV. Hell you could watch a DVD and it would look just fine. Because that's about the quality you're streaming. Same goes with 4K. It's not Ultra Blu-Ray Disc quality, but people can't tell, because the TV's are way to small for the distance they sit. They can't see the better detail anyway.

    https://www.tekrevue.com/tv-screen-size-calculator/

    Myself, I've never been a fan of buying Digital copy's because of DRM (Digital Rights Management) and all the limitations it comes with. It also rarely cheaper than a Disc. So I buy my movies on DISC, and then RIP them into a Digital format myself and then put it on my NAS where I can stream it anywhere in my house using PLEX to my AppleTV locally, or even away from house on my iPad. It's like my own personal Netflix type service. I rip DVD's in the past, but I can RIP Blue-Ray's just as easily. I haven't gotten into 4K. So I don't know if I can do those or not?!?!

    I buy all my movies in 4K for around $5-$10. Just bought the new Thor movie in 4K for $10, which is only 4K on Vudu and not iTunes. 
    I just checked Vudu's pricing on the Thor: Ragnarok and it's quite a bit higher than you state, but it is listed as available in UHD for $24.99.

    Apple doesn't have Thor: Ragnarok listed in 4k, again, as you state, but available 4K HDR movies are typically $19.99 or less.
    There are more places to buy digital codes than Vudu or iTunes. Pretty big market of people buying and selling digital codes. 
    ah.  Yeah, I don't think grey market, technically illegal sales are the best way to quote prices for something.  
    tmay
  • Reply 42 of 51
    linkmanlinkman Posts: 1,040member
    tmay said:
    jbdragon said:
    If you paid for the 1080P, Blu=Ray version of movies, and get 4K upgrade of them for FREE, STOP COMPLAINING!!!!

    Right now, I don't get a crap about 4K. I don't have a 4K TV. Really though, most people that have a 4K TV, they're too small. They may have already had a too small 1080P HDTV, then Upgraded to a 4K TV of the same size, when it really should be even larger than that 1080P TV, that was already to small.

    That's the thing, if you're around 8 feet from the screen, you should be looking at, at least a 80-90" 4K TV!!! You do what to see the better resolution you're paying for right? That is really the problem with 4K. What people will notice far more is HDR. (High Dynamic Range) I know you think that size 4K TV is crazy and HUGE, but not really!!! At 8 feet, 65" is the bare minimum of size you would need for 4K!!! This is one of the reasons why Streaming is so popular. because the quality of the stream is so much lower than from a Blu-Ray Disc, that HD streaming looked just fine to people because of having to small of a HDTV. Hell you could watch a DVD and it would look just fine. Because that's about the quality you're streaming. Same goes with 4K. It's not Ultra Blu-Ray Disc quality, but people can't tell, because the TV's are way to small for the distance they sit. They can't see the better detail anyway.

    https://www.tekrevue.com/tv-screen-size-calculator/

    Myself, I've never been a fan of buying Digital copy's because of DRM (Digital Rights Management) and all the limitations it comes with. It also rarely cheaper than a Disc. So I buy my movies on DISC, and then RIP them into a Digital format myself and then put it on my NAS where I can stream it anywhere in my house using PLEX to my AppleTV locally, or even away from house on my iPad. It's like my own personal Netflix type service. I rip DVD's in the past, but I can RIP Blue-Ray's just as easily. I haven't gotten into 4K. So I don't know if I can do those or not?!?!

    I buy all my movies in 4K for around $5-$10. Just bought the new Thor movie in 4K for $10, which is only 4K on Vudu and not iTunes. 
    Really?  Whenever I look at buying movies online the new releases are consistently $20.  The only movies available for $5 are random oldies during very occasional sales.  Where can you buy Ragnarok for $10?  I think it only came out in any format within the past week or two.
    He's talking about the download codes that are included in the boxed dvd's and BD's. Redbox is selling those as well, and Disney is none to happy!

    Might be some fine print that limits this to the original owner in possession of the disk.
    I think the cheap ones that sirlance99 refers to are through forums, Craigslist, etc. There is some risk in dealing with those sellers and buyers however. I'll bet that the licensing terms does restrict the download to whomever owns the disk. It's probably a legal quagmire as to if/when you sell off the discs because you can't transfer ownership of the online version.
  • Reply 43 of 51
    In regards to Apple transitioning their movie and TV Show files to H.265, while new content is likely in both, for older content, it's likely to take a while for the conversion to happen.  I'm betting that they will roll out H.265 iTunes Store wide, maybe this year, but more likely next year or the following year.  Apple has been putting the pieces into place, with introducing widespread H.265 support in iOS and MacOS, plus the hardware support in almost all of it's hardware, with the one exception being the current iPad Mini.  With that likely to either be replaced with a new version, or retired entirely, the entire hardware lineup for Apple would support H.265 in hardware. 

    At that point, the only thing holding back widespread support in the iTunes Store would be the content that is still H.264.  Please note, this is for SD and HD content, not UHD content.  While I could see them eventually okay streaming UHD on Kaby Lake+ Macs, I don't think they'll be supporting downloading UHD iTunes content for a while.  Honestly, I expect them to roll out UHD TV Shows before they do downloading UHD iTunes content.
  • Reply 44 of 51
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Interesting deception upon Apples part!

    What bothers me the most here is that these managers in California believe that everybody has access to 25MBPS bandwidth.   We dont and frankly many of us never will have that sort of download speed.  Downloadable files are the only solution to reliable playback on slow networks. 

    As for the speculation of why no 4k downloads i doubt we have tge truth there yet.  Studios could be a factor but the network operators could also be a factor.  Beyond that not all content is restricted by the studios so why isnt such downloadable?    

    Sadly these policies seemly encourage the very thing that apparentky so frightens the excutives in California.  
  • Reply 45 of 51
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 3,966member
    sflocal said:
    So we "sort of" get an upgrade to 4K.   Streaming only sounds nice but I've already exceeded my Comcast Terabyte cap like 4 times.  4K isn't going to make this cap any harder to hit.  

    Also it's not the most carbon friendly approach.   Content Distribution Networks are fueled by datacenters which are often "fueled" by energy sources that aren't so clean.  I'm a bit dismayed that a company that prides itself on not using non-recyclable materials is promoting a carbon unfriendly approach to video video disty. 

    I'm going to pick up a Nvidia Shield TV and see how that works along with a ATV 4K.   I'm feeling too constrained with streamers and this "Just stream everything" when my fastest network at home is my LAN. 

    So people buy the movie on DVD, and now that it's out on Blue-Ray, they magically expect the studios to give it to them for free?  There is nothing to read here.

    I'm not sure I buy the carbon footprint here... it's much less than the old days of stamping-out a billion DVD's on plastic, and VHS videotapes back in the day.  You're watching the 4K movie either on your TV, or computer, or both... so you're burning electricity either way, and the datacenter still remain on and running whether people stream movies or not.
    https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions

    The generation of Electricity in its entirety contributes more carbon than our vehicle emissions.  Data centers are getting cleaner thanks to solar and hydroelectric. The first thing I do in every new home is replace low efficiency appliances and lighting. The wife and I are looking at Solar for our roof. 

    Our children have to clean up the trash the former generation leaves. I’m trying to keep that mess as small as possible 
    This is off topic, but replacing your appliances before the end of their useful life actually wastes resources. Not only do you have to pay for the appliances, but there are resources and energy expended to produce them, along with their requisite contributions to pollution. If you need a new refrigerator or dishwasher, look for an efficient model, but if your refrigerator is only 3 years old you're better off waiting to replace it until it's necessary.
    randominternetperson
  • Reply 46 of 51
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 6,899administrator
    wizard69 said:
    Interesting deception upon Apples part!

    What bothers me the most here is that these managers in California believe that everybody has access to 25MBPS bandwidth.   We dont and frankly many of us never will have that sort of download speed.  Downloadable files are the only solution to reliable playback on slow networks. 

    As for the speculation of why no 4k downloads i doubt we have tge truth there yet.  Studios could be a factor but the network operators could also be a factor.  Beyond that not all content is restricted by the studios so why isnt such downloadable?    

    Sadly these policies seemly encourage the very thing that apparentky so frightens the excutives in California.  
    As a point of fact, the FCC considers 25/3 broadband to be the minimum spec to actually qualify as such. And, it's also decided that wireless doesn't count as broadband for an assortment of reasons.
  • Reply 47 of 51
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,441member
    MplsP said:
    sflocal said:
    So we "sort of" get an upgrade to 4K.   Streaming only sounds nice but I've already exceeded my Comcast Terabyte cap like 4 times.  4K isn't going to make this cap any harder to hit.  

    Also it's not the most carbon friendly approach.   Content Distribution Networks are fueled by datacenters which are often "fueled" by energy sources that aren't so clean.  I'm a bit dismayed that a company that prides itself on not using non-recyclable materials is promoting a carbon unfriendly approach to video video disty. 

    I'm going to pick up a Nvidia Shield TV and see how that works along with a ATV 4K.   I'm feeling too constrained with streamers and this "Just stream everything" when my fastest network at home is my LAN. 

    So people buy the movie on DVD, and now that it's out on Blue-Ray, they magically expect the studios to give it to them for free?  There is nothing to read here.

    I'm not sure I buy the carbon footprint here... it's much less than the old days of stamping-out a billion DVD's on plastic, and VHS videotapes back in the day.  You're watching the 4K movie either on your TV, or computer, or both... so you're burning electricity either way, and the datacenter still remain on and running whether people stream movies or not.
    https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions

    The generation of Electricity in its entirety contributes more carbon than our vehicle emissions.  Data centers are getting cleaner thanks to solar and hydroelectric. The first thing I do in every new home is replace low efficiency appliances and lighting. The wife and I are looking at Solar for our roof. 

    Our children have to clean up the trash the former generation leaves. I’m trying to keep that mess as small as possible 
    This is off topic, but replacing your appliances before the end of their useful life actually wastes resources. Not only do you have to pay for the appliances, but there are resources and energy expended to produce them, along with their requisite contributions to pollution. If you need a new refrigerator or dishwasher, look for an efficient model, but if your refrigerator is only 3 years old you're better off waiting to replace it until it's necessary.
    There's a continuing market for used, good condition, but "inefficient" appliances, so upgrading doesn't necessarily mean that the used one gets tossed.
  • Reply 48 of 51
    tmay said:
    MplsP said:
    sflocal said:
    So we "sort of" get an upgrade to 4K.   Streaming only sounds nice but I've already exceeded my Comcast Terabyte cap like 4 times.  4K isn't going to make this cap any harder to hit.  

    Also it's not the most carbon friendly approach.   Content Distribution Networks are fueled by datacenters which are often "fueled" by energy sources that aren't so clean.  I'm a bit dismayed that a company that prides itself on not using non-recyclable materials is promoting a carbon unfriendly approach to video video disty. 

    I'm going to pick up a Nvidia Shield TV and see how that works along with a ATV 4K.   I'm feeling too constrained with streamers and this "Just stream everything" when my fastest network at home is my LAN. 

    So people buy the movie on DVD, and now that it's out on Blue-Ray, they magically expect the studios to give it to them for free?  There is nothing to read here.

    I'm not sure I buy the carbon footprint here... it's much less than the old days of stamping-out a billion DVD's on plastic, and VHS videotapes back in the day.  You're watching the 4K movie either on your TV, or computer, or both... so you're burning electricity either way, and the datacenter still remain on and running whether people stream movies or not.
    https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions

    The generation of Electricity in its entirety contributes more carbon than our vehicle emissions.  Data centers are getting cleaner thanks to solar and hydroelectric. The first thing I do in every new home is replace low efficiency appliances and lighting. The wife and I are looking at Solar for our roof. 

    Our children have to clean up the trash the former generation leaves. I’m trying to keep that mess as small as possible 
    This is off topic, but replacing your appliances before the end of their useful life actually wastes resources. Not only do you have to pay for the appliances, but there are resources and energy expended to produce them, along with their requisite contributions to pollution. If you need a new refrigerator or dishwasher, look for an efficient model, but if your refrigerator is only 3 years old you're better off waiting to replace it until it's necessary.
    There's a continuing market for used, good condition, but "inefficient" appliances, so upgrading doesn't necessarily mean that the used one gets tossed.
    If someone else is using your old appliance I can’t see how that’s saving the planet. 
  • Reply 49 of 51
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,441member
    tmay said:
    MplsP said:
    sflocal said:
    So we "sort of" get an upgrade to 4K.   Streaming only sounds nice but I've already exceeded my Comcast Terabyte cap like 4 times.  4K isn't going to make this cap any harder to hit.  

    Also it's not the most carbon friendly approach.   Content Distribution Networks are fueled by datacenters which are often "fueled" by energy sources that aren't so clean.  I'm a bit dismayed that a company that prides itself on not using non-recyclable materials is promoting a carbon unfriendly approach to video video disty. 

    I'm going to pick up a Nvidia Shield TV and see how that works along with a ATV 4K.   I'm feeling too constrained with streamers and this "Just stream everything" when my fastest network at home is my LAN. 

    So people buy the movie on DVD, and now that it's out on Blue-Ray, they magically expect the studios to give it to them for free?  There is nothing to read here.

    I'm not sure I buy the carbon footprint here... it's much less than the old days of stamping-out a billion DVD's on plastic, and VHS videotapes back in the day.  You're watching the 4K movie either on your TV, or computer, or both... so you're burning electricity either way, and the datacenter still remain on and running whether people stream movies or not.
    https://www.epa.gov/ghgemissions/sources-greenhouse-gas-emissions

    The generation of Electricity in its entirety contributes more carbon than our vehicle emissions.  Data centers are getting cleaner thanks to solar and hydroelectric. The first thing I do in every new home is replace low efficiency appliances and lighting. The wife and I are looking at Solar for our roof. 

    Our children have to clean up the trash the former generation leaves. I’m trying to keep that mess as small as possible 
    This is off topic, but replacing your appliances before the end of their useful life actually wastes resources. Not only do you have to pay for the appliances, but there are resources and energy expended to produce them, along with their requisite contributions to pollution. If you need a new refrigerator or dishwasher, look for an efficient model, but if your refrigerator is only 3 years old you're better off waiting to replace it until it's necessary.
    There's a continuing market for used, good condition, but "inefficient" appliances, so upgrading doesn't necessarily mean that the used one gets tossed.
    If someone else is using your old appliance I can’t see how that’s saving the planet. 
    Lots of people don't have the money for a new refrigerator when their's craps out, so they buy a used one for $0.05 on the dollar. Economic reality outweighs good stewardship of the planet. 
    GG1muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 50 of 51
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,217member
    pujones1 said:
    Is this download restriction limited to 4K movies that were an upgrade or is this inclusive of 4k movies that we purchase as 4K? What about when I buy a physical 4K disc that comes with a 4k iTunes copy? Still no download option? Can you download 4K on Vudu or any other service or is this an industry wide restriction? 

    I routinely exceeded the Xfinity 1TB limit so now I'm paying the extra $50 for unlimited. 4K streaming shouldn't be a problem.

    I'm happy that the Apple TV 4K exceeded preorder expectations. I'm glad I ordered one from Best Buy. None of the stores in my area has them other than a few 32g models.
    if you read the terms of that 4K digital copy it likely says that downloading v streaming is dependent upon the terms of service from Apple. so since the terms right now are streaming only you can only stream. if they later work out a deal for downloading then you'll be able to download. otherwise you can download 1080p.
  • Reply 51 of 51
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member
    lkrupp said:
    Use your heads people, think before jumping to conclusions. The above paragraph is the most likely correct scenario.
    “Keeping discs alive” doesn’t sound like something Apple would agree to, though.  :p
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