Google's Pixel 2 XL priced higher than Apple's iPhone 8 Plus but is half as fast, lacks ma...

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  • Reply 101 of 148
    gatorguy said:
    Rayz2016 said:
    I have to say I'm always surprised by the paper-thin skin of the Android community. The moment they read a negative piece about their beloved platform, they sign up and post a dozen comments (usually without paragraphs or line breaks) arguing with commendable emotion but very little skill. 

    What they fail to understand is that sites like this are feeding off their insecurity. If you like Android then just use it;  enjoy it! Invading Mac sites just looks like you lack confidence in your choice of platform and desperately need to convince others. I read a lot of the first or second time posters here, and with every post I thought the same thing: are you trying to convince me, or yourself?

    It seems that the rate of Android invaders has stepped up across the internet over the past few weeks. I'm hoping that it's just the usual fear induced by an upcoming iPhone release, and not the symptom of a wider problem. I've only seen this level of invasive desperation twice before:

    When Apple was on its knees just before Gil Amelio took over.
    When IBM was just about to can OS/2

    I'm sure Android isn't on its last legs, but you chaps make it look like it's circling the drain.

    The chances are you're doing more harm than good. Daniel's article will be forgotten about in 48 hours; the impression left by rabid Android users will last much longer.

    The irony is that the level of stretching that the author has to do to bash every single weakness AND strength of the Pixels makes him look very very insecure with his iPhone.  This is actually kind of pointless.  No one sane believes the Pixel is any real threat to iPhone sales.  Some tiny sliver of iPhone users (some of whom I know) have and will make the jump to Pixel and love it.  but most will stay locked into Apple's ecosystem and won't even consider leaving.  So why so much hate?  I would think the author would be happy that Google is applying competitive pressure.  For all the fanboys out there, NEITHER platform would where it is right now if they weren't competing with each other.  Google is good for Apple.  Apple is good for Google.  We all win.  We could write a VERY long comparison of all the stuff each side 'stole' from the other.  At the end of the day, both companies focus on slightly different things and the phones we have are frickin' awesome as a result.  I contemplated ordering an iPhone 8/X but at the end of the day, the camera and the AI features were what won the day for me. The phone is 'fast enough'.  If I see it lagging and stuttering, I'll be pissed, sure.  But from using the Pixel and knowing many people who've owned it, that seriously has not been a problem, specs or no specs.
    The point of the article isn't to convert fandroids to iOS. It's pointing out the fact that the Pixel costs more and offers less than an iPhone 8. Despite this the tech press narrative is that Apple is overpriced. This paradox is newsworthy in an editorial for discussion.
    The tech press narrative is that the Pixel2 XL is over-priced too. They're being consistent at least, so no there is not a paradox. 
    Sure there is. Compare coverage from Verge on iPhone vs Pixel 2. They didn't even really care about the lack of legacy headphone port, despite losing their shit a year ago. The difference in coverage and acceptance between Apple gear the crummier Google crap is quite noteworthy. Google can jack up its prices, but they're still offering a crummier product, as detailed in this piece. 
    watto_cobrafreediverx
  • Reply 102 of 148
    Soli said:
    PIXELFAN said:
    Blunt said:
    Pixelfan go customize your Pixel and fuck off.
    i use both a 6s plus and a pixel XL daily, I have an 8 plus to play with as well everyday.

    Have you or any apple fan boys ever used a Pixel?

    or do you just believe that a picture of a circuit board and some geekbench tests mean your phone is the best ever?
    I've tested the original Pixel and a huge number of non-Apple made devices. I don't "play with" them but analyze them in a variety of ways and Apple's devices keep coming up as being best in class, which included being fastest in actual use and most refined.

    I can tell you that every time someone posts "but blah blah was first" that the experience, quality, and/or security of that so-called feature is exceptionally poor. Take Touch ID for example. I bet you were someone that made a big deal about how Apple was just "catching up to the completion" and that you had a fingerprint reader on a WinPC a decade earlier, but people like you would leave out just how poor that experience was and, most importantly, how insecure it was.

    As for posting the engineering abilities of the logic board, that speaks volumes about the product because the average customer never sees it. Since you don't know why that's important I'll explain it to you: Companies that only care about the superficial aspects of what the customer can see and not the experience or the whole of the device are the problem with this industry. The extra R&D and manufacturing cost to make a more complex and compact logic board show that Apple is better at engineering and cares about the device instead about making a quick sale and then dropping the customer once they realize those simplistic spec sheet numbers don't tell the whole story.

    You're the kind of person that looks at the amount of RAM but not the type, speed. You're the type of person that looks at the number of cores and clock rate, but nothing els about an extremely complex SoC. You're the type of person that Google and other low-tier vendors love.

    PS: No one believes you bought an iPhone 8 for your wife.
    I believe him.  So your statement is factually false.  But the more important question is: why don't you believe him? 
    Because we see first-time posters show up after events to bang their drum, spread some FUD, then vanish a week later, all the time. 
    edited October 2017 watto_cobra
  • Reply 103 of 148
    Rayz2016 said:
    I have to say I'm always surprised by the paper-thin skin of the Android community. The moment they read a negative piece about their beloved platform, they sign up and post a dozen comments (usually without paragraphs or line breaks) arguing with commendable emotion but very little skill. 

    What they fail to understand is that sites like this are feeding off their insecurity. If you like Android then just use it;  enjoy it! Invading Mac sites just looks like you lack confidence in your choice of platform and desperately need to convince others. I read a lot of the first or second time posters here, and with every post I thought the same thing: are you trying to convince me, or yourself?

    It seems that the rate of Android invaders has stepped up across the internet over the past few weeks. I'm hoping that it's just the usual fear induced by an upcoming iPhone release, and not the symptom of a wider problem. I've only seen this level of invasive desperation twice before:

    When Apple was on its knees just before Gil Amelio took over.
    When IBM was just about to can OS/2

    I'm sure Android isn't on its last legs, but you chaps make it look like it's circling the drain.

    The chances are you're doing more harm than good. Daniel's article will be forgotten about in 48 hours; the impression left by rabid Android users will last much longer.

    The irony is that the level of stretching that the author has to do to bash every single weakness AND strength of the Pixels makes him look very very insecure with his iPhone.  This is actually kind of pointless.  No one sane believes the Pixel is any real threat to iPhone sales.  Some tiny sliver of iPhone users (some of whom I know) have and will make the jump to Pixel and love it.  but most will stay locked into Apple's ecosystem and won't even consider leaving.  So why so much hate?  I would think the author would be happy that Google is applying competitive pressure.  For all the fanboys out there, NEITHER platform would where it is right now if they weren't competing with each other.  Google is good for Apple.  Apple is good for Google.  We all win.  We could write a VERY long comparison of all the stuff each side 'stole' from the other.  At the end of the day, both companies focus on slightly different things and the phones we have are frickin' awesome as a result.  I contemplated ordering an iPhone 8/X but at the end of the day, the camera and the AI features were what won the day for me. The phone is 'fast enough'.  If I see it lagging and stuttering, I'll be pissed, sure.  But from using the Pixel and knowing many people who've owned it, that seriously has not been a problem, specs or no specs.
    The point of the article isn't to convert fandroids to iOS. It's pointing out the fact that the Pixel costs more and offers less than an iPhone 8. Despite this the tech press narrative is that Apple is overpriced. This paradox is newsworthy in an editorial for discussion.
    Offers Less. ... it offers less powerful hardware.  whether it offers less as a complete experience is a little more subjective.
    techrules
  • Reply 104 of 148

    Blunt said:
    Wow, lots of textbook Androidkiddies troll posts. The truth hurts. Try to be a bit more creative next time. I mean no one is buying things like: My partner ownes an iPhone and my Pixel is a million times better and now she thinks about switching.
    you live in a bubble if you think it doesn't happen.  I personally know several switchers who have switched to pixel and not looked back.  Different reasons usually.  Sometimes it's as simple as wanting something 'different'.  Sometimes it's something else, but if you SERIOUSLY Tthink NO ONE is ever wanting to jump from iPhone to Pixel, you live in an alteranate reality.  True a sizeable majority will stay locked into the Apple ecosystem, but there is always a percentage that has no problem hopping the fence.  Deny if you like.
    An insignificant number isn't noteworthy. There are also people who drink their own urine believing it to be therapeutic....not many, but they do exist. So what?
    I'm just noticing a pattern here.  It's a mass denial that anyone might actually  prefer Android.  It's kind of fun to watch the mass delusion.
    techrules
  • Reply 105 of 148
    SoliSoli Posts: 7,337member

    Blunt said:
    Wow, lots of textbook Androidkiddies troll posts. The truth hurts. Try to be a bit more creative next time. I mean no one is buying things like: My partner ownes an iPhone and my Pixel is a million times better and now she thinks about switching.
    you live in a bubble if you think it doesn't happen.  I personally know several switchers who have switched to pixel and not looked back.  Different reasons usually.  Sometimes it's as simple as wanting something 'different'.  Sometimes it's something else, but if you SERIOUSLY Tthink NO ONE is ever wanting to jump from iPhone to Pixel, you live in an alteranate reality.  True a sizeable majority will stay locked into the Apple ecosystem, but there is always a percentage that has no problem hopping the fence.  Deny if you like.
    An insignificant number isn't noteworthy. There are also people who drink their own urine believing it to be therapeutic....not many, but they do exist. So what?
    I'm just noticing a pattern here.  It's a mass denial that anyone might actually  prefer Android.  It's kind of fun to watch the mass delusion.
    We all know plenty people prefer Android. We also know there are plenty of people that hate Apple no matter how much better, faster, and more refined their products are and at any price point.
    StrangeDayswatto_cobrafreediverx
  • Reply 106 of 148
    ranman2017 said:
    Does the user experience suffer? No.
    Glad to see you're not just a one-off account. I know multi quoting is a pain here, too. Also, ehh… 
    You're denying crap that even huge apple fans don't.
    I doubt that, just as I doubt Siri's 'inadequacies'.
    No one is being held back.
    Being, no. It's just something about a lack of care and consideration put into the software. "It's good enough;" that's all that matters, particularly when the phone isn't the product.
    What ARE you talking about?  Oh yeah, tinfoil hat stuff.
    Aww, cute. He thinks "conspiracy theory" is a bad word. They've admitted to it themselves.
    Look, if the companies had just added a second port
    So… NOT done the one thing they explicitly needed to do. Do you understand how irrelevant that statement is? The port's gone. Forever.
    I *hate* having to buy a SPLITTER To charge my phone while using headphones.
    Hence the push toward wireless charging.
    No, Bluetooth is still finding it's way and that just makes it a pain in the ass for everyone.
    Boy, I hear that. AirPlay's a much smoother experience (though won't be on headphones anytime soon).
      But yeah in a couple of years, we probably won't care.  How does that help us NOW?
    "These olive trees won't bear fruit until I'm 80; how does that help me NOW?" The sickness of instant gratification is why society is in its current mess. Maybe learn from that?
    So you DID mock Apple for making a big phone?
    Oh yeah.  :D I still don't like the 5.5. Heck, I don't like the iPad mini. Que sera sera.
    Hate to break it to you but even DSLR's have SOFTWARE in them.
    Yes; you know what I'm saying here. The old "we'll fix it in software" argument as an excuse for lesser hardware.
    Can't concede anyone did any ONE thing better.

    I like the… uh… shit, what do I like… Honestly, I have WAY more complaints about what Apple does than I do good things to say about any of their competitors in any field. I guess I like this mouse. It's as simple as you can get–five bucks–but it's one of the best mice I've ever used. Granted, I only use it in Windows–I use the Magic Trackpad in OS X…


    Wow, I'm sitting here reading someone pretending like no one on the Apple side would agree that Google Assistant is out ahead of Siri.  I'm trying to digest that. I posted a MacWorld article link earlier that says exactly that.  It's been backed up by LOTS Of comparisons and tests online.  And yes you can actually find the DF post by Gruber so pissed off about Siri's complete fail against Android Auto voice control he said that the Apple team should be forced to watch the YouTube clip between an Android and Apple fan where they tried to do the same commands/queries and Apple fell on its face.  But if you live in a bubble, maybe you don't see it.
    techrules
  • Reply 107 of 148

    Blunt said:
    Wow, lots of textbook Androidkiddies troll posts. The truth hurts. Try to be a bit more creative next time. I mean no one is buying things like: My partner ownes an iPhone and my Pixel is a million times better and now she thinks about switching.
    you live in a bubble if you think it doesn't happen.  I personally know several switchers who have switched to pixel and not looked back.  Different reasons usually.  Sometimes it's as simple as wanting something 'different'.  Sometimes it's something else, but if you SERIOUSLY Tthink NO ONE is ever wanting to jump from iPhone to Pixel, you live in an alteranate reality.  True a sizeable majority will stay locked into the Apple ecosystem, but there is always a percentage that has no problem hopping the fence.  Deny if you like.
    An insignificant number isn't noteworthy. There are also people who drink their own urine believing it to be therapeutic....not many, but they do exist. So what?
    I'm just noticing a pattern here.  It's a mass denial that anyone might actually  prefer Android.  It's kind of fun to watch the mass delusion.
    Here's another pattern: 

    - AppleInsider writes something critical of Android
    - fandroids descend from the heavens w/ no-post-history accounts, flap their wings around, squawk a bunch, then leave

    Despite this old pattern, the writer engaged with you, but you refused to take issue with the factual accounts in his piece, citing your "lack of time". He said its best:

    You can’t refute anything because you’re so pressed for time, but you do have the free time to post pages of your opinion that ramble on and on. 

    Appears you do have time, just nothing interesting to say. 

    ...how much time have you invested so far? Clearly more than it would have taken to respond to the challenge. Nope, you're just here to flap wings before leaving again.
    RonnnieOwatto_cobrafreediverx
  • Reply 108 of 148
    SoliSoli Posts: 7,337member
    Soli said:
    PIXELFAN said:
    Blunt said:
    Pixelfan go customize your Pixel and fuck off.
    i use both a 6s plus and a pixel XL daily, I have an 8 plus to play with as well everyday.

    Have you or any apple fan boys ever used a Pixel?

    or do you just believe that a picture of a circuit board and some geekbench tests mean your phone is the best ever?
    I've tested the original Pixel and a huge number of non-Apple made devices. I don't "play with" them but analyze them in a variety of ways and Apple's devices keep coming up as being best in class, which included being fastest in actual use and most refined.

    I can tell you that every time someone posts "but blah blah was first" that the experience, quality, and/or security of that so-called feature is exceptionally poor. Take Touch ID for example. I bet you were someone that made a big deal about how Apple was just "catching up to the completion" and that you had a fingerprint reader on a WinPC a decade earlier, but people like you would leave out just how poor that experience was and, most importantly, how insecure it was.

    As for posting the engineering abilities of the logic board, that speaks volumes about the product because the average customer never sees it. Since you don't know why that's important I'll explain it to you: Companies that only care about the superficial aspects of what the customer can see and not the experience or the whole of the device are the problem with this industry. The extra R&D and manufacturing cost to make a more complex and compact logic board show that Apple is better at engineering and cares about the device instead about making a quick sale and then dropping the customer once they realize those simplistic spec sheet numbers don't tell the whole story.

    You're the kind of person that looks at the amount of RAM but not the type, speed. You're the type of person that looks at the number of cores and clock rate, but nothing els about an extremely complex SoC. You're the type of person that Google and other low-tier vendors love.

    PS: No one believes you bought an iPhone 8 for your wife.
    But the more important question is: why don't you believe him? 
    When someone claims that the engineering and manufacturing effort that that went into the Moto X logic board compared to the iPhone 8 logic board says nothing about the efforts that went into those components then I know they're full of shit.
    StrangeDayswatto_cobratechrules
  • Reply 109 of 148

    PIXELFAN said:
    I use a Pixel XL and Apple 6s Plus that I use daily. I ca nappreciate all of your fancy scores and pictures but in practical daily use I widely prefer the Pixel. 
    You have 1 post, don't care about facts, and won't be here in a month. Man I wish AI was still holding new members until they proved they weren't astroturfers or trolls.
    or rather you want to make sure anyone who posts here agrees with you.
    Not at all. In fact I've had many disagreements with other posters taking an issue with your low value posts, such as Tallest Skil and Soli. The difference is, they aren't trolls who showed up out of no where only to spread FUD before vanishing again.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 110 of 148
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,247member
    I have been waiting for this piece to be written.  It follows the same pattern as previous AI posts.  Basically a VERY long screed made up of 
    1.  Some facts that are objectively true
    2.  Some facts that are objectively false
    3.  Some things which  are opinion  presented as fact.
    4.  Some things which cannot be proven presented  as fact
    5. A heavy dose of hypocrisy
    6. All of the above presented with a level of abject hatred towards all things Google.

    I could go through and write a piece refuting this, but honestly it's not worth my time.  So setting aside the fact that I think the author literally wakes up hating Google and dreaming of all the nasty things he can say about their products, he misses the point entirely.  MacWorld didn't, however:

    https://www.macworld.com/article/3230303/internet-of-things/hey-siri-google-assistant-is-winning-the-ai-game-and-its-not-even-close.html

    The long and short is that sure, just looking at the hardware, Apple makes faster, snazzier hardware.  However, when you buy a phone these days you're buying hardware AND software.  Google has basically decided that it wanted to make hardware that was good enough to not hold back its software.  And it's done so.  If you actually WATCH The keynote, it's all about AI and Machine Learning. The devices are there to provide a portal into that.   We can benchmark and we can spec ourselves to death, but at the end of the day it's whether your phone does what you want it do quickly and efficiently.  Sometimes on device (The "Always Listening" music ID works in airplane mode because it doesn't send stuff to google...it's ON DEVICE -- something the author apparently (deliberately?) missed).  And sometimes in the cloud.  If having the absolute fastest piece of hardware with the most expensive components is what you're about, buy an iPhone.  If you want the best AI and integrated ML services, then you're probably gonna buy a Pixel.  It's honestly that simple. Just because Google is doing better in AI and ML than Apple, doesn't mean Apple sucks at it.  And just because Apple excels at making the sportscar of phones doesn't mean Google sucks at it.  They are just focused on different things.  In the end, if your phone is fast and smooth and you aren't waiting around on it, and it does cool stuff....you'll love your phone no matter what the spec sheet says.  I realize the author cannot wrap his brain around this because it's nothing bug a fog of hate.  

    I would also be remiss in not calling out the hypocrisy of the  author slamming Google over the headphone jack.  First of all, as an aside, I'm in the camp that says BOTH  companies were wrong to yank it.  Lots of ink has been spilled on this so I'm not going into it.  Didn't like it when Apple did it.  Don't like it that Google did it.  But to mock Google for making hay about it last year in their ads?  Does anyone remember the Apple "thumb" ad arguing that the old small iPhones were the only suitable size for a phone because of the size of your hand/thumb?  A year later out comes the giant plus size iPhone.  Were you mocking then?  Yeah didn't think so.  EVERY company bashes what they don't got...until they add it.  

    And yeah, mock the camera if you want to, I've seen the shots, and in MOST cases, it is head and shoulders better than the iPhone camera.  There are still issues with Google's bokeh, but since it's all done in software with machine learning, I won't have to wait a year for a new physical camera to see that improve.  I expect as more and more machine learning happens, the camera software will get smarter about its depth mapping and subsequent processing.  

    Anyway, none of this is Apple bashing.  The Apple phones are spectacular design accomplishments and speed demons...but the AI/Assistant features which are central to Google's phone are just way ahead of Siri on my iOS devices.  If you don't care about this, enjoy your iPhone.
    Last year DED wrote several of these type of stories concerning Alexa, the Google Assistant, and Siri and just wait a little bit more because Siri is about to get great because of these little acquisitions Apple has made.

    We don't have long to wait because Apple is coming out with HomePods in December.   Hopefully they have actually improved Siri enough that she's not embarrassed by Alexa and Google Home.   Will Siri recognize individual voices?  Or are the HomePods just expensive speakers for Apple Music.

    I like the Alexa Announcements made recently.   Going to pick up the EchoPlus because of the Zigbee support. 
    May also get a pair of Sonos ONE's.   I guess they are still revamping the Sinos 3 to compete with the Homepods.  

    Apple let seems to be falling to 3rd place in the Home- it's no like little kids soccer where you get a trophy for showing up.
    Hopefully Apple Held some stuff back in the HomePods preview.

    Atleast the Apple Watch is crushing their competition.

  • Reply 111 of 148
    PIXELFAN said:
    Blunt said:
    Pixelfan go customize your Pixel and fuck off.
    i use both a 6s plus and a pixel XL daily, I have an 8 plus to play with as well everyday.

    Have you or any apple fan boys ever used a Pixel?

    or do you just believe that a picture of a circuit board and some geekbench tests mean your phone is the best ever?
    Is using three phones a day normal behaviour these days? Just wondering ...
    RonnnieOwatto_cobrafreediverx
  • Reply 112 of 148
    nht said:
    jbdragon said:

    I just really find it funny that Google just 1 year ago on last models phones where bashing APple for not having a Headphone jack, and now here they are with no headphone jack. They have a Adapter that's more then DOUBLE the price of Apple's at $20, to Apple's $9. Worse they don't even include some headphones. I mean really??? A so called Premium phone, and all they do is throw in a over priced Adapter. HAHAHAHAHA You're paying more for less. What happened in this new warped world where Google's hardware costs are worse then Apple?
    Android zealots are so anti-Apple that in many ways it deeply resembles politics in America. 

    Likewise, quite a few folks here are so anti-Google that Apple working with Google in any way doesn't compute.

    Based on the folks I know at Google and Apple, there is a level of shared respect among elites despite the rivalry that the rabid fans don't get and never will because they won't ever be elites at anything...

    The folks that work at Google and Apple are some of the very best tech folks in the country.  Their suckiest tech contributions are far better than DED's best.
    I agree completely. I really don't understand the psychological damage needed in a human to become such a rabid zealot of any company. I mean deep down inside, it's the need for what they prefer to be the "best". If it's not the "best", it negates their entire being. I find that both hilarious and so so sad at the same time. I currently have an iPhone 6 (work phone) and an iPad 10.5 Pro. I really dig iPad's and have never had an Android tablet be able to pull me away. The Tab S3 was close, but I found the SoC lacking for games... (That screen though, my God).

    That being said, I truly prefer Android on a phone. It's not about specs. These specs are all overkill at this point anyway. It's all about functionality and the AI. For me, Android Assistant is so far beyond Siri it's not funny. Talking to Assistant is like speaking with an intelligent AI. Speaking to Siri is often like talking to a small child. I have to speak very deliberately, slowly and concise or Siri doesn't get it. It's frustrating for everything but the most simple task. I will also say this, using Apple carplay has made me consider driving my car off a road just to end the session. Slow, buggy and clueless. Apple maps on Carplay is so damn slow that I have to start setting things up about 15 mins before I plan on leaving. With Android Auto, I just talk like normal and I'm off to the races! I still can't get the damn music to stop pausing between the music app and maps app on Carplay. 

    All that being said, I just pre-ordered the Pixel 2 XL as for my needs, it looks amazing. It may not have the synthetic benchmark scores to keep some folks happy, but the AI on Android is a god damn pleasure to use and my wife doesn't notice a hiccup in using her year old Pixel everyday. Although I am buying the pixel 2, I'm certainly not giving up my iPad. I use that damn thing all day around the house. You see, I love Apple and Google for different reasons. It is possible for a well-rounded human being with little emotional scarring to like and appreciate both systems lol. Everyone's needs are different I understand, and if you're heavily invested in the Apple Ecosystem, I get that too. But why have such an irrational hatred for the other side like the author of this article? It's just ridiculous. 
    mvigodmuthuk_vanalingamGG1
  • Reply 113 of 148
    mvigodmvigod Posts: 172member
    nht said:
    jbdragon said:

    I just really find it funny that Google just 1 year ago on last models phones where bashing APple for not having a Headphone jack, and now here they are with no headphone jack. They have a Adapter that's more then DOUBLE the price of Apple's at $20, to Apple's $9. Worse they don't even include some headphones. I mean really??? A so called Premium phone, and all they do is throw in a over priced Adapter. HAHAHAHAHA You're paying more for less. What happened in this new warped world where Google's hardware costs are worse then Apple?
    Android zealots are so anti-Apple that in many ways it deeply resembles politics in America. 

    Likewise, quite a few folks here are so anti-Google that Apple working with Google in any way doesn't compute.

    Based on the folks I know at Google and Apple, there is a level of shared respect among elites despite the rivalry that the rabid fans don't get and never will because they won't ever be elites at anything...

    The folks that work at Google and Apple are some of the very best tech folks in the country.  Their suckiest tech contributions are far better than DED's best.
    I agree completely. I really don't understand the psychological damage needed in a human to become such a rabid zealot of any company. I mean deep down inside, it's the need for what they prefer to be the "best". If it's not the "best", it negates their entire being. I find that both hilarious and so so sad at the same time. I currently have an iPhone 6 (work phone) and an iPad 10.5 Pro. I really dig iPad's and have never had an Android tablet be able to pull me away. The Tab S3 was close, but I found the SoC lacking for games... (That screen though, my God).

    That being said, I truly prefer Android on a phone. It's not about specs. These specs are all overkill at this point anyway. It's all about functionality and the AI. For me, Android Assistant is so far beyond Siri it's not funny. Talking to Assistant is like speaking with an intelligent AI. Speaking to Siri is often like talking to a small child. I have to speak very deliberately, slowly and concise or Siri doesn't get it. It's frustrating for everything but the most simple task. I will also say this, using Apple carplay has made me consider driving my car off a road just to end the session. Slow, buggy and clueless. Apple maps on Carplay is so damn slow that I have to start setting things up about 15 mins before I plan on leaving. With Android Auto, I just talk like normal and I'm off to the races! I still can't get the damn music to stop pausing between the music app and maps app on Carplay. 

    All that being said, I just pre-ordered the Pixel 2 XL as for my needs, it looks amazing. It may not have the synthetic benchmark scores to keep some folks happy, but the AI on Android is a god damn pleasure to use and my wife doesn't notice a hiccup in using her year old Pixel everyday. Although I am buying the pixel 2, I'm certainly not giving up my iPad. I use that damn thing all day around the house. You see, I love Apple and Google for different reasons. It is possible for a well-rounded human being with little emotional scarring to like and appreciate both systems lol. Everyone's needs are different I understand, and if you're heavily invested in the Apple Ecosystem, I get that too. But why have such an irrational hatred for the other side like the author of this article? It's just ridiculous. 

    I just pre-ordered a Pixel 2 XL this morning as well for the same exact reasons as you did.  The AI and functionality are very important to me.  I like being able to squeeze the phone and ask Google a question, get directions or perform other functions.  Over 2/3 of my iPhone usage is interacting with Google AI, search, Gmail, calendar and other products.  iPhone home button for Siri is a complete waste of an opportunity for me. Every time I use iPhone I have to go into google app for voice search/assistant.  Now with Pixel I can squeeze the phone and cut out finger unlock > get to app > launch app > click or start a voice search.  Cut that out 100 times a day now.

    For the Apple fans here I'm one of them but I think giving Android a go is now worthwhile for my daily driver phone.  I already have an iPhone 7 Plus and am adding the Pixel 2 XL to my account as my second number.  I can switch back and forth as I choose.  I'm a heavy apple house with 4 iPhones, 6 ipads, a MacBook Pro, two iMacs and two apple tv's.  Just stating this because I know many hardcore Apple fans simply won't believe it is even possible for an Apple customer to consider Android.  It is though.

    Apple has some things that bug me and if there is a way to hedge my way a bit out of the ecosystem I'm happy to do it.  A huge one is that I can now use Android Auto to have Waze on my car's infotainment.  Apple has decided I should not have Waze or Spotify and be locked into their apps.  Sorry Apple.  That is a non-starter and that decision was what is good for Apple and not for me the customer.  Fail.  Also, let me remap the home button to something besides Siri.  Again this was good for Apple but bad for me the customer.  Let me enable "hey google" instead of "hey Siri" on my iPhone.  Too many things Apple does for apple and not me.

    I would never buy Samsung Galaxy either for same reason.  Bixby button. WTF!  They won't let me remap that to Google Assistant.  That is good for Samsung and bad for me the customer.  Sorry, no sale.  Also, no OS updates or security patches in a timely manner on Galaxy phones.  No sale.

    Pixel 2 hits the mark for me in everything I want in a phone.  What will I lose?  iMessage.  Find Friends.  What do I gain?  Easy access to features I use most with Google AI and services.  Android Auto.  Integration with Google home.  

    I'll keep my iPhone 7 Plus as I said and just decide which one to take with me.  Depending on reviews of the X I may or may not upgrade my 7 Plus to an X. We'll see.
    JTRCK
  • Reply 114 of 148
    Is there a substantial difference in use between the two platforms? I'm asking because when I use an iPhone 6s or my HTC 10 (used primarily for the excellent DAC/Music quality), I notice almost no difference no matter how superior the processor in the iPhone is. In fact, I prefer the Android interface to iPhone's. As a Mac (2015 MacBook Pro, 2015 MacBook) and iPad (Air 2) user, I'm also a heavy user of google's services: gmail, google Docs, calendar, google Photos, maps, Google Home, etc., and I find the services substantially better on Android. Years ago, Android users claimed superior hardware, but knew that Apple had the software experience down. Apple could do with 1GB, what Android couldn't with 3GB. But it's 2017, the Note 8 has 6GB of RAM, it is still beat by the iPhone when opening apps, but finally wins when reopening those same apps (google iPhone 8 vs Note 8 speed test). But I don't even think it matters that the Note finally wins in a synthetic race.

    Apple can still do with 3GB what Android can barely pull with 6GB of ram. But does it matter? Is there a substantial difference in use? I think there is, and it's in google's favor. Pixel has clean Android compared to other manufacturers: always responsive, long-lasting in a Pixel XL body, with 2-3 years of support. Sure, it might open apps slower than iPhone 8, but do you notice it? Sure, its storage speed is inferior, but do you notice it? Bear with me for a second longer: google music. I find it infinitely superior to Apple Music. In fact, one week with google music led me to cancel my subscription with Apple 1 year ago. Google Photos: easy, reliable, fast, family-sharing, excellent editing tools, unlimited storage, etc. Google Maps: easy, reliable, fast, endless starred locations + recommendations, etc. Google Assistant: easy, reliable, fast, responsive, lets me know how my trip to work will be the moment I step out of bed, etc., do you see where I am going here? If Android is such an inferior platform, why doesn't it feel like it? 

    "...it appears that nobody cares about snappy performance..." I think people only care about slow performance. In a pixel, performance is so smooth and buttery and consistent, you will not have people complaining that it loses a speed test vs an iPhone by 1 whole minute. Especially when the experience is so well rounded. Look at the apps/software mentioned above. All those apps are on my iPad. I use them more than any other app. I wanted to buy an iPhone 7 last year, so I walked into the Apple Store, and left with my HTC 10 in hand. It wasn't a worthy upgrade for me, even though the hardware inside the iPhone 7 cannot be compared to the HTC 10. What gives? Google is clearly on to something here. It's clearly not the hardware - it's software. I cannot wait to see what the Pixel XL2 experience will be like.

    I also think there are a lot of disparaging claims in this opinion piece. Quote: "It [the phone] fully reflects its maker as a greed machine without a shred of shame or humanity; a company that sees no value in honesty or integrity. Unsurprisingly, it gets top marks from phony reviewers." How can one possibly hope to support these claims? The same things have been said about apple countless times. "Take a dimly lit skyline panorama with a Pixel phone and it appears to be capturing amazing amounts of light. However, the finished capture is blown out with no detail, and rather useless as a photo." I'd like to see samples of this and comparisons from iPhones and other Androids. Sample photos of last year's pixels look nothing short of stunning.
    edited October 2017 gatorguyavon b7
  • Reply 115 of 148
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,247member
    jbdragon said:
    I don't know what it is with Google's Insane Prices on their new hardware. What are you getting? They're trying to copy and be more like Apple and it really hasn't worked.

    I just really find it funny that Google just 1 year ago on last models phones where bashing APple for not having a Headphone jack, and now here they are with no headphone jack. They have a Adapter that's more then DOUBLE the price of Apple's at $20, to Apple's $9. Worse they don't even include some headphones. I mean really??? A so called Premium phone, and all they do is throw in a over priced Adapter. HAHAHAHAHA You're paying more for less. What happened in this new warped world where Google's hardware costs are worse then Apple?

    The phone stuff. The Cromebook is priced where you might as well buy a computer with a so called full OS. People talked about the cost of Apple's HomePod at $350, then here's google with their $400 version. I really don't get what's going on with Google. Who's really going to buy this over priced stuff from Google? They're trying to make Android out to be a Premium device after all this time of being advertised as the much cheaper priced phones over Apple's over priced stuff, and yet look at them now. Same price or more for less. I'm really confused with what Google is trying to do.
    Google has to raise prices to get better components in their phones.    Apple's build quality is superior (probably best in the biz) ;  it will take more years to approach this quality.
    Google wouldn't be able to get into Apple's league by selling cheap Nexus phones.   We will see if Google is serious and dedicated enough to stick with it.

  • Reply 116 of 148
    ranman2017 said:
    …pretending like no one…
    Ah, but you've dichotomized my words.
    And yes you can actually find the DF post by Gruber
    I'm not finding it, but that's my fault. I'll have to dedicate some time to look harder. Thanks for the tip.
  • Reply 117 of 148
    19831983 Posts: 1,031member
    I'm an Apple guy but this 'feature' is just an exercise in angry Google bashing. Like something militant Android fanboys would publish about Apple. We're better than that...
    gatorguyfreediverx
  • Reply 118 of 148
    My friend, there are many frustrations in your article. You spent a lot of time trying to convince everyone that Apple products are better than Google products. We understand your pain, but many things in your article are wrong, subjective or missing. First of all, the price. Why don’t you compare Pixel 2 (649$) with iPhone 8 (699$)? Specs (processor, memory and how fast it is). This is subjective. Power is good when you need it. Do you own an iPhone 7, you feel is not fast enough for you and you feel the need to switch to the new CPU from iPhone 8? As long as your mobile phone is performing good for your daily tasks, it doesn’t matter CPU it has. Camera. Pixel’s camera might not have the 2x optical zoom, but how much would you use it? And, to be honest, 2x optical zoom is nothing. Why don’t you mention about the optical + digital stabilization found in Pixel phones? This is a much better option than OIS found on iPhone 8. Design - this is subjective. Different people, different preferences. OS - It also comes to preferences, both have good and bad. Battery - :) You haven’t used a Pixel phone before. First of all, Pixel and Pixel 2 phones have a bigger battery (since you like to compare the numbers) compared with Apples’s devices. But, everything comes down to hardware, software optimisation and how you use your device. I believe the new Android 8 (Oreo) is doing a great job on optimising the resources and it surpasses the iPhone 7 or iPhone 7 Plus on the battery test. Things that you are missing from your article. Space. With Pixel phones you can save all your photos and videos into your Google Photos account for free. This is a feature that will cost you on iPhone. Virtual assistant (VA). VA is a feature itself and it should be taken into consideration. In this moment, Google’s VA is by far the most advanced on the market and it will get better and better each year. I think it’s quite hard to catch up right now and Siri is at least one year behind. I am not sure if you have tried the VA from Google on Android, but it’s quite impressive what it can do for you. It can scan your emails and it can remind you when you need to pay your bills, it will identify your flight bookings and it will remind you when you need to leave to airport, it will remind you the gate number of your flight, it will record the pattern of your commute and it will alert you when you need to leave in order to get in time to office, home or any other place you go frequently. All of this will be done seamlessly, without any effort from your side. You can control via verbal controls devices in your house and also apps.
    techrules
  • Reply 119 of 148
    nhtnht Posts: 4,125member
    mvigod said:
    nht said:
    jbdragon said:

    I just really find it funny that Google just 1 year ago on last models phones where bashing APple for not having a Headphone jack, and now here they are with no headphone jack. They have a Adapter that's more then DOUBLE the price of Apple's at $20, to Apple's $9. Worse they don't even include some headphones. I mean really??? A so called Premium phone, and all they do is throw in a over priced Adapter. HAHAHAHAHA You're paying more for less. What happened in this new warped world where Google's hardware costs are worse then Apple?
    Android zealots are so anti-Apple that in many ways it deeply resembles politics in America. 

    Likewise, quite a few folks here are so anti-Google that Apple working with Google in any way doesn't compute.

    Based on the folks I know at Google and Apple, there is a level of shared respect among elites despite the rivalry that the rabid fans don't get and never will because they won't ever be elites at anything...

    The folks that work at Google and Apple are some of the very best tech folks in the country.  Their suckiest tech contributions are far better than DED's best.
    I agree completely. I really don't understand the psychological damage needed in a human to become such a rabid zealot of any company. I mean deep down inside, it's the need for what they prefer to be the "best". If it's not the "best", it negates their entire being. I find that both hilarious and so so sad at the same time. I currently have an iPhone 6 (work phone) and an iPad 10.5 Pro. I really dig iPad's and have never had an Android tablet be able to pull me away. The Tab S3 was close, but I found the SoC lacking for games... (That screen though, my God).

    That being said, I truly prefer Android on a phone. It's not about specs. These specs are all overkill at this point anyway. It's all about functionality and the AI. For me, Android Assistant is so far beyond Siri it's not funny. Talking to Assistant is like speaking with an intelligent AI. Speaking to Siri is often like talking to a small child. I have to speak very deliberately, slowly and concise or Siri doesn't get it. It's frustrating for everything but the most simple task. I will also say this, using Apple carplay has made me consider driving my car off a road just to end the session. Slow, buggy and clueless. Apple maps on Carplay is so damn slow that I have to start setting things up about 15 mins before I plan on leaving. With Android Auto, I just talk like normal and I'm off to the races! I still can't get the damn music to stop pausing between the music app and maps app on Carplay. 

    All that being said, I just pre-ordered the Pixel 2 XL as for my needs, it looks amazing. It may not have the synthetic benchmark scores to keep some folks happy, but the AI on Android is a god damn pleasure to use and my wife doesn't notice a hiccup in using her year old Pixel everyday. Although I am buying the pixel 2, I'm certainly not giving up my iPad. I use that damn thing all day around the house. You see, I love Apple and Google for different reasons. It is possible for a well-rounded human being with little emotional scarring to like and appreciate both systems lol. Everyone's needs are different I understand, and if you're heavily invested in the Apple Ecosystem, I get that too. But why have such an irrational hatred for the other side like the author of this article? It's just ridiculous. 

    I just pre-ordered a Pixel 2 XL this morning as well for the same exact reasons as you did.  The AI and functionality are very important to me.  I like being able to squeeze the phone and ask Google a question, get directions or perform other functions.  Over 2/3 of my iPhone usage is interacting with Google AI, search, Gmail, calendar and other products.  iPhone home button for Siri is a complete waste of an opportunity for me. Every time I use iPhone I have to go into google app for voice search/assistant.  Now with Pixel I can squeeze the phone and cut out finger unlock > get to app > launch app > click or start a voice search.  Cut that out 100 times a day now.

    For the Apple fans here I'm one of them but I think giving Android a go is now worthwhile for my daily driver phone.  I already have an iPhone 7 Plus and am adding the Pixel 2 XL to my account as my second number.  I can switch back and forth as I choose.  I'm a heavy apple house with 4 iPhones, 6 ipads, a MacBook Pro, two iMacs and two apple tv's.  Just stating this because I know many hardcore Apple fans simply won't believe it is even possible for an Apple customer to consider Android.  It is though.

    Apple has some things that bug me and if there is a way to hedge my way a bit out of the ecosystem I'm happy to do it.  A huge one is that I can now use Android Auto to have Waze on my car's infotainment.  Apple has decided I should not have Waze or Spotify and be locked into their apps.  Sorry Apple.  That is a non-starter and that decision was what is good for Apple and not for me the customer.  Fail.  Also, let me remap the home button to something besides Siri.  Again this was good for Apple but bad for me the customer.  Let me enable "hey google" instead of "hey Siri" on my iPhone.  Too many things Apple does for apple and not me.

    I would never buy Samsung Galaxy either for same reason.  Bixby button. WTF!  They won't let me remap that to Google Assistant.  That is good for Samsung and bad for me the customer.  Sorry, no sale.  Also, no OS updates or security patches in a timely manner on Galaxy phones.  No sale.

    Pixel 2 hits the mark for me in everything I want in a phone.  What will I lose?  iMessage.  Find Friends.  What do I gain?  Easy access to features I use most with Google AI and services.  Android Auto.  Integration with Google home.  

    I'll keep my iPhone 7 Plus as I said and just decide which one to take with me.  Depending on reviews of the X I may or may not upgrade my 7 Plus to an X. We'll see.
    You know why I won't buy a Pixel? Because my kids Nexus 5 is stuck on Marshmallow.  I can move it N because I am a dev and know how but the 2014 iPhone 5S just got iOS 11 so it just annoys me.  Oreo?  Yah, eventually maybe for the Nexus but not for any of the other Android phones I have.

    He's got a Nexus because his ZTE Axon Pro's battery died and it just wasn't worth it to mess with when I had a Nexus to lend him.
    watto_cobrafreediverx
  • Reply 120 of 148
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 18,603member
    nht said:
    mvigod said:
    nht said:
    jbdragon said:

    I just really find it funny that Google just 1 year ago on last models phones where bashing APple for not having a Headphone jack, and now here they are with no headphone jack. They have a Adapter that's more then DOUBLE the price of Apple's at $20, to Apple's $9. Worse they don't even include some headphones. I mean really??? A so called Premium phone, and all they do is throw in a over priced Adapter. HAHAHAHAHA You're paying more for less. What happened in this new warped world where Google's hardware costs are worse then Apple?
    Android zealots are so anti-Apple that in many ways it deeply resembles politics in America. 

    Likewise, quite a few folks here are so anti-Google that Apple working with Google in any way doesn't compute.

    Based on the folks I know at Google and Apple, there is a level of shared respect among elites despite the rivalry that the rabid fans don't get and never will because they won't ever be elites at anything...

    The folks that work at Google and Apple are some of the very best tech folks in the country.  Their suckiest tech contributions are far better than DED's best.
    I agree completely. I really don't understand the psychological damage needed in a human to become such a rabid zealot of any company. I mean deep down inside, it's the need for what they prefer to be the "best". If it's not the "best", it negates their entire being. I find that both hilarious and so so sad at the same time. I currently have an iPhone 6 (work phone) and an iPad 10.5 Pro. I really dig iPad's and have never had an Android tablet be able to pull me away. The Tab S3 was close, but I found the SoC lacking for games... (That screen though, my God).

    That being said, I truly prefer Android on a phone. It's not about specs. These specs are all overkill at this point anyway. It's all about functionality and the AI. For me, Android Assistant is so far beyond Siri it's not funny. Talking to Assistant is like speaking with an intelligent AI. Speaking to Siri is often like talking to a small child. I have to speak very deliberately, slowly and concise or Siri doesn't get it. It's frustrating for everything but the most simple task. I will also say this, using Apple carplay has made me consider driving my car off a road just to end the session. Slow, buggy and clueless. Apple maps on Carplay is so damn slow that I have to start setting things up about 15 mins before I plan on leaving. With Android Auto, I just talk like normal and I'm off to the races! I still can't get the damn music to stop pausing between the music app and maps app on Carplay. 

    All that being said, I just pre-ordered the Pixel 2 XL as for my needs, it looks amazing. It may not have the synthetic benchmark scores to keep some folks happy, but the AI on Android is a god damn pleasure to use and my wife doesn't notice a hiccup in using her year old Pixel everyday. Although I am buying the pixel 2, I'm certainly not giving up my iPad. I use that damn thing all day around the house. You see, I love Apple and Google for different reasons. It is possible for a well-rounded human being with little emotional scarring to like and appreciate both systems lol. Everyone's needs are different I understand, and if you're heavily invested in the Apple Ecosystem, I get that too. But why have such an irrational hatred for the other side like the author of this article? It's just ridiculous. 

    I just pre-ordered a Pixel 2 XL this morning as well for the same exact reasons as you did.  The AI and functionality are very important to me.  I like being able to squeeze the phone and ask Google a question, get directions or perform other functions.  Over 2/3 of my iPhone usage is interacting with Google AI, search, Gmail, calendar and other products.  iPhone home button for Siri is a complete waste of an opportunity for me. Every time I use iPhone I have to go into google app for voice search/assistant.  Now with Pixel I can squeeze the phone and cut out finger unlock > get to app > launch app > click or start a voice search.  Cut that out 100 times a day now.

    For the Apple fans here I'm one of them but I think giving Android a go is now worthwhile for my daily driver phone.  I already have an iPhone 7 Plus and am adding the Pixel 2 XL to my account as my second number.  I can switch back and forth as I choose.  I'm a heavy apple house with 4 iPhones, 6 ipads, a MacBook Pro, two iMacs and two apple tv's.  Just stating this because I know many hardcore Apple fans simply won't believe it is even possible for an Apple customer to consider Android.  It is though.

    Apple has some things that bug me and if there is a way to hedge my way a bit out of the ecosystem I'm happy to do it.  A huge one is that I can now use Android Auto to have Waze on my car's infotainment.  Apple has decided I should not have Waze or Spotify and be locked into their apps.  Sorry Apple.  That is a non-starter and that decision was what is good for Apple and not for me the customer.  Fail.  Also, let me remap the home button to something besides Siri.  Again this was good for Apple but bad for me the customer.  Let me enable "hey google" instead of "hey Siri" on my iPhone.  Too many things Apple does for apple and not me.

    I would never buy Samsung Galaxy either for same reason.  Bixby button. WTF!  They won't let me remap that to Google Assistant.  That is good for Samsung and bad for me the customer.  Sorry, no sale.  Also, no OS updates or security patches in a timely manner on Galaxy phones.  No sale.

    Pixel 2 hits the mark for me in everything I want in a phone.  What will I lose?  iMessage.  Find Friends.  What do I gain?  Easy access to features I use most with Google AI and services.  Android Auto.  Integration with Google home.  

    I'll keep my iPhone 7 Plus as I said and just decide which one to take with me.  Depending on reviews of the X I may or may not upgrade my 7 Plus to an X. We'll see.
    You know why I won't buy a Pixel? Because my kids Nexus 5 is stuck on Marshmallow.  I can move it N because I am a dev and know how but the 2014 iPhone 5S just got iOS 11 so it just annoys me.  Oreo?  Yah, eventually maybe for the Nexus but not for any of the other Android phones I have.

    He's got a Nexus because his ZTE Axon Pro's battery died and it just wasn't worth it to mess with when I had a Nexus to lend him.
    At least the new Pixel's are guaranteed at least three years of OS updates,  Android P, Q and perhaps even R in addition to the very latest Oreo version they'll ship with.
    techrules
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