iPhone X doomsayers lack basic reading comprehension skills (or they're purposefully disho...

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  • Reply 21 of 53
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,442administrator
    What was the point of this article? AI: I like your site, I use your app often, but I’m “just not that into you” ...not enough for me to want to read articles about how pretty and wonderful you are. Stick to the facts, not the sympathy requests. And the fact remains that the iPhone X is underselling. Doomed for failure? No, but too expensive and too ugly? Consumer spending is saying “yes”. There’s your story, sans pity.
    I am in no need of sympathy, nor did I ask for any. This also doesn't have anything to do with "pretty and wonderful." And, like I've always said, if you don't want to read a piece, we don't make you!
     
    The fact is... your "fact" remains to be seen, and only Apple knows for sure. If Apple was going to widely miss their guidance, they are under obligation to say so early -- and they did not. And, if sales are crazily down, we'll talk about it, the same as we always do. At no point did we declare that Apple was doomed, nor was the iPhone X the reason for it -- yet here we are.

    I do not have control of my words after they are put to "print." However, I can, and do, take those to task for improper use.

    That all said, we appreciate your reading, and your app use. Readers are the reason for both why and how we do this.


    edited January 2018 ihatescreennamesMuntzfastasleepmuthuk_vanalingam2old4funStrangeDaysmacguiwatto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 53
    aricb said:
    I didn't read any of the doomsayer reports on other sites, but i'm willing to bet they are layered in "could be", "possible", "likely", "maybe", and other words liars regularly use. Fox news has used this journalistic loophole to its maximum potential by stating a two minute article and finishing it with "maybe" as the last word.
    The crazy thing to me is that we all see news outlets pull this kind of thing about Apple but then assume they don’t regarding other things that we agree with. As if it’s only Fox News who does the ‘fake news’ thing ... right! If anything, with the media frothing at the mouth about our current administration Fox News has been transformed into a news agency of relatively integrity because of falling standards everywhere.
    Muntzmmatz2old4funpatchythepirate
  • Reply 23 of 53
    Mass media has no crediblity left.. its a dog eat dog world AI. Your reports are not the only ones subject to misrepresenting, spins and manipulations.. Just look at the political world..
  • Reply 24 of 53
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 4,529member
    Really AI was the source of the fake news of the doomed IPhone X, It should not surprise anyone this is the world we live in these days where the media need to fill the bank accounts and the only way to do it is to create store that people want to read forget they there is no fact behind them.

    Face book said they plan to crack down on fact stories, not sure how you do that when most of them are fake, would they have filter these stories from main stream media, probably not.
  • Reply 25 of 53
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 3,664member
    asdasd said:
    Hmm. I expected this to be a DED article. 
    Nope. Just another annoyed AI staffer catching crap for what other venues wrote.
    How about either providing direct quotes or links to the incorrectly reported takes by these venues? There's nothing wrong with calling out bad reporting.
    I think that is a valid observation. We can use the comments to link to some of those that we may have seen ourselves but the author should be specific on which articles or comments provoked this piece. Without the specifics it's difficult to evaluate the opinion.

    For example, neither of the articles linked to by Strange Days so much as whispers Apple is doomed. In fact, both speak highly of the iPhone 8 and the Forbes one predicts possible growth for Apple running through 2018 and 2019.

    We can nit pick them but I'm not seeing the Apple is doomed line.  

    It's true that articles get picked up on and spun in every direction but that is nothing particularly new or mind-blowing. As long as the source link is provided we can click through and hopefully find the original. I know it's frustrating though.
  • Reply 26 of 53
    Apple are reported to have sold 29 million iPhone X's in the holiday quarter making it the best selling smartphone in the holiday season.  http://www.firstpost.com/tech/news-analysis/apple-shipped-29-million-iphone-x-units-in-q4-2017-making-it-the-best-selling-phone-in-the-holiday-season-canalys-4317357.html
    When has anyone cancelled a phone with $29 billion sales in a quarter?  Samsung would kill for these sales figures for its flagship phones. 
    Muntzmuthuk_vanalingamcornchip
  • Reply 27 of 53
    Unfortunately, AI shares some responsibility for yelling "fire" in a crowded theater; along with the other media sites that thrive on clicks. Reporting on sketchy rumors emanating from the oft-wrong Ming Kuo is simply engaging in gossip. For you to now stand on your soapbox to criticize the lazy, shoddy reporting of other media outlets is pretty hypocritical. You did no independent investigation to determine whether Ming's reporting was credible, but you were quick to seize on his rumor mongering for a headline on your site. Unfortunately, this gossiping is not as harmless as the childhood game of telephone; it had real world consequences, i.e. a loss of $7/share for aapl. In my case that translated into a $30k hit to my Apple investment. SEC regulations forbid Apple--or any other publicly traded company--from commenting during the 30-day quiet period prior to their earnings report. But unfortunately, there is no such prohibition on media sites and anal-ysts from engaging in damaging, self-serving speculation. Stick to just reporting on Apple products AI and leave the gossiping to the National Enquirer and TMZ.
    Welcome to the forums! 

    Did you even read the original story? It doesn't seem like you did. You're also not in a position to say that we didn't do fact-checking of our own, as I don't recall you in our work Slack. Also, you may note that we reported on the note an hour after some of our competitors did -- given that we all got the note at the same time, and I had some questions, I thought it fit to make some calls and check some sources before I wrote.

    In any event -- sorry for your loss, I'm sure you'll be fine. However, we will continue to report as we see fit.
    I am not sure why you are taking this stance against what is a very reasonable post. Yes AI needs to post articles that are of interest or relevance to Apple followers, but I too agree that AI has had a role in recent APPL decline by what turns out to be baseless speculation.  AI gives "Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo" way too much air time. He is just one more analyst that is interested in moving AAPL and making money.
    SpamSandwichMuntzStrangeDays
  • Reply 28 of 53
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,442administrator
    Unfortunately, AI shares some responsibility for yelling "fire" in a crowded theater; along with the other media sites that thrive on clicks. Reporting on sketchy rumors emanating from the oft-wrong Ming Kuo is simply engaging in gossip. For you to now stand on your soapbox to criticize the lazy, shoddy reporting of other media outlets is pretty hypocritical. You did no independent investigation to determine whether Ming's reporting was credible, but you were quick to seize on his rumor mongering for a headline on your site. Unfortunately, this gossiping is not as harmless as the childhood game of telephone; it had real world consequences, i.e. a loss of $7/share for aapl. In my case that translated into a $30k hit to my Apple investment. SEC regulations forbid Apple--or any other publicly traded company--from commenting during the 30-day quiet period prior to their earnings report. But unfortunately, there is no such prohibition on media sites and anal-ysts from engaging in damaging, self-serving speculation. Stick to just reporting on Apple products AI and leave the gossiping to the National Enquirer and TMZ.
    Welcome to the forums! 

    Did you even read the original story? It doesn't seem like you did. You're also not in a position to say that we didn't do fact-checking of our own, as I don't recall you in our work Slack. Also, you may note that we reported on the note an hour after some of our competitors did -- given that we all got the note at the same time, and I had some questions, I thought it fit to make some calls and check some sources before I wrote.

    In any event -- sorry for your loss, I'm sure you'll be fine. However, we will continue to report as we see fit.
    I am not sure why you are taking this stance against what is a very reasonable post. Yes AI needs to post articles that are of interest or relevance to Apple followers, but I too agree that AI has had a role in recent APPL decline by what turns out to be baseless speculation.  AI gives "Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo" way too much air time. He is just one more analyst that is interested in moving AAPL and making money.
    You're welcome to agree with him, and you and he can think what you like. 

    However, his basis for his assumptions (fact checking, et cetera) are baseless. Additionally, our report puts no credence on reports of slow iPhone sales, nor does it guess that Apple is doomed as a result.

    Have a nice weekend, everybody! See you on Monday.
    edited January 2018 muthuk_vanalingam2old4funpatchythepirate
  • Reply 29 of 53
    viclauyyc said:
    aricb said:
    I didn't read any of the doomsayer reports on other sites, but i'm willing to bet they are layered in "could be", "possible", "likely", "maybe", and other words liars regularly use. Fox news has used this journalistic loophole to its maximum potential by stating a two minute article and finishing it with "maybe" as the last word.
    Sure they qualify in the story copy, but they just toss crap into the headlines. 

    Newsweek: “Is Apple About to Cancel the iPhone X? Poor Sales Mean Device Faces ‘End of Life

    Forbes: “Apple Leak Reveals Sudden iPhone X Cancellation” (every word false in this one)
    Have you noticed how many ADs in the tiny Forbes article? Seems they are much more interested in selling AD than make accurate reporting.

    Maybe there is too much pressure from “editors”. Maybe the guy just want to make extra few bucks, after all he is not reporter or someone in news business. He is just a content generator, who works in a click bait website.
    That’s what I noticed too. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out the X design will continue in some way, but there will be other models for other consumers too, just that it wouldn’t be branded as the ‘X’ anymore. That’s what the original report was trying to say. There was nothing in there saying they were out and out cancelling the X. Jeez, media has taken a real turn into the dumpster in recent years, just to get people to click on their articles for the advertising revenue. It’s disconcerting because there are actually people out there who consume their content and accept their “reporting” as truth. 
  • Reply 30 of 53
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    tht said:
    News-tainment is bereft of much sense. They only try to create acute drama with every single word possible. I basically ignore all this crap and only start believing after some checking.

    It really behooves everyone to realize what they are watching or reading is not fact or news, and realize that it’s a kind of communal gossip writ large.
    Editorials (which this obviously is) have  existed for hundreds of years.
    Make your point about what was said, claiming it's shit is not a point buddy.
    And yes, considering your response, not reading sure seems like a big problem.
    What was the point of this article? AI: I like your site, I use your app often, but I’m “just not that into you” ...not enough for me to want to read articles about how pretty and wonderful you are. Stick to the facts, not the sympathy requests. And the fact remains that the iPhone X is underselling. Doomed for failure? No, but too expensive and too ugly? Consumer spending is saying “yes”. There’s your story, sans pity.
    Are you triggered, will you cry? What's the point of YOUR RESPONSE and where's your fracking proof about your last sentences.

    Please don't abuse french btw and yeah, I'm french speaking.
    Va acheter un telephone "alphabetique" (sic) merdique et lâche nous la paix.


  • Reply 31 of 53
    clexmanclexman Posts: 148member
    I heard a rumor that car manufacturers were going to discontinue their 2017 models and replace them with 2018 models. It must be because the 2017 models were a failure.
    kseccornchip
  • Reply 32 of 53
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 4,569member
    A phrase headlining the words “pot” and “kettle” comes to mind…


  • Reply 33 of 53
    brakkenbrakken Posts: 677member
    asdasd said:
    Hmm. I expected this to be a DED article. 
    Nope. Just another annoyed AI staffer catching crap for what other venues wrote.
    The difference being that Dilger presents a thesis, analyses accordingly, and presetns a thorougly logical and scintilating conclusion. 
    Dilger, please!
  • Reply 34 of 53
    What was the point of this article? AI: I like your site, I use your app often, but I’m “just not that into you” ...not enough for me to want to read articles about how pretty and wonderful you are. Stick to the facts, not the sympathy requests. And the fact remains that the iPhone X is underselling. Doomed for failure? No, but too expensive and too ugly? Consumer spending is saying “yes”. There’s your story, sans pity.
    Well, you and I have different perspectives on this. Mine is that it’s one of the better articles I’ve read in quite awhile.

    Why? Because even though it’s about the reported life cycle of a simple luxury item, it does a pretty good job of illustrating one of the major challenges facing us as a society today: the frequently inept and sometimes malicious handling of information by those we rely upon for providing information.

    From tech to politics, what the author describes and comments on is all too common.  And destructive on a number of levels.
    Information is now disseminated in orders of magnitude of volume and speed greater than we’ve evolved to process it. And because of this critical thinking is arguably more important now than in the past.  So I’m pleased whenever I see an example of someone in the media (or anywhere, for that matter) thinking critically.

    I don’t mind at all the author’s laying out the process by which AI does its job.  Doing so actually helped me appreciate this site a bit more.

    2old4funmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 35 of 53
    eightzero said:
    mavemufc said:
    Surely anyone with a bit of common sense can see these rumours are fake.
    LOL. Where have you been for the last few years? Common sense? We live in a post-factual world.

    And stop calling me Shirley. 
    Well yeah, but still!
  • Reply 36 of 53
    ksecksec Posts: 1,554member
    So AI, consistently reporting on Apple Rumours, didn't like other reporting the same rumours with a different spin, and decided to call them lacking basic reading comprehension skills.  

    Christ, what has happen to Journalism.
  • Reply 37 of 53
    thedbathedba Posts: 474member
    Unfortunately, AI shares some responsibility for yelling "fire" in a crowded theater; along with the other media sites that thrive on clicks. Reporting on sketchy rumors emanating from the oft-wrong Ming Kuo is simply engaging in gossip. For you to now stand on your soapbox to criticize the lazy, shoddy reporting of other media outlets is pretty hypocritical. You did no independent investigation to determine whether Ming's reporting was credible, but you were quick to seize on his rumor mongering for a headline on your site. Unfortunately, this gossiping is not as harmless as the childhood game of telephone; it had real world consequences, i.e. a loss of $7/share for aapl. In my case that translated into a $30k hit to my Apple investment. SEC regulations forbid Apple--or any other publicly traded company--from commenting during the 30-day quiet period prior to their earnings report. But unfortunately, there is no such prohibition on media sites and anal-ysts from engaging in damaging, self-serving speculation. Stick to just reporting on Apple products AI and leave the gossiping to the National Enquirer and TMZ.
    AI never yelled fire in a crowded theatre as you put it.
    They simply reported on what Ming Chi Kuo put out. And btw, he’s one of the better analysts out there. Not perfect but but better than most.
    As for your $30K hit, that’s the way the market goes. If you can’t take the heat get out. 
    Blaming AI or Kuo isn’t your answer.
    Welcome to AI.
  • Reply 38 of 53
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 3,664member
    mmatz said:
    What was the point of this article? AI: I like your site, I use your app often, but I’m “just not that into you” ...not enough for me to want to read articles about how pretty and wonderful you are. Stick to the facts, not the sympathy requests. And the fact remains that the iPhone X is underselling. Doomed for failure? No, but too expensive and too ugly? Consumer spending is saying “yes”. There’s your story, sans pity.
    Well, you and I have different perspectives on this. Mine is that it’s one of the better articles I’ve read in quite awhile.

    Why? Because even though it’s about the reported life cycle of a simple luxury item, it does a pretty good job of illustrating one of the major challenges facing us as a society today: the frequently inept and sometimes malicious handling of information by those we rely upon for providing information.

    From tech to politics, what the author describes and comments on is all too common.  And destructive on a number of levels.
    Information is now disseminated in orders of magnitude of volume and speed greater than we’ve evolved to process it. And because of this critical thinking is arguably more important now than in the past.  So I’m pleased whenever I see an example of someone in the media (or anywhere, for that matter) thinking critically.

    I don’t mind at all the author’s laying out the process by which AI does its job.  Doing so actually helped me appreciate this site a bit more.

    I think AI does a pretty good job in many areas but having limited finances and staff brings other realities to the table. I will cut a lot of slack to any site that tries to produce the best it can.

    This particular article points an accusing finger at 'mischaracterization' (among other elements) in the tech press but IMO that is precisely what the author did in another article on app store revenues that was published on the same day. Take a look at that one and how it portrays the information it feeds off.

    "... the major challenges facing us as a society today: the frequently inept and sometimes malicious handling of information by those we rely upon for providing information."

    I think DED opinion articles here should be taken for what they are. The opinion of one person. IMO, they are often used to take jabs at Google and Samsung and/or to paint and overwhelmingly pleasing picture of Apple.

    Case at hand. Is the article on Android app store revenues an opinion piece, a factual piece, balanced, unbalanced, etc. A mix of some or all of those elements?

    Whatever your personal take, we mustn't rely on few news outlets for information. In that case the source was given. That is what really counts. From there you can ride with DEDs reading of the numbers, take a different view or look for more to flesh them out.

    Of course, we should also look beyond media names and focus on who is writing. AI has a spread of styles and, from what I can gather, there is a fair amount of editorial freedom available. I think this goes down into forum posters too where you will also find a wide spread of opinion. 

    As long as we are capable of seeing where factual pieces swing into, and then out of, opinion (and sources are provided), most people will be OK.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 39 of 53
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 4,836member
    asdasd said:
    Hmm. I expected this to be a DED article. 
    Nope. Just another annoyed AI staffer catching crap for what other venues wrote.
    For what its worth, you guys do a pretty damn good job. You're always the first place I look for Apple News. Yes, you're not always first as you mentioned, but the information is more than usually correct. Everyone misses every once in a while...I think that just part of the game. 

    I agree it sucks when others take something and spin it around. I don't know what it is with the media today. Everything has to be sensationalized into a negative narrative. Everyone wants everything to fail, fail, fail! It gets headlines, which gets traffic, which makes them more money. Sad part is, people read these stories and think they're true. I wonder how many around the world read these articles and really think the iPhone X is a dud and that Apple is starting to fail? We've seen this time and time again, and then when Apple reports its results its like Apple makes them look like a fool over and over again, but that doesn't stop the media from trying to write a story about Apple's decline afterwards. I don't know what we do to fix this...
    patchythepirate
  • Reply 40 of 53
    The point of this article is that other media twisted the facts that AI wrote about to make it sound like the iPhone X was a failure. Then sensationalized it with Apple is doomed.
    Anyone with half a brain knows Apple has got 1000 times more money then in the early 90's so it is no where near the doomed category no matter how you look at it. Of course Apple stock took a hit as well with these crappy articles that other media spread there lies with. 
    It should be interesting when Apple does there quarterly report and what the sales figures really are. I know in the past these media and Analists keep looking at part orders of vendors and when they go down they assume the product is not selling well. But in fact Apple changed vendors for the parts and even Tim Cook has said in the past don't go by this because we change our sources all the time for many reasons. iPhone X is not underselling by any means, it's not ugly, so Wem you are the one people should pity. Take your sorry ass malware filled Android piece of crap and go somewhere else.
    StrangeDays
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