Apple considers cheaper HomePod in face of lackluster sales

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 95
    And the bad news carries on.
    It is being reported that iTunes is under review and a decision about it will be made next March.
    This is a new article that references the rumour that hit the headlines last month.
    http://www(dot)alphr(dot)com/apple/1009058/apple-killing-itunes-store-apple-music

    This is full-on BS. The venue they're quoting has been declaring the death of iTunes downloads in Year=Year+2 since 2015.

    We've spoken about this before, and recently. https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/03/30/fake-news-apple-isnt-killing-itunes-music-downloads
    Agreed but... If you tell the same story enough times then more and more people will believe it. Then it becomes 'fact' even though it isn't. A sign of the times perhaps?
  • Reply 22 of 95
    bitmodbitmod Posts: 171member
    clarker99 said:
    I searched voice assistant speaker sales for 2017 and the number seems to be 24-27million units worldwide.

    If Apple sells the reported 2.5m HomePods and the voice assistant market grows to ~40m sales (I can make things up like analysts do) then Apple has grabbed 6.25% market share while selling to only 3 countries, limited features, no 3rd party apps, no ports/bluetooth, little to no promotion and primarily promoting it as a high quality speaker. 

    And that 6.25% market share will prob grab the majority of the smart speaker profits.
    No.
  • Reply 23 of 95
    For me, the homepod works. Sounds fantastic. I'm fully immersed in the  ecosystem with music and such. Siri is Siri...for now anyway. I have recommended it to my friends who are similar to me in terms of Apple. I'm a satisfied customer. Not everyone will be...
    watto_cobrajonagold
  • Reply 24 of 95
    FolioFolio Posts: 368member
    No analyst models I’ve seen have any HomePod contribution to revenue, so anything is a bonus. On the plus side, Apple will finally pump talent and $$$ into Siri now. So I’m glad Apple got something out there. Understandably some concern if this launch is sluggish, since Amazon and Google head start with good or better agents in an intimate platform. Since one’s time is zero-sum, interaction with Alexa means less dwell with iPhone, and especially in future more of this as Amazon and Google betting will be “monetized time.” Worrisome as it expands beyond music, to all forms of entertainment, e-commerce, home control. And Google and Amazon can sell below cost and still come out ahead with their different modus operandi. In short, this seems more formidable to me than Watch vs Fitbit. One bright spot? Many Amazon and Google devices are so dirt cheap as to be readily trashed for those who eventually decide to jump to Apple's system. And ultimate success here (with enhanced Siri everywhere) defends and expands Apple's turf.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 95
    bitmodbitmod Posts: 171member
    jcs2305 said:
    cwoody said:
    What did they expect? They made a super niche speaker that’s super pricey and not at all portable or really compatible outside of apples ecosystem. Like I’ve never had the urge to buy a Sonos speaker, because I’ve always had an actual home entertainment system at home. And between Siri being half baked and having lots of inadequacies and HomeKit still feels like a beta, it’s not really worth it from a smart speaker perspective either. You basically need an iOS device to use it... which you can literally use for all of the hey Siri commands on their own. So you’re basically limiting it to someone who wants a very limited stationary speaker with good sound quality and who want to pay a premium for it. I can’t think of a single use for a HomePod in my house and I’m sure a lot of others feel exactly the same way.
    What I expect is the continuing influx of single post trolls talking S*** about a speaker they don't own, and continually quote incorrect info or compare it to a HT setup. There are many places in the home or office that just aren't suitable for a freakin home entertainment system my god the idiocy is just too much.
    Lots of people don't own a 1984 Hyundai Pony either - doesn't mean they don't know it's a crap car. 
    And as far as comparing it to a HT setup... it was the typical mob of fanboy's here that flooded the forums with "it sound's better than a $50,000 HT rig" because of beam forming and an array of $3 tweeters... that opened that Pandora's box. 

    Trolling goes both ways Bub. Over-the-top 'Everything Apple is Perfect in every way and your a troll if you disagree'... is trolling in itself. 
    [Deleted User]muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 26 of 95
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,733member
    foggyhill said:
    Yes, analysts, the same people who crapped on the watch 20 times at least... Yup, lets all believe these guys.

    70% of launch markets (most of EU, Canada, the Americas and Asia) not launched yet and the biggest 4 months of those products are september to january and they pull that out of their ass.

    I'm betting for nearly 8-10M, but hey, don't quote me... Yeah, do.

    That's why I take Apple Insider and Kuo less and less seriously (and all the other tech sites are even worse).

    Please get a journalism degree, this week has been embarassing!! You are veering into the same realm as MacRumors, Verge, etc.
    Did you even read the article? Based on your complaints, it doesn't seem like it. Everything you complained about was in the article before you issued your little tirade.

    FTA: "If the numbers are accurate, and stay at 10 units per day, this would lead to 630,000 sold just through Apple Stores through the end of the year not including what's already been sold, units sold by retailers like Target and Best Buy, and what may be sold by Apple online. This also does not include any holiday increase in sales, as Christmas 2018 will be the first holiday season that the HomePod will be available.

    If Apple sells 630,000 HomePods just at retail, this is still a $220 million business in itself.

    Additionally, the HomePod will be available in France and Germany before the end of the Spring, with more announcements of availability expected before the end of the year."

    The title alone is a departure from sound journalism, not to mention the actual vetting of the actual info.
    Black ink will not make this more professional. Push back only after looking up how it should be done.

    My "tirade" aka "rant" aka" "tired of this" reflects my annoyance at the ever rising clickbaity ways of online "news" and this site which has veered that way lately.

    I'm attacking the integrity of most "sources" used in online news,
    Most should not be used AT ALL for this kind of info.
    This is essentially a self-serving PR package from Kuo to stay in the news cycle
    (and yes, in communications you recognize those things). Kuo is very good at this game.

    In the past, before say 2005, the medias mostly ignored these kinds of things.
    Yet, now despite being mostly WRONG in anything related to volume, financials,
    people like Kuo continue to be published by many media, falling over themselves for clicks.
    The constant need for content has trumped any actual journalism.

    BTW,
    Maybe I'll just scan and send a copy of my grad certificate in communications from Mcgill
    so I get taken half seriously (I don't really think I'm move past half point... ).


    flaneurwatto_cobracornchip[Deleted User]
  • Reply 27 of 95
    bitmodbitmod Posts: 171member
    macxpress said:
    What number is considered a success versus a failure? Not every Apple product is going to sell tens of millions. I think Apple has its own sales goals internally and THEY will determine whether or not HomePod is a success of a failure. Also, when Apple enters a new space, it doesn't always take off right away, just like with Apple Watch and look where Apple Watch is now? iPhone was pretty much the same way. 
    Reaffirming the old tech adage - Never buy rev1 anything. 
  • Reply 28 of 95
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 3,218administrator
    foggyhill said:
    foggyhill said:
    Yes, analysts, the same people who crapped on the watch 20 times at least... Yup, lets all believe these guys.

    70% of launch markets (most of EU, Canada, the Americas and Asia) not launched yet and the biggest 4 months of those products are september to january and they pull that out of their ass.

    I'm betting for nearly 8-10M, but hey, don't quote me... Yeah, do.

    That's why I take Apple Insider and Kuo less and less seriously (and all the other tech sites are even worse).

    Please get a journalism degree, this week has been embarassing!! You are veering into the same realm as MacRumors, Verge, etc.
    Did you even read the article? Based on your complaints, it doesn't seem like it. Everything you complained about was in the article before you issued your little tirade.

    FTA: "If the numbers are accurate, and stay at 10 units per day, this would lead to 630,000 sold just through Apple Stores through the end of the year not including what's already been sold, units sold by retailers like Target and Best Buy, and what may be sold by Apple online. This also does not include any holiday increase in sales, as Christmas 2018 will be the first holiday season that the HomePod will be available.

    If Apple sells 630,000 HomePods just at retail, this is still a $220 million business in itself.

    Additionally, the HomePod will be available in France and Germany before the end of the Spring, with more announcements of availability expected before the end of the year."

    The title alone is a departure from sound journalism, not to mention the actual vetting of the actual info.
    Black ink will not make this more professional. Push back only after looking up how it should be done.

    My "tirade" aka "rant" aka" "tired of this" reflects my annoyance at the ever rising clickbaity ways of online "news" and this site which has veered that way lately.

    I'm attacking the integrity of most "sources" used in online news,
    Most should not be used AT ALL for this kind of info.
    This is essentially a self-serving PR package from Kuo to stay in the news cycle
    (and yes, in communications you recognize those things). Kuo is very good at this game.

    In the past, before say 2005, the medias mostly ignored these kinds of things.
    Yet, now despite being mostly WRONG in anything related to volume, financials,
    people like Kuo continue to be published by many media, falling over themselves for clicks.
    The constant need for content has trumped any actual journalism.

    BTW,
    Maybe I'll just scan and send a copy of my grad certificate in communications from Mcgill
    so I get taken half seriously (I don't really think I'm move past half point... ).


    The "black ink" is for you to read, since, like I said, now I'm certain you didn't bother to read the article. And, your degree in communications should make you able to tell the difference between the news, which is Kuo saying what he thinks, versus the headline, the lede, and the discussion internal to the story.

    We're done here. You want to keep talking crap, feel free to do so in my direct messages, because this is the end of this conversation in the forums. I'm not going to send you my assorted diplomas, so I don't need to see yours.
    edited April 13 MplsPwatto_cobrapscooter63muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 29 of 95
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,169member
    bitmod said:
    macxpress said:
    What number is considered a success versus a failure? Not every Apple product is going to sell tens of millions. I think Apple has its own sales goals internally and THEY will determine whether or not HomePod is a success of a failure. Also, when Apple enters a new space, it doesn't always take off right away, just like with Apple Watch and look where Apple Watch is now? iPhone was pretty much the same way. 
    Reaffirming the old tech adage - Never buy rev1 anything. 
    I don't ascribe to that aphorism. I can't think of any HW product that Apple releases that doesn't have some HW that would be considered revision 1. The HomePod HW is perfectly fine, IMO—it's the firmware and Siri that are hamstringing the device, and we know that both the OS it's forked from and Siri aren't even close to being first gen in concept.

    By comparison, Amazon's Echo was amazing from day one despite having no prior experience in this field and a litany of failed CE before it. I don't feel Apple should be the worst digital personal assistant in the game and yet I couldn't tell you any new commands to try so I'm left with doing the same, simplistic tasks that I've been doing for years.

    Being Friday, I received my "What’s new with Alexa?" email which details new commands, current event commands, a list of the most requested commands, and Skills to try. Being a mostly display-less device I feel  this is extremely important feature (read: out-of-sight, out-of-mind), but of course they have an app and website which allows for all this to be viewed, plus being able to see and rate the queries you've made. I feel that if Apple had allowed users to rate and correct Siri requests they'd be able to have move Siri much further ahead. I hope things change within the Siri camp soon.
    edited April 13 eightzeroelijahgmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 30 of 95
    stanhopestanhope Posts: 123member
    Props to those who bought HomePod.  It was over for me when they missed christmas...add to that the messed up way apple handle my apple music subscription (since cancelled) and SIRI lite and I decided to wait or forego the experience this go around all together.  You can’t even use 2 yet.....whoever piloted this plane needs retraining.
  • Reply 31 of 95
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 6,285member
    cwoody said:
    What did they expect? They made a super niche speaker that’s super pricey and not at all portable or really compatible outside of apples ecosystem. Like I’ve never had the urge to buy a Sonos speaker, because I’ve always had an actual home entertainment system at home. And between Siri being half baked and having lots of inadequacies and HomeKit still feels like a beta, it’s not really worth it from a smart speaker perspective either. You basically need an iOS device to use it... which you can literally use for all of the hey Siri commands on their own. So you’re basically limiting it to someone who wants a very limited stationary speaker with good sound quality and who want to pay a premium for it. I can’t think of a single use for a HomePod in my house and I’m sure a lot of others feel exactly the same way.
    Nice troll.
    watto_cobracornchippscooter63
  • Reply 32 of 95
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,169member
    lkrupp said:
    cwoody said:
    What did they expect? They made a super niche speaker that’s super pricey and not at all portable or really compatible outside of apples ecosystem. Like I’ve never had the urge to buy a Sonos speaker, because I’ve always had an actual home entertainment system at home. And between Siri being half baked and having lots of inadequacies and HomeKit still feels like a beta, it’s not really worth it from a smart speaker perspective either. You basically need an iOS device to use it... which you can literally use for all of the hey Siri commands on their own. So you’re basically limiting it to someone who wants a very limited stationary speaker with good sound quality and who want to pay a premium for it. I can’t think of a single use for a HomePod in my house and I’m sure a lot of others feel exactly the same way.
    Nice troll.
    What about his comment is trollish? I'd even say it's too measured with his use of "you basically need an iOS device" when you can't even set it up without having an "iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch has iOS 11.2.5 or later." No basically about it; you literally need to be in the Apple ecosystem to get it up and running. That's not the case with their other home-based device, the Apple TV.
    MplsP[Deleted User]muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 33 of 95
    chaicka said:
    Launch Markets so limited (3 countries only), what do journalists and analysts expect?
    Well I am sure there is a lot of pent up demand in Antigua, Barbados, Iceland and Qatar that will make those numbers jump.

    The speaker is a flop like Apple Music where Apple has been able to convert almost a Billion iTunes accounts to well under 1/10th that many to the rental model after years of giving away trials to anybody with a pulse.

    That speaker is grossly overpriced. I already have an excellent Focal system in my Living Room and allI have to do is connect an Amazon Dot as an input for more features and far higher sound quality. It won’t cost a King’s Ransom, either.

    That speaker is a flop. When it goes stupid out of warranty repairs start at $275. I am sure a lot of people will spend $275 to fix a speaker that costs $350 before discounts. That is kind of like the iPhone X that costs $1000 but only gets you a little over $400 on Gazelle. Or a $5000 iMac. Someone at Apple needs to give the people in the bubble of Silicon Valley a wake up call.
  • Reply 34 of 95
    eightzeroeightzero Posts: 2,111member
    Soli said:
    bitmod said:
    macxpress said:
    What number is considered a success versus a failure? Not every Apple product is going to sell tens of millions. I think Apple has its own sales goals internally and THEY will determine whether or not HomePod is a success of a failure. Also, when Apple enters a new space, it doesn't always take off right away, just like with Apple Watch and look where Apple Watch is now? iPhone was pretty much the same way. 
    Reaffirming the old tech adage - Never buy rev1 anything. 
    I don't ascribe to that aphorism. I can't think of any HW product that Apple releases that doesn't have some HW that would be considered revision 1. The HomePod HW perfectly fine. It's the firmware and Siri that are hamstringing the device, and we know that both the OS it's forked from and Siri aren't even close to being first generation.

    By comparison, Amazon's Echo was amazing from day one despite having no prior experience in this field and a litany of failed CE before it. I don't feel Apple should be the worst digital personal assistant in the game and yet I couldn't tell you any new commands to try so I'm left with doing the same, simplistic tasks that I've been doing for years.

    Being Friday, I received my "What’s new with Alexa?" email which details new commands to try, current event commands, a list of the most requested commands, and Skills to try. Being a mostly display-less device this is extremely important feature, but of course they have an app which allows for all this plus being able to see and rate the queries you've made. I feel that if Apple had allowed users to rate and correct Siri requests they'd be able to have move Siri much further ahead. I hope things change within the Siri camp soon.
    I'd be curious to see some statistics about the investment made by those respective companies in their voice assistants - Siri and Alexa. Like how much they spend, how many employees, strategic goals. All very, very proprietary, and we never will see these, but it sure seems like Apple is way behind. Granted, perhaps Amazon as more skin in the game, since Alexa is linked to a warehousing system with huge revenue behind it. 
  • Reply 35 of 95
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 4,017member
    deleted
    edited April 13
  • Reply 36 of 95
    kruegdudekruegdude Posts: 147member
    bitmod said:
    jcs2305 said:
    cwoody said:
    What did they expect? They made a super niche speaker that’s super pricey and not at all portable or really compatible outside of apples ecosystem. Like I’ve never had the urge to buy a Sonos speaker, because I’ve always had an actual home entertainment system at home. And between Siri being half baked and having lots of inadequacies and HomeKit still feels like a beta, it’s not really worth it from a smart speaker perspective either. You basically need an iOS device to use it... which you can literally use for all of the hey Siri commands on their own. So you’re basically limiting it to someone who wants a very limited stationary speaker with good sound quality and who want to pay a premium for it. I can’t think of a single use for a HomePod in my house and I’m sure a lot of others feel exactly the same way.
    What I expect is the continuing influx of single post trolls talking S*** about a speaker they don't own, and continually quote incorrect info or compare it to a HT setup. There are many places in the home or office that just aren't suitable for a freakin home entertainment system my god the idiocy is just too much.
    Lots of people don't own a 1984 Hyundai Pony either - doesn't mean they don't know it's a crap car. 
    And as far as comparing it to a HT setup... it was the typical mob of fanboy's here that flooded the forums with "it sound's better than a $50,000 HT rig" because of beam forming and an array of $3 tweeters... that opened that Pandora's box. 

    Trolling goes both ways Bub. Over-the-top 'Everything Apple is Perfect in every way and your a troll if you disagree'... is trolling in itself. 

    Well, since I’m one of those that’s not heard of the Hyundai Pony I can tell you I don’t, and actually can’t, know it’s a crap car. 

    Also, having tried to read every comment in these forums about The HomePod I’m pretty sure no one has compared the HomePod to a $50,000 home theatre system making that a straw man. 

    Combine that with “mob of fanboys” and you’ve got a pretty weak set of talking points which doesn’t lend itself to any kind of constructive conversation on this subject. 

    Unless, of course, your intention was to purposely troll, then well done. 


    Lab4Uswatto_cobra
  • Reply 37 of 95
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 2,602member
    macxpress said:
    What number is considered a success versus a failure? Not every Apple product is going to sell tens of millions. I think Apple has its own sales goals internally and THEY will determine whether or not HomePod is a success of a failure. Also, when Apple enters a new space, it doesn't always take off right away, just like with Apple Watch and look where Apple Watch is now? iPhone was pretty much the same way. 
    Exactly. If it sells, serves its purpose for those who buy it and makes a profit. Mission accomplished. At least for a new product segment in their lineup of this kind.

    We can criticise it for not doing this or that,  Siri, its price even but if it is selling enough to turn a profit and purchasers are happy, then the actual sales numbers are a bit moot right now.

    When it gets a broader roll out, second generation etc, there will more to compare it too.

    Apple obviously has its own projections and will react accordingly but I think this is a category where they'll stick it out and improve it before considering throwing in the towel.

    Right now, it's too early for alarmism.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 38 of 95
    nunzynunzy Posts: 654member
    Apple will never join a race to the bottom.  If anything, they will come out with a Homepod Pro.
    watto_cobracornchipjonagold
  • Reply 39 of 95
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,465member
    bitmod said:
    macxpress said:
    What number is considered a success versus a failure? Not every Apple product is going to sell tens of millions. I think Apple has its own sales goals internally and THEY will determine whether or not HomePod is a success of a failure. Also, when Apple enters a new space, it doesn't always take off right away, just like with Apple Watch and look where Apple Watch is now? iPhone was pretty much the same way. 
    Reaffirming the old tech adage - Never buy rev1 anything. 
    That depends, ese. While you were waiting for the second iPad, I got a full year of the most amazing browsing experience available at that time. 

    The AirPods I got on day one are still a daily joy to use. 

    This here HomePod I’m using is the most incredible little source of great sound I have ever had the daily pleasure to live with for a lousy 350 bucks. Even with its connection idiosyncrasies. And don’t really care at all about talking to a machine unless I’m driving, so Siri can just take her time.

    I am looking foward to another one for stereo when that happens, but this one is still great right now.

    edited April 13 watto_cobrapscooter63
  • Reply 40 of 95
    entropysentropys Posts: 1,207member
    IMHO to fix HomePod issues I offer this free advice (so its worth can be gauged)

    • drop the price
    • Substantially fix SIRI
    • drop the price
    • Substantially fix SIRI
    • stereo
    • drop the price
    • open to other streaming services
    • drop the price

    I have a few thoughts on a more diversified range of speakers (with prices to match) too:
    a portable version
    one with a built in HomeKit server/Apple TV
    a soundbar 
    Over ear headphones (quality sound in all models, but low, mid and high quality range with ANC at the mid and top tiers). These would be higher quality than the equivalent Beats at each price point (let Mr Cook charge $25 more at each tier for teh marrrgins).

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