Apple's weak Chinese iPhone sales blamed directly on high prices

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 83
    maestro64 said:
    IDC always has narrative different than what is really happening, nothing new here. It has been stated by Apple and others the Trade wars had a direct affect on Apple's business in China and the fact their were rumors and statements that Chinese companies were ordering/paying people not to buy Apple but Buy Chinese competitors. 

    Based on this it was not the selling price but trade actions causing the problem.
    How do we know Apple's being honest? It's very hard to believe price isn't affecting sales here and abroad. I'm sure the trade war plays some role but not all of it. 
    If price was the real issue it would have shown up in the numbers all over the world not just China. plus Apple reports their numbers by region and you see the China numbers begin down. Plus Apple is publicly traded company and when they make public statement they can be sued if they are caught not being honest, this is why we have shareholder lawsuits for company who miss lead the investing public. You can not say the same about IDC. I am not saying trust Apple implicitly, but see if their statement align with other things going on. 
    jony0
  • Reply 62 of 83
    maestro64 said:
    [...] I am willing to wait to get something since I know the price will come down or there will be a deal around the corner.
    Really? How much did the price of the Mac mini come down in the four years we waited for an update? How much has the price of a the cylinder Mac Pro come down since it hit the market five years ago?

    I disagree that waiting is a viable solution to overcoming the high price of Apple products.
    Well I have not been in the market for mini or pro the last few years and I bought my Imac from B&H and got $250 plus a free printer in a xmas deal they did, so i did wait and saved money. 

    But in the reality of it all, the cost of tech comes down every year, you are seeing it in the purchase price, but what all you get for that same $100 you spend. So the FaceID phones are expensive now since the tech is really new, eventually the cost of the tech will come down and you will be able to get in a lower cost phone. Plus we know Apple consumer will pay to have what they want. Apple is also the master of know the feature people are willing to pay extra for.

    One thing a learned about tech and cost, and people complaining on the rich can afford it. When tech is new and costly it also does not work real well so the rich got the new buggy stuff where are those who can not afford and have to wait usually get the better quality stuff. This is part of the reason I tend not to buy what is new, wait and it you will be rewarded.

  • Reply 63 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,695member
    designr said:
    Demands curves slope down. Who knew.

    It isn’t just Canada!  I basically canceled two Apple purchases (MAC Mini & IPad) because of he irrationally high prices.  As for the new iPhone I can hardly say it is worth the price.  

    Since 2008 most of my tech purchases have been Apple related but that is coming to a halt.  Gr Rey people and greedy companies just suck!
  • Reply 64 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,695member
    hucom2000 said:
    We're all beating dead horses here, probably.

    But whoever I talk to, Apple fanatics or people who converted from Windows or Anroid over the last few years, agree that Apple's pricing has gone out of hand. Everyone agrees that quality costs money. Yet they unanimously say that the have to re-evaluate whether they can justify buying another Apple device or not.

    Sure, Apple can start lowering prices. But it seems that the damage to Apple's reputation has already been done. In a lot of people's minds they are a company that is selling highly overpriced devices. This makes me sad. It seems like such a foolish mistake to make. I don't understand it. 

    Time Cook keeps talking about how expensive it is to develop these devices. But with the amount of cash the company is garnering every quarter, this seems like a desperate attempt to justify. People are not stupid. Developing the first iPhone, a truly revolutionary device, not evolutionary, with a much smaller marked, must have been very expensive. Yet it cost half as much as today's offerings. In a lot of people's minds - including mine - something just doesn't add up.
    It adds up to greed!!!!   I don’t know of a better word to use here. 

  • Reply 65 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,695member
    maestro64 said:
    IDC always has narrative different than what is really happening, nothing new here. It has been stated by Apple and others the Trade wars had a direct affect on Apple's business in China and the fact their were rumors and statements that Chinese companies were ordering/paying people not to buy Apple but Buy Chinese competitors. 

    Based on this it was not the selling price but trade actions causing the problem.
    Apples selling price is a world wide problem.   It is fairly difficult to accept any arguement that it isn’t as the sentiment is voiced world wide.  
  • Reply 66 of 83
    It's not only the prices are very high, it certainly is in this country, but there are other issues.
    Quality control has dropped, features and ports have been removed from products, improvements in their software products have stagnated, key product lines cancelled, products had not updated for 4-5 years all still were sold at the same release price, the once-good  Apple Store experience has declined, the fact that Apple has more concern for its institutional shareholders than paying users, gigantic pay for high profile employees brought in, etc. All things these are adding up now.
  • Reply 67 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,695member
    maestro64 said:
    [...] I am willing to wait to get something since I know the price will come down or there will be a deal around the corner.
    Really? How much did the price of the Mac mini come down in the four years we waited for an update? How much has the price of a the cylinder Mac Pro come down since it hit the market five years ago?

    I disagree that waiting is a viable solution to overcoming the high price of Apple products.
    The Mac Pro was a huge management disaster.  
    First; off they should have known and understood the high end customer needs.  Those people require a entirely different machine.    
    Second; seconds there is a massive market for more reasonable workstations that the Mac Pro would have been ideal for with a little configuration workand rational pricing.   This is the market where a single decent GPU card is needed and a reasonably priced CPU isrequired to power the machine.  We are talking $1500 for a reasonably configured machine quickly moving to $2000 with a high end GPU.  
    Third; Apple gives up way to easy.  Seriously you look at their response to the Mac Pros failure and you would think that there is a spoiled 5 year old running the company.   The machine hasn’t been touched since introduction.  
    Fourth; Apple seems to like to blame their screw ups on the customer.   

    To develop on #4 a bit consider the Mac Mini.   They introduce a terrifible revision after too long with nothing a few years ago and then use the lack of sales to justify the price increase on the Mini.   Sales are terrible on a highly outdated model that sucked when it was released so to increase profitability we must price the new Mini much higher.  The net result will be simple, sales will suck even with what can finally be said is an excellent update.  It is like Apple can’t help itself but to kill off products with stupidity.  
  • Reply 68 of 83
    lkrupp said:
    Tim Cook is not the right CEO for Apple in 2019. A true definition of success would be to sell the hardware with a razor thin margin, and make buttloads of cash on services. Apple is doing a poor job at services right now - Amazon, Google, Microsoft are performing much better on that regard. And I'm not talking iCloud photo storage here. I'm talking professional SaaS services for both consumers and enterprise. 
    Also Tim Cook should invest cash they are not moving. Buy 20% of Tesla, buy 25% of Netflix. It's frustrating to be a shareholder of a company that keeps money on the banks and over-pays management.
    So do you vote your shares? Have you voted against Cook as CEO? I vote my AAPL shares every year and I like Tim Cook as CEO. If you don’t vote then I cancel you out and then some.
    Absolutely I do vote. I have my money managed and invest in several tech companies. I get mail via the money manager on everything around my invested stock. For example last year I had to vote on the Disney/Fox takeover. Although I haven't specifically voted on Cook and Apple, it is my intend to do so. 
  • Reply 69 of 83
    ivanhivanh Posts: 287member
    You bought a $1,500 iPhone last year because you wanted to run a $10 app? Well, no comment.

    Buy another $1,500 iPhone next year just because you want to run the same app for $0 to maintain its speed in the next year’s iOS version running everything slower every year?

    Are you out of your mind?
  • Reply 70 of 83

    Tim Cook is not the right CEO for Apple in 2019. A true definition of success would be to sell the hardware with a razor thin margin, and make buttloads of cash on services.
    You're high. That may be YOUR definition of success, but it is not a "true" definition of success. Apple became the most successful public corporation in human history by selling hardware. Switching to a services-focused model would put them in league with companies like Netflix, which make peanuts compared to Apple.

    Profit is the air corporations breathe.
    I'm not high, I merely have a different opinion than yours. Hardware profits have proven to be an issue, as the article tells us as well as their performance lately. There's only so much phones and tablets you can sell, and there's only so much you can profit. Services scale so much more. Their hardware should be treated as 'vending machines' for their services. Although I was not referring to Netflix (although I think they should invest in them), I was referring to professional SaaS services, similar to Google's services, including GSuite that scales from consumer use to enterprise teams, which is just one example. They have such a strong hardware and software ecosystem, they should extend that to their services.  
  • Reply 71 of 83
    Since Apple fell 19.9% due to high prices, why did Xaomai fall 34.9% due to lower prices?
    That’s a very good question. I’ve been wondering the same too.
  • Reply 72 of 83
    geekmee said:
    Is this from the same IDC that in 2011 that predicted by 2015 Microsoft would squash Apple in phone sales??
    Seriously, I’ve been reading IDC predictions since 1997 (that’s 22 farking years) and IDC has never been remotely right about anything. Don’t think they are going to be right all of a sudden...
    jony0
  • Reply 73 of 83
    JFC_PAJFC_PA Posts: 289member
    The current state of Apple is symbolized by the un ending rip off and hazzard that is the charging cord and lightening connector. Please if you can my dear user name me one other electronic product cable of the last 50 years that fails and fails within months. There is no other as this problem was solved decades ago. Only apple has this problem and it continues year after year. $40 per cable F u Apple
    Nonsense. My cables last years because I don't trash them. And they cost $20. Even Anker's newest Lightning cable is only $3 cheaper. Big whoop.

    A couple years back my experiment MonoPrice and Amazon cables both fell apart fairly quickly tho -- the plug assemblies came apart. Never happened with any of my Apple cables. 
    Bah nonsense 
    so you claim I’m using  the cable wrong. 
    I call bullshit. 
    I use the cable. Period. 
    No other cable has experienced this failure on any device in my near 5o years. 
     It has never occurred on anything ever but an Apple product and this has happened continually since my first iPhone v1. 
    So spare us defending the most valuable company on Earth who somehow can’t make a power cord that doesn’t fray. 


    LOL.  You created a screen name based solely on the fact that you mistreat your Apple cable and want to whine about it?

    My family has owned at least 20 iPods, iPads, and iPhones over the years.  Most of those cables are still working fine.  Have I replaced some?  Not that I recall, but perhaps one or two.  It certainly hasn't been a big deal.
    One cable failure is too many. 
    Name any other product from a toaster to a hairdryer that has failed cables. 

    And go fuck your self for the rude childish reply 



    Power drill: cord failed. Coffee maker: cord failed. Power saw: cord failed.    Rice maker: cord failed. Connecting and disconnecting cords can lead to fatigue and failure, or just fraying that doesn’t look safe and at 110 volts I’m less sanguine than a 5 watt usb connector once I see a start of fraying a 110 volt cord is gone. . It happens. While out of possibly a dozen iPhone, iPad and iPod cables? Not a one. I did have an EarPods connector go bad, but as I get a new one with every phone it wasn’t a tragedy. 

    OBTW? What with Qi standard wireless charging? The latest iPhones. Do. Not. Need. A. Power cord!’  Your lifelong nightmare has ended. Happy for you. 

    Apple support page:
    https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208078
    edited February 12 jony0fastasleep
  • Reply 74 of 83
    Tim Cook is not the right CEO for Apple in 2019. A true definition of success would be to sell the hardware with a razor thin margin, and make buttloads of cash on services.
    Where did you pull that definition of success from? Your butt?
    jony0fastasleep
  • Reply 75 of 83
    Same for the US. One bad thing about promoting a former CFO to CEO is their mindset; the vision is not innovation, the vision is profit. For shareholders, it's a great short-term ride. Long-term, it's another ride, down the other side of that roller coaster. Be careful what you wish for.
  • Reply 76 of 83
    The current state of Apple is symbolized by the un ending rip off and hazzard that is the charging cord and lightening connector. Please if you can my dear user name me one other electronic product cable of the last 50 years that fails and fails within months. There is no other as this problem was solved decades ago. Only apple has this problem and it continues year after year. $40 per cable F u Apple
    Nonsense. My cables last years because I don't trash them. And they cost $20. Even Anker's newest Lightning cable is only $3 cheaper. Big whoop.

    A couple years back my experiment MonoPrice and Amazon cables both fell apart fairly quickly tho -- the plug assemblies came apart. Never happened with any of my Apple cables. 
    Bah nonsense 
    so you claim I’m using  the cable wrong. 
    I call bullshit. 
    I use the cable. Period. 
    No other cable has experienced this failure on any device in my near 5o years. 
     It has never occurred on anything ever but an Apple product and this has happened continually since my first iPhone v1. 
    So spare us defending the most valuable company on Earth who somehow can’t make a power cord that doesn’t fray. 


    My experience with Apple cables is about the same as any other brand, not so much better or worse that I've noticed a significant difference. However, lots and lots and lots and lots of people have this same complaint. Everywhere I go I see desks with Lighting cables held together with Scotch tape (literally). I find it hard to imagine that so many people are outright abusive of their cables, which leads me to think maybe those of us who consciously avoid doing things that will cause cable failure are the minority.
    I agree. Same could be said for the folks that claim to not have trouble with Apple branded cables as well.  I have also noticed the same thing you have with tape and whatever else holding cables together. I have also seen many people yank and toss cables in ways I NEVER would. A lot of people pull these things from just above the actual lightning connector itself on the cable. Or how many times do folks use their devices while they are plugged. They forget and stand up and rip the plug out of the device?  I think what some see as normal use others would consider mishandling. 

    I have only had Apple branded cables go bad on me when it is one I keep in the car 24/7. I prefer to plug my phone in to the armrest usb rather than use blue tooth in my vehicle. So I keep a cord constantly plugged in to use whenever I want music in the car.  I am in Eastern PA and it gets pretty cold in the winter and pretty hot in the summers. So the heat cycling and sunlight tend to make them more susceptible to the casing crack. Other than that I have been using the same cables in the house for years now without problems. 
  • Reply 77 of 83
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,197administrator
    acejax805 said:
    Same for the US. One bad thing about promoting a former CFO to CEO is their mindset; the vision is not innovation, the vision is profit. For shareholders, it's a great short-term ride. Long-term, it's another ride, down the other side of that roller coaster. Be careful what you wish for.
    Apple’s public financial data for the US says otherwise.
    jony0
  • Reply 78 of 83
    The current state of Apple is symbolized by the un ending rip off and hazzard that is the charging cord and lightening connector. Please if you can my dear user name me one other electronic product cable of the last 50 years that fails and fails within months. There is no other as this problem was solved decades ago. Only apple has this problem and it continues year after year. $40 per cable F u Apple
    Nonsense. My cables last years because I don't trash them. And they cost $20. Even Anker's newest Lightning cable is only $3 cheaper. Big whoop.

    A couple years back my experiment MonoPrice and Amazon cables both fell apart fairly quickly tho -- the plug assemblies came apart. Never happened with any of my Apple cables. 
    Bah nonsense 
    so you claim I’m using  the cable wrong. 
    I call bullshit. 
    I use the cable. Period. 
    No other cable has experienced this failure on any device in my near 5o years. 
     It has never occurred on anything ever but an Apple product and this has happened continually since my first iPhone v1. 
    So spare us defending the most valuable company on Earth who somehow can’t make a power cord that doesn’t fray. 


    LOL.  You created a screen name based solely on the fact that you mistreat your Apple cable and want to whine about it?

    My family has owned at least 20 iPods, iPads, and iPhones over the years.  Most of those cables are still working fine.  Have I replaced some?  Not that I recall, but perhaps one or two.  It certainly hasn't been a big deal.
    Why do people here jump to the conclusion that people who have trouble with failing cables are mistreating them? Why do you assume your experience is typical and his is unusual? Why is any complaint "whining?"

    I don't have a lot of trouble with Apple cables either, but I'm not so arrogant as to assume my experience extends to everyone else.
    There are millions of lightning enabled devices in the wild.  I don't see the amount of people reporting problems here and other boards as a large enough sample size to say there is a manufacturing issue with Apple branded cables. I have multiple cables throughout the house with multiple users grabbing and using them daily without issues.

    I sit in the same boat as others saying I have not had cables fail like some have reported.  I am not some Apple cheerleader that would just blindly defend a stupid charging cable, and I don't believe others here are doing that either.... well maybe some people are  B)   There is unfortunately a LOT of whining from a bunch of "I just joined to bash Apple" posters that really muck up things up when it comes to who is actually having issues and who is a full of shit troll unfortunately.

    I will also say that I had more issues with the old style 30 pin connector than I ever had with a lightning cable. Sheesh.. especially the original style that had to be squeezed on the sides to release from the device! Can't remember how many times I saw people trying to force those off because they had no idea there were release buttons on the side.


  • Reply 79 of 83
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,233member
    maestro64 said:
    maestro64 said:
    IDC always has narrative different than what is really happening, nothing new here. It has been stated by Apple and others the Trade wars had a direct affect on Apple's business in China and the fact their were rumors and statements that Chinese companies were ordering/paying people not to buy Apple but Buy Chinese competitors. 

    Based on this it was not the selling price but trade actions causing the problem.
    How do we know Apple's being honest? It's very hard to believe price isn't affecting sales here and abroad. I'm sure the trade war plays some role but not all of it. 
    If price was the real issue it would have shown up in the numbers all over the world not just China. plus Apple reports their numbers by region and you see the China numbers begin down. Plus Apple is publicly traded company and when they make public statement they can be sued if they are caught not being honest, this is why we have shareholder lawsuits for company who miss lead the investing public. You can not say the same about IDC. I am not saying trust Apple implicitly, but see if their statement align with other things going on. 
    I personally think it is the rise of nationalist sentiment in China, in particular after the arrest of the Huawei CFO.
  • Reply 80 of 83
    jony0jony0 Posts: 269member
    acejax805 said:
    Same for the US. One bad thing about promoting a former CFO to CEO is their mindset; the vision is not innovation, the vision is profit. For shareholders, it's a great short-term ride. Long-term, it's another ride, down the other side of that roller coaster. Be careful what you wish for.
    Well then it's great that Apple didn't fall into that trap.
    One good thing about promoting a former COO to CEO is their mindset; the vision is not primarily innovation or profit but efficiency and upscaling. For shareholders, it can be a slighty down short-term ride ramping up. Long-term, it's another ride, up the other side of that roller coaster. Just what I wished for. 
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