Cameras on 'iPhone 12' may offer 240fps 4K video, use 7-element lenses

Posted:
in iPhone edited July 2020
The "iPhone 12" could be capable of recording video at up to 240fps at a 4K resolution, and 2020 may be the last year that iPhones use a 7-piece plastic lens, a leaker claims.

Cameras on the iPhone 11 Pro models.
Cameras on the iPhone 11 Pro models.


The imaging capabilities of the iPhone have been a major selling point for the smartphone line, and has been a major marketing tool for years. As Apple continues to improve the camera system on the "iPhone 12," it is claimed a bigger change may be coming to video.

According to YouTube's EverythingApplePro as well as Max Weinbach, Apple is working on adding the ability to record video using the rear cameras at a 4K resolution at frame rates of 120fps and 240fps. References were apparently discovered in the camera app supplied as part of the initial iOS 14 developer beta, while other sources suggest Apple is continuing to test the capability for video capture internally.

For consumers, this change would be a considerable increase from current 4K-resolution frame rates, and effectively enables the slo-mo function to operate at higher resolutions.





Continuing the camera rumors, a Weibo leaker is cited as claiming the "iPhone 12" range will be the only one to offer cameras with a seven-element plastic lens, an increase from the six-element version used in the iPhone 11. While this isn't a new suggestion, as it has previously been brought up by Ming-Chi Kuo in March, the leaker goes further in suggesting Apple is already working on eight-piece lenses for its 2021 iPhones.

The video also touched upon other elements of the "iPhone 12," including a claim that production of the "A14" SoC will begin in the next week, following a Chinese holiday. The chip will have almost double the number of transistors at 15 billion compared to the 8.5 billion used on the A13.

For the display, a production update for the Pro Motion panels indicates 120Hz screens are still likely to arrive in 2020 for the "iPhone 12 Pro" models. While the "iPhone 12 Pro Max" screen has passed five out of five production tests, the non-Max version has achieved four out of five, with the miss attributed to its smaller size.

Despite the hardware failure, it is apparently a fixable problem, but the cost to rectify may prompt Apple to pull Pro Motion for this cycle.

As for connectivity, it is claimed a version of the "iPhone 12" using the Qualcomm X60 5G modem has passed engineering tests, which could lead to its use in the 2020 model instead of being put off into the 2021 version. A Weibo leaker writes that the modem has "successfully passed a series of final tests of Apple performance," covering power consumption, heat dissipation, noise, interference, electromagnetic waves, and other concerns.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 28
    hmlongcohmlongco Posts: 582member
    "The chip will have almost double the number of transistors at 15 billion compared to the 8.5 billion used on the A13."

    That's... impressive. What are they going to do with all of that extra silicon?
  • Reply 2 of 28
    hmlongco said:
    "The chip will have almost double the number of transistors at 15 billion compared to the 8.5 billion used on the A13."

    That's... impressive. What are they going to do with all of that extra silicon?
    ARM Mac? The A12z already matches an 10th Gen i7.
  • Reply 3 of 28
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 8,021member
    The X60 would be a big plus.

    At its announcement QC said it would be available at the absolute earliest in late 2020. 

    It might also allow Apple to kill two birds with one stone. Be one of the first to use the X60 and resolve the rumoured size problems for the 5G antenna as QC released a smaller antenna package along with the modem.

    There was talk of Apple trying to design their own antennas but I can't remember if that was supposed to be for the 2020 or 2021 iPhones. 
    lkruppGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 4 of 28
    frantisekfrantisek Posts: 761member
    hmlongco said:
    "The chip will have almost double the number of transistors at 15 billion compared to the 8.5 billion used on the A13."

    That's... impressive. What are they going to do with all of that extra silicon?

    Isn't 4K 240 FPS enough? AR VR functionality, AI, LiDAR capability and computational photography, video processioning anytime...And beefed up version for Mac. Question whether A14 mentioned here is for phone not Mac.
    If true, isn't it going to be insane?
  • Reply 5 of 28
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    A bit more zoom power in the phone‘s camera would be nice. The current zoom is impressive, but some competitors go a bit further and I’ve seen more of a need for it as I take more outdoor shots.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 6 of 28
    uraharaurahara Posts: 733member
    A bit more zoom power in the phone‘s camera would be nice. The current zoom is impressive, but some competitors go a bit further and I’ve seen more of a need for it as I take more outdoor shots.
    Just zoom it in the editor, and save. 
    I assume you are speaking about digital zoom. 
  • Reply 7 of 28
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,640member
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 8 of 28
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 4,038member
    240 FPS @ 4K - dang, those files will take a lot of memory!
  • Reply 9 of 28
    MplsP said:
    240 FPS @ 4K - dang, those files will take a lot of memory!
    True, but hopefully they’ll also be relatively short. Personally I don’t really like to have slo-mo videos where the slo-mo part is more than just a few seconds.

    I’m also curious if they’ll enable an even higher FPS at 1080. 
    frantisek
  • Reply 10 of 28
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,557member
    hmlongco said:
    "The chip will have almost double the number of transistors at 15 billion compared to the 8.5 billion used on the A13."

    That's... impressive. What are they going to do with all of that extra silicon?
    The future, man, the future. Enough horsepower to do whatever they can think of.
  • Reply 11 of 28
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,557member

    melgross said:
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    On the other hand Apple has made it very clear they want complete control of the hardware. If Apple Silicon kicks Intel's ass as rumored then Apple might still try to make its own 5G modem, especially if they can get better performance than QC product. You are right though, Qualcomm will do whatever it takes to keep Apple's business.
  • Reply 12 of 28
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,455member
    lkrupp said:

    melgross said:
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    On the other hand Apple has made it very clear they want complete control of the hardware. If Apple Silicon kicks Intel's ass as rumored then Apple might still try to make its own 5G modem, especially if they can get better performance than QC product. You are right though, Qualcomm will do whatever it takes to keep Apple's business.
    Apple will definitely be making its own modems, sooner than later, but in the meantime, it doesn't hurt Qualcomm to have Apple as one of the lead users of the X60 modem.

    Frankly, I'm quite happy that I put off purchase of the current iPhone for this fall's. About the only feature that is missing in the rumors, is the ability to use the Apple Pencil, and that was always a long shot anyway, albeit Scribble opens the door for that in the near future.
  • Reply 13 of 28
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    urahara said:
    A bit more zoom power in the phone‘s camera would be nice. The current zoom is impressive, but some competitors go a bit further and I’ve seen more of a need for it as I take more outdoor shots.
    Just zoom it in the editor, and save. 
    I assume you are speaking about digital zoom. 
    Increased optical zoom would be nice, but if that’s no longer physically possible I imagine the resolution of the pixels will continue to improve.
  • Reply 14 of 28
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 4,038member
    urahara said:
    A bit more zoom power in the phone‘s camera would be nice. The current zoom is impressive, but some competitors go a bit further and I’ve seen more of a need for it as I take more outdoor shots.
    Just zoom it in the editor, and save. 
    I assume you are speaking about digital zoom. 
    Increased optical zoom would be nice, but if that’s no longer physically possible I imagine the resolution of the pixels will continue to improve.
    ??? I assume you mean the number of pixels on the sensor since a pixel will always have a resolution of one pixel. :wink: 

    Increasing the number of pixels is not a guarantee of better image quality. As the pixels get smaller on the sensor they are more prone to noise, and as we’ve seen in the last several years, the image processing plays as much of a role as the sensor itself. 

    A few years ago we took a trip and I brought with a canon point and shoot camera. Nominally the sensor and lens were better than my 6s but the pics taken on my 6s were better quality. 
  • Reply 15 of 28
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    lkrupp said:

    melgross said:
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    On the other hand Apple has made it very clear they want complete control of the hardware. If Apple Silicon kicks Intel's ass as rumored then Apple might still try to make its own 5G modem, especially if they can get better performance than QC product. You are right though, Qualcomm will do whatever it takes to keep Apple's business.

    Perhaps....
    But Apple's history is that they would rather go with a high end reliable vendor than do it inhouse.
    The trouble is that Intel has been flailing and failing and Qualcomm were greedy jerks thinking that THEY owned the iPhone.   While Intel is spinning its wheels, Qualcomm appears to have mended their ways.  Or, at least we are hoping that they have
  • Reply 16 of 28
    seanismorrisseanismorris Posts: 1,624member
    The iPhone SE is looking better and better.

    The “flagship” Apple phones are designed for someone else.  A better camera isn’t going to drive my purchase.

    A better microphone, better speakers, better screen, longer battery life... all important,  every day.

    The processor & camera on iPhones are overkill.
  • Reply 17 of 28
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,455member
    lkrupp said:

    melgross said:
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    On the other hand Apple has made it very clear they want complete control of the hardware. If Apple Silicon kicks Intel's ass as rumored then Apple might still try to make its own 5G modem, especially if they can get better performance than QC product. You are right though, Qualcomm will do whatever it takes to keep Apple's business.

    Perhaps....
    But Apple's history is that they would rather go with a high end reliable vendor than do it inhouse.
    The trouble is that Intel has been flailing and failing and Qualcomm were greedy jerks thinking that THEY owned the iPhone.   While Intel is spinning its wheels, Qualcomm appears to have mended their ways.  Or, at least we are hoping that they have
    As part of the deal deal made with Qualcomm, Apple licensed a broad range of Qualcomm's IP. Given the IP that Apple obtained from purchase of "the majority" of Intel's modem business , and what Apple already owns or licenses from other third parties, I would be surprised in Apple doesn't have its own range of modem designs in a few years.
    edited June 2020 GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 18 of 28
    CheeseFreezeCheeseFreeze Posts: 1,344member
    I’m mostly hoping for a larger sensor. 1” is wishful thinking considering the physical size of the phone, but more DoF, better low light performance and higher dynamic range would be awesome to have.
  • Reply 19 of 28
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    tmay said:
    lkrupp said:

    melgross said:
    I’ve been saying that apple may not get the current Qualcomm modem. Qualcomm is bending over backwards to make Apple happy. The better the modems they get, particularly if they get them a half cycle before Android makers, could keep Apple with Qualcomm longer than otherwise.
    On the other hand Apple has made it very clear they want complete control of the hardware. If Apple Silicon kicks Intel's ass as rumored then Apple might still try to make its own 5G modem, especially if they can get better performance than QC product. You are right though, Qualcomm will do whatever it takes to keep Apple's business.

    Perhaps....
    But Apple's history is that they would rather go with a high end reliable vendor than do it inhouse.
    The trouble is that Intel has been flailing and failing and Qualcomm were greedy jerks thinking that THEY owned the iPhone.   While Intel is spinning its wheels, Qualcomm appears to have mended their ways.  Or, at least we are hoping that they have
    As part of the deal deal made with Qualcomm, Apple licensed a broad range of Qualcomm's IP. Given the IP that Apple obtained from purchase of "the majority" of Intel's modem business , and what Apple already owns or licenses from other third parties, I would be surprised in Apple doesn't have its own range of modem designs in a few years.

    I didn't know that Apple had licensed Qualcomm IP.   That makes it more likely that they are still planning their own modems than that Qualcomm had mended their ways and had become a responsible, trustworthy business partner.
  • Reply 20 of 28
    boboliciousbobolicious Posts: 1,174member
    I'd like to see an upgraded ultra wide lens:
    - as sharp as the main 'pro' lens
    - with less chromatic aberration
    - that can be fully used in video mode (vs cropped)
    - gives me reason to abandon the Zeiss Exolens
    I assume such small lenses present many design challenges...
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