2021 Apple TV 4K versus 2017 Apple TV 4K - Who should buy the new model, and who should no...

2»

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 37
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    ...

    Pop a pair of HomePods next to your Apple TV and you get [Sort of Get] Dolby Atmos.

    ...
    Fixed that for you!

    I am hoping Apple will develop something expandable out into a Home Theater system.  They could start with a Sound Bar that could convert to a center speaker as you add Subwoofer, front speakers, rear speakers and (maybe) overhead speakers to provide full and real Dolby Atmos.

    That would be fully consistent with Apple's long time commitment to music and sound.  And besides, they sadly discontinued the HomePod
    Beats
  • Reply 22 of 37
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,067member
    I recently bought a new Vizio set for our gym room and since it came with the Apple TV app (and AirPlay and HomeKit) and other streaming apps I thought it would be all set. Nope. The Vizio is so slow it’s absolutely painful to use the UI to do anything. And the convoluted crappy UX problems make my SO simply use an iPad instead of the bigger TV! So, it will be necessary to hook an ATV up to it after all. Moving my HD one in there and putting this new 4K in the living room. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 37
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,067member
    ...

    Pop a pair of HomePods next to your Apple TV and you get [Sort of Get] Dolby Atmos.

    ...
    Fixed that for you!

    I am hoping Apple will develop something expandable out into a Home Theater system.  They could start with a Sound Bar that could convert to a center speaker as you add Subwoofer, front speakers, rear speakers and (maybe) overhead speakers to provide full and real Dolby Atmos.

    That would be fully consistent with Apple's long time commitment to music and sound.  And besides, they sadly discontinued the HomePod
    Er no, producing a line of home theater components is not fully consistent with their product line (“A 1000 No’s For Every Yes”). Would I like one? Sure. But I’d also like an Apple router and a printer and home automation devices. But it’s just not their bag. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 37
    neilmneilm Posts: 951member
    One reason to buy a new 2021 ATV 4K, even if you already have the previous ATV 4K model, is that the old one remains functional and even has some monetary value. You can use it yourself in another room, give it to family or a friend, or even sell it.

    I ordered mine today.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 37
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    I recently bought a new Vizio set for our gym room and since it came with the Apple TV app (and AirPlay and HomeKit) and other streaming apps I thought it would be all set. Nope. The Vizio is so slow it’s absolutely painful to use the UI to do anything. And the convoluted crappy UX problems make my SO simply use an iPad instead of the bigger TV! So, it will be necessary to hook an ATV up to it after all. Moving my HD one in there and putting this new 4K in the living room. 

    My friend's Vizio is the same
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 26 of 37
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    ...

    Pop a pair of HomePods next to your Apple TV and you get [Sort of Get] Dolby Atmos.

    ...
    Fixed that for you!

    I am hoping Apple will develop something expandable out into a Home Theater system.  They could start with a Sound Bar that could convert to a center speaker as you add Subwoofer, front speakers, rear speakers and (maybe) overhead speakers to provide full and real Dolby Atmos.

    That would be fully consistent with Apple's long time commitment to music and sound.  And besides, they sadly discontinued the HomePod
    Er no, producing a line of home theater components is not fully consistent with their product line (“A 1000 No’s For Every Yes”). Would I like one? Sure. But I’d also like an Apple router and a printer and home automation devices. But it’s just not their bag. 

    Sorry, but Apple has been highly involved in music and its delivery since almost its beginning and proud of it.   In fact, they revolutionized the music delivery industry.

    Since then they have entered into TV / streaming services as well as sound delivery.

    So, yeh, its is and it has been a part of their business.  Putting out a high end sound system would just be part of that.

    Admittedly, Tim may think that there's not enough profit in it.  We will see.
    Beats
  • Reply 27 of 37
    ...

    Pop a pair of HomePods next to your Apple TV and you get [Sort of Get] Dolby Atmos.

    ...
    Fixed that for you!

    I am hoping Apple will develop something expandable out into a Home Theater system.  They could start with a Sound Bar that could convert to a center speaker as you add Subwoofer, front speakers, rear speakers and (maybe) overhead speakers to provide full and real Dolby Atmos.

    That would be fully consistent with Apple's long time commitment to music and sound.  And besides, they sadly discontinued the HomePod
    Er no, producing a line of home theater components is not fully consistent with their product line (“A 1000 No’s For Every Yes”). Would I like one? Sure. But I’d also like an Apple router and a printer and home automation devices. But it’s just not their bag. 
    There are solid rumors to the contrary. Basically the idea is that Apple found many of the original HomePods ended up just sitting next to Apple TVs. So they’ve been discontinued and now they are working on a hybrid Apple TV and HomePod, put into a soundbar-like device, maybe also with a separate camera for videoconferencing.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 37
    BeatsBeats Posts: 3,035member
    PATHETIC.

    $149 for an HD Apple TV?? WTF??

    If Apple wants to compete with shi**y players like Roku they could have kept last gen’s 4K and dropped the price of THAT. It’s OLD with an even older processor!  Apple could drop the price of last gen’s 4K to $99 with 32GB storage and still potentially make profit with how outdated it is.

    The new ATV is useless to me. There’s no reason to upgrade. The only good feature added(120Hz) benefits gaming the most and ironically gaming is ignored.

    This is what would have satisfied me:

    Apple TV 4K (A10x) 32GB $99
    Apple TV 4K (A12)  64GB $149
    But there’s still ONE MORE THING...
    Apple TV Pro (M1) 256GB $299
    (Gaming and Camera array benefits)
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 29 of 37
    BeatsBeats Posts: 3,035member
    viclauyyc said:
    I just wish the new ATV has additional audio output. 

    If I hook it directly to my TV, I can only use the TV speaker or optical out to my soundbar.  

    But if it has audio out, I can connect it to my HT system. Yes, I can connect the ATV to the receiver in my HT. But I don’t want want any video quality loss.  
    Why would you get video quality loss hooking the ATV up to your receiver as an input? I did this for years. It’s no different than hooking a BluRay player up as an input. 

    Technically he should get ZERO quality loss if all inputs and outputs are the same HDMI spec.

    If he has OCD like me then we don’t wanna doubt and we want straight connections and disregard theory often.

    entropys said:

    Ofer said:
    Apple totally dropped the ball here IMO. It’s one thing to take an area where Apple dominates, such as the iPad, and only offer minor incremental updates. They can get away with taking their time. It’s another thing altogether when Apple is the minority player. They’re obviously not going to compete with the Rokus and the Amazon Fire sticks on price. So they need to compete with innovation and features. There is nothing obviously innovative about the newest iteration of the Apple TV. Very few people (outside of brand loyalists) are going to pay the premium price on the new Apple TV over the cheaper offerings from other companies.

    As for me personally, the only feature I was hoping for, support for Spatial Audio, is not being offered on the new Apple TV. I thought this would’ve been a no-brainer.

    Well, obviously a reason is the ATV is very unlikely to be placed in the centre of your TV screen, meaning if spatial audio was directed to your ATV, it would be off centre all the time.

    Of course, I don’t see why you couldn’t do a software version of spacial audio for the TV. For example in ATV settings build a Calibrate location feature by placing your iPhone over a square in the centre of your TV screen, and have spacial audio in the ATV remember where that is in the room. That would work with older 4K and HD ATVs as well

    A FaceID camera array placed on top your TV would solve this and plenty other problems. Too many to list.

    ivanh said:
    How does the latest Apple TV 4K compare to the Apple TV app installed in the much cheaper Google TV? 
    It’s a good question. To really answer it, you’d need to have both. Google TV definitely studied Apple’s tvOS and the tv app, and it seems to sort of combine them.

    On tvOS, the tv app serves three functions, [1] home to all your tv Channels, [2] a way to find and buy/rent movies and television shows using your Apple ID, and [3] a place where you can track and access most of the content you’ve been watching on tvOS/iOS/iPadOS/macOS (Netflix and a few other, smaller ones, like MHz Choice, don’t participate, but all of the other big ones do).

    On Google TV, that third function is absorbed by Google TV itself, and it looks a lot like the tv app:

    https://tv.google/

    I don’t know if the tv app running on Google TV still has that third function. Probably not. Nonetheless, the first two functions, home to tv+ and any other Channels you subscribe to, plus media content you’ve bought with your Apple ID, will work just fine:

    https://support.apple.com/guide/tvplus/google-tv-apd6fda69173/1.0/web/1.0

    My goodness!! I wish Apple could sue the sh** out of these knockoff companies.



    Pathetic of Google. If we turned this into a “spot the difference” game we would have a tough time.
  • Reply 30 of 37
    omasouomasou Posts: 324member
    ivanh said:
    How does the latest Apple TV 4K compare to the Apple TV app installed in the much cheaper Google TV? 
    It does everything the Apple TV hardware does except the ability to install app and therefore no Apple Arcade or Apple Fitness+.

    BTW, If it matters, I am running the Apple TV on a Sony A8H with Android not Google TV.
    Beats
  • Reply 31 of 37
    chasmchasm Posts: 2,481member
    omasou said:
    ivanh said:
    How does the latest Apple TV 4K compare to the Apple TV app installed in the much cheaper Google TV? 
    It does everything the Apple TV hardware does except the ability to install app and therefore no Apple Arcade or Apple Fitness+.

    BTW, If it matters, I am running the Apple TV on a Sony A8H with Android not Google TV.
    Your answer is on point, but you missed one important feature: DOESN'T CONSTANTLY SPY ON YOU. If you think Google gathers a lot of information on its users, wait till you find out how much your TV maker knows about you and what you watch, search for, etc.

    I'm a very happy Apple TV 4K owner (bought shortly after it first came out (late 2017) as a xmas present. But I will likely replace it with the new version for xmas this year. Reasons include: knowing that it will get many years of support, the new remote, the faster chip, potential for future audio/video enhancements/standards, Apple Arcade, Apple Fitness+, working with my pair of HomePods, compatibility with any future reinvention of the HomePod concept, and most importantly PRIVACY AND SECURITY, none of which (apart from possibly the last item) is offered by the Apple TV app embedded in TVs.
    Beatswatto_cobra
  • Reply 32 of 37
    omasouomasou Posts: 324member
    chasm said:
    omasou said:
    ivanh said:
    How does the latest Apple TV 4K compare to the Apple TV app installed in the much cheaper Google TV? 
    It does everything the Apple TV hardware does except the ability to install app and therefore no Apple Arcade or Apple Fitness+.

    BTW, If it matters, I am running the Apple TV on a Sony A8H with Android not Google TV.
    Your answer is on point, but you missed one important feature: DOESN'T CONSTANTLY SPY ON YOU. If you think Google gathers a lot of information on its users, wait till you find out how much your TV maker knows about you and what you watch, search for, etc.

    I'm a very happy Apple TV 4K owner (bought shortly after it first came out (late 2017) as a xmas present. But I will likely replace it with the new version for xmas this year. Reasons include: knowing that it will get many years of support, the new remote, the faster chip, potential for future audio/video enhancements/standards, Apple Arcade, Apple Fitness+, working with my pair of HomePods, compatibility with any future reinvention of the HomePod concept, and most importantly PRIVACY AND SECURITY, none of which (apart from possibly the last item) is offered by the Apple TV app embedded in TVs.
    If the TV is hooked to an external device it still knows something and honestly nothing I can do about it. The new Sony TVs are fantastic, the remote functions well w/all the services, etc.

    I do, do my best buy signing out of Google once I install my apps and set the privacy features I can.

    The only complaint I have is that the remote is BT, which I had to disable to make it send IR for my sound bar and I lose the Google Voice assistant for search, which surprisingly was pretty good in fact I was very surprised by how good and fast the Android TV is but like you said then it captures that info too.

    One resent change Sony made in the last few days was to updated the home UI for TVs and PS. The new UI is all about recommendations and favorite lists. I hate it. I'm so tired of the Internet and everything else "recommending" and "personalizing". I know there is a ton of search results that are not being returned that would be more helpful than what is returned.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 33 of 37
    omasouomasou Posts: 324member
    Beats said:
    PATHETIC.

    $149 for an HD Apple TV?? WTF??

    If Apple wants to compete with shi**y players like Roku they could have kept last gen’s 4K and dropped the price of THAT. It’s OLD with an even older processor!  Apple could drop the price of last gen’s 4K to $99 with 32GB storage and still potentially make profit with how outdated it is.

    The new ATV is useless to me. There’s no reason to upgrade. The only good feature added(120Hz) benefits gaming the most and ironically gaming is ignored.

    This is what would have satisfied me:

    Apple TV 4K (A10x) 32GB $99
    Apple TV 4K (A12)  64GB $149
    But there’s still ONE MORE THING...
    Apple TV Pro (M1) 256GB $299
    (Gaming and Camera array benefits)
    How long have you been following Apple? They don't do the race to the bottom and marketshare FUD. They sell what they feel are quality products at what some argue is a fair price. The don't need or want to compete w/Roku. Though they did just hand them there hats b/c just like CarPlay a lot of new TV manufactures support the Apple TV app, AirPlay and HomeKit. Previously, I had noticed every manufacture including Roku. Maybe they still do but just not yelling about it anymore.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 34 of 37
    omasouomasou Posts: 324member
    I'm wondering if they included the A12 b/c of the pandemic and availability of newer chips?
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 37
    BeatsBeats Posts: 3,035member
    omasou said:
    Beats said:
    PATHETIC.

    $149 for an HD Apple TV?? WTF??

    If Apple wants to compete with shi**y players like Roku they could have kept last gen’s 4K and dropped the price of THAT. It’s OLD with an even older processor!  Apple could drop the price of last gen’s 4K to $99 with 32GB storage and still potentially make profit with how outdated it is.

    The new ATV is useless to me. There’s no reason to upgrade. The only good feature added(120Hz) benefits gaming the most and ironically gaming is ignored.

    This is what would have satisfied me:

    Apple TV 4K (A10x) 32GB $99
    Apple TV 4K (A12)  64GB $149
    But there’s still ONE MORE THING...
    Apple TV Pro (M1) 256GB $299
    (Gaming and Camera array benefits)
    How long have you been following Apple? They don't do the race to the bottom and marketshare FUD. They sell what they feel are quality products at what some argue is a fair price. The don't need or want to compete w/Roku. Though they did just hand them there hats b/c just like CarPlay a lot of new TV manufactures support the Apple TV app, AirPlay and HomeKit. Previously, I had noticed every manufacture including Roku. Maybe they still do but just not yelling about it anymore.

    That’s weird. Why are they using bottom chips then?
  • Reply 36 of 37
    nicholfdnicholfd Posts: 793member
    Beats said:
    omasou said:
    Beats said:
    PATHETIC.

    $149 for an HD Apple TV?? WTF??

    If Apple wants to compete with shi**y players like Roku they could have kept last gen’s 4K and dropped the price of THAT. It’s OLD with an even older processor!  Apple could drop the price of last gen’s 4K to $99 with 32GB storage and still potentially make profit with how outdated it is.

    The new ATV is useless to me. There’s no reason to upgrade. The only good feature added(120Hz) benefits gaming the most and ironically gaming is ignored.

    This is what would have satisfied me:

    Apple TV 4K (A10x) 32GB $99
    Apple TV 4K (A12)  64GB $149
    But there’s still ONE MORE THING...
    Apple TV Pro (M1) 256GB $299
    (Gaming and Camera array benefits)
    How long have you been following Apple? They don't do the race to the bottom and marketshare FUD. They sell what they feel are quality products at what some argue is a fair price. The don't need or want to compete w/Roku. Though they did just hand them there hats b/c just like CarPlay a lot of new TV manufactures support the Apple TV app, AirPlay and HomeKit. Previously, I had noticed every manufacture including Roku. Maybe they still do but just not yelling about it anymore.

    That’s weird. Why are they using bottom chips then?
    Because Apple's "bottom" chip is better than mosts "top" chips.  And I think they are using the chip that is required for the job, not necessarily the "bottom".
    omasouwatto_cobra
  • Reply 37 of 37
    omasouomasou Posts: 324member
    Beats said:
    omasou said:
    Beats said:
    PATHETIC.

    $149 for an HD Apple TV?? WTF??

    If Apple wants to compete with shi**y players like Roku they could have kept last gen’s 4K and dropped the price of THAT. It’s OLD with an even older processor!  Apple could drop the price of last gen’s 4K to $99 with 32GB storage and still potentially make profit with how outdated it is.

    The new ATV is useless to me. There’s no reason to upgrade. The only good feature added(120Hz) benefits gaming the most and ironically gaming is ignored.

    This is what would have satisfied me:

    Apple TV 4K (A10x) 32GB $99
    Apple TV 4K (A12)  64GB $149
    But there’s still ONE MORE THING...
    Apple TV Pro (M1) 256GB $299
    (Gaming and Camera array benefits)
    How long have you been following Apple? They don't do the race to the bottom and marketshare FUD. They sell what they feel are quality products at what some argue is a fair price. The don't need or want to compete w/Roku. Though they did just hand them there hats b/c just like CarPlay a lot of new TV manufactures support the Apple TV app, AirPlay and HomeKit. Previously, I had noticed every manufacture including Roku. Maybe they still do but just not yelling about it anymore.

    That’s weird. Why are they using bottom chips then?
    Like @nicholfd mentioned its the chip required to do the job and certainly not "a bottom chip" or its pandemic supply chain related.
    edited May 2021
Sign In or Register to comment.