You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic. Your trick is keep blaming Xi that if US imposes sanctions on China it is not against Chinese people.
I don't have to live in the PRC like you do, so I don't give a fuck what you think. But you thinking that Xi Jinping is free of blame is delusional.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
You spend too much time on China. You don't know US government. You don't know America. Which country US government encouraged business? Except Israel, I cannot think of any. Not Japan, not Taiwan, not South Korea, not Mexico, not Canada.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
You spend too much time on China. You don't know US government. You don't know America. Which country US government encouraged business? Except Israel, I cannot think of any. Not Japan, not Taiwan, not South Korea, not Mexico, not Canada.
So you don't think that the U.S. encourages business with Canada, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, India, Taiwan, South Korea, Mexico., plus the UK, EU, and many other friendly countries?
You think that the U.S. doesn't encourage trade with China, yet China is our largest import market, and third largest export market. Perhaps you are confused because the U.S. has been applying trade restriction to the PRC because of mercantilism and human rights violations, not to mention the militarization.
Personally, I would like to see much more of U.S. trade with China sourced elsewhere, but that will take awhile.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
You spend too much time on China. You don't know US government. You don't know America. Which country US government encouraged business? Except Israel, I cannot think of any. Not Japan, not Taiwan, not South Korea, not Mexico, not Canada.
So you don't think that the U.S. encourages business with Canada, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, India, Taiwan, South Korea, Mexico., plus the UK, EU, and many other friendly countries?
You think that the U.S. doesn't encourage trade with China, yet China is our largest import market, and third largest export market. Perhaps you are confused because the U.S. has been applying trade restriction to the PRC because of mercantilism and human rights violations, not to mention the militarization.
Personally, I would like to see much more of U.S. trade with China sourced elsewhere, but that will take awhile.
You are not an American. You don't know America. If US government encourages business investment in foreign country, it will encounter opposition from opposing US companies.
The virus is NOT leaked from the Wuhan lab. The chief scientist in the lab has records of all viruses in the lab. After covid-19 broke out, she compared it to all the viruses in the lab and found no match.
And you believe that? There is a ton of circumstantial evidence that points to this leaking from the lab in Wuhan. China hasn't been very transparent with anyone trying to research the origins of the virus. The last thing I would do is believe a Chinese government scientist. Look up the gain-of-function research experiments they were doing in the Wuhan lab with bat coronaviruses. The original theory of this starting in the wet market in Wuhan has already turned out to be wrong. All the animals tested in the Wuhan market came back negative for covid. Until more evidence surfaces to say otherwise, everything points to covid leaking from the Wuhan lab.
No, there is no evidence that it originated in the Wuhan lab. That evidence consists of circumstantial speculation that it COULD HAVE, not that it did. To the purveyors of anti-China propaganda, it is up to China to prove that it didn't simply because they have already pronounced China guilty by means of politicized rhetoric.
Like wise there is now a petition with 25 million signatures to look at Ft Detrick because it COULD HAVE originated there just as easily.
Should we have to prove that it didn't -- because somebody speculated that it did? Perhaps a WHO inspection and investigation?
And, why would you believe right wing propagandists who we KNOW are prolific liars and dealers in disinformation over the WHO and the Chinese government? Oh yeh, we believe Q over facts, evidence and science.
There is circumstantial evidence it possibly originated from the Wuhan Lab. There is no other evidence that points elsewhere currently. China has no one but themselves to blame over anti-China rhetoric you see here, in Australia, and Europe. They hid covid from the world for months. They lied about the covid numbers there. They are still hiding evidence and not being cooperative with the WHO and other investigations. That is a fact and has nothing to do with politics. Why did China reject a further WHO investigation over the origins of covid? China hasn't been very transparent about what was going on during the early days of the covid pandemic. If this didn't come from the Wuhan Lab, then why is China refusing to turn over the raw data from the first covid cases?
There is zero evidence covid came from here. That's ridiculous.
I'm no right wing propagandist, but I find it funny everyone saying Trump is an idiot for saying it came from the Wuhan Lab. Facebook, Twitter, etc were banning his comments. Now with a Democratic led White House, even Biden and his staff are finding the Wuhan Lab leak possibility credible. Even the WHO is saying China wouldn't turn over information and they weren't very cooperative during their first investigation.
China's track record has been pretty poor so I don't see how you or anyone else can defend them over the way they have been handling covid.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
You spend too much time on China. You don't know US government. You don't know America. Which country US government encouraged business? Except Israel, I cannot think of any. Not Japan, not Taiwan, not South Korea, not Mexico, not Canada.
So you don't think that the U.S. encourages business with Canada, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, India, Taiwan, South Korea, Mexico., plus the UK, EU, and many other friendly countries?
You think that the U.S. doesn't encourage trade with China, yet China is our largest import market, and third largest export market. Perhaps you are confused because the U.S. has been applying trade restriction to the PRC because of mercantilism and human rights violations, not to mention the militarization.
Personally, I would like to see much more of U.S. trade with China sourced elsewhere, but that will take awhile.
You are not an American. You don't know America. If US government encourages business investment in foreign country, it will encounter opposition from opposing US companies.
The virus is NOT leaked from the Wuhan lab. The chief scientist in the lab has records of all viruses in the lab. After covid-19 broke out, she compared it to all the viruses in the lab and found no match.
And you believe that? There is a ton of circumstantial evidence that points to this leaking from the lab in Wuhan. China hasn't been very transparent with anyone trying to research the origins of the virus. The last thing I would do is believe a Chinese government scientist. Look up the gain-of-function research experiments they were doing in the Wuhan lab with bat coronaviruses. The original theory of this starting in the wet market in Wuhan has already turned out to be wrong. All the animals tested in the Wuhan market came back negative for covid. Until more evidence surfaces to say otherwise, everything points to covid leaking from the Wuhan lab.
No, there is no evidence that it originated in the Wuhan lab. That evidence consists of circumstantial speculation that it COULD HAVE, not that it did. To the purveyors of anti-China propaganda, it is up to China to prove that it didn't simply because they have already pronounced China guilty by means of politicized rhetoric.
Like wise there is now a petition with 25 million signatures to look at Ft Detrick because it COULD HAVE originated there just as easily.
Should we have to prove that it didn't -- because somebody speculated that it did? Perhaps a WHO inspection and investigation?
And, why would you believe right wing propagandists who we KNOW are prolific liars and dealers in disinformation over the WHO and the Chinese government? Oh yeh, we believe Q over facts, evidence and science.
There is circumstantial evidence it possibly originated from the Wuhan Lab. There is no other evidence that points elsewhere currently. China has no one but themselves to blame over anti-China rhetoric you see here, in Australia, and Europe. They hid covid from the world for months. They lied about the covid numbers there. They are still hiding evidence and not being cooperative with the WHO and other investigations. That is a fact and has nothing to do with politics. Why did China reject a further WHO investigation over the origins of covid? China hasn't been very transparent about what was going on during the early days of the covid pandemic. If this didn't come from the Wuhan Lab, then why is China refusing to turn over the raw data from the first covid cases?
There is zero evidence covid came from here. That's ridiculous.
I'm no right wing propagandist, but I find it funny everyone saying Trump is an idiot for saying it came from the Wuhan Lab. Facebook, Twitter, etc were banning his comments. Now with a Democratic led White House, even Biden and his staff are finding the Wuhan Lab leak possibility credible. Even the WHO is saying China wouldn't turn over information and they weren't very cooperative during their first investigation.
China's track record has been pretty poor so I don't see how you or anyone else can defend them over the way they have been handling covid.
Who is playing politics? Who is trying to hide facts? Why don't you summon Virologist Danielle Anderson questioning her experience while working in Wuhan lab?
Suppose it does come out that the virus was man made by China. Would Apple, who has become so politically correct, say one word? No, they won’t. And it would be be so hypocritical
What if it comes out that the virus came from the U.S.? Would you say one word? No, you won't. And it would be so hypocritical.
There is zero evidence that the SARS-COVID 19 virus originated in the U.S.
Was the virus spreading in people outside China before December 2019?
Answering this question is also key to establishing the timeline of the first COVID-19 cases. Previously, researchers in Europe have reported1,2,3 finding antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 in samples taken at blood banks from November 2019 onwards.
Ben Embarek says this doesn’t necessarily suggest the virus originated in Europe, but supports the idea that it was spreading in Wuhan before the first known cases. “Wuhan at that time was a very well-connected international city with direct flights to the entire planet on a daily basis. So if it was circulating in Wuhan, it could easily have been brought to other parts of the world through travellers, and circulating again, undetected, in different regions,” he says.
Still, he recommends that the blood samples from Europe be retested to confirm that they indicate cases of COVID-19. Some of them, from Italy and France, are already being reanalysed, he says.
As scientists with relevant expertise, we agree with the WHO director-general (5), the United States and 13 other countries (6), and the European Union (7) that greater clarity about the origins of this pandemic is necessary and feasible to achieve. We must take hypotheses about both natural and laboratory spillovers seriously until we have sufficient data. A proper investigation should be transparent, objective, data-driven, inclusive of broad expertise, subject to independent oversight, and responsibly managed to minimize the impact of conflicts of interest. Public health agencies and research laboratories alike need to open their records to the public. Investigators should document the veracity and provenance of data from which analyses are conducted and conclusions drawn, so that analyses are reproducible by independent experts.
Needless to say, China would resort to official propaganda blaming the Ft. Detrick Laboratory in the U.S., rather than allow the World to investigate the origin of SARS-COVID 19.
Gain of function is pioneered in the western world. In other words, western scientists have been doing this kind of experiment all the time. Covid-19 may not be originated from Ft. Derrick Laboratory. But this lab must be doing similar experiment. There was an accident in the lab early in 2019. Why US government does not allow inspection in the lab? The argument for rein spection of the Wuhan lab is to prevent another pandemic in the future. I think this argument should be applied to all the virus labs in the world. Don't you agree?
Blood work from U.S. patients taken in 2019 show they were infected with the virus. So, did we give it to China or did they give it us? Or, most likely, did a third country give it to both of us.
But, because of politics, both countries will continue pointing fingers at each other rather than seeking the truth -- which, frankly is a moot point right now. We should be focused on eradicating the virus rather than a grade school squabble over who pushed who.
One of the expectations of a new and independent investigation in China would be for China to provide PCR testing of all their blood work taken in the Hubei Province from August thru November, and perhaps even earlier, to determine how long the SARS-COVID 19 had been circulating in China. It's a certainty that testing would show SARS-COVID 19 circulating much earlier than those few samples found in the rest of the world, including the U.S.
Given that Wuhan has airline connections to most of the world, it wouldn't be unexpected to find SARS-COVID 19 outside of China, but it would also be the case that these variants would be derivatives of the original variant, hence why the investigation must test those blood samples in the Hubei Province.
They aren't stupid. They know those pushing for a second investigation are only looking for a way to further their political and ideological agenda -- and any further investigation would be neither transparent or impartial.
China's "Wolf Warrior Diplomacy" is merely a reaction to U.S. smear campaigns. They tried ignoring the smears, but they continued. So, China is pushing back.
... But, as usual, the playground bully throws a hissy fit when his victim hits back
Yeah, that must be it. /s
So, you make no secret of the fact that the only reason you China haters are pushing continued investigations is to smear China.
It's been our "strategy" since the beginning: instead of protecting our people and economy we smeared China.
It is why the virus ran rampant through the U.S.: we have been running on delusion instead of fact. Delusion that sucked in gullible people like you: "Hey! Fool! Look Over There!"
Meanwhile, China managed the virus well, never had massive deaths from it and it caused only short blip in their economy.
Here, we will likely never fully recover from it economically. The young people with massive student loans will also be saddled with massive federal debt.
Ironically, China is in a worse economic position than the U.S. because our vaccines have a high efficacy, and the U.S. is already recovering.
Stronger recoveries from the Covid-19 pandemic in the US, the UK and other rich western countries will result in faster than expected growth for the global economy this year, the International Monetary Fund has predicted.
The Washington-based IMF’s half-yearly World Economic Outlook (WEO) said successful vaccine programmes, businesses adapting to the challenges of lockdown and Joe Biden’s $1.9tn (£1.4tn) stimulus package had been key factors in the upgrade.
After contracting by 3.3% in 2020, the IMF said the world economy would now grow by 6% in 2021 and a further 4.4% in 2022. The last WEO in October had predicted expansion of 5.2% in 2021 and 4.2% in 2022. The October forecast for 2021 was later upgraded to 5.5% growth in January this year.
Many observers look at China and see its leadership playing a masterful game. They see China refusing to bend its policies to fit global norms and successfully going its own way. The reality is that Beijing has tried to bend repeatedly under President Xi Jinping but has almost broken each time and has had to fall back on its old ways—which are not succeeding. The quantity and the quality of China’s growth (looking past the anomalies of the pandemic period) have both deteriorated. And unless the leadership of the Chinese Communist Party finds its way back to the path of economic liberalization, China’s future will look very different from the rosy picture the CCP paints.
The urgency of reform is a happy result of China’s rise to middle-income status from the extreme poverty it experienced just a few decades ago. It is nothing to be ashamed of. But the applause that China has earned for its economic successes will subside if Xi fails to tolerate policy debate and accept more constrained political ambitions that admit the limits of the CCP’s capabilities.
It's apparent that Xi Jinping is causing the West to reduce investments in China, and re-source much of its current manufacturing to other, more liberal countries. This will have a long term impact on China's economy which is becoming debt laden, and over aged.
This is manipulation of logic and disregard US government has been doing since Trump was elected in 2016. US government has never encouraged businesses to invest in China since diplomatic relation was established in 1979 over forty years ago. As an American, how come you don't know this fact? Where have you been since 2016. Oh, yes! You have busy reading all anti-China propaganda. LOL
Suppose it does come out that the virus was man made by China. Would Apple, who has become so politically correct, say one word? No, they won’t. And it would be be so hypocritical
What if it comes out that the virus came from the U.S.? Would you say one word? No, you won't. And it would be so hypocritical.
There is zero evidence that the SARS-COVID 19 virus originated in the U.S.
Was the virus spreading in people outside China before December 2019?
Answering this question is also key to establishing the timeline of the first COVID-19 cases. Previously, researchers in Europe have reported1,2,3 finding antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 in samples taken at blood banks from November 2019 onwards.
Ben Embarek says this doesn’t necessarily suggest the virus originated in Europe, but supports the idea that it was spreading in Wuhan before the first known cases. “Wuhan at that time was a very well-connected international city with direct flights to the entire planet on a daily basis. So if it was circulating in Wuhan, it could easily have been brought to other parts of the world through travellers, and circulating again, undetected, in different regions,” he says.
Still, he recommends that the blood samples from Europe be retested to confirm that they indicate cases of COVID-19. Some of them, from Italy and France, are already being reanalysed, he says.
As scientists with relevant expertise, we agree with the WHO director-general (5), the United States and 13 other countries (6), and the European Union (7) that greater clarity about the origins of this pandemic is necessary and feasible to achieve. We must take hypotheses about both natural and laboratory spillovers seriously until we have sufficient data. A proper investigation should be transparent, objective, data-driven, inclusive of broad expertise, subject to independent oversight, and responsibly managed to minimize the impact of conflicts of interest. Public health agencies and research laboratories alike need to open their records to the public. Investigators should document the veracity and provenance of data from which analyses are conducted and conclusions drawn, so that analyses are reproducible by independent experts.
Needless to say, China would resort to official propaganda blaming the Ft. Detrick Laboratory in the U.S., rather than allow the World to investigate the origin of SARS-COVID 19.
Gain of function is pioneered in the western world. In other words, western scientists have been doing this kind of experiment all the time. Covid-19 may not be originated from Ft. Derrick Laboratory. But this lab must be doing similar experiment. There was an accident in the lab early in 2019. Why US government does not allow inspection in the lab? The argument for rein spection of the Wuhan lab is to prevent another pandemic in the future. I think this argument should be applied to all the virus labs in the world. Don't you agree?
Blood work from U.S. patients taken in 2019 show they were infected with the virus. So, did we give it to China or did they give it us? Or, most likely, did a third country give it to both of us.
But, because of politics, both countries will continue pointing fingers at each other rather than seeking the truth -- which, frankly is a moot point right now. We should be focused on eradicating the virus rather than a grade school squabble over who pushed who.
One of the expectations of a new and independent investigation in China would be for China to provide PCR testing of all their blood work taken in the Hubei Province from August thru November, and perhaps even earlier, to determine how long the SARS-COVID 19 had been circulating in China. It's a certainty that testing would show SARS-COVID 19 circulating much earlier than those few samples found in the rest of the world, including the U.S.
Given that Wuhan has airline connections to most of the world, it wouldn't be unexpected to find SARS-COVID 19 outside of China, but it would also be the case that these variants would be derivatives of the original variant, hence why the investigation must test those blood samples in the Hubei Province.
They aren't stupid. They know those pushing for a second investigation are only looking for a way to further their political and ideological agenda -- and any further investigation would be neither transparent or impartial.
China's "Wolf Warrior Diplomacy" is merely a reaction to U.S. smear campaigns. They tried ignoring the smears, but they continued. So, China is pushing back.
... But, as usual, the playground bully throws a hissy fit when his victim hits back
Yeah, that must be it. /s
It would not answer the question if the virus was brought in from outside. How would you resolve this question?
The PRC has had 20 months to figure out where it originated, and they have not acknowledged that origin yet. It's likely that they never will.
If you are postulating that the virus came from outside China, then the PRC would still have to determine an origin within China. Then they would have to determine a plausible connection made from outside China. That hasn't happened.
It could be originated from Italy. Blood samples showed that antibody as early as October, 2019.
Then it should be easy to test blood samples in the Hubei Province to find out when SARS-COVID 19 shows up.
Oh, wait. That would require an independent investigation that the PRC won't allow.
Italy found the antibody as early as October 2019. There is little value gained testing Hubei.
Little value only if the PRC is afraid of what they will find has been circulating earlier than that. Science requires that testing be done on blood samples taken much earlier than symptomatic cases, if finding the actual origin is the goal
So, you claim to be fact based but dismiss any fact that exposes your hatred of China to be a sham.
According to you: "It had to be in China first because I hate China". Got it.
LOL!
I love how you so casually dismiss science. You're fine noting that there were a very few cases of COVID 19 found in testing blood samples in the U.S. the occurred in late November, but you don't acknowledge that China needs to look through its blood samples even earlier to see when the first case(s) of COVID 19 ceccured in the Hubei Province. Recall that China had deaths attributed to COVID 19 months before any in the U.S., implying that COVID 19 had been circulating even earlier than November in China.
What are you so afraid of? That China will be determined absolutely to be the source? That is an accurate assumption already. No wonder the world is losing patience with China.
It's true that China has used it's authoritarianism, again, and again, to lockdown it's citizens, including even today, and the U.S. has a large number of anti-vaxxers to contend with, but it is also true that China's vaccine efficacy hover's around 50%, meaning that their vaccinated population is much less protected, especially the Delta Variant, than ours, where the vaccines are over 90% efficacy. China really only has lockdowns to mitigate the spread, and it is in fact hurting their economy as well.
LOL... You apparently don't realize that hate and science are two very different things.
Your argument that China needs to be investigated because the U.S. discovered the virus was circulating here in 2019 is somewhere between laughable and pitiful. And, because China identified it, took action and announced it to the world before we even knew it was circulating here, to you, means: "Blame China".
So is that hate driven delusion of yours pitiful or laughable? I'm leaning towards pitiful
When you trained to be a "psychiatric nurse" did you even have to attend any biology classes?
This is basic. China had unidentified symptomatic cases of what would be known later as SARS-COVID 19, months before those few asymptomatic cases occurred in the U.S, discovered only after testing older blood samples after the pandemic was in full swing. China hasn't provided the same testing to rule out SARS-COVID 19 circulating in late summer of 2019 .
LOL...
So, because you hate China, that proves that they had "symptomatic cases" and the U.S. didn't -- even though we now know that we had cases that we failed to recognize as COVID back in 2019 and possibly even before China did.
Sorry, I didn't think your obsessively deluded mind could sink any further. I was wrong about that.
I guess that proves the power of propaganda over a weak mind.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
The U.S. government does not encourage business in ANY country but our own.
That was a nice try at justifying your obsessive hate. But again, it failed.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic. Your trick is keep blaming Xi that if US imposes sanctions on China it is not against Chinese people.
No, he focuses very well on topic -- because his topic is "I HATE CHINA - and you should too!"
So, he wonders from topic to topic trying to justify his hatred. And, whenever he loses one argument he resurrects another. And, at this point, since he's lost so many arguments, he simply resurrects old ones.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic. Your trick is keep blaming Xi that if US imposes sanctions on China it is not against Chinese people.
I don't have to live in the PRC like you do, so I don't give a fuck what you think. ...
You Parrot Trump well: When you lose a debate, attack the messenger -- with lies.
You think if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes true. Obviously Trump's lies did -- at least in your head.
You have tried to dodge your comment implying US government has been encouraging businesses investing in China. This is not true. You are not able to focus on topic. It means you are a person lack of logic.
I'm telling you why the U.S. Government isn't encouraging business in China, and hasn't for decades. Do you really think that the U.S. Government would continue to encourage business in China after Tiananmen Square? Do you think that the U.S. Government encourages business in countries that have gotten more repressive since trade was established?
Yet U.S. businesses are in China. How can that be? Simple. Capitalism. But the balance is shifting, and capitalism is being constrained by U.S. outrage over China's Human Rights violations.
Now you have the PRC blocking its own tech companies from investment. Surely, at some point, you have to admit that Xi Jinping is bad for business and investment.
Have you ever even watched the videos of Tiananmen Square? I'm guessing that it is banned by the PRC.
The U.S. government does not encourage business in ANY country but our own.
That was a nice try at justifying your obsessive hate. But again, it failed.
LOL!
You might want to look up the U.S. State and Commerce Departments...and the International Trade Commission...
Create prosperity by strengthening the international competitiveness of U.S. industry, promoting trade and investment, and ensuring fair trade and compliance with trade laws and agreements.
ITA VISION
Foster economic growth and prosperity through global trade.
ITA VALUES
High standards of personal integrity and professional excellence
Suppose it does come out that the virus was man made by China. Would Apple, who has become so politically correct, say one word? No, they won’t. And it would be be so hypocritical
What if it comes out that the virus came from the U.S.? Would you say one word? No, you won't. And it would be so hypocritical.
There is zero evidence that the SARS-COVID 19 virus originated in the U.S.
Was the virus spreading in people outside China before December 2019?
Answering this question is also key to establishing the timeline of the first COVID-19 cases. Previously, researchers in Europe have reported1,2,3 finding antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 in samples taken at blood banks from November 2019 onwards.
Ben Embarek says this doesn’t necessarily suggest the virus originated in Europe, but supports the idea that it was spreading in Wuhan before the first known cases. “Wuhan at that time was a very well-connected international city with direct flights to the entire planet on a daily basis. So if it was circulating in Wuhan, it could easily have been brought to other parts of the world through travellers, and circulating again, undetected, in different regions,” he says.
Still, he recommends that the blood samples from Europe be retested to confirm that they indicate cases of COVID-19. Some of them, from Italy and France, are already being reanalysed, he says.
As scientists with relevant expertise, we agree with the WHO director-general (5), the United States and 13 other countries (6), and the European Union (7) that greater clarity about the origins of this pandemic is necessary and feasible to achieve. We must take hypotheses about both natural and laboratory spillovers seriously until we have sufficient data. A proper investigation should be transparent, objective, data-driven, inclusive of broad expertise, subject to independent oversight, and responsibly managed to minimize the impact of conflicts of interest. Public health agencies and research laboratories alike need to open their records to the public. Investigators should document the veracity and provenance of data from which analyses are conducted and conclusions drawn, so that analyses are reproducible by independent experts.
Needless to say, China would resort to official propaganda blaming the Ft. Detrick Laboratory in the U.S., rather than allow the World to investigate the origin of SARS-COVID 19.
Gain of function is pioneered in the western world. In other words, western scientists have been doing this kind of experiment all the time. Covid-19 may not be originated from Ft. Derrick Laboratory. But this lab must be doing similar experiment. There was an accident in the lab early in 2019. Why US government does not allow inspection in the lab? The argument for rein spection of the Wuhan lab is to prevent another pandemic in the future. I think this argument should be applied to all the virus labs in the world. Don't you agree?
Blood work from U.S. patients taken in 2019 show they were infected with the virus. So, did we give it to China or did they give it us? Or, most likely, did a third country give it to both of us.
But, because of politics, both countries will continue pointing fingers at each other rather than seeking the truth -- which, frankly is a moot point right now. We should be focused on eradicating the virus rather than a grade school squabble over who pushed who.
One of the expectations of a new and independent investigation in China would be for China to provide PCR testing of all their blood work taken in the Hubei Province from August thru November, and perhaps even earlier, to determine how long the SARS-COVID 19 had been circulating in China. It's a certainty that testing would show SARS-COVID 19 circulating much earlier than those few samples found in the rest of the world, including the U.S.
Given that Wuhan has airline connections to most of the world, it wouldn't be unexpected to find SARS-COVID 19 outside of China, but it would also be the case that these variants would be derivatives of the original variant, hence why the investigation must test those blood samples in the Hubei Province.
They aren't stupid. They know those pushing for a second investigation are only looking for a way to further their political and ideological agenda -- and any further investigation would be neither transparent or impartial.
China's "Wolf Warrior Diplomacy" is merely a reaction to U.S. smear campaigns. They tried ignoring the smears, but they continued. So, China is pushing back.
... But, as usual, the playground bully throws a hissy fit when his victim hits back
Yeah, that must be it. /s
It would not answer the question if the virus was brought in from outside. How would you resolve this question?
The PRC has had 20 months to figure out where it originated, and they have not acknowledged that origin yet. It's likely that they never will.
If you are postulating that the virus came from outside China, then the PRC would still have to determine an origin within China. Then they would have to determine a plausible connection made from outside China. That hasn't happened.
It could be originated from Italy. Blood samples showed that antibody as early as October, 2019.
Then it should be easy to test blood samples in the Hubei Province to find out when SARS-COVID 19 shows up.
Oh, wait. That would require an independent investigation that the PRC won't allow.
Italy found the antibody as early as October 2019. There is little value gained testing Hubei.
Little value only if the PRC is afraid of what they will find has been circulating earlier than that. Science requires that testing be done on blood samples taken much earlier than symptomatic cases, if finding the actual origin is the goal
So, you claim to be fact based but dismiss any fact that exposes your hatred of China to be a sham.
According to you: "It had to be in China first because I hate China". Got it.
LOL!
I love how you so casually dismiss science. You're fine noting that there were a very few cases of COVID 19 found in testing blood samples in the U.S. the occurred in late November, but you don't acknowledge that China needs to look through its blood samples even earlier to see when the first case(s) of COVID 19 ceccured in the Hubei Province. Recall that China had deaths attributed to COVID 19 months before any in the U.S., implying that COVID 19 had been circulating even earlier than November in China.
What are you so afraid of? That China will be determined absolutely to be the source? That is an accurate assumption already. No wonder the world is losing patience with China.
It's true that China has used it's authoritarianism, again, and again, to lockdown it's citizens, including even today, and the U.S. has a large number of anti-vaxxers to contend with, but it is also true that China's vaccine efficacy hover's around 50%, meaning that their vaccinated population is much less protected, especially the Delta Variant, than ours, where the vaccines are over 90% efficacy. China really only has lockdowns to mitigate the spread, and it is in fact hurting their economy as well.
LOL... You apparently don't realize that hate and science are two very different things.
Your argument that China needs to be investigated because the U.S. discovered the virus was circulating here in 2019 is somewhere between laughable and pitiful. And, because China identified it, took action and announced it to the world before we even knew it was circulating here, to you, means: "Blame China".
So is that hate driven delusion of yours pitiful or laughable? I'm leaning towards pitiful
When you trained to be a "psychiatric nurse" did you even have to attend any biology classes?
This is basic. China had unidentified symptomatic cases of what would be known later as SARS-COVID 19, months before those few asymptomatic cases occurred in the U.S, discovered only after testing older blood samples after the pandemic was in full swing. China hasn't provided the same testing to rule out SARS-COVID 19 circulating in late summer of 2019 .
LOL...
So, because you hate China, that proves that they had "symptomatic cases" and the U.S. didn't -- even though we now know that we had cases that we failed to recognize as COVID back in 2019 and possibly even before China did.
Sorry, I didn't think your obsessively deluded mind could sink any further. I was wrong about that.
I guess that proves the power of propaganda over a weak mind.
Testing has found Covid-19 infections in the U.S. in December 2019, according to a study, providing further evidence indicating the coronavirus was spreading globally weeks before the first cases were reported in China.
The study published Monday identified 106 infections from 7,389 blood samples collected from donors in nine U.S. states between Dec. 13 and Jan. 17. The samples, collected by the American Red Cross, were sent to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention for testing to detect if there were antibodies against the virus.
“The findings of this report suggest that SARS-CoV-2 infections may have been present in the U.S. in December 2019, earlier than previously recognized,” the paper said.
Reports of a mysterious pneumonia spreading in Wuhan, China, first emerged in late December 2019. After multiplying rapidly throughout the city in the following weeks, the disease spread across the globe, with the first U.S. case emerging on Jan. 19.
The revelations in the paper by researchers from the CDC reinforce the growing understanding that the coronavirus was silently circulating worldwide earlier than known, and could re-ignite debate over the origins of the pandemic.
It’s not the first evidence showing the virus could have existed or infected people outside China before 2020. A patient in France was found to have contracted the virus after being hospitalized with flu-like symptoms at the end of December, contradicting official statistics showing Covid-19 reached the country from people returning from Wuhan at the end of January.
The CDC study indicated there were isolated infections in the western part of the U.S. in mid-December. Antibodies were also found in early January in other states before the virus was known to have been introduced to those places.
The scientists indicated it’s unlikely that the antibodies developed to curb other coronaviruses, as 84 samples were found to have neutralizing activity specific to SARS-CoV-2.
They also noted it wasn’t possible to determine the magnitude of infections on a state or national level based on the samples, or whether the cases were locally transmitted or travel-related.
Using molecular dating tools and epidemiological simulations, researchers at University of California San Diego School of Medicine, with colleagues at the University of Arizona and Illumina, Inc., estimate that the SARS-CoV-2 virus was likely circulating undetected for at most two months before the first human cases of COVID-19 were described in Wuhan, China in late-December 2019.
Writing in the March 18, 2021 online issue of Science, they also note that their simulations suggest that the mutating virus dies out naturally more than three-quarters of the time without causing an epidemic.
“Our study was designed to answer the question of how long could SARS-CoV-2 have circulated in China before it was discovered,” said senior author Joel O. Wertheim, PhD, associate professor in the Division of Infectious Diseases and Global Public Health at UC San Diego School of Medicine.
“To answer this question, we combined three important pieces of information: a detailed understanding of how SARS-CoV-2 spread in Wuhan before the lockdown, the genetic diversity of the virus in China and reports of the earliest cases of COVID-19 in China. By combining these disparate lines of evidence, we were able to put an upper limit of mid-October 2019 for when SARS-CoV-2 started circulating in Hubei province.”
Cases of COVID-19 were first reported in late-December 2019 in Wuhan, located in the Hubei province of central China. The virus quickly spread beyond Hubei. Chinese authorities cordoned off the region and implemented mitigation measures nationwide. By April 2020, local transmission of the virus was under control but, by then, COVID-19 was pandemic with more than 100 countries reporting cases.
SARS-CoV-2 is a zoonotic coronavirus, believed to have jumped from an unknown animal host to humans. Numerous efforts have been made to identify when the virus first began spreading among humans, based on investigations of early-diagnosed cases of COVID-19. The first cluster of cases — and the earliest sequenced SARS-CoV-2 genomes — were associated with the Huanan Seafood Wholesale Market, but study authors say the market cluster is unlikely to have marked the beginning of the pandemic because the earliest documented COVID-19 cases had no connection to the market.
Regional newspaper reports suggest COVID-19 diagnoses in Hubei date back to at least November 17, 2019, suggesting the virus was already actively circulating when Chinese authorities enacted public health measures.
Why are you attempting to carry water for the PRC, when all of the science and evidence points to China as the origin?
This could be easily answered by the PRC if they had allowed an independent investigation into the origins of the SAR-COVID 19 virus. But of course, they don't want the rest of the world to have even more evidence that the virus originated in China.
Jfc, can one of you please be the bigger person and stop replying? This interminable squabbling is mind-destroying.
Both Waveparticle and GeorgeBMac are spreading misinformation, again. I counter that.
You have the option to stop following. They have the option to stop spreading misinformation. The moderators can clean house again.
Misinformation is anathema to Democracy.
I think/hope you know that I'm on your side, but that doesn't mean that the entire exchange isn't incredibly tedious. I'd wager that the only people reading it are the three of you, and none of you are going to give an inch of ground, so it's ultimately pointless. You've done your job in correcting the initial misinformation, time to back off now. Because for the rest of us it's just clutter in the way of talking about the actual thread subject.
Jfc, can one of you please be the bigger person and stop replying? This interminable squabbling is mind-destroying.
Both Waveparticle and GeorgeBMac are spreading misinformation, again. I counter that.
You have the option to stop following. They have the option to stop spreading misinformation. The moderators can clean house again.
Misinformation is anathema to Democracy.
I think/hope you know that I'm on your side, but that doesn't mean that the entire exchange isn't incredibly tedious. I'd wager that the only people reading it are the three of you, and none of you are going to give an inch of ground, so it's ultimately pointless. You've done your job in correcting the initial misinformation, time to back off now. Because for the rest of us it's just clutter in the way of talking about the actual thread subject.
So please just stop, for everyone's sanity.
I shall stop, and I do realize that you have my back.
Comments
You think that the U.S. doesn't encourage trade with China, yet China is our largest import market, and third largest export market. Perhaps you are confused because the U.S. has been applying trade restriction to the PRC because of mercantilism and human rights violations, not to mention the militarization.
Personally, I would like to see much more of U.S. trade with China sourced elsewhere, but that will take awhile.
There is zero evidence covid came from here. That's ridiculous.
I'm no right wing propagandist, but I find it funny everyone saying Trump is an idiot for saying it came from the Wuhan Lab. Facebook, Twitter, etc were banning his comments. Now with a Democratic led White House, even Biden and his staff are finding the Wuhan Lab leak possibility credible. Even the WHO is saying China wouldn't turn over information and they weren't very cooperative during their first investigation.
China's track record has been pretty poor so I don't see how you or anyone else can defend them over the way they have been handling covid.
I am so happy that you aren't an American.
You might want to look up the U.S. State and Commerce Departments...and the International Trade Commission...
https://www.trade.gov
You might be the next Nurse Ratched...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nurse_Ratched
U.S. cases of COVID 19 in 2019;
https://fortune.com/2020/12/01/december-2019-covid-arrival-us/
But then there's this;
https://health.ucsd.edu/news/releases/Pages/2021-03-18-novel-coronavirus-circulated-undetected-months-before-first-covid-19-cases-in-wuhan-china.aspx
Why are you attempting to carry water for the PRC, when all of the science and evidence points to China as the origin?
This could be easily answered by the PRC if they had allowed an independent investigation into the origins of the SAR-COVID 19 virus. But of course, they don't want the rest of the world to have even more evidence that the virus originated in China.
You have the option to stop following. They have the option to stop spreading misinformation. The moderators can clean house again.
Misinformation is anathema to Democracy.
So please just stop, for everyone's sanity.
It is you spreading your hate and disinformation. Sorry, but your lies hurt not only China but the U.S. as well.