The Braves actually have the bats to do some damage this year. Too bad their middle relief seems to be sucking. It'll be an interesting playoffs for Braves fans. Hopefully it'll be different than years past where they could pitch with the best of 'em but couldn't score on a little league team. Who knows what'll come of it? But the Giants are overrated.
Braves out of the NL and Bo Sox from the AL. Braves in 6.
yes, of course. but no organization can support a championship caliber team every single year, except for maybe the yankees (for obvious reasons). the giants are losing a HUGE chunk of their team after this season, and coupling that with an ageing barry bonds, dont have much to work with in terms of building around. bonds cant keep this pace forever and is bound to be less productive someday--this leaves the team with even less offense. alfonso and durham arent gonna cut it. and the rookies from the minors certainly arent gonna make an impact anytime soon. the pitching staff will be schmidt, an aging rueter, and a couple rookies. yes, it would be nice to keep ponson, but w/ him already rejecting a 3 year, $15 million deal (from a team he reportedly liked playing for, mind you!), it will take even more money. even if we do manage to keep him, he isnt exactly a stud pitcher--#3, maybe 2 at best. a 3.77 ERA, which is the best he's ever had by far, isn't impressing me.
We lost a huge chunk of our team this year. Where did it put us? The jury's still out on Alfonzo. I think he can improve greatly. You do know he's not even 30 yet, right? He might never slim down, but guess what, he's better than David Bell was last year. Durham's a lead-off man. He never was anything more than that. And Sabean's never let us down before with the rostering, so why are you so paranoid?
He liked playing there because he was winning. He's never gotten a chance to play with a top caliber team, and that's what the Giants are year in and year out. And why mention his ERA? That 3.77 ERA is against the Yankees, Red Sox, and Blue Jays...three of the most devastating offenses in the majors. I bet that AL East 3.77 is good for a 3.1 in the NL West, considering he would have been blanking the Dodgers and Padres game after game. And Schmidt's ERA last year was 3.45...and 4.07 the year before that. We'll just have to wait and see how he acclimates. And, damn, he's only 26. You make it sound like he's been having disappointing years when he only started pitching for Baltimore in 1998! Schmidt's career ERA was much higher than after his first 5 years. Also bear in mind that Camden is hitter friendly and Pac Bell is a hitter's nightmare.
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all in all, the team will be solid, but nothing spectacular. the rooks will hopefully develop and impress, but i dont count on much from them for another couple years, especially since we lost the best of them, ainsworth.
Our best prospects have always been Foppert and Williams, and Boof Bonser in AA. The only reason we went with Ainsworth was seasoning. He's 24 and they're 21-22. His freak shoulder blade injury is much more risky than 26-year old with a career ERA of 4.77 having two solid seasons in a row.
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w/ all the money made available because of the vacancies after this year, who will they pick up? are there any good free agents after this year? anyone who you can build an offense around for years to come? bonds is gonna retire sooner rather than later, and when that happens, Frisco will need a new stud, or, as you said, "attendance will plummet" in Pac Bell. the only guy i can see in that situation would be Vlad, but i'm a wishful thinker...
We will have a new stud, but it won't be Guerrero. As proven, he's injury prone, and he's going to command a lot more than the $15M we're paying Bonds. And Bonds' contract is only set through next year, with options for years 4 and 5 after that. Bonds definitely won't retire until he's broken Ruth's 714 home run mark, and he'll probably make a run for Aaron's. He just won't do either as a Giant. Why be a wishful thinker about Vlad and not Ponson?
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dealing with pitching, which needs only one spot to fill, is one thing...but you still neglect the two-thirds of the position spots which need filling. the guys you listed earlier arent gonna cut it--you claim that next years team is gonna be great, but then you go on to list a bunch of minor leaguers out of an offensively anemic minor league system. barry might be the best offensive player of our generation, or even all time, but he cant do everything.
How am I neglecting the other positions to fill? It's about assets. Do you agree that we can find a much better first baseman than JT Snow for much less than the $7M we're paying him this year? Will we be paying Torrealba the same as what we're paying Santiago this year? No. Do we need Nen? He's a nice guy, but no. Is Ponson going just swallow up our payroll? No. He's a ~$6M player on a contending team, just like Schmidt.
I find it highly unlikely that the Giants will be in the shitter next year. Attendance is as strong as ever, and the extra ticket sales from last year's deep postseason run are going to allow Magowan to pour more money back in than ever. The Giants and Dodgers have been high-rolling teams forever. The only contending team I know of that has lots of debts to pay are the Diamondbacks.
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we better get a ring this year cause next year would take a "2002 Angels type season" to win anything.
Perhaps, but I don't see the reasoning. One way or another, the Giants are going to be in the market for a veteran pitcher. it might as well be the guy that pitched for you a bit in the previous season. I don't care that the analysts say we're just renting him. That has nothing to do with the reasons you're supplying. If we don't resign him, it'll be because of the exact opposite reason...Sabean thinks we won't need another pitcher like him. And if we do need one, we'll trade some prospects away. The Giants under Sabean have always gotten by with trades. It's about time we pick a guy and stick with him.
Essentially, Boston's deal with Pittsburgh ended up being Freddy Sanchez for Suppan and Sauerbeck. I liked Freddy a LOT but he is 26. There's no way he blossoms into another Bagwell. And I rather doubt he'll even be another Soriano, for that matter. He'll be good - great defensively - but not the kind of guy you build a team around. The BoSox have a real need NOW and a solid shot at the WS. Freddy's not too high a price to pay to meet that need. Suppan might finally be maturing as a pitcher. His lifetime stats aren't all that hot but so far this year's been a career year for him. And he's NOT Mendoza!!!
The Sox would have liked to have landed Javier Vasquez. Who wouldn't? Theo said he talked to Omar Minaya four times yesterday. The Sox were pushing real hard but apparently there wasn't a deal there to be made. So they went for Suppan instead. (Baltimore never returned Theo's phone call.) I like the deals we've made. Would have liked it even more if we had beaten the Rangers last night.
So the Mariners pretty much traded away for two Mets? Uh. What?! And they sent a pretty good pitcher to the Yankees, who they'll probably play in the postseason? Too much Wacky Tobacky up in the Northwest...
So the Mariners pretty much traded away for two Mets? Uh. What?! And they sent a pretty good pitcher to the Yankees, who they'll probably play in the postseason? Too much Wacky Tobacky up in the Northwest...
Who else did they get besides Benitez? I kind of like this deal from a Mariner perspective. Benitez may thrive away from New York. He's got major league stuff. His tenure with the Yankees wasn't at all bad - 9 1/3 innings, 1.93 ERA, 1-1.
In other news: Suppan sucked the first time out for the Sox.
The Braves actually have the bats to do some damage this year. Too bad their middle relief seems to be sucking. It'll be an interesting playoffs for Braves fans. Hopefully it'll be different than years past where they could pitch with the best of 'em but couldn't score on a little league team. Who knows what'll come of it? But the Giants are overrated.
Braves out of the NL and Bo Sox from the AL. Braves in 6.
Sorry - Sox in 7. Ortiz hits a run scoring single to win
the game in the bottom of the 9th. Beantown goes to heaven in a little boat.
AAAARGH! I thought I'd finally never have to watch Benitez blow another game for a team I'm rooting for. After all that heatburn and heartbreak he gave us Mets fans, I was salivating at the thought of watching him do the same for the Yankees. But now he's followed me out to Seattle?! WTF! Go away! Leave me alone! I can't take any more!!!
Still think Cody Ransom's not making an impact anytime soon?
a fluke. the guy's never hit above 240 in any stage in the minors. aside from pitching, the giants have next to nothing to look forward to from their farm system anytime soon.
a fluke. the guy's never hit above 240 in any stage in the minors. aside from pitching, the giants have next to nothing to look forward to from their farm system anytime soon.
And you're on crack. Ransom will AT LEAST be a bench player next year, and at least one out of Santos, Torcato, Valderrama will join him. And nobody's been talking about Lance Niekro either, but he should probably be added to the list too.
And you're on crack. Ransom will AT LEAST be a bench player next year, and at least one out of Santos, Torcato, Valderrama will join him. And nobody's been talking about Lance Niekro either, but he should probably be added to the list too.
yes, they will be there...but out of necessity. cause we dont have anyone better from the system. none of them are even being considered as close to blue-chip quality. yes, they might eventually be starting somewhere in the majors, but the odds that they will be above average ballplayers are miniscule. the name armando rios comes to mind...
you might call me pessimistic, but i am just being realistic. you are incredibly optimistic over a bunch of minor-leaguers with such limited potential.
So the Mariners pretty much traded away for two Mets? Uh. What?!
The Mariners needed a SS with Guillen being injured as he seems to always be. Sanchez was basically free, Kenny Kelly will probably be a career AAA guy or at best a fifth outfielder who pinch hits and nothing more. It has turned out fairly well too so far. He's hit .345 with no errors in 9 games as a Mariner. Not bad at all for a fill-in player who cost the Mariners nothing.
I kinda doubt the Mariners are gonna make hte playoffs unless Garcia gets it together.
There are some legit arguments that can be made for Benitez over Nelson under the cicumstances and Nelson has been rather mediocre this year although he has been pitching well lately. But I don't like the deal at all and it is hard not to think that it was done on account of his recent comments.
There are some legit arguments that can be made for Benitez over Nelson under the cicumstances and Nelson has been rather mediocre this year although he has been pitching well lately. But I don't like the deal at all and it is hard not to think that it was done on account of his recent comments.
Benitez does well in non big games. The minute the pressure gets high he crumbles. NOT someone you trade for in a pennant run
Yankees Mariners game was pretty exciting, even if it wasn't one of the better played games of the season. Nelson was hittable as he sometimes is and let inhereted runners score, as he has all season. No surprise there. Nice to see the Mariners do OK against Clemens who usually owns them. And no Benitez, just some Shiggy and Soriano love. Benitez may suck donkey testicles, but the Yankees bullpen is still inferior to the Mariners. Too bad you can say the reverse about our hitters compared to the Yankees.
Btw, speaking of Sorianos, Alphonso Soriano is typically New York overhyped, bad ass though he may be. Bret Boone is his daddy. All Star starter my ass. .936 versus .816 OPS plus Boone is the man at 2B while Soriano boots more than his fair share.
This is the big stretch for Boston now. 14 straight against Oakland and Seattle while New York is playing weak teams. Boston can kill themselves in the East and in the wildcard if they get bitchslapped around during these games. If the Red Sox go 6-8 or something like that and NY goes 10-4 say then they're gonna be 7 back just like that with only 30 games to play. Alternatively, if Boston beats up on Oakland and Seattle then they could position themselves well for the wild card, even if they don't win the East.
Comments
Originally posted by torifile
The Braves actually have the bats to do some damage this year. Too bad their middle relief seems to be sucking. It'll be an interesting playoffs for Braves fans. Hopefully it'll be different than years past where they could pitch with the best of 'em but couldn't score on a little league team. Who knows what'll come of it? But the Giants are overrated.
Braves out of the NL and Bo Sox from the AL. Braves in 6.
silly braves fans...
i pity thee, followers of the NL antichrist.
yes, of course. but no organization can support a championship caliber team every single year, except for maybe the yankees (for obvious reasons). the giants are losing a HUGE chunk of their team after this season, and coupling that with an ageing barry bonds, dont have much to work with in terms of building around. bonds cant keep this pace forever and is bound to be less productive someday--this leaves the team with even less offense. alfonso and durham arent gonna cut it. and the rookies from the minors certainly arent gonna make an impact anytime soon. the pitching staff will be schmidt, an aging rueter, and a couple rookies. yes, it would be nice to keep ponson, but w/ him already rejecting a 3 year, $15 million deal (from a team he reportedly liked playing for, mind you!), it will take even more money. even if we do manage to keep him, he isnt exactly a stud pitcher--#3, maybe 2 at best. a 3.77 ERA, which is the best he's ever had by far, isn't impressing me.
We lost a huge chunk of our team this year. Where did it put us? The jury's still out on Alfonzo. I think he can improve greatly. You do know he's not even 30 yet, right? He might never slim down, but guess what, he's better than David Bell was last year. Durham's a lead-off man. He never was anything more than that. And Sabean's never let us down before with the rostering, so why are you so paranoid?
He liked playing there because he was winning. He's never gotten a chance to play with a top caliber team, and that's what the Giants are year in and year out. And why mention his ERA? That 3.77 ERA is against the Yankees, Red Sox, and Blue Jays...three of the most devastating offenses in the majors. I bet that AL East 3.77 is good for a 3.1 in the NL West, considering he would have been blanking the Dodgers and Padres game after game. And Schmidt's ERA last year was 3.45...and 4.07 the year before that. We'll just have to wait and see how he acclimates. And, damn, he's only 26. You make it sound like he's been having disappointing years when he only started pitching for Baltimore in 1998! Schmidt's career ERA was much higher than after his first 5 years. Also bear in mind that Camden is hitter friendly and Pac Bell is a hitter's nightmare.
all in all, the team will be solid, but nothing spectacular. the rooks will hopefully develop and impress, but i dont count on much from them for another couple years, especially since we lost the best of them, ainsworth.
Our best prospects have always been Foppert and Williams, and Boof Bonser in AA. The only reason we went with Ainsworth was seasoning. He's 24 and they're 21-22. His freak shoulder blade injury is much more risky than 26-year old with a career ERA of 4.77 having two solid seasons in a row.
w/ all the money made available because of the vacancies after this year, who will they pick up? are there any good free agents after this year? anyone who you can build an offense around for years to come? bonds is gonna retire sooner rather than later, and when that happens, Frisco will need a new stud, or, as you said, "attendance will plummet" in Pac Bell. the only guy i can see in that situation would be Vlad, but i'm a wishful thinker...
We will have a new stud, but it won't be Guerrero. As proven, he's injury prone, and he's going to command a lot more than the $15M we're paying Bonds. And Bonds' contract is only set through next year, with options for years 4 and 5 after that. Bonds definitely won't retire until he's broken Ruth's 714 home run mark, and he'll probably make a run for Aaron's. He just won't do either as a Giant. Why be a wishful thinker about Vlad and not Ponson?
dealing with pitching, which needs only one spot to fill, is one thing...but you still neglect the two-thirds of the position spots which need filling. the guys you listed earlier arent gonna cut it--you claim that next years team is gonna be great, but then you go on to list a bunch of minor leaguers out of an offensively anemic minor league system. barry might be the best offensive player of our generation, or even all time, but he cant do everything.
How am I neglecting the other positions to fill? It's about assets. Do you agree that we can find a much better first baseman than JT Snow for much less than the $7M we're paying him this year? Will we be paying Torrealba the same as what we're paying Santiago this year? No. Do we need Nen? He's a nice guy, but no. Is Ponson going just swallow up our payroll? No. He's a ~$6M player on a contending team, just like Schmidt.
I find it highly unlikely that the Giants will be in the shitter next year. Attendance is as strong as ever, and the extra ticket sales from last year's deep postseason run are going to allow Magowan to pour more money back in than ever. The Giants and Dodgers have been high-rolling teams forever. The only contending team I know of that has lots of debts to pay are the Diamondbacks.
we better get a ring this year cause next year would take a "2002 Angels type season" to win anything.
Perhaps, but I don't see the reasoning. One way or another, the Giants are going to be in the market for a veteran pitcher. it might as well be the guy that pitched for you a bit in the previous season. I don't care that the analysts say we're just renting him. That has nothing to do with the reasons you're supplying. If we don't resign him, it'll be because of the exact opposite reason...Sabean thinks we won't need another pitcher like him. And if we do need one, we'll trade some prospects away. The Giants under Sabean have always gotten by with trades. It's about time we pick a guy and stick with him.
Originally posted by _ alliance _
silly braves fans...
i pity thee, followers of the NL antichrist.
I think they'll make it out of the division championships this year!
The Sox would have liked to have landed Javier Vasquez. Who wouldn't? Theo said he talked to Omar Minaya four times yesterday. The Sox were pushing real hard but apparently there wasn't a deal there to be made. So they went for Suppan instead. (Baltimore never returned Theo's phone call.) I like the deals we've made. Would have liked it even more if we had beaten the Rangers last night.
Originally posted by Eugene
So the Mariners pretty much traded away for two Mets? Uh. What?! And they sent a pretty good pitcher to the Yankees, who they'll probably play in the postseason? Too much Wacky Tobacky up in the Northwest...
Who else did they get besides Benitez? I kind of like this deal from a Mariner perspective. Benitez may thrive away from New York. He's got major league stuff. His tenure with the Yankees wasn't at all bad - 9 1/3 innings, 1.93 ERA, 1-1.
In other news: Suppan sucked the first time out for the Sox.
Originally posted by torifile
The Braves actually have the bats to do some damage this year. Too bad their middle relief seems to be sucking. It'll be an interesting playoffs for Braves fans. Hopefully it'll be different than years past where they could pitch with the best of 'em but couldn't score on a little league team. Who knows what'll come of it? But the Giants are overrated.
Braves out of the NL and Bo Sox from the AL. Braves in 6.
Sorry - Sox in 7. Ortiz hits a run scoring single to win
the game in the bottom of the 9th. Beantown goes to heaven in a little boat.
Thoth
Originally posted by zaphod_beeblebrox
His tenure with the Yankees wasn't at all bad - 9 1/3 innings, 1.93 ERA, 1-1.
OH YES IT WAS
Statistics don't show the whole story
Originally posted by Eugene
...blah blah...Benitez....Mariners....blah???
AAAARGH! I thought I'd finally never have to watch Benitez blow another game for a team I'm rooting for. After all that heatburn and heartbreak he gave us Mets fans, I was salivating at the thought of watching him do the same for the Yankees. But now he's followed me out to Seattle?! WTF! Go away! Leave me alone! I can't take any more!!!
and the rookies from the minors certainly arent gonna make an impact anytime soon.
Still think Cody Ransom's not making an impact anytime soon?
Originally posted by Eugene
Still think Cody Ransom's not making an impact anytime soon?
a fluke. the guy's never hit above 240 in any stage in the minors. aside from pitching, the giants have next to nothing to look forward to from their farm system anytime soon.
Originally posted by _ alliance _
a fluke. the guy's never hit above 240 in any stage in the minors. aside from pitching, the giants have next to nothing to look forward to from their farm system anytime soon.
And you're on crack. Ransom will AT LEAST be a bench player next year, and at least one out of Santos, Torcato, Valderrama will join him. And nobody's been talking about Lance Niekro either, but he should probably be added to the list too.
Originally posted by Eugene
And you're on crack. Ransom will AT LEAST be a bench player next year, and at least one out of Santos, Torcato, Valderrama will join him. And nobody's been talking about Lance Niekro either, but he should probably be added to the list too.
yes, they will be there...but out of necessity. cause we dont have anyone better from the system. none of them are even being considered as close to blue-chip quality. yes, they might eventually be starting somewhere in the majors, but the odds that they will be above average ballplayers are miniscule. the name armando rios comes to mind...
you might call me pessimistic, but i am just being realistic. you are incredibly optimistic over a bunch of minor-leaguers with such limited potential.
So the Mariners pretty much traded away for two Mets? Uh. What?!
The Mariners needed a SS with Guillen being injured as he seems to always be. Sanchez was basically free, Kenny Kelly will probably be a career AAA guy or at best a fifth outfielder who pinch hits and nothing more. It has turned out fairly well too so far. He's hit .345 with no errors in 9 games as a Mariner. Not bad at all for a fill-in player who cost the Mariners nothing.
I kinda doubt the Mariners are gonna make hte playoffs unless Garcia gets it together.
There are some legit arguments that can be made for Benitez over Nelson under the cicumstances and Nelson has been rather mediocre this year although he has been pitching well lately. But I don't like the deal at all and it is hard not to think that it was done on account of his recent comments.
Originally posted by ColanderOfDeath
There are some legit arguments that can be made for Benitez over Nelson under the cicumstances and Nelson has been rather mediocre this year although he has been pitching well lately. But I don't like the deal at all and it is hard not to think that it was done on account of his recent comments.
Benitez does well in non big games. The minute the pressure gets high he crumbles. NOT someone you trade for in a pennant run
Btw, speaking of Sorianos, Alphonso Soriano is typically New York overhyped, bad ass though he may be. Bret Boone is his daddy. All Star starter my ass. .936 versus .816 OPS plus Boone is the man at 2B while Soriano boots more than his fair share.
This is the big stretch for Boston now. 14 straight against Oakland and Seattle while New York is playing weak teams. Boston can kill themselves in the East and in the wildcard if they get bitchslapped around during these games. If the Red Sox go 6-8 or something like that and NY goes 10-4 say then they're gonna be 7 back just like that with only 30 games to play. Alternatively, if Boston beats up on Oakland and Seattle then they could position themselves well for the wild card, even if they don't win the East.
Originally posted by Eugene
Oh, the Giants used their 13th different starting pitcher today. Sheesh.
schmidt better get over his elbow tendinitis problem.
on a positive note, correia looked quite strong tonight. good show.