According to a literal interpretation of Genesis with the number errors corrected, Genesis actually happened about 400 years before Jesus was supposed to hit the scene. Mmmmm...
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"[Protestantism] Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
I would have thought that you should start rejecting the Catholic Celebrations of Christmas (Sol Invicta - pagan origins 25th December worship, birthday of the invincible sun), as there is no Biblical reference to it. Your Christmas trees, come from a Northern European Pagan tradition of bringing trees inside and decorating them, as a reminder that the sun will be 'born' again on dec25th and new life will start again next spring. Biblical reference Not to do it!!!
Easter (Babylonian origin Ishtar - sun goddess born from a huge 'Easter' egg - Easter weekend date is calculated from pure astrology!) no biblical reference to it.
QUOTE : "Matthew 17
The Transfiguration
1After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus."
This is reference to the sun being at it's highest point at the summer Equinox (june21). Just like Jesus, the sun reached it's most powerful position, and from here on out, both the Sun and in the Jesus story, power starts to decline, as the days grow shorter than the nights, and Jesus starts to get into trouble in Jerusalem.
so we have 3 points of our cross, each corresponding to the solar equinox, all we need now is the last one, the Autumn Equixon sep21 - pretty much harvest time, which is of epic significance to ancient civilizations whose existance, survival and trade is based on agriculture. This is the time when the sun passes very close to the star 'Spica' of the constellation Virgo (a virgin woman holding an ear of wheat in her hand) and then the sun passes into Libra (scales of justice). So what is Jesus doing....overthrowing the markets (scales) and merchandisers in the temple, cursing a fig tree, figuratively leaves falling from trees in Autumn before settling down to a nice feast with his disciples.
According to a literal interpretation of Genesis with the number errors corrected, Genesis actually happened about 400 years before Jesus was supposed to hit the scene. Mmmmm...
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"Protestantism, however, by no means despises or rejects church authority as such, but only subordinates it to, and measures its value by, the Bible, and believes in a progressive interpretation of the Bible through the expanding and deepening consciousness of Christendom. Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
Using the bible as a science book is a pure nonsense. This apply in particular with the genesis. There is no need to loose your time with people who have the faith in the scientifical value of the bible.
The funny thing, is that you wrote that some creationists accept the catholic bible and are creationist. Strange if we consider that the creationist theory is not backed by the catholic church.
I am curious to know what Lemaitre (Priest and physic nobel prize) would have said about the creationist thing.
Now, imagine that god made a book who represant is opinions and his morale. How would he manage to make this book simple enough to be understand by simple minds like us humans. Don't you think that he should be in phasis with the current level of understanding of things we have now. D'ont you think, that he will employ as much possible metaphors in order to let us touch abstract thing ?
Don't you think that he will avoid at any cost any scientifical references, because such references are subject to evolution, and thus are doomed to change?
Certain ones cannot change - I would expect God to have mentioned that the earth was a sphere for example and that it was not the centre of the solar system.
These things seem very basic factors in a creation story if it is a true record.
Causing the "the sun to stand still" is not a statement that the sun revolves around the Earth on a planetary scale.
According to a literal interpretation of Genesis with the number errors corrected, Genesis actually happened about 400 years before Jesus was supposed to hit the scene. Mmmmm...
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"[Protestantism] Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
I would have thought that you should start rejecting the Catholic Celebrations of Christmas (Sol Invicta - pagan origins 25th December worship, birthday of the invincible sun), as there is no Biblical reference to it. Your Christmas trees, come from a Northern European Pagan tradition of bringing trees inside and decorating them, as a reminder that the sun will be 'born' again on dec25th and new life will start again next spring. Biblical reference Not to do it!!!
Easter (Babylonian origin Ishtar - sun goddess born from a huge 'Easter' egg - Easter weekend date is calculated from pure astrology!) no biblical reference to it.
QUOTE : "Matthew 17
The Transfiguration
1After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus."
This is reference to the sun being at it's highest point at the summer Equinox (june21). Just like Jesus, the sun reached it's most powerful position, and from here on out, both the Sun and in the Jesus story, power starts to decline, as the days grow shorter than the nights, and Jesus starts to get into trouble in Jerusalem.
so we have 3 points of our cross, each corresponding to the solar equinox, all we need now is the last one, the Autumn Equixon sep21 - pretty much harvest time, which is of epic significance to ancient civilizations whose existance, survival and trade is based on agriculture. This is the time when the sun passes very close to the star 'Spica' of the constellation Virgo (a virgin woman holding an ear of wheat in her hand) and then the sun passes into Libra (scales of justice). So what is Jesus doing....overthrowing the markets (scales) and merchandisers in the temple, cursing a fig tree, figuratively leaves falling from trees in Autumn before settling down to a nice feast with his disciples.
Agian, I disagree. I don't think you are making sense here.
I was just checking out one of the little propganda booklets (the comics) and remembered how important the persecution complex is to you guys. It's really genius propaganda since it gives you a narrative to retreat to after making totally logically incoherent arguments.
Agian, I disagree. I don't think you are making sense here.
How can you disagree If you can't make sense of what i wrote?
Infact, you perfectly understand what I meant, and it makes perfect sense, but you want to keep your head in the sand and plead stupidity. Carry on...
Shall I tell you why Jesus begins his ministry at 30? Shall I tell you why Jesus went to John and got baptised?, shall I tell you why Satan tempts Jesus, shall I tell you why John is put in prison and Jesus not worry? Shall I tell you why Jesus visits Simon and Peter the fishermen? Shall I explain why Jesus is the lamb of God who takes the sin from the world? Shall I tell you why Jesus calms the storm? Shall I tell you why John gets beheaded and rises from the dead? Shall I tell you how it is possible for Jesus to walk on water? Shall I tell you how Jesus rode a foal and ass? Shall I tell you why Judas has to kiss Jesus to identify the most popular man in the area, but no one can pick him out?
Certain ones cannot change - I would expect God to have mentioned that the earth was a sphere for example and that it was not the centre of the solar system.
These things seem very basic factors in a creation story if it is a true record.
My demonstration was : even if the bible is god own words, this words canno't discribe the world in a scientifical way.
Now Segovius you are free to doubt that the Bible is god own words. I would never contradict you on that subject ...
It's one of the typical chick stories where the fundie kid has to go up against the evil teacher and jeering class. It's all part of their mythology that helps them justify beliefs that they know are unjustifiable.
An interesting read, mildly related to abiogenesis.
I had the idea to make life from scratch about 20 years ago as an undergrad. A grad student was trying to encourge me to go for it. Luckily, I new better than to try such a daunting task. I'm sure it will be achieved one day.
Although we will learn from the endeavour and it will certainly make some headlines, it really won't do much I think to answer the tough questions of how life began. It's more of a technical task to slim life down to its minimum parts and try to get the system rolling. All this is based on parts taken from life as we know it today, which is most likely very different from when it started.
exactly, while there are many many questions that need an answer, at least people are working on it, and whether it happens tomorrow, in 40 years, or after i'm recycled, we will have an answer one day.
exactly, while there are many many questions that need an answer, at least people are working on it, and whether it happens tomorrow, in 40 years, or after i'm recycled, we will have an answer one day.
My faith is based in reality, fact and evidence, and a part of my faith is that I do not know everything, do not know what the truth is, and do not know how to acquire it, but my faith allows me to be honest in accepting these deficiencies and doesn't require me to blaspheme God by denying everything in existance from the universe to a quark, just to fullfil a hopeless selfish desire that I can transcend death by believing in an imaginary friend.
Comments
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"[Protestantism] Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
I would have thought that you should start rejecting the Catholic Celebrations of Christmas (Sol Invicta - pagan origins 25th December worship, birthday of the invincible sun), as there is no Biblical reference to it. Your Christmas trees, come from a Northern European Pagan tradition of bringing trees inside and decorating them, as a reminder that the sun will be 'born' again on dec25th and new life will start again next spring. Biblical reference Not to do it!!!
Easter (Babylonian origin Ishtar - sun goddess born from a huge 'Easter' egg - Easter weekend date is calculated from pure astrology!) no biblical reference to it.
QUOTE : "Matthew 17
The Transfiguration
1After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus."
This is reference to the sun being at it's highest point at the summer Equinox (june21). Just like Jesus, the sun reached it's most powerful position, and from here on out, both the Sun and in the Jesus story, power starts to decline, as the days grow shorter than the nights, and Jesus starts to get into trouble in Jerusalem.
so we have 3 points of our cross, each corresponding to the solar equinox, all we need now is the last one, the Autumn Equixon sep21 - pretty much harvest time, which is of epic significance to ancient civilizations whose existance, survival and trade is based on agriculture. This is the time when the sun passes very close to the star 'Spica' of the constellation Virgo (a virgin woman holding an ear of wheat in her hand) and then the sun passes into Libra (scales of justice). So what is Jesus doing....overthrowing the markets (scales) and merchandisers in the temple, cursing a fig tree, figuratively leaves falling from trees in Autumn before settling down to a nice feast with his disciples.
Originally posted by MarcUK
According to a literal interpretation of Genesis with the number errors corrected, Genesis actually happened about 400 years before Jesus was supposed to hit the scene. Mmmmm...
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"Protestantism, however, by no means despises or rejects church authority as such, but only subordinates it to, and measures its value by, the Bible, and believes in a progressive interpretation of the Bible through the expanding and deepening consciousness of Christendom. Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
Using the bible as a science book is a pure nonsense. This apply in particular with the genesis. There is no need to loose your time with people who have the faith in the scientifical value of the bible.
The funny thing, is that you wrote that some creationists accept the catholic bible and are creationist. Strange if we consider that the creationist theory is not backed by the catholic church.
I am curious to know what Lemaitre (Priest and physic nobel prize) would have said about the creationist thing.
Now, imagine that god made a book who represant is opinions and his morale. How would he manage to make this book simple enough to be understand by simple minds like us humans. Don't you think that he should be in phasis with the current level of understanding of things we have now. D'ont you think, that he will employ as much possible metaphors in order to let us touch abstract thing ?
Don't you think that he will avoid at any cost any scientifical references, because such references are subject to evolution, and thus are doomed to change?
Originally posted by segovius
Certain ones cannot change - I would expect God to have mentioned that the earth was a sphere for example and that it was not the centre of the solar system.
These things seem very basic factors in a creation story if it is a true record.
Causing the "the sun to stand still" is not a statement that the sun revolves around the Earth on a planetary scale.
More contrivance.
Originally posted by MarcUK
According to a literal interpretation of Genesis with the number errors corrected, Genesis actually happened about 400 years before Jesus was supposed to hit the scene. Mmmmm...
I wonder Fundies, why do you accept the NIV, KJV etc. bibles? For all your hatred of Catholics, the Bible is a Catholic book, created by Catholics, voted for by Catholics, perverted by Catholics and propogated by Catholic brutality.
quote
"[Protestantism] Hence, besides having its own symbols or standards of public doctrine, it retained all the articles of the ancient creeds and a large amount of disciplinary and ritual tradition, and rejected only those doctrines and ceremonies for which no clear warrant was found in the Bible and which seemed to contradict its letter or spirit."
I would have thought that you should start rejecting the Catholic Celebrations of Christmas (Sol Invicta - pagan origins 25th December worship, birthday of the invincible sun), as there is no Biblical reference to it. Your Christmas trees, come from a Northern European Pagan tradition of bringing trees inside and decorating them, as a reminder that the sun will be 'born' again on dec25th and new life will start again next spring. Biblical reference Not to do it!!!
Easter (Babylonian origin Ishtar - sun goddess born from a huge 'Easter' egg - Easter weekend date is calculated from pure astrology!) no biblical reference to it.
QUOTE : "Matthew 17
The Transfiguration
1After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus."
This is reference to the sun being at it's highest point at the summer Equinox (june21). Just like Jesus, the sun reached it's most powerful position, and from here on out, both the Sun and in the Jesus story, power starts to decline, as the days grow shorter than the nights, and Jesus starts to get into trouble in Jerusalem.
so we have 3 points of our cross, each corresponding to the solar equinox, all we need now is the last one, the Autumn Equixon sep21 - pretty much harvest time, which is of epic significance to ancient civilizations whose existance, survival and trade is based on agriculture. This is the time when the sun passes very close to the star 'Spica' of the constellation Virgo (a virgin woman holding an ear of wheat in her hand) and then the sun passes into Libra (scales of justice). So what is Jesus doing....overthrowing the markets (scales) and merchandisers in the temple, cursing a fig tree, figuratively leaves falling from trees in Autumn before settling down to a nice feast with his disciples.
Agian, I disagree. I don't think you are making sense here.
Originally posted by dmz
Agian, I disagree. I don't think you are making sense here.
How can you disagree If you can't make sense of what i wrote?
Infact, you perfectly understand what I meant, and it makes perfect sense, but you want to keep your head in the sand and plead stupidity. Carry on...
Shall I tell you why Jesus begins his ministry at 30? Shall I tell you why Jesus went to John and got baptised?, shall I tell you why Satan tempts Jesus, shall I tell you why John is put in prison and Jesus not worry? Shall I tell you why Jesus visits Simon and Peter the fishermen? Shall I explain why Jesus is the lamb of God who takes the sin from the world? Shall I tell you why Jesus calms the storm? Shall I tell you why John gets beheaded and rises from the dead? Shall I tell you how it is possible for Jesus to walk on water? Shall I tell you how Jesus rode a foal and ass? Shall I tell you why Judas has to kiss Jesus to identify the most popular man in the area, but no one can pick him out?
Shall I, or will it all go right over your head?
Originally posted by segovius
Certain ones cannot change - I would expect God to have mentioned that the earth was a sphere for example and that it was not the centre of the solar system.
These things seem very basic factors in a creation story if it is a true record.
My demonstration was : even if the bible is god own words, this words canno't discribe the world in a scientifical way.
Now Segovius you are free to doubt that the Bible is god own words. I would never contradict you on that subject ...
Originally posted by segovius
Which ones ?
Really powerful stuff - specially the lake of fire that the guy gets chucked into by the angel for looking at the woman.
Eegeh...I'm still shuddering.....
Damn, that woman was pretty hot, for sure
Originally posted by segovius
Which ones ?
I remember reading those 'Chick' comics when I was a kid ...
Big Daddy
It's one of the typical chick stories where the fundie kid has to go up against the evil teacher and jeering class. It's all part of their mythology that helps them justify beliefs that they know are unjustifiable.
Originally posted by segovius
OMG - found it on the 'internets'
The trauma is all coming back - I got to go and lie down. I may need medication....Powerdoc ?
Nooooooooooo
A good alcohool will do the trick
Thanks for your link.
Interesting brainwashing. You are sleeping in the church and therefore you are damned to eternal fire. What a lovely lord.
Originally posted by MarcUK
Powerdoc, you may want to revoke those pictures of 'Chester and give yourself up for Christ?
Methinks that I can find good company in hell with you and Segovius.
Originally posted by segovius
OMG - found it on the 'internets'
The trauma is all coming back - I got to go and lie down. I may need medication....Powerdoc ?
Nooooooooooo
I can't decide who those guys hate more:
Mormons, Muslims, Catholics, JW's, <insert non-evangelical Christian here>...
An interesting read, mildly related to abiogenesis.
Originally posted by MarcUK
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4104483.stm
An interesting read, mildly related to abiogenesis.
I had the idea to make life from scratch about 20 years ago as an undergrad. A grad student was trying to encourge me to go for it. Luckily, I new better than to try such a daunting task. I'm sure it will be achieved one day.
Although we will learn from the endeavour and it will certainly make some headlines, it really won't do much I think to answer the tough questions of how life began. It's more of a technical task to slim life down to its minimum parts and try to get the system rolling. All this is based on parts taken from life as we know it today, which is most likely very different from when it started.
Originally posted by MarcUK
exactly, while there are many many questions that need an answer, at least people are working on it, and whether it happens tomorrow, in 40 years, or after i'm recycled, we will have an answer one day.
You have great faith, grasshopper.
Originally posted by dmz
You have great faith, grasshopper.
thankyou,
My faith is based in reality, fact and evidence, and a part of my faith is that I do not know everything, do not know what the truth is, and do not know how to acquire it, but my faith allows me to be honest in accepting these deficiencies and doesn't require me to blaspheme God by denying everything in existance from the universe to a quark, just to fullfil a hopeless selfish desire that I can transcend death by believing in an imaginary friend.
You have no faith, fake T-rex.