I'd like to see the equivalent level of innovation of 'Front Row'. A new app. Something cool. For pros. Dual Dual core across the line.
Good gpus as standard.
Option for 7800gtx. WITH decent drivers Open GL for change.
Apple's all about the software. And their software range is growing every year. I hope Apple adds to the pro-line software on Wednesday.
They're drawing attention to Macs now..using Halo of iPod as leverage at these events.
Now.
Lemon Bon Bon
Well the cpu speed was no great shakes. from 2 GHz to 2.1GHz on the top and the bottom from 1.8 to 1.9. I would have liked to see just a bit more. But otherwise a very good upgrade.
I would rather see an ATI 1800xt. They just came out with new software drivers that re-programs the GPU so that it now actually beats the Nvidia in Doom 3 an speeds up Open Gl overall. Maybe that will help us too.
I also thought that due to IBM's experience with dual cores they would have had the MP out way before Intel and AMD. We were expecting that. But they didn't. We were expecting it at least 18 months ago. So don't expect anything at this time. Just hope.
The 970MP is a pair of 970 cores with doubled L2 caches each connected to a shared elastic bus FSB. At 1.25 GHz (for a 2.5 GHz processor) this FSB has 8 GB/sec of upstream and 8 GB/sec of downstream bandwidth -- which is more than the current G5 memory subsystem can sustain at its peak rate. Two dual core chips obviously puts double the pressure on the memory system. Even if Apple goes it DDR2 its not clear that the memory will meet the FSB's capabilities so it likely doesn't matter that the FSB is shared between the dual cores.
The 1 MB L2 cache per core will make a huge difference to performance, however, and will alleviate the shortage of memory bandwidth for broad classes of problems. Heterogenous workloads will benefit -- many applications will run compute intensive code on data which fits in the L2 cache and this will run very well at the same time as a bandwidth intensive calculate on a different core. Your video processing task won't slow down your SETI background tasks.
I'm going to be sorely tempted to buy one of these. If they have PCI Express and new ATI GPUs then I fear for my pocketbook. The memory bandwidth problem is eased somewhat if half of your traffic is going across to the GPU in parallel with the other half coming from memory. CoreImage probably screams on these beasts.
The 970MP is a pair of 970 cores with doubled L2 caches each connected to a shared elastic bus FSB. At 1.25 GHz (for a 2.5 GHz processor) this FSB has 8 GB/sec of upstream and 8 GB/sec of downstream bandwidth -- which is more than the current G5 memory subsystem can sustain at its peak rate. Two dual core chips obviously puts double the pressure on the memory system. Even if Apple goes it DDR2 its not clear that the memory will meet the FSB's capabilities so it likely doesn't matter that the FSB is shared between the dual cores.
The 1 MB L2 cache per core will make a huge difference to performance, however, and will alleviate the shortage of memory bandwidth for broad classes of problems. Heterogenous workloads will benefit -- many applications will run compute intensive code on data which fits in the L2 cache and this will run very well at the same time as a bandwidth intensive calculate on a different core. Your video processing task won't slow down your SETI background tasks.
I'm going to be sorely tempted to buy one of these. If they have PCI Express and new ATI GPUs then I fear for my pocketbook. The memory bandwidth problem is eased somewhat if half of your traffic is going across to the GPU in parallel with the other half coming from memory. CoreImage probably screams on these beasts.
Definitely. The doubled cache that IBM announced will certainly help. If it has Express I intend to get one myself.
Now, this is something I seem to remember, but I haven't given it much thought for a while. Hasn't it been said that the memory controller couldn't handle the total bandwidth of both chips? If so, how will that affect a quad core design?
Three questions about possible upgrades. 1. Everyone seems to agree that Freescale doesn't have a dual core chip. From power and space considerations, could Apple put two 7448's in one PB? Presumably, they're lower power and smaller than the current 7447's, and they have (might have?) a faster bus making them effective in a two-processor configuration, and Apple does have some experience making dual processor G4's. 2. Would two G4 processors be effective in video decoding, or is this not a parallel-ible (able?) task?
3. Can Apple put an HD-DVD recorder of one flavor or the other in upgraded PowerMacs? "Too expensive" may not be a well-justified response, since Apple put regular DVD recorders in the PM's when stand alone DVD recorders cost more than PM's. Apple has also been known to put later-discarded recorder technologies (DVD-RAM) in their PM's.
Okay I'm excited about the annoucement because I'm going to buy the 15" variant of the laptop that is announced on the 19th.
Given, that early resolutions specs for a future powerbook were leaked in a pb manual, Can anyone make an educated guess at what the 15" powerbook's resolutionw will be? I assume widescreen and HD? anyone care to make a mockup. Obviously the graphic I posted earlier didn't show them as widescreen.
Given what's on Dell's Website I assume this is what Apple's specs will be:
would rather see an ATI 1800xt. They just came out with new software drivers that re-programs the GPU so that it now actually beats the Nvidia in Doom 3 an speeds up Open Gl overall. Maybe that will help us too.
Not in any of the benches I've seen.
The Nividia still hands teh Ati card it's a**
ATI is late to the party.
And cost more. At least on the PC side. But it does seem to do Shader 3 very well.
Either card would be good. But face facts. GL on the Mac needs a big boost whether ATI or Nvidia. Because both are 100% behind their PC equivalents on the driver front.
I thought Tiger was going to fix that. Hmmph.
When Doom 3 scores on a Dual 2.7 suck compared to an 'average' PC you have to ask what's going on?
I will be buying one of these machines. I've waited 6 years. That's quite enough. Ridiculous. But I think these machines are going to be the finest PowerMacs ever shipped.
PCI Express is nice. But it's not a massive difference to AGP at the moment. It's just a nice 'token' to have that your platform isn't 'behind'.
More important are Dual Core or rather DUAL Dual Core with performance advantages AND a decent GPU. ATI or Nvidia's latest.
I'd be happy with that. AND happier with the attention and fanfare for 'Pro' solutions that has been showered on the iPod.
Apple, I think, are beginning to go to another level with their product introductions. Software and hardware in the glow of the iPod halo.
The dual^2 thing, what will that mean in use when not using specialized apps?
When going from single -> dual processors what did we gain? I understand we primary gained in apps compiled for dual processors and to a lesser extend when running multiple apps, where the finder would level out the load to both processors (but not nearly as good as specialized apps). Or did the finder just level out its OWN work load?
How is that compared when going dual processors to dual "dual core" processors? Is each core less than the cores that are in the processors now? Is the benefits comparable (and how) of going single single core -> dual single core as going single single core -> single dual core?
With regard to Blu-ray and Apple, wasn't Apple first to market with their DVD burning Superdrive?
I couldn't recall the manufacturer but google shows that it was a Pioneer, is this correct?
I also noticed that engadget has a blurb on the Pioneer BDR-101A Blu-ray burner (backward compatable with DVD burning but not CD burning). It appears as "BDR-101A" in the photos at akihabaranews, but even they text it as "BRD-101A", which appears to have propagated to other websites (blu-ray.com shows it as "BDR-101" along with several other "prototypes"). It appears that the first mention of this on the web dates to 08/23 (see http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?t=146842 which references the source at dvdrwinfo.net (in Korean!)), is this correct? I thought that they (Japanese) were already marketing Blu-ray in their country?
Searching pioneerelectronics.com (US) and pioneer.co.jp (Japan) shows no hits via google, there are also no PR's on these sites WRT this burner.
I also didn't see this drive being sold anywhere, I may have missed it.
I also searched AI for this keyword "BDR-101A" (and "Pioneer" in the two most recent threads WRT specific Blu-ray burners) with no hits, thinking you guys would know (or have discussed) this burner.
Seeing as (I presume) that Apple (and Pioneer) were first to the desktop market with the Superdrive, could this happen again, with the PM's next week? With the BDR-101A?
Maybe AI's sources got it wrong on the PB Blu-ray burners and meant PM's?
Could this in fact be "The year of HD" (at least for content creators) as CIJ suggested at MWSF05?
This would make the PM's best of class (in my opinion, with Apple's HW panache, OS X, and assuming 970MP dualies (4-way), PCI-e, DDR2, etcetera)).
At the end of this semester, I'm going to buy a 12" Powerbook with a 20" Cinema Display and use it for the next 4-5 years while working on my PhD. If the 15" and 17" get nice HD displays and cool new features while the PB 12" get "upgraded" to a 1.67 GHz G4 and 512 MB RAM standard... I'm not going to be happy.
\\
At the end of next week your options may have changed a bit!
Depending on what your major is the 23" display may be a better choice, simply because you can have more windows open at once. I broke down and bought one when I moved my accounting program from XP (the last app to go) to OS X. Lots of windows open at once to keep everything in view and it was the most significant user oriented improvement I've seen in computers for years. It is worth taking a look at, especially with a lot of windows open.
Three questions about possible upgrades. 1. Everyone seems to agree that Freescale doesn't have a dual core chip. From power and space considerations, could Apple put two 7448's in one PB? Presumably, they're lower power and smaller than the current 7447's, and they have (might have?) a faster bus making them effective in a two-processor configuration, and Apple does have some experience making dual processor G4's. 2. Would two G4 processors be effective in video decoding, or is this not a parallel-ible (able?) task?
3. Can Apple put an HD-DVD recorder of one flavor or the other in upgraded PowerMacs? "Too expensive" may not be a well-justified response, since Apple put regular DVD recorders in the PM's when stand alone DVD recorders cost more than PM's. Apple has also been known to put later-discarded recorder technologies (DVD-RAM) in their PM's.
There aren't any Hi-def players available yet in mass production. That is supposed to start in the first quarter to early second quarter.
And cost more. At least on the PC side. But it does seem to do Shader 3 very well.
Either card would be good. But face facts. GL on the Mac needs a big boost whether ATI or Nvidia. Because both are 100% behind their PC equivalents on the driver front.
I thought Tiger was going to fix that. Hmmph.
When Doom 3 scores on a Dual 2.7 suck compared to an 'average' PC you have to ask what's going on?
Lemon Bon Bon
Well you haven't seen everything. This is new. Anandtech reported on it on the 13th. The tests are from HEXUS which a pretty well known site and often gets preliminary drivers and software from companies shortly before they intro it officially.
Here are their tests, just remember it's not finished being tweeked. Also remember that almost no gamer plays at 1024 x 768.
I will be buying one of these machines. I've waited 6 years. That's quite enough. Ridiculous. But I think these machines are going to be the finest PowerMacs ever shipped.
PCI Express is nice. But it's not a massive difference to AGP at the moment. It's just a nice 'token' to have that your platform isn't 'behind'.
More important are Dual Core or rather DUAL Dual Core with performance advantages AND a decent GPU. ATI or Nvidia's latest.
I'd be happy with that. AND happier with the attention and fanfare for 'Pro' solutions that has been showered on the iPod.
Apple, I think, are beginning to go to another level with their product introductions. Software and hardware in the glow of the iPod halo.
Good stuff.
lemon bon bon
The problem with PCI, but much more so with PCI X, is that it won't be around much longer. The expectation is that at least 50% of all PC's sold by January will be Express based. Not many machines ever used the X bus, and those that did, for the most part, were not crossover machines as the PM's are i.e. home machines as well as technical and professional workstations.
Most of the higher machines such as workstations and servers that had been built around PCI X have already moved to Express. The reason why this is important is that boards based on the X standard will rapidly disappear. Apple simply doesn't sell enough PM's to keep those manufacturers in business making them. I would expect that a year from now, boards such as SATA, Firewire, USB, audio, Video (as opposed to graphics) boards, and others will be disappearing from shelves.
None of the new graphics boards from ATI and Nvidia run on AGP, and while it's expected that they will rework the medium and low end boards to do so, the high end ones won't. AGP can no longer support the memory bandwidth they require. 16 pipe boards can't run on AGP.
It's expected that the generation after this one, expected in mid year 2006, may not run on AGP at all, unless they decide to have the low end boards only come with an AGP interface. By 2007 no board will work with AGP only older generation boards will do that.
It's like the situation we have now, where an AGP 4X machine, like everything before the G5, will only run a 9800 board, which at this time is totally obsolete. I'm sure you have seen the tests on that.
The dual^2 thing, what will that mean in use when not using specialized apps?
When going from single -> dual processors what did we gain? I understand we primary gained in apps compiled for dual processors and to a lesser extend when running multiple apps, where the finder would level out the load to both processors (but not nearly as good as specialized apps). Or did the finder just level out its OWN work load?
How is that compared when going dual processors to dual "dual core" processors? Is each core less than the cores that are in the processors now? Is the benefits comparable (and how) of going single single core -> dual single core as going single single core -> single dual core?
Everything benefits to some extent with two cores or chips. OS X, unlike OS 9 and before, is much better at using two (and finally!) four chips. The OS is much snappier with two. It also allows the program more cpu time, thus speeding it up, if only slightly.
Few programs will gain much, if anything, from four cpu's even if they are written to take advantage of more than one.
But, as you point out, multiple app usage will be much faster. Remember though that most apps in the background are NOT doing anything. They are just sitting there waiting for your input.
So, if you are like me, you might have Photoshop, Illustrator, and Indesign open at once, but you are only actually using one at a time. The others are doing nothing. You can check Activity Monitor" to see what;'s happening.
Only programs that are working, such as a FCP render will be using appreciable cpu time. Others such as Safari use some as well because they are also working.
As to which way is better, dual cores or dual chips, each seems to have its advantages and disadvantages. IBM increased the L2 cache for the PM chips so maybe that will help.
Comments
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
I hope apple are going to appley the same level of panache to their Pro line relaunch.
The iMac relauch (and that's waht it was...) was nothing short of stunning.
GPU. Answered. Faster CPu. Faster bus. 512 megs. Upto 2.5 gigs. Upto 500 gig hard drive?
Pci Express.
Pro-Machines.
I'd like to see the equivalent level of innovation of 'Front Row'. A new app. Something cool. For pros. Dual Dual core across the line.
Good gpus as standard.
Option for 7800gtx. WITH decent drivers Open GL for change.
Apple's all about the software. And their software range is growing every year. I hope Apple adds to the pro-line software on Wednesday.
They're drawing attention to Macs now..using Halo of iPod as leverage at these events.
Now.
Lemon Bon Bon
Well the cpu speed was no great shakes. from 2 GHz to 2.1GHz on the top and the bottom from 1.8 to 1.9. I would have liked to see just a bit more. But otherwise a very good upgrade.
I would rather see an ATI 1800xt. They just came out with new software drivers that re-programs the GPU so that it now actually beats the Nvidia in Doom 3 an speeds up Open Gl overall. Maybe that will help us too.
Hey, maybe both.
Originally posted by melgross
You might think that, but you don't know that.
I also thought that due to IBM's experience with dual cores they would have had the MP out way before Intel and AMD. We were expecting that. But they didn't. We were expecting it at least 18 months ago. So don't expect anything at this time. Just hope.
The 970MP is a pair of 970 cores with doubled L2 caches each connected to a shared elastic bus FSB. At 1.25 GHz (for a 2.5 GHz processor) this FSB has 8 GB/sec of upstream and 8 GB/sec of downstream bandwidth -- which is more than the current G5 memory subsystem can sustain at its peak rate. Two dual core chips obviously puts double the pressure on the memory system. Even if Apple goes it DDR2 its not clear that the memory will meet the FSB's capabilities so it likely doesn't matter that the FSB is shared between the dual cores.
The 1 MB L2 cache per core will make a huge difference to performance, however, and will alleviate the shortage of memory bandwidth for broad classes of problems. Heterogenous workloads will benefit -- many applications will run compute intensive code on data which fits in the L2 cache and this will run very well at the same time as a bandwidth intensive calculate on a different core. Your video processing task won't slow down your SETI background tasks.
I'm going to be sorely tempted to buy one of these. If they have PCI Express and new ATI GPUs then I fear for my pocketbook. The memory bandwidth problem is eased somewhat if half of your traffic is going across to the GPU in parallel with the other half coming from memory. CoreImage probably screams on these beasts.
Originally posted by Programmer
The 970MP is a pair of 970 cores with doubled L2 caches each connected to a shared elastic bus FSB. At 1.25 GHz (for a 2.5 GHz processor) this FSB has 8 GB/sec of upstream and 8 GB/sec of downstream bandwidth -- which is more than the current G5 memory subsystem can sustain at its peak rate. Two dual core chips obviously puts double the pressure on the memory system. Even if Apple goes it DDR2 its not clear that the memory will meet the FSB's capabilities so it likely doesn't matter that the FSB is shared between the dual cores.
The 1 MB L2 cache per core will make a huge difference to performance, however, and will alleviate the shortage of memory bandwidth for broad classes of problems. Heterogenous workloads will benefit -- many applications will run compute intensive code on data which fits in the L2 cache and this will run very well at the same time as a bandwidth intensive calculate on a different core. Your video processing task won't slow down your SETI background tasks.
I'm going to be sorely tempted to buy one of these. If they have PCI Express and new ATI GPUs then I fear for my pocketbook. The memory bandwidth problem is eased somewhat if half of your traffic is going across to the GPU in parallel with the other half coming from memory. CoreImage probably screams on these beasts.
Definitely. The doubled cache that IBM announced will certainly help. If it has Express I intend to get one myself.
Now, this is something I seem to remember, but I haven't given it much thought for a while. Hasn't it been said that the memory controller couldn't handle the total bandwidth of both chips? If so, how will that affect a quad core design?
Originally posted by kmok1
This makes me ponder: What is Steve going to do for MWSF???
10.5 Leopard preview.
3. Can Apple put an HD-DVD recorder of one flavor or the other in upgraded PowerMacs? "Too expensive" may not be a well-justified response, since Apple put regular DVD recorders in the PM's when stand alone DVD recorders cost more than PM's. Apple has also been known to put later-discarded recorder technologies (DVD-RAM) in their PM's.
Given, that early resolutions specs for a future powerbook were leaked in a pb manual, Can anyone make an educated guess at what the 15" powerbook's resolutionw will be? I assume widescreen and HD? anyone care to make a mockup. Obviously the graphic I posted earlier didn't show them as widescreen.
Given what's on Dell's Website I assume this is what Apple's specs will be:
12.1" 1280 x 768 pixels
15.4" 1680 x 1050 pixels\t
17" 1920 x 1200 pixels
I'm gonna buy a "17 powerbook Weds with 2 Gigs of RAM if they're out that day.
would rather see an ATI 1800xt. They just came out with new software drivers that re-programs the GPU so that it now actually beats the Nvidia in Doom 3 an speeds up Open Gl overall. Maybe that will help us too.
Not in any of the benches I've seen.
The Nividia still hands teh Ati card it's a**
ATI is late to the party.
And cost more. At least on the PC side. But it does seem to do Shader 3 very well.
Either card would be good. But face facts. GL on the Mac needs a big boost whether ATI or Nvidia. Because both are 100% behind their PC equivalents on the driver front.
I thought Tiger was going to fix that. Hmmph.
When Doom 3 scores on a Dual 2.7 suck compared to an 'average' PC you have to ask what's going on?
Lemon Bon Bon
PCI Express is nice. But it's not a massive difference to AGP at the moment. It's just a nice 'token' to have that your platform isn't 'behind'.
More important are Dual Core or rather DUAL Dual Core with performance advantages AND a decent GPU. ATI or Nvidia's latest.
I'd be happy with that. AND happier with the attention and fanfare for 'Pro' solutions that has been showered on the iPod.
Apple, I think, are beginning to go to another level with their product introductions. Software and hardware in the glow of the iPod halo.
Good stuff.
lemon bon bon
When going from single -> dual processors what did we gain? I understand we primary gained in apps compiled for dual processors and to a lesser extend when running multiple apps, where the finder would level out the load to both processors (but not nearly as good as specialized apps). Or did the finder just level out its OWN work load?
How is that compared when going dual processors to dual "dual core" processors? Is each core less than the cores that are in the processors now? Is the benefits comparable (and how) of going single single core -> dual single core as going single single core -> single dual core?
Originally posted by kmok1
This makes me ponder: What is Steve going to do for MWSF???
Originally posted by BWhaler
10.5 Leopard preview.
iPod nano 6GB or 8GB (discontinuing the 2GB)
iPod 80GB
iWork 6
something like that...
With regard to Blu-ray and Apple, wasn't Apple first to market with their DVD burning Superdrive?
I couldn't recall the manufacturer but google shows that it was a Pioneer, is this correct?
I also noticed that engadget has a blurb on the Pioneer BDR-101A Blu-ray burner (backward compatable with DVD burning but not CD burning). It appears as "BDR-101A" in the photos at akihabaranews, but even they text it as "BRD-101A", which appears to have propagated to other websites (blu-ray.com shows it as "BDR-101" along with several other "prototypes"). It appears that the first mention of this on the web dates to 08/23 (see http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?t=146842 which references the source at dvdrwinfo.net (in Korean!)), is this correct? I thought that they (Japanese) were already marketing Blu-ray in their country?
Searching pioneerelectronics.com (US) and pioneer.co.jp (Japan) shows no hits via google, there are also no PR's on these sites WRT this burner.
I also didn't see this drive being sold anywhere, I may have missed it.
I also searched AI for this keyword "BDR-101A" (and "Pioneer" in the two most recent threads WRT specific Blu-ray burners) with no hits, thinking you guys would know (or have discussed) this burner.
Seeing as (I presume) that Apple (and Pioneer) were first to the desktop market with the Superdrive, could this happen again, with the PM's next week? With the BDR-101A?
Maybe AI's sources got it wrong on the PB Blu-ray burners and meant PM's?
Could this in fact be "The year of HD" (at least for content creators) as CIJ suggested at MWSF05?
This would make the PM's best of class (in my opinion, with Apple's HW panache, OS X, and assuming 970MP dualies (4-way), PCI-e, DDR2, etcetera)).
I can dream can't I?
Thoughts? Comments?
Originally posted by adamrao
At the end of this semester, I'm going to buy a 12" Powerbook with a 20" Cinema Display and use it for the next 4-5 years while working on my PhD. If the 15" and 17" get nice HD displays and cool new features while the PB 12" get "upgraded" to a 1.67 GHz G4 and 512 MB RAM standard... I'm not going to be happy.
\\
At the end of next week your options may have changed a bit!
Depending on what your major is the 23" display may be a better choice, simply because you can have more windows open at once. I broke down and bought one when I moved my accounting program from XP (the last app to go) to OS X. Lots of windows open at once to keep everything in view and it was the most significant user oriented improvement I've seen in computers for years. It is worth taking a look at, especially with a lot of windows open.
Good luck on the PhD - hope all goes well.
Originally posted by dh87
Three questions about possible upgrades. 1. Everyone seems to agree that Freescale doesn't have a dual core chip. From power and space considerations, could Apple put two 7448's in one PB? Presumably, they're lower power and smaller than the current 7447's, and they have (might have?) a faster bus making them effective in a two-processor configuration, and Apple does have some experience making dual processor G4's. 2. Would two G4 processors be effective in video decoding, or is this not a parallel-ible (able?) task?
3. Can Apple put an HD-DVD recorder of one flavor or the other in upgraded PowerMacs? "Too expensive" may not be a well-justified response, since Apple put regular DVD recorders in the PM's when stand alone DVD recorders cost more than PM's. Apple has also been known to put later-discarded recorder technologies (DVD-RAM) in their PM's.
There aren't any Hi-def players available yet in mass production. That is supposed to start in the first quarter to early second quarter.
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
Not in any of the benches I've seen.
The Nividia still hands teh Ati card it's a**
ATI is late to the party.
And cost more. At least on the PC side. But it does seem to do Shader 3 very well.
Either card would be good. But face facts. GL on the Mac needs a big boost whether ATI or Nvidia. Because both are 100% behind their PC equivalents on the driver front.
I thought Tiger was going to fix that. Hmmph.
When Doom 3 scores on a Dual 2.7 suck compared to an 'average' PC you have to ask what's going on?
Lemon Bon Bon
Well you haven't seen everything. This is new. Anandtech reported on it on the 13th. The tests are from HEXUS which a pretty well known site and often gets preliminary drivers and software from companies shortly before they intro it officially.
Here are their tests, just remember it's not finished being tweeked. Also remember that almost no gamer plays at 1024 x 768.
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=3668
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
I will be buying one of these machines. I've waited 6 years. That's quite enough. Ridiculous. But I think these machines are going to be the finest PowerMacs ever shipped.
PCI Express is nice. But it's not a massive difference to AGP at the moment. It's just a nice 'token' to have that your platform isn't 'behind'.
More important are Dual Core or rather DUAL Dual Core with performance advantages AND a decent GPU. ATI or Nvidia's latest.
I'd be happy with that. AND happier with the attention and fanfare for 'Pro' solutions that has been showered on the iPod.
Apple, I think, are beginning to go to another level with their product introductions. Software and hardware in the glow of the iPod halo.
Good stuff.
lemon bon bon
The problem with PCI, but much more so with PCI X, is that it won't be around much longer. The expectation is that at least 50% of all PC's sold by January will be Express based. Not many machines ever used the X bus, and those that did, for the most part, were not crossover machines as the PM's are i.e. home machines as well as technical and professional workstations.
Most of the higher machines such as workstations and servers that had been built around PCI X have already moved to Express. The reason why this is important is that boards based on the X standard will rapidly disappear. Apple simply doesn't sell enough PM's to keep those manufacturers in business making them. I would expect that a year from now, boards such as SATA, Firewire, USB, audio, Video (as opposed to graphics) boards, and others will be disappearing from shelves.
None of the new graphics boards from ATI and Nvidia run on AGP, and while it's expected that they will rework the medium and low end boards to do so, the high end ones won't. AGP can no longer support the memory bandwidth they require. 16 pipe boards can't run on AGP.
It's expected that the generation after this one, expected in mid year 2006, may not run on AGP at all, unless they decide to have the low end boards only come with an AGP interface. By 2007 no board will work with AGP only older generation boards will do that.
It's like the situation we have now, where an AGP 4X machine, like everything before the G5, will only run a 9800 board, which at this time is totally obsolete. I'm sure you have seen the tests on that.
Originally posted by Anders
The dual^2 thing, what will that mean in use when not using specialized apps?
When going from single -> dual processors what did we gain? I understand we primary gained in apps compiled for dual processors and to a lesser extend when running multiple apps, where the finder would level out the load to both processors (but not nearly as good as specialized apps). Or did the finder just level out its OWN work load?
How is that compared when going dual processors to dual "dual core" processors? Is each core less than the cores that are in the processors now? Is the benefits comparable (and how) of going single single core -> dual single core as going single single core -> single dual core?
Everything benefits to some extent with two cores or chips. OS X, unlike OS 9 and before, is much better at using two (and finally!) four chips. The OS is much snappier with two. It also allows the program more cpu time, thus speeding it up, if only slightly.
Few programs will gain much, if anything, from four cpu's even if they are written to take advantage of more than one.
But, as you point out, multiple app usage will be much faster. Remember though that most apps in the background are NOT doing anything. They are just sitting there waiting for your input.
So, if you are like me, you might have Photoshop, Illustrator, and Indesign open at once, but you are only actually using one at a time. The others are doing nothing. You can check Activity Monitor" to see what;'s happening.
Only programs that are working, such as a FCP render will be using appreciable cpu time. Others such as Safari use some as well because they are also working.
As to which way is better, dual cores or dual chips, each seems to have its advantages and disadvantages. IBM increased the L2 cache for the PM chips so maybe that will help.