There will be woodcrest in two years, it just will be cheap enough to go in iMac. The developement costs are such that I doubt Intel will just say goodbye to woodcrest. It will just move down the food chain.
No, Woodcrest is the newest Xeon DP. That means it is a workstation & server chip. Xeon is rarely "moved down" to consumer computers. The Conroe is mostly the same chip anyway and plenty for consumer use..
But there have been well over 100 machines announced.
But how many of them are shipping?
What does it matter. PC users will buy PC's That's my take on it. If you want a product from Apple your just going to have to wait until their quality assurance is over, and that has a lot to do with seeing what else is out there. Apple doesn't have to compete with PC's. They can now sit back, wait and see what the rest of the field is offering. Apple will announce in about 4 weeks. They may announce an xserve sooner though. But not a Mac Pro. There is no need to get all emotional about it. General discussion is open in the other forum.
I wish people would stop using rumored names to call machines. The name Mac Pro is stupid as hell, so lets stop calling it that until if/when its official. There is no proof they will call it that yet. And for those that claim its proof because of the trademark filing on "Mac Pro" well thats just one of hundreds of names that have been filed by apple and never used yet.
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
I vote for MacTower and MacTower Pro...
i just get annoyed when people keep using "Mac Pro" so much.
I wish people would stop using rumored names to call machines. The name Mac Pro is stupid as hell, so lets stop calling it that until if/when its official. There is no proof they will call it that yet. And for those that claim its proof because of the trademark filing on "Mac Pro" well thats just one of hundreds of names that have been filed by apple and never used yet.
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
I vote for MacTower and MacTower Pro...
i just get annoyed when people keep using "Mac Pro" so much.
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
Is this a joke, or a serious question?
Mac Pro is a perfectly logical name with their new naming scheme. The only Intel Mac not to fit in that scheme is the iMac, and only so because the name has simply become such a powerful brand. Other than that, it's very much aligned. A 3x2 matrix, with only the MacBook mini not having surfaced. Who knows
I believe a search on these boards will show me to be the first to propose the MacTower Pro moniker.
'Mac Pro' is truly a dumb name.
Unfortunately, this is a season of dumb names for Apple machines. Deal with it.
I have resigned myself to the fact the new machines will likely have the 'Mac Pro' name on them.
What's more important is what's inside and whether on not Apple will be able to claim that the new machines run even Photoshop and Office just as fast as the previous G5s.
That claim alone would mean that Pros would begin to switch even without Adobe, and cause Apple stock to surge.
Given the new processor, memory and bandwidth, and the fact that by the time the new machines ship the G5 would not have been updated for almost a year, I think this this is in the realm of possibility.
Mac Pro is logical, and there was a trademark filing for it. If it turns out to be the MacTower or Tower Mac, or Mac Extreme, we'll start calling it that.
Boy ThinkSecret has gone a little soft...they publish a report stating that Xserves maybe imminent but admit that their sources aren't all corrobrating...
What does it matter. PC users will buy PC's That's my take on it. If you want a product from Apple your just going to have to wait until their quality assurance is over, and that has a lot to do with seeing what else is out there. Apple doesn't have to compete with PC's. They can now sit back, wait and see what the rest of the field is offering. Apple will announce in about 4 weeks.
The workstation and server market isn't like the consumer computer market. Computer makers generally don't just shove out crap into the workstation and server market and expect to stay in that segment for long, so I doubt those announced systems are unreliable, poorly made or insufficiently tested.
When they went to water cooling all of the two chip systems used it. I don't remember if all of the latter machines with the dual core chips did though.
Apple-history says that the first liquid cooled G5 was only the top-end 2.5GHz unit, the 2x2.0 unit introduced at the same time didn't need it. I thought that continued with the next revision, dual 2.7 using liquid cooling, with the dual 2.3 not using it, but I haven't found that information yet.
I would say it really doesn't matter if only the top end uses the liquid cooling. One model using it will screw the rest of them over, as Apple will keep the same case/mobo, and the main problem with the Powermac's cooling is the size.
Then again, because of forum issues, I can't see the post you quoted, so I may be in left field here.
In two years woodcrest will be slow processor, and apple probably wont be using them anymore.
Heh. In two years time Apple will be using Intel chips
< 50nm for sure. Who knows if 65nm Cores will still be around in two years time... Probably on the bottom end, just like how Pentium D 90nm CPUs are all hitting/ moving towards the bargain basement.
I would say it really doesn't matter if only the top end uses the liquid cooling. One model using it will screw the rest of them over, as Apple will keep the same case/mobo, and the main problem with the Powermac's cooling is the size.
Then again, because of forum issues, I can't see the post you quoted, so I may be in left field here.
The issue was about cost of the base model, not case size. It's unclear whether the liquid cooling had an effect on case size because the first generation units didn't have it, and the second generation wasn't introduced until a full year later.
I think the whole idea of performance-per-watt is that Apple won't have to have chunky machines with liquid cooling to get some killer computing power.
Given even current Xeon and Opteron servers AFAIK do *not* use liquid cooling (admittedly they are different form factors of 1U, 2U or whatever rack style) ... the Mac Pros even the highest end will most likely *not* use liquid cooling. Some sort of smart heatpipe system with *ahem* thermal paste applied properly ... Fan noise should not be an issue with dampening material, 120mm fans or whatever.
I think Apple engineering will deliver internals that deliver the Woodcrest dualie/quad etc power that Mac Pros should have, and they should be able to manage the acoustics quite well. Well, that's the faith I have currently with the Mac Pros.
Washable filters that prevent dust buildup inside the case that you could easily slide in and out would be nice as well, but that's pushing the wishlist a bit.
Comments
Originally posted by backtomac
There will be woodcrest in two years, it just will be cheap enough to go in iMac. The developement costs are such that I doubt Intel will just say goodbye to woodcrest. It will just move down the food chain.
No, Woodcrest is the newest Xeon DP. That means it is a workstation & server chip. Xeon is rarely "moved down" to consumer computers. The Conroe is mostly the same chip anyway and plenty for consumer use..
Originally posted by onlooker
Do you not read these forums, or rember the things that you have discussed in here in the past month? You know the answer.
And actually no one has a woodcrest shipping that I am aware of. Other than intel itself.
But there have been well over 100 machines announced.
Originally posted by melgross
But there have been well over 100 machines announced.
But how many of them are shipping?
What does it matter. PC users will buy PC's That's my take on it. If you want a product from Apple your just going to have to wait until their quality assurance is over, and that has a lot to do with seeing what else is out there. Apple doesn't have to compete with PC's. They can now sit back, wait and see what the rest of the field is offering. Apple will announce in about 4 weeks. They may announce an xserve sooner though. But not a Mac Pro. There is no need to get all emotional about it. General discussion is open in the other forum.
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
I vote for MacTower and MacTower Pro...
i just get annoyed when people keep using "Mac Pro" so much.
Originally posted by doh123
I wish people would stop using rumored names to call machines. The name Mac Pro is stupid as hell, so lets stop calling it that until if/when its official. There is no proof they will call it that yet. And for those that claim its proof because of the trademark filing on "Mac Pro" well thats just one of hundreds of names that have been filed by apple and never used yet.
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
I vote for MacTower and MacTower Pro...
i just get annoyed when people keep using "Mac Pro" so much.
Shut up.
Originally posted by doh123
Ever think that they dont want other people using "Mac Pro" for other reasons than a computer name?
Is this a joke, or a serious question?
Mac Pro is a perfectly logical name with their new naming scheme. The only Intel Mac not to fit in that scheme is the iMac, and only so because the name has simply become such a powerful brand. Other than that, it's very much aligned. A 3x2 matrix, with only the MacBook mini not having surfaced. Who knows
Originally posted by kim kap sol
Shut up.
I second that. We have to call it something for purposes of discussion.
Originally posted by doh123
I vote for MacTower and MacTower Pro...
Vote all you want.
Apple is not a democracy.
'Mac Pro' is truly a dumb name.
Unfortunately, this is a season of dumb names for Apple machines. Deal with it.
I have resigned myself to the fact the new machines will likely have the 'Mac Pro' name on them.
What's more important is what's inside and whether on not Apple will be able to claim that the new machines run even Photoshop and Office just as fast as the previous G5s.
That claim alone would mean that Pros would begin to switch even without Adobe, and cause Apple stock to surge.
Given the new processor, memory and bandwidth, and the fact that by the time the new machines ship the G5 would not have been updated for almost a year, I think this this is in the realm of possibility.
Actually, my point was the opposite - that the insides matter more.
Examples like this are why you should be required to take an IQ test before posting in Future Hardware.
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0606xserve.html
Originally posted by onlooker
But how many of them are shipping?
What does it matter. PC users will buy PC's That's my take on it. If you want a product from Apple your just going to have to wait until their quality assurance is over, and that has a lot to do with seeing what else is out there. Apple doesn't have to compete with PC's. They can now sit back, wait and see what the rest of the field is offering. Apple will announce in about 4 weeks.
The workstation and server market isn't like the consumer computer market. Computer makers generally don't just shove out crap into the workstation and server market and expect to stay in that segment for long, so I doubt those announced systems are unreliable, poorly made or insufficiently tested.
Originally posted by melgross
When they went to water cooling all of the two chip systems used it. I don't remember if all of the latter machines with the dual core chips did though.
Apple-history says that the first liquid cooled G5 was only the top-end 2.5GHz unit, the 2x2.0 unit introduced at the same time didn't need it. I thought that continued with the next revision, dual 2.7 using liquid cooling, with the dual 2.3 not using it, but I haven't found that information yet.
Then again, because of forum issues, I can't see the post you quoted, so I may be in left field here.
In two years woodcrest will be slow processor, and apple probably wont be using them anymore.
Heh. In two years time Apple will be using Intel chips
< 50nm for sure. Who knows if 65nm Cores will still be around in two years time... Probably on the bottom end, just like how Pentium D 90nm CPUs are all hitting/ moving towards the bargain basement.
Originally posted by ZachPruckowski
I would say it really doesn't matter if only the top end uses the liquid cooling. One model using it will screw the rest of them over, as Apple will keep the same case/mobo, and the main problem with the Powermac's cooling is the size.
Then again, because of forum issues, I can't see the post you quoted, so I may be in left field here.
The issue was about cost of the base model, not case size. It's unclear whether the liquid cooling had an effect on case size because the first generation units didn't have it, and the second generation wasn't introduced until a full year later.
Given even current Xeon and Opteron servers AFAIK do *not* use liquid cooling (admittedly they are different form factors of 1U, 2U or whatever rack style) ... the Mac Pros even the highest end will most likely *not* use liquid cooling. Some sort of smart heatpipe system with *ahem* thermal paste applied properly
I think Apple engineering will deliver internals that deliver the Woodcrest dualie/quad etc power that Mac Pros should have, and they should be able to manage the acoustics quite well. Well, that's the faith I have currently with the Mac Pros.
Washable filters that prevent dust buildup inside the case that you could easily slide in and out would be nice as well, but that's pushing the wishlist a bit.