Apple previews iTV set-top device

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  • Reply 121 of 343
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bdj21ya


    I respectfully disagree. Compare a fast moving picture side by side between an LCD and Plasma. LCD's just don't have the refresh rate to handle a premium movie watching experience, They get blurry or fuzzy when things are moving too fast.



    If you're going to spend a lot of money on a TV, get a Plasma.



    I really don't have a problem with the recent LCDs, but plasma TVs are generally cheaper than the same size LCD. The problem is that plasma starts at 37".
  • Reply 122 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JLL


    I'm absolutely not agreeing with you here. If all-in-one is what "we" want where are all the devices then?



    Adding all that into one box just creates complexity.



    iTV is excactly what I've been asking for for years. I have a great DVD player/HDD recorder, a great amp and a great plasma, and I just need a simple device to let me see my photos on the tv, select and hear music on my stereo and perhaps watch whatever kind of QT movies I have.



    I don't need a computer in my living room since I won't be using 99% of that computers features.



    And the best of it all? I can mix and match my devices to get what I want.





    To add my 2 cents, I would love to see at least a DVD player stuck onto this thing. I don't see that adding complexity so much as reducing complexity for the average consumer. As it stands right now, Front Row is set up to view Photos, music, movie files and DVD's. The iTV handles everything except the DVD part (unless you want to spend the time to rip them all to your HD). I realize the software that SJ showed us yesterday was not "Front Row" as we know it, but it was darn close. Why not tack on a cheap (really cheap in bulk) slot loader, update Front Row across the board and call it a day? When the dust settles on the whole HDDVD/Blu Ray thing, then Apple could update as needed.



    But think about this...you could have one input on your TV that could show you your pictures, downloaded movies/music and regular DVD's. No more fiddling around with selecting the right TV input, or messing with the receiver. I know that may not sound like a big deal to most of us, but to Joe Sixpack (and more likely Sue Sixpack) the ability to turn on the TV and get all of this media from the same source would be very appealing. I can tell you from experience that my girlfriend (and her parents when they visit) would love to get all that media out of one TV input. One for the cable, one for the iTV and that's it!



    All-in-one is Apple's thing. I'm not asking to surf the web or record to a HD...just keep Front Row consistent for Macs and the iTV. One box, one remote and tons of media options.
  • Reply 123 of 343
    This product needs more refinement so I'm glad its not available now. Some people might just run out and get it as is and I think those are the same people who ran out and bought the first shuffle and then the Nano came out down the road. If all this device is going to do is allow me to stream content to it and display in on my tv, I would be better off simply using my old mac with added video capability and a wireless card.



    Apple needs to add a dvd player and hard drive to the unit at the very least. The ideal would be to put a 60 GB HD, DVD player, remote control, and give the ability to function as a DVR.



    This in no way would turn into a competing product with the mac mini.
  • Reply 124 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tempest


    This product needs more refinement so I'm glad its not available now. Some people might just run out and get it as is and I think those are the same people who ran out and bought the first shuffle and then the Nano came out down the road. If all this device is going to do is allow me to stream content to it and display in on my tv, I would be better off simply using my old mac with added video capability and a wireless card.



    Apple needs to add a dvd player and hard drive to the unit at the very least. The ideal would be to put a 60 GB HD, DVD player, remote control, and give the ability to function as a DVR.



    This in no way would turn into a competing product with the mac mini.



    Agreed it needs more refinement, it's just a pre-release announcement without even a full feature list attached! Wait till later in the year, maybe for the MacWorld Convention in January, then we'll either know more, or it'll be released.



    Why put a DVD player in it? I'd bet that Apple will allow streaming from the mac to the iTV. If they allow that, you've already got a DVD player in your mac - and one that's controllable by the Apple Remote through the iTV! How cool - one less remote to have on my coffee table! (Steve DID note that the iTV is compatible with the Apple Remote, by the way)



    Likewise, why a Hard Disk? Your Mac has one of those. All you need is a PCI card that has a cable-in port, with recording software, and your Mac will do that, too.



    Why add more crap to it? It's already expensive as it is; add more, and you may as well get the Mac Mini...



    With certain features allowable through streaming from a Mac, this thing has the potential to help me get rid of both the DVD player AND the Cd players in my home theater stack (CD player's gone already, thanks to my iPod). I think that's what Apple has in mind.



    Wait no more than two years, and Apple will have an Apple branded, surround sound home theater system sitting next to your TV, with 802.111n (or whatever the next great thing there is) streaming media content from the ITS through your Mac. Bose speakers, (Harmon Kardon for the low end) Dolby surround sound, etc.



    THAT'S what's on Apple's mind!
  • Reply 125 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rahrens


    Agreed it needs more refinement, it's just a pre-release announcement without even a full feature list attached! Wait till later in the year, maybe for the MacWorld Convention in January, then we'll either know more, or it'll be released.



    Why put a DVD player in it? I'd bet that Apple will allow streaming from the mac to the iTV. If they allow that, you've already got a DVD player in your mac - and one that's controllable by the Apple Remote through the iTV! How cool - one less remote to have on my coffee table! (Steve DID note that the iTV is compatible with the Apple Remote, by the way)



    Likewise, why a Hard Disk? Your Mac has one of those. All you need is a PCI card that has a cable-in port, with recording software, and your Mac will do that, too.



    Why add more crap to it? It's already expensive as it is; add more, and you may as well get the Mac Mini...



    With certain features allowable through streaming from a Mac, this thing has the potential to help me get rid of both the DVD player AND the Cd players in my home theater stack (CD player's gone already, thanks to my iPod). I think that's what Apple has in mind.



    Wait no more than two years, and Apple will have an Apple branded, surround sound home theater system sitting next to your TV, with 802.111n (or whatever the next great thing there is) streaming media content from the ITS through your Mac. Bose speakers, (Harmon Kardon for the low end) Dolby surround sound, etc.



    THAT'S what's on Apple's mind!



    I'd like a DVD player built into the iTV so that I wouldn't have to use my computer to read the DVD. What happens if someone wants to watch a movie and I'm playing a game that requires the disc to be in the drive? The hard drive would be useful so that you wouldn't have to rely on constant data transfers between your computer and the iTV.



    The mac mini is a computer and the iTV is clearly not. Adding a hard drive & DVD player doesn't make it one. The iTV has better video output capabilities while the mac mini in its present design, doesn't come close.
  • Reply 126 of 343
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,798member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rahrens


    Agreed it needs more refinement, it's just a pre-release announcement without even a full feature list attached!



    The whole reason for the announcement was to ensure that people do not buy competing boxes for Christmas.

    That is the only reason Jobs even mentioned it.
  • Reply 127 of 343
    iveive Posts: 23member
    So, now Elgato/EyeTV is a dead company...



    They could now focus on recording, but that's also a strong point of all the harddisk

    recorders (without a computer) out there.



    Also the CEO of Elgato last year came to Apple Germany...

    He knows it was comming.



    ive
  • Reply 128 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tempest


    The mac mini is a computer and the iTV is clearly not. Adding a hard drive & DVD player doesn't make it one. The iTV has better video output capabilities while the mac mini in its present design, doesn't come close.



    That may be, but add a 500 GB HD at almost $300 plus a DVd player at almost $100, and you're already past the price of the Mac Mini, as I noted.



    By that time, you may as well just buy the Mini. Most people would look at that price point and balk. I'm sure that's why they did it this way instead.



    This isn't intended to be a computer. And they DID include the WiFi capability just so you can stream content from your Mac. That's another reason why it doesn't, and will not have, an HDD or DVD-player.
  • Reply 129 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Frank777


    The whole reason for the announcement was to ensure that people do not buy competing boxes for Christmas.

    That is the only reason Jobs even mentioned it.



    That's not surprising... but I'm glad he did.
  • Reply 130 of 343
    The Mac version of an app that will rip DVDs is called Handbrake, it can be downloaded at:



    http://handbrake.m0k.org/?page_id=24



    Take the DVD you bought, rip it using Handbrake, make it a Quicktime movie and import it to your iTunes lIbrary, and watch it on yer iPod or through the iTV.
  • Reply 131 of 343
    pt123pt123 Posts: 696member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tundraboy


    Yes, the day will come when everything in your entertainment center will carry the Apple logo. Well, except the set top box. Though I will never part with my paradyme speakers.



    The bottleneck right now is bandwidth. Once we're up to around 30 MBPS or higher then Netflix, Blockbuster, and all the others will be as good as dead. Blockbuster already is though they don't know it yet.



    I get to watch 10 movies a month with Netflix, at my house or my friends. Can't do that with iTV, at least not easily. Open up the mail, plop the DVD in, enjoy the show, doesn't get easier than that.
  • Reply 132 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rahrens


    That may be, but add a 500 GB HD at almost $300 plus a DVd player at almost $100, and you're already past the price of the Mac Mini, as I noted.



    By that time, you may as well just buy the Mini. Most people would look at that price point and balk. I'm sure that's why they did it this way instead.



    This isn't intended to be a computer. And they DID include the WiFi capability just so you can stream content from your Mac. That's another reason why it doesn't, and will not have, an HDD or DVD-player.





    Why add a 500 GB HD? Apple can simply put a 60 GB HD and a regular DVD drive for $100 which still adds up to $200 less than the low end mac mini. If people want more hard drive space they can simply add a usb hard drive like people already do with the mac mini.



    Competing products to iTV currently: http://www.zensonic.com/z500_overview.php

    http://www.buildyourowncomputer.com/...PROD/J5/13184B
  • Reply 133 of 343
    screedscreed Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Frank777


    The whole reason for the announcement was to ensure that people do not buy competing boxes for Christmas.

    That is the only reason Jobs even mentioned it.



    Hand > Forehead > SMACK!



    Of course. I was trying to figure out why Steve would do such a thing.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ive


    So, now Elgato/EyeTV is a dead company...



    I disagree.

    Although I understand where you're going, now that TV shows and movies are available from IT(formerly M)S without commercials, who'd buy a $150 widget that does the same thing with commercials, right?

    I see that point but Elgato widgets have mobility on their side plus, most importantly, US broadband is thoroughly lacking for the time being.

    Pulling shows off the air is highly convenient in areas where broadband is lacking or missing.
  • Reply 134 of 343
    The iTV is a nice idea, but so was the cube...anyone remember that?



    The iTV will tank in its present form. Period. Why am I (or the typical consumer) going to pay $300 so that I can watch sub-standard video downloaded onto my Mac, broadcast to my overpriced/under-featured iTV to watch 640x480 video on my 50" screen TV with 5.1 Dolby Digital sound system????



    I can hear a big fat "DOH!" right now. My only hope is that Steve really *gets* it and that this is just the first forray to keep the MPAA happy, and his plans are to turn this device into a worthwhile product rather than another waste of time and money.



    My prediction; the iTV (or any competing device) will only take off if:
    • You can download DVD quality video in Dolby5.1/THX

    • It can replace at the very least a basic DVR

    • Offers a legitimate alternative to Cable Companies On-Demand Rentals

    I mean really, the entertainment world is gearing up for the next revolution in quality and it's called Hi-Def, so who really wants something that is a step back in quality and you're paying more money to boot?



    fuzz_ball
  • Reply 135 of 343
    screedscreed Posts: 1,077member
    If the iTV didn't have HD capability right now, they would not have bothered with HDMI and component connections. They could have slapped in VGA and S-video a great deal more inexpensively.



    Apple != idiots.



    Come on now.



    Edit: I'm having issues with the word they today.
  • Reply 136 of 343
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sCreeD


    Apple != idiots.



    Come on now.



    Edit: I'm having issues with the word they today.



    1) I never said Apple is full of idiots.

    2) Just because they are not idiots, doesn't mean they can't release a bad product (e.g. the Cube)

    3) Yes, it has HDMI, but then my Gamecube has broadband capabilities built-in that were never fully used.

    4) Like I said, I hope the reason for this neutered first version was simply to keep the TV/Movie execs happy and that Steve is ferverishly working them over to the reality of what consumers want.

    5) We all have issues once in a while, so you're not alone



    fuzz_ball
  • Reply 137 of 343
    So, considering the fact that Apple's Q1 2007 ends December 31st 2006, when do you think the product will be released? Is this why they announced it now (only a month or two away vs almost 6)?
  • Reply 138 of 343
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,949member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by fuzz_ball


    1) I never said Apple is full of idiots.

    2) Just because they are not idiots, doesn't mean they can't release a bad product (e.g. the Cube)



    I thought the only major problem with the Cube was the price. I don't think anyone is saying that Apple can't make a bad product, but I didn't think the Cube was bad.



    Apple generally seems to make nice products, though I don't think the Mighty Mouse is good.
  • Reply 139 of 343
    screedscreed Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by fuzz_ball


    1) I never said Apple is full of idiots.

    2) Just because they are not idiots, doesn't mean they can't release a bad product (e.g. the Cube)

    3) Yes, it has HDMI, but then my Gamecube has broadband capabilities built-in that were never fully used.

    4) Like I said, I hope the reason for this neutered first version was simply to keep the TV/Movie execs happy and that Steve is ferverishly working them over to the reality of what consumers want.

    5) We all have issues once in a while, so you're not alone



    Okay, fair enough, did not mean to put words in your mouth. On #3, you're kind of sidestepping here. Let me restate what I said before, but differently. For 640x480 video, HDMI and component video outs are awfully high bandwidth/quality ports for such low quality source. (Nudge, nudge, wink, wink).

    On #4, I don't think Apple or Steve work like that. Look, the entertainment execs, fully and completely chickened out of having their content available on Day One. (Either that or Jobs/Iger decided for Disney to be the premiere content provider and everyone else will be let in when the holiday shopping season starts in Oct./Nov.).

    There was a story on Engadget or Gizmodo, where the guys were seeing a demo of the unit and asked to see the settings such screen resolution. The Apple demonstrator essentially said "not today, maybe later."

    I'll cut to the chase:

    Later spring 2007

    -Library content, DVD-quality $9.99

    -Debut content, DVD-quality $14.99

    -Library content, HD-quailty $18.99

    -Debut content, HD-quailty $24.99



    Boom! All of a sudden, iTunes is competing directly with Blu-ray and HD-DVD sales at essentially the same price and the iTV will handle both resolutions.



    You can buy HD content today for $19.99, but can you get a Blu-ray or HD-DVD player for $300? Nope. Not until, at the earliest, the '07 holiday shopping season.
  • Reply 139 of 343
    screedscreed Posts: 1,077member
    FRAK! DP.





    Oh and the Cube was a marketing failure not an engineering one.
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