Why I would go for a new iPod over an iPhone for a while:
(1) If I were going to spring 600 bucks on a "convergence" device, I would want something that would actually replace my ipod - all 23 gigs of my music/photos/video podcasts. I mean, it is widescreen with brilliant video - but only 8 Gigs? Perhaps as a nano replacement it works...But it is no full ipod replacement with only 8 Gigs of memory...
Well, maybe I'm not the average user, but I prefer to store my MP3 collection on a RAID 5 server myself. Having had 6 hard drives die on me over a 10 year period, I don't trust a collection of music I've spent 7 years building to any single hard drive -- especially a portable one. That's like leaving a collection of vinyl records in a glass house and hoping the sun doesn't shine for too long on it.
So 8 gigs is plenty for me on a portable listening device.
Quote:
(2)Apple tends to wildly exaggerate battery life, so if they say 5 hours -I take it with a grain of salt and wonder - what if it is something miserable, like 2 in real world conditions? Without a user-replaceable battery, it has to have some good battery life unless you want to be saddled with a charger at home, work, car, etc...
Admittedly, I'm not an avid cell phone user, but I'm sure that there'll be enough charge in one battery to last at least a day under heavy use. I dunno about you, but I can't always listen to music at my job. I actually need to speak with people and go to meetings occasionally. At which time I won't be using the device. I also prefer to read and send email at a real computer with a decent sized monitor. So I'd estimate heavy use to be about 6-8 hours of continuous usage (being on the phone, listening to music, or internet usage when you're not at a real computer). I'm sure the battery will be able to do that at the very least. This isn't a laptop computer after all.
Quote:
(3) If I so much as glance at my ipod screen, it scratches - hopefully it is more smudge-scratch proof than it seems...
If you're so averse to scratches, buy a protective case for it. I'm sure there'll be plenty of them when this device hits the market. I personally view a few scuffs and scratches to be the normal wear and tear of ownership, but I can understand the need to keep things in "mint condition" some people have.
Quote:
Finally, the software is closed - so you have to wait for Apple to release a "widget" that you could really use but Apple hasn't released it yet.
If it's based on Mac OS, then I'm sure that Apple will be happy to provide developer tools for it once it's released. After all, the more cool applications/widgets/etc which are developed for the phone, the more phones they'll sell. I can't see why they'd keep it as a closed development environment after it's been released to the public.
Unless you're expecting them to open source the OS itself -- but I'm not sure why you'd need that unless you're planning to develop your own device based on it.
wow very nicely put, i agree with everything you have said auxio, except that last part, i guess Job's said it will be closed app on newsweek, but he did say that widgets will become the future of apps and most things should be created on widgets, and he also said that if third parties did want to create products, they would have to go through apple and have permission along with a Q&A time about the software...at least everything will be clean and not buggy on the phone, my Dash has a lot of things i put on myself and the phone now works half the time..kind of sucks
(1) If I were going to spring 600 bucks on a "convergence" device, I would want something that would actually replace my ipod - all 23 gigs of my music/photos/video podcasts. I mean, it is widescreen with brilliant video - but only 8 Gigs? Perhaps as a nano replacement it works...But it is no full ipod replacement with only 8 Gigs of memory...
It's not meant to replace ANY iPod. Do you really expect people to strap an iPhone to their arm when they're working out? It's a replacement for crappy smartphones. That's it! NOt everyone wants or needs an iPhone just as not everyone wants or needs an iPod video. If you look at Apple's marketing and release history, the next major change to the iPod Video will be a full size, touch screen with a 100GB HDD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Truthbearer
(2)Apple tends to wildly exaggerate battery life, so if they say 5 hours -I take it with a grain of salt and wonder - what if it is something miserable, like 2 in real world conditions? Without a user-replaceable battery, it has to have some good battery life unless you want to be saddled with a charger at home, work, car, etc...
THe weren't very accurate several years prior but now they are pretty dead on balls with multiple reports that the battery exceeded Apple's claims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Truthbearer
(3) If I so much as glance at my ipod screen, it scratches - hopefully it is more smudge-scratch proof than it seems...
Nope. It's the same polycarbonate screen with a touch sensitive film applied. I guess you shouldn't "glance" at it. Nice hyperbole, there! The trick is to either not care or actaully take care of your stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Truthbearer
Finally, the software is closed - so you have to wait for Apple to release a "widget" that you could really use but Apple hasn't released it yet.
There is always a chance someone will hack the OS, but there are several reasons why Apple has a closed platform. It's a lvoe hate thing, but overall, it keeps the phone is working solidly. Poorly made 3rd-party apps is the leading cause of system errors. Apple could also sell widgets on the iTS or they may be working on a development kit. The current Xocde won't work. remember, the Phone doesn't have a PPC or Intel processor.
i thought it might be running PPC...they just didnt know yet...nothing has really been official about the chip in the phone, im gonna hope its something ppc ARM or intel, even tho intel said they have no idea about it haha
I think that, to some degree it is. It's biggest market will probably be the customer that justifies it has the best iPod - and one that includes a phone, so it is easier to justify buying. If you were giong to buy a new iPod, replacing a 1 or 2 gen iPod what would you be looking at? All of a sudden you're looking at one more iPod - this one with a phone included as well as being the most beautiful iPod made.
To make it easier to decide I would not be surprised to see Apple releasing an iPod that is basically the iPhone without the phone. It will generate more profits for Apple (especially through economies of scale) and blow the market apart - yet again.
I think that, to some degree it is. It's biggest market will probably be the customer that justifies it has the best iPod - and one that includes a phone, so it is easier to justify buying. If you were giong to buy a new iPod, replacing a 1 or 2 gen iPod what would you be looking at? All of a sudden you're looking at one more iPod - this one with a phone included as well as being the most beautiful iPod made.
Every new iPod model has altered the sales of the other iPod models when it's introduced. So why do they do it? Obviously, it opens their product up to s larger range of potential customers. The iPhone WILL NOT replace the iPod Video for those that:
a) prefer their non-Cingular call carrier
b) do not need a handheld internet device
c) do not want an al-in-one device
d) prefer more than >30GB of storage.
e) (to a lesser degree) prefer the textile feeling of a clickwheel for eyes-free operation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenaustus
To make it easier to decide I would not be surprised to see Apple releasing an iPod that is basically the iPhone without the phone.
That too is obvious. It's the next thing to do. I imaginethey will use OS X Leopard, like in the iPhone, to utilize Core Animation. Other features will all depend on if they can increase the battery life, capacity and/or hardware features (e.g.:wi-fi) without also signifiicantly increasing the weigh, size and/or cost. There is no way for us to know the logistics of the problems they face. I'm still awed by how much stuff they jammed into the iPhone.
I can't believe that Cingular will sell 10 million of these when there customers are almost 60 million. Does NOT compute. $500-600 phone in the land of nokia 6010?
Uhhh..how about NEW subscribers? Duh.
I'm not a cingular subscriber but I'm tearing up my T-mobile contract the day the iPhone comes out. How to afford the cancelation fees? Just buy AAPL stock now, should easily cover it in six-months. 8)
haha me too....and A LOT of people will be doing the same thing...ill be in line for the iphone WHILE im cancelling my tmobile plan and porting my number..gonna be a great day
Me three. I like T-Mobile and have had horrible experiences with CIngular's customer service, but I will be switching to Cingular posthaste when the iPhonr is available.
Me three. I like T-Mobile and have had horrible experiences with CIngular's customer service, but I will be switching to Cingular posthaste when the iPhonr is available.
haha its not that bad..at least here in southern california, well all i can say is i have tmobile but have no idea about tmobiles service, i do know their support sucks, but i dont live near any tmobile towers, only cingular, so my phone always says cingular...never had a dropped called never had a problem for 9 months, im happy with it
It is the same screen as the regular iPod with a touch sensor laid over it.
Also, do your homework before you tell me I am wrong about the closed OS -both that same interview, and Steve Jobs' Newsweek interview (today) confirmed that it will be closed. And if you think you can significant;y improve battery life with new technology in a couple of months, you need to get an education...
WHat do you mean by closed?
that doesnt mean that there will be no third party apps for it -- Windows Mobile is closed, but there are great 3rd party apps, ghell, MS sells an IDE specifically for it...and technically OSX is closed too...
I would bet money that they will put out an SDK/IDE for it at WWDC, which happens to be a little way after the phones release -- thus they can get a ton of feedback on the phone its self without any 2rd party interference...this is key for bug fixes and market research for what to change/add in future iterations.
Me three. I like T-Mobile and have had horrible experiences with CIngular's customer service, but I will be switching to Cingular posthaste when the iPhonr is available.
Yeah, cingular is not great. But the reason Apple went with them is because they suck so bad --Steve Jobs can strong-arm them to change their entire networks to fit his phone, and they are bending over and doing it else go out of business. Once the money pours into cingular, expect their infrastructure to grow fast. 3G, etc, will come quickly. I have no worries about the new Cingular.
Customer service bad? When SJ hears about it, he will get on his iPhone and straighten Cingular out, fast!
haha i love your thinking..and i agree...Jobs will spank spank spank till cingular stands tall to be a great carrier
and a_greer, i agree with you too...WWDC will be right after the launch and windows mobile is closed, yet they have some great apps that can be placed on the phone, iphone has mac os x so why not let apple make some awesome apps, they know what to do dont worry theyre user friendly unlike pc..remember?
that doesnt mean that there will be no third party apps for it -- Windows Mobile is closed, but there are great 3rd party apps, ghell, MS sells an IDE specifically for it...and technically OSX is closed too...
Is Windows Mobile really closed? I knew a couple people that programmed for it using the regular Visual Studio bundle, no secret society, no hazing, nothing special.
haha i love your thinking..and i agree...Jobs will spank spank spank till cingular stands tall to be a great carrier
Exactly. Many of iPhone's ideas have been around, but the network companys rule the roost, not the phone designers. They have all kinds of stupid beurocracy and business suits preventing good ideas. SJ went to Cingular and said, "You guys suck, and you know it. You have no ideas of your own. No 3G, no media deals, etc. Give me everything I want and we will get an amazing phone, and will make you rich." Like vader and luke.
So..everyone is bad mouthing Cingular right now. Not so..the "new" Cingular w/iPhone will be totally badass, because it will have SJ's blessing and features. Trust me. SJ *had* to take a poor company to get what he wants....so of course were sacrifices like 3G. But we will get there..fast.
Meanwhile all the other pompus phone companys are s-c-r-e-w-e-d.
So, the question is, why am I getting only the equivalent of my spinning HD-based battery life on a flash-based product? Is it perhaps that Apple is finally being honest on this issue? What else is sucking up all the extra battery life on the iPhone?
Hello? Large touchscreen, advanced computer...? Hello? \
Comments
Why I would go for a new iPod over an iPhone for a while:
(1) If I were going to spring 600 bucks on a "convergence" device, I would want something that would actually replace my ipod - all 23 gigs of my music/photos/video podcasts. I mean, it is widescreen with brilliant video - but only 8 Gigs? Perhaps as a nano replacement it works...But it is no full ipod replacement with only 8 Gigs of memory...
Well, maybe I'm not the average user, but I prefer to store my MP3 collection on a RAID 5 server myself. Having had 6 hard drives die on me over a 10 year period, I don't trust a collection of music I've spent 7 years building to any single hard drive -- especially a portable one. That's like leaving a collection of vinyl records in a glass house and hoping the sun doesn't shine for too long on it.
So 8 gigs is plenty for me on a portable listening device.
(2)Apple tends to wildly exaggerate battery life, so if they say 5 hours -I take it with a grain of salt and wonder - what if it is something miserable, like 2 in real world conditions? Without a user-replaceable battery, it has to have some good battery life unless you want to be saddled with a charger at home, work, car, etc...
Admittedly, I'm not an avid cell phone user, but I'm sure that there'll be enough charge in one battery to last at least a day under heavy use. I dunno about you, but I can't always listen to music at my job. I actually need to speak with people and go to meetings occasionally. At which time I won't be using the device. I also prefer to read and send email at a real computer with a decent sized monitor. So I'd estimate heavy use to be about 6-8 hours of continuous usage (being on the phone, listening to music, or internet usage when you're not at a real computer). I'm sure the battery will be able to do that at the very least. This isn't a laptop computer after all.
(3) If I so much as glance at my ipod screen, it scratches - hopefully it is more smudge-scratch proof than it seems...
If you're so averse to scratches, buy a protective case for it. I'm sure there'll be plenty of them when this device hits the market. I personally view a few scuffs and scratches to be the normal wear and tear of ownership, but I can understand the need to keep things in "mint condition" some people have.
Finally, the software is closed - so you have to wait for Apple to release a "widget" that you could really use but Apple hasn't released it yet.
If it's based on Mac OS, then I'm sure that Apple will be happy to provide developer tools for it once it's released. After all, the more cool applications/widgets/etc which are developed for the phone, the more phones they'll sell. I can't see why they'd keep it as a closed development environment after it's been released to the public.
Unless you're expecting them to open source the OS itself -- but I'm not sure why you'd need that unless you're planning to develop your own device based on it.
(1) If I were going to spring 600 bucks on a "convergence" device, I would want something that would actually replace my ipod - all 23 gigs of my music/photos/video podcasts. I mean, it is widescreen with brilliant video - but only 8 Gigs? Perhaps as a nano replacement it works...But it is no full ipod replacement with only 8 Gigs of memory...
It's not meant to replace ANY iPod. Do you really expect people to strap an iPhone to their arm when they're working out? It's a replacement for crappy smartphones. That's it! NOt everyone wants or needs an iPhone just as not everyone wants or needs an iPod video. If you look at Apple's marketing and release history, the next major change to the iPod Video will be a full size, touch screen with a 100GB HDD.
(2)Apple tends to wildly exaggerate battery life, so if they say 5 hours -I take it with a grain of salt and wonder - what if it is something miserable, like 2 in real world conditions? Without a user-replaceable battery, it has to have some good battery life unless you want to be saddled with a charger at home, work, car, etc...
THe weren't very accurate several years prior but now they are pretty dead on balls with multiple reports that the battery exceeded Apple's claims.
(3) If I so much as glance at my ipod screen, it scratches - hopefully it is more smudge-scratch proof than it seems...
Nope. It's the same polycarbonate screen with a touch sensitive film applied. I guess you shouldn't "glance" at it. Nice hyperbole, there! The trick is to either not care or actaully take care of your stuff.
Finally, the software is closed - so you have to wait for Apple to release a "widget" that you could really use but Apple hasn't released it yet.
There is always a chance someone will hack the OS, but there are several reasons why Apple has a closed platform. It's a lvoe hate thing, but overall, it keeps the phone is working solidly. Poorly made 3rd-party apps is the leading cause of system errors. Apple could also sell widgets on the iTS or they may be working on a development kit. The current Xocde won't work. remember, the Phone doesn't have a PPC or Intel processor.
It's not meant to replace ANY iPod.
I think that, to some degree it is. It's biggest market will probably be the customer that justifies it has the best iPod - and one that includes a phone, so it is easier to justify buying. If you were giong to buy a new iPod, replacing a 1 or 2 gen iPod what would you be looking at? All of a sudden you're looking at one more iPod - this one with a phone included as well as being the most beautiful iPod made.
To make it easier to decide I would not be surprised to see Apple releasing an iPod that is basically the iPhone without the phone. It will generate more profits for Apple (especially through economies of scale) and blow the market apart - yet again.
I think that, to some degree it is. It's biggest market will probably be the customer that justifies it has the best iPod - and one that includes a phone, so it is easier to justify buying. If you were giong to buy a new iPod, replacing a 1 or 2 gen iPod what would you be looking at? All of a sudden you're looking at one more iPod - this one with a phone included as well as being the most beautiful iPod made.
Every new iPod model has altered the sales of the other iPod models when it's introduced. So why do they do it? Obviously, it opens their product up to s larger range of potential customers. The iPhone WILL NOT replace the iPod Video for those that:
To make it easier to decide I would not be surprised to see Apple releasing an iPod that is basically the iPhone without the phone.
That too is obvious. It's the next thing to do. I imaginethey will use OS X Leopard, like in the iPhone, to utilize Core Animation. Other features will all depend on if they can increase the battery life, capacity and/or hardware features (e.g.:wi-fi) without also signifiicantly increasing the weigh, size and/or cost. There is no way for us to know the logistics of the problems they face. I'm still awed by how much stuff they jammed into the iPhone.
I can't believe that Cingular will sell 10 million of these when there customers are almost 60 million. Does NOT compute. $500-600 phone in the land of nokia 6010?
Uhhh..how about NEW subscribers? Duh.
I'm not a cingular subscriber but I'm tearing up my T-mobile contract the day the iPhone comes out. How to afford the cancelation fees? Just buy AAPL stock now, should easily cover it in six-months. 8)
Me three.
haha its not that bad..at least here in southern california, well all i can say is i have tmobile but have no idea about tmobiles service, i do know their support sucks, but i dont live near any tmobile towers, only cingular, so my phone always says cingular...never had a dropped called never had a problem for 9 months, im happy with it
You are so wrong on point #3. Why don't you look at:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/macworld2...ons-227575.php
It is the same screen as the regular iPod with a touch sensor laid over it.
Also, do your homework before you tell me I am wrong about the closed OS -both that same interview, and Steve Jobs' Newsweek interview (today) confirmed that it will be closed. And if you think you can significant;y improve battery life with new technology in a couple of months, you need to get an education...
WHat do you mean by closed?
that doesnt mean that there will be no third party apps for it -- Windows Mobile is closed, but there are great 3rd party apps, ghell, MS sells an IDE specifically for it...and technically OSX is closed too...
I would bet money that they will put out an SDK/IDE for it at WWDC, which happens to be a little way after the phones release -- thus they can get a ton of feedback on the phone its self without any 2rd party interference...this is key for bug fixes and market research for what to change/add in future iterations.
Me three.
Yeah, cingular is not great. But the reason Apple went with them is because they suck so bad --Steve Jobs can strong-arm them to change their entire networks to fit his phone, and they are bending over and doing it else go out of business. Once the money pours into cingular, expect their infrastructure to grow fast. 3G, etc, will come quickly. I have no worries about the new Cingular.
Customer service bad? When SJ hears about it, he will get on his iPhone and straighten Cingular out, fast!
and a_greer, i agree with you too...WWDC will be right after the launch and windows mobile is closed, yet they have some great apps that can be placed on the phone, iphone has mac os x so why not let apple make some awesome apps, they know what to do dont worry theyre user friendly unlike pc..remember?
WHat do you mean by closed?
that doesnt mean that there will be no third party apps for it -- Windows Mobile is closed, but there are great 3rd party apps, ghell, MS sells an IDE specifically for it...and technically OSX is closed too...
Is Windows Mobile really closed? I knew a couple people that programmed for it using the regular Visual Studio bundle, no secret society, no hazing, nothing special.
haha i love your thinking..and i agree...Jobs will spank spank spank till cingular stands tall to be a great carrier
Exactly. Many of iPhone's ideas have been around, but the network companys rule the roost, not the phone designers. They have all kinds of stupid beurocracy and business suits preventing good ideas. SJ went to Cingular and said, "You guys suck, and you know it. You have no ideas of your own. No 3G, no media deals, etc. Give me everything I want and we will get an amazing phone, and will make you rich." Like vader and luke.
So..everyone is bad mouthing Cingular right now. Not so..the "new" Cingular w/iPhone will be totally badass, because it will have SJ's blessing and features. Trust me. SJ *had* to take a poor company to get what he wants....so of course were sacrifices like 3G. But we will get there..fast.
Meanwhile all the other pompus phone companys are s-c-r-e-w-e-d.
So, the question is, why am I getting only the equivalent of my spinning HD-based battery life on a flash-based product? Is it perhaps that Apple is finally being honest on this issue? What else is sucking up all the extra battery life on the iPhone?
Hello? Large touchscreen, advanced computer...? Hello?
Let's not forget that CIngluar has 25% of all US customers.
How long will it take for Apple to buy out and build up it's own network... hmm... oh, Google!