I've used it exclusively since it had been released. All of my bookmarks are easily accessible in the bookmark toolbar. My only gripe is that sometimes pages don't even load when they're supposed to. The work around is to relaunch Safari- which is a pain.
Maybe Mozilla when I want to zip around the web. But IE has always been my browser of choice on the Mac (my first Mac was a first generation Bondi-Blue iMac).
I think Safari has a looooong way to go before even reaching IE or even Chimera (never tried that).
One thing I notice (and need from other web applications) about Safari with Mail is that they can both be online and downloading without much stress on each other. With other non-native applications this has been a problem (Hell, always with web apps in OS 9) where one will slow down signifigantly because the other is operating (downloading).
Guess this is because Safari/Mail are OS X native. Wish other apps start "switching".
I give Safari another 6 months...then we'll see. They really need to improve the Download features. More like IE's Download Manager...which is great.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I now primarily use Safari. However, one strange bug occurs when I attempt to view some eBay auction items. I get a screen telling me "access to this particular category or item has been blocked due to legal restrictions in your home country"...etc. Using IE, I can view the same item normally. Has anyone else encountered this on eBay, and what might be causing this on Safari but not on IE?
<strong>I'm using it full time but the window position bug is quite annoying and I hope Apple fixes it soon. Otherwise it's the best browser I've ever used.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Safari is my default browser now. It's just better than the alternatives for my purposes: It's fast and reasonably standards compliant and lean, in every sense of the word.
I was glad to hear that OmniWeb's looking at WebCore, though. If they graft OW's flat-out gorgeous UI and fat feature set on top of that rendering engine, I'm sold.
I was glad to hear that OmniWeb's looking at WebCore, though. If they graft OW's flat-out gorgeous UI and fat feature set on top of that rendering engine, I'm sold.
</strong>
<hr></blockquote>
From what I've been reading WebCore on it's own is next to useless. The people on cocoa-dev are hoping for WebKit to be open-sourced as well as (they believe) it exposes the WebCore functionality at a higher level.
There have been a few snide comments claiming Apple are following the letter, but not the spirit of the LGPL by releasing such an opaque component, but they have promised to release an SDK, so I'll guess we'll know the truth when it arrives.
The problem is they probably won't release it until after Safari is finalized and released. This may be too long a wait for Omni, especially if they don't know Apple's intentions. I'm hoping they can work something out though.
I use Chimera virtually all the time with Safari playing second fiddle. I find the latest nightlies of Chimera to be much faster and more stable than Safari at the moment; maybe I'm just used to Chimera's foibles but it feels like a much more mature app to me.
I have that pipelining thing enabled in Chimera so that may be some of the speed difference, but Safari doesn't seem very quick at all on my iBook. I would guess it's because it's been Altivec-optimized to hell and back, and the G4 users are seeing the biggest gain. That's the main reason I don't use it, but also there seems to be some sort of problem with downloads; I use Speed Download as the download manager for all my browsers and Safari will send the url over to it but then crash directly afterwards. Theres also been a few other little errors that have turned me off from using it heavily, I'm looking forward to the 1.0 and subsequent releases though.
I thought the Omniweb team was rewriting their rendering engine from the ground up in Cocoa, not using some existing rendering engine?
I'm using Safari full time almost. A few sites I use Netscape for and today I found one I had to go to IE for.
<a href="http://www.tennisaustralia.com.au"; target="_blank">Try this</a> under Safari or Netscape then try it under IE. Safari and Netscape don't even render it wrong they just can't even access the page.
From what I've been reading WebCore on it's own is next to useless. The people on cocoa-dev are hoping for WebKit to be open-sourced as well as (they believe) it exposes the WebCore functionality at a higher level.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wonder what their definition of "useless" is. It's probably not as slick as the average Cocoa framework, but that's not surprising given that it's a slightly massaged codebase taken from Linux.
[quote]<strong>There have been a few snide comments claiming Apple are following the letter, but not the spirit of the LGPL by releasing such an opaque component, but they have promised to release an SDK, so I'll guess we'll know the truth when it arrives.
The problem is they probably won't release it until after Safari is finalized and released. This may be too long a wait for Omni, especially if they don't know Apple's intentions. I'm hoping they can work something out though.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Funny; I read most of this as "they won't release it until they're done working on it," which seems fine with me. Developing on a moving target is a PITA.
And anyone who thinks KHTML is opaque should be thanking God on their knees that Apple didn't adopt Gecko.
I don't see how waiting for 1.0 Final will negatively impact OmniGroup in any way. Unless Apple takes 9 months or more to get Safari out of beta, it'll be finished long before Omni's own renderer would have been.
If Omni and others get a finished, polished SDK and codebase to work on, where's the harm in that? They don't have to release their browsers concurrently with Safari to compete.
Not just yet: there are some weird javascript bugs that annoy the hell out of me (hey, if every other browser can play properly, whay can't Safari?), but I do use it for the times when the godawful slowness of IE annoys me too much.
I never realised how poor IE is until I got broadband (dial-up can't deliver pages quickly enough to highlight how woeful it is), but I've got Mozilla, Nutscrape, IE, Safari and Chimera loaded at the moment (not to mention Nutscrape and IE on my Windoze machine) and Safari blows the lot of them into the weeds.
Come the final release, I can see the rest being consigned to the test drive and not featuring in my day-to-day activities...
Comments
Go to <a href="http://www.ebnews.com"; target="_blank">www.ebnews.com</a> and tell me what you see wrong here with safari...
[ 01-16-2003: Message edited by: Outsider ]</p>
And Bring On The Tabs!
<strong>Internet Explorer.
Maybe Mozilla when I want to zip around the web. But IE has always been my browser of choice on the Mac (my first Mac was a first generation Bondi-Blue iMac).
I think Safari has a looooong way to go before even reaching IE or even Chimera (never tried that).
One thing I notice (and need from other web applications) about Safari with Mail is that they can both be online and downloading without much stress on each other. With other non-native applications this has been a problem (Hell, always with web apps in OS 9) where one will slow down signifigantly because the other is operating (downloading).
Guess this is because Safari/Mail are OS X native. Wish other apps start "switching".
I give Safari another 6 months...then we'll see. They really need to improve the Download features. More like IE's Download Manager...which is great.</strong><hr></blockquote>
you need to try OW
<strong>I'm using it full time but the window position bug is quite annoying and I hope Apple fixes it soon. Otherwise it's the best browser I've ever used.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I agree. That bug is VERY annoying!
I was glad to hear that OmniWeb's looking at WebCore, though. If they graft OW's flat-out gorgeous UI and fat feature set on top of that rendering engine, I'm sold.
Who wouldn't?
<strong>
I was glad to hear that OmniWeb's looking at WebCore, though. If they graft OW's flat-out gorgeous UI and fat feature set on top of that rendering engine, I'm sold.
</strong>
<hr></blockquote>
From what I've been reading WebCore on it's own is next to useless. The people on cocoa-dev are hoping for WebKit to be open-sourced as well as (they believe) it exposes the WebCore functionality at a higher level.
There have been a few snide comments claiming Apple are following the letter, but not the spirit of the LGPL by releasing such an opaque component, but they have promised to release an SDK, so I'll guess we'll know the truth when it arrives.
The problem is they probably won't release it until after Safari is finalized and released. This may be too long a wait for Omni, especially if they don't know Apple's intentions. I'm hoping they can work something out though.
I have that pipelining thing enabled in Chimera so that may be some of the speed difference, but Safari doesn't seem very quick at all on my iBook. I would guess it's because it's been Altivec-optimized to hell and back, and the G4 users are seeing the biggest gain. That's the main reason I don't use it, but also there seems to be some sort of problem with downloads; I use Speed Download as the download manager for all my browsers and Safari will send the url over to it but then crash directly afterwards. Theres also been a few other little errors that have turned me off from using it heavily, I'm looking forward to the 1.0 and subsequent releases though.
I thought the Omniweb team was rewriting their rendering engine from the ground up in Cocoa, not using some existing rendering engine?
[ 01-17-2003: Message edited by: hotboxd ]</p>
I only use Tabs every once and a while, but it would be a nice feature. I also wish they had OmniWebs download manager.
Love the bookmarks!
<a href="http://www.tennisaustralia.com.au"; target="_blank">Try this</a> under Safari or Netscape then try it under IE. Safari and Netscape don't even render it wrong they just can't even access the page.
<strong>
From what I've been reading WebCore on it's own is next to useless. The people on cocoa-dev are hoping for WebKit to be open-sourced as well as (they believe) it exposes the WebCore functionality at a higher level.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wonder what their definition of "useless" is. It's probably not as slick as the average Cocoa framework, but that's not surprising given that it's a slightly massaged codebase taken from Linux.
[quote]<strong>There have been a few snide comments claiming Apple are following the letter, but not the spirit of the LGPL by releasing such an opaque component, but they have promised to release an SDK, so I'll guess we'll know the truth when it arrives.
The problem is they probably won't release it until after Safari is finalized and released. This may be too long a wait for Omni, especially if they don't know Apple's intentions. I'm hoping they can work something out though.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Funny; I read most of this as "they won't release it until they're done working on it," which seems fine with me. Developing on a moving target is a PITA.
And anyone who thinks KHTML is opaque should be thanking God on their knees that Apple didn't adopt Gecko.
I don't see how waiting for 1.0 Final will negatively impact OmniGroup in any way. Unless Apple takes 9 months or more to get Safari out of beta, it'll be finished long before Omni's own renderer would have been.
If Omni and others get a finished, polished SDK and codebase to work on, where's the harm in that? They don't have to release their browsers concurrently with Safari to compete.
[ 01-17-2003: Message edited by: Amorph ]
[ 01-17-2003: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
I never realised how poor IE is until I got broadband (dial-up can't deliver pages quickly enough to highlight how woeful it is), but I've got Mozilla, Nutscrape, IE, Safari and Chimera loaded at the moment (not to mention Nutscrape and IE on my Windoze machine) and Safari blows the lot of them into the weeds.
Come the final release, I can see the rest being consigned to the test drive and not featuring in my day-to-day activities...
I just started using it for the first time last night on my iBook 800, and it FLIES. It's the only browser I'll use. No problems so far.
There are a few sites that I regularly must use that have developers seemingly aware of only one browser (IE), so I have to use IE daily too.