Looking over at Tom's hardware a 6800GT at PCIe x1 had 42.3 FPS for Doom 3 Demo1 Ultra Quality 1600x1200, 32 Bit. Not too shabby even when bandwidth limited.
Obviously the card will not fit, but besides that - we were talking about a true desktop not a server in here. (Hijacker ) Don't be trying to turn this thread into a different box. There is already a server thread elsewhere in FH.
Obviously the card will not fit, but besides that - we were talking about a true desktop not a server in here. (Hijacker ) Don't be trying to turn this thread into a different box. There is already a server thread elsewhere in FH.
Heh...a cube isn't a minitower? Just a bit shorter?
The card could fit in an expansion chassis. Or you could throw out the second HDD and have a vid card like in the original cube...but I think a second HDD would be better than a 1/2 sized slot since a lot of folks use a macbook and mini's for their day to day tasks.
Anyway, I was just answering what I would do with a minitower that I couldn't with a mini: media server without external drives.
Those Cubes are not 8 x 8 x 8-inch. They are no where near the size of the Apple cube. Different enclosure = different ballgame. The Apple mission is lost in those cubes. Usual PC cube dimensions are (DxWxH): 14.7" x 11.2" x 9" [edit] That's over 1.5 Cubic Feet BTW.
It's not even a cube at those dimensions when you think about it.
The old cube isn't really a cube either is it? There was a big clear plastic bit at the bottom.
I wouldn't say that Apple necessarily have to adhere to strict dimensions. That tends to be where they fail. They say well our designers need a computer to look like this, so you technicians have to find a way to make a computer fit to which they will say to use the smallest parts that run the coolest.
When designing a mini-tower, they should say we need to make a cubic enclosure of similar dimensions to the G4 cube. Then they design the internals and build a box around it. If it's bigger than the old cube so be it. I'd rather have a slightly bigger machine that accommodated the parts I wanted than a smaller machine that didn't.
When designing a mini-tower, they should say we need to make a cubic enclosure of similar dimensions to the G4 cube.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
Go out to desktop section at best buy. The only single drive model they sell is the HP slimlines. Believe me, having that second drive is very handy.
Yeah, I wouldn't know. I'm using the one on my Macbook maybe once a month. A few years ago my desktop's optical drive broke and I went a year and a half without one.
They really ship everything with two optical drives?
Yeah, I wouldn't know. I'm using the one on my Macbook maybe once a month. A few years ago my desktop's optical drive broke and I went a year and a half without one.
They really ship everything with two optical drives?
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
Well possibly not if tower refers to something that is tall and thin but it's a mini-tower. So if you take a tower like the G5/Mac Pro and then make a smaller version of it, it can be called a mini-tower. People will generally know what you mean in context. As far as a slim and tall desktop like the Dell image, I could maybe go for that too but I just like the idea of a cube so much better. If Apple made a slim tower, then they would be more like normal PC manufacturers, the cube has a certain appeal in terms of design.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRoethig
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
Yeah I noticed this even on cheap computers. DVD burners are very cheap these days and it's crazy that Apple don't have one at least in every model they sell. I have an external burner and it takes standard IDE drives and I was in a store a few months back and they had some 20x DVD burner IDE drive with 5x DVD-Ram support for about £20. Only the Mac Pro can use drives like this internally.
Well possibly not if tower refers to something that is tall and thin but it's a mini-tower. So if you take a tower like the G5/Mac Pro and then make a smaller version of it, it can be called a mini-tower. People will generally know what you mean in context. As far as a slim and tall desktop like the Dell image, I could maybe go for that too but I just like the idea of a cube so much better. If Apple made a slim tower, then they would be more like normal PC manufacturers, the cube has a certain appeal in terms of design.
Yeah I noticed this even on cheap computers. DVD burners are very cheap these days and it's crazy that Apple don't have one at least in every model they sell. I have an external burner and it takes standard IDE drives and I was in a store a few months back and they had some 20x DVD burner IDE drive with 5x DVD-Ram support for about £20. Only the Mac Pro can use drives like this internally.
The positive side to Apple using regular dimensions is the fact that you will be able to fit industry standard size parts from wherever you chose. Not just custom made to fit Apple parts. It's the freedom that people need to be comfortable with purchasing it.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
What? I was in comp usa and did not see a machine with a 2nd optical drive standard. Not that I was looking all that hard but still...if almost every desktop had two optical drives I'd have noticed and gone over to see if they had a HD-DVD reader with a DVD-Burner. They sure don't list a second DVD burner or drive on the spec sheets peeking at the Best Buy website.
They certainly have extra BAYs that can take more external drives but who the heck ships with two DVD drives standard?
I like the design and I know you are showing an updated cube, but would it fit 2 hard drives and 1, preferably 2, PCI Express slots? Also, instead of four USB ports on the front there should be 2 USB, 1 FireWire 400, and an earphone jack. I would definitely get that and a Cinema Display before an iMac any day of the week! It would be nice to see one get unveiled next month after the new iPods are shown, but if there is new hardware I do not expect it to be available until after Leopard is released.
I want at least two PCI-e slots, in addition to the graphics card slot. It's possible to do without, if I run cables to external hardware, but I don't like that for the same reason I don't want a second HDD on the end of a cable. Clutter.
Currently, I have a 24 bit A/D audio converter in one slot, and an additional USB ports in the other. Not all audio gear comes on PCI-e cards, but uses USB. Also I have flash drives and iPods on USB. Sure, I could use a hub but it is the same story, more clutter on the desktop. I don't want it.
One big problem with the G5 style cube design that no one seems to realize is that that design is beyond EOL. Chances are so high that the Mac Pro will not stay with the G5 design in January it's not even funny. We thought the whole design was going to change in the next round before Apple announced it was transitioning to intel. Then Apple kept all the designs for all Macs the same so users would have that visual stimulant to say "look - they are still Macs". With light of that I doubt Apple will box up a G5 look a like for one round. Because they'll have to have an updated design for the day they decide to update it.
Plus I still don't think it's a good idea to reuse a design that was a complete failure.
One big problem with the G5 style cube design that no one seems to realize is that that design is beyond EOL. Chances are so high that the Mac Pro will not stay with the G5 design in January it's not even funny.
[...]
Plus I still don't think it's a good idea to reuse a design that was a complete failure.
Please enlighten me one at least one of two things. What makes you so certain that it is going to change, and how exactly was the PowerMac G5 case a "complete failure"?
See, here's my thinking. They redesigned the interior of the G5 with the advent of the Mac Pro, realizing they had a solid exterior look, but the inside could use some tightening up. Voila, here's the Mac Pro. Easy, tool-less upgrades, good number of drives, easy RAM install via the daughtercards, etc. That being said, even my G5 tower is a joy to look at. See, anyone who has a G5 usually has it for the power, not for the look. I'm given that impression by the fact that every G5 or Mac Pro I've ever sold has been to someone in the creative industry, whether it be as a server for a web design company, a primary powerhouse for movie production, or for professional audiophiles.
Given that, if you (and I use "you" in a general sense... I'm not targeting) are within that group and are still complaining that the classy look isn't the right type of class, or whatever, then you are being far too picky, and should direct that attention toward your work. Other than that, most people that buy one for other reasons are likely buying the wrong machine. And when you buy a machine that's not meant for your target demographic, it's not Apple's fault when it doesn't fulfill your every expectation.
BTW, I love the G5 case, but it's design is older than dirt in computer years, and older than dust in Apple years.
But there's no problems with the current case, and with the interior redesign that came with the Mac Pro, I doubt it will change again so quickly. Besides, many pro users LOVE the case, as it has a signature look that screams "Yeah, that just happened."
But there's no problems with the current case, and with the interior redesign that came with the Mac Pro, I doubt it will change again so quickly. Besides, many pro users LOVE the case, as it has a signature look that screams "Yeah, that just happened."
I also like the look of the G5/Mac Pro case. Consider too how long its predecessor lasted, starting with the Blue & White and going to the Mirrored Drive Doors.
Comments
http://www.tomshardware.com/2004/11/...ng/page10.html
I doubt anyone has done a more recent bench with x1 (why would anyone bother?) but it should be good enough for casual gaming.
Obviously the card will not fit, but besides that - we were talking about a true desktop not a server in here. (Hijacker
Heh...a cube isn't a minitower? Just a bit shorter?
The card could fit in an expansion chassis. Or you could throw out the second HDD and have a vid card like in the original cube...but I think a second HDD would be better than a 1/2 sized slot since a lot of folks use a macbook and mini's for their day to day tasks.
Anyway, I was just answering what I would do with a minitower that I couldn't with a mini: media server without external drives.
Heck, I'm not even raining on anyone's parade...
Those Cubes are not 8 x 8 x 8-inch. They are no where near the size of the Apple cube. Different enclosure = different ballgame. The Apple mission is lost in those cubes. Usual PC cube dimensions are (DxWxH): 14.7" x 11.2" x 9" [edit] That's over 1.5 Cubic Feet BTW.
It's not even a cube at those dimensions when you think about it.
The old cube isn't really a cube either is it? There was a big clear plastic bit at the bottom.
I wouldn't say that Apple necessarily have to adhere to strict dimensions. That tends to be where they fail. They say well our designers need a computer to look like this, so you technicians have to find a way to make a computer fit to which they will say to use the smallest parts that run the coolest.
When designing a mini-tower, they should say we need to make a cubic enclosure of similar dimensions to the G4 cube. Then they design the internals and build a box around it. If it's bigger than the old cube so be it. I'd rather have a slightly bigger machine that accommodated the parts I wanted than a smaller machine that didn't.
When designing a mini-tower, they should say we need to make a cubic enclosure of similar dimensions to the G4 cube.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
Go out to desktop section at best buy. The only single drive model they sell is the HP slimlines. Believe me, having that second drive is very handy.
Yeah, I wouldn't know. I'm using the one on my Macbook maybe once a month. A few years ago my desktop's optical drive broke and I went a year and a half without one.
They really ship everything with two optical drives?
Yeah, I wouldn't know. I'm using the one on my Macbook maybe once a month. A few years ago my desktop's optical drive broke and I went a year and a half without one.
They really ship everything with two optical drives?
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
Well possibly not if tower refers to something that is tall and thin but it's a mini-tower. So if you take a tower like the G5/Mac Pro and then make a smaller version of it, it can be called a mini-tower. People will generally know what you mean in context. As far as a slim and tall desktop like the Dell image, I could maybe go for that too but I just like the idea of a cube so much better. If Apple made a slim tower, then they would be more like normal PC manufacturers, the cube has a certain appeal in terms of design.
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
Yeah I noticed this even on cheap computers. DVD burners are very cheap these days and it's crazy that Apple don't have one at least in every model they sell. I have an external burner and it takes standard IDE drives and I was in a store a few months back and they had some 20x DVD burner IDE drive with 5x DVD-Ram support for about £20. Only the Mac Pro can use drives like this internally.
Well possibly not if tower refers to something that is tall and thin but it's a mini-tower. So if you take a tower like the G5/Mac Pro and then make a smaller version of it, it can be called a mini-tower. People will generally know what you mean in context. As far as a slim and tall desktop like the Dell image, I could maybe go for that too but I just like the idea of a cube so much better. If Apple made a slim tower, then they would be more like normal PC manufacturers, the cube has a certain appeal in terms of design.
Yeah I noticed this even on cheap computers. DVD burners are very cheap these days and it's crazy that Apple don't have one at least in every model they sell. I have an external burner and it takes standard IDE drives and I was in a store a few months back and they had some 20x DVD burner IDE drive with 5x DVD-Ram support for about £20. Only the Mac Pro can use drives like this internally.
The positive side to Apple using regular dimensions is the fact that you will be able to fit industry standard size parts from wherever you chose. Not just custom made to fit Apple parts. It's the freedom that people need to be comfortable with purchasing it.
If it's dimensions are similar to the Cube, then it isn't a tower, is it? Just being picky. The biggest objection I have is that I need PCI-e slots, and not just for a graphics card.
For what?
Almost every desktop. Then again, the rest of the computer world is more concerned about how a computer functions rather than how good it looks.
What? I was in comp usa and did not see a machine with a 2nd optical drive standard. Not that I was looking all that hard but still...if almost every desktop had two optical drives I'd have noticed and gone over to see if they had a HD-DVD reader with a DVD-Burner. They sure don't list a second DVD burner or drive on the spec sheets peeking at the Best Buy website.
They certainly have extra BAYs that can take more external drives but who the heck ships with two DVD drives standard?
I like the design and I know you are showing an updated cube, but would it fit 2 hard drives and 1, preferably 2, PCI Express slots? Also, instead of four USB ports on the front there should be 2 USB, 1 FireWire 400, and an earphone jack. I would definitely get that and a Cinema Display before an iMac any day of the week! It would be nice to see one get unveiled next month after the new iPods are shown, but if there is new hardware I do not expect it to be available until after Leopard is released.
For what?
I want at least two PCI-e slots, in addition to the graphics card slot. It's possible to do without, if I run cables to external hardware, but I don't like that for the same reason I don't want a second HDD on the end of a cable. Clutter.
Currently, I have a 24 bit A/D audio converter in one slot, and an additional USB ports in the other. Not all audio gear comes on PCI-e cards, but uses USB. Also I have flash drives and iPods on USB. Sure, I could use a hub but it is the same story, more clutter on the desktop. I don't want it.
Plus I still don't think it's a good idea to reuse a design that was a complete failure.
One big problem with the G5 style cube design that no one seems to realize is that that design is beyond EOL.
Yes, they will likely update the look of the Mac Pro a bit. But you know, some designs just seem kinda ageless.
Plus I still don't think it's a good idea to reuse a design that was a complete failure.
Eh...Its more elegant than a Shuttle sized SFF computer. Some of which can hold 1 or 2 PCIe cards but aren't mini-towers.
Vinea
One big problem with the G5 style cube design that no one seems to realize is that that design is beyond EOL. Chances are so high that the Mac Pro will not stay with the G5 design in January it's not even funny.
[...]
Plus I still don't think it's a good idea to reuse a design that was a complete failure.
Please enlighten me one at least one of two things. What makes you so certain that it is going to change, and how exactly was the PowerMac G5 case a "complete failure"?
See, here's my thinking. They redesigned the interior of the G5 with the advent of the Mac Pro, realizing they had a solid exterior look, but the inside could use some tightening up. Voila, here's the Mac Pro. Easy, tool-less upgrades, good number of drives, easy RAM install via the daughtercards, etc. That being said, even my G5 tower is a joy to look at. See, anyone who has a G5 usually has it for the power, not for the look. I'm given that impression by the fact that every G5 or Mac Pro I've ever sold has been to someone in the creative industry, whether it be as a server for a web design company, a primary powerhouse for movie production, or for professional audiophiles.
Given that, if you (and I use "you" in a general sense... I'm not targeting) are within that group and are still complaining that the classy look isn't the right type of class, or whatever, then you are being far too picky, and should direct that attention toward your work. Other than that, most people that buy one for other reasons are likely buying the wrong machine. And when you buy a machine that's not meant for your target demographic, it's not Apple's fault when it doesn't fulfill your every expectation.
G5 case. I already went into that in the thread.
BTW, I love the G5 case, but it's design is older than dirt in computer years, and older than dust in Apple years.
cube design <- Complete failure.
Oh. Seems the egg's on my face, then? Right-o.
BTW, I love the G5 case, but it's design is older than dirt in computer years, and older than dust in Apple years.
But there's no problems with the current case, and with the interior redesign that came with the Mac Pro, I doubt it will change again so quickly. Besides, many pro users LOVE the case, as it has a signature look that screams "Yeah, that just happened."
But there's no problems with the current case, and with the interior redesign that came with the Mac Pro, I doubt it will change again so quickly. Besides, many pro users LOVE the case, as it has a signature look that screams "Yeah, that just happened."
I also like the look of the G5/Mac Pro case. Consider too how long its predecessor lasted, starting with the Blue & White and going to the Mirrored Drive Doors.