And they both suck at different times too - I'm always impressed with Finder's ability to hang my system when it can't connect/disconnect from a server share, and at least I know of a handy terminal command to fix it (sudo shutdown -n -r now).
I used to have this problem all the time prior to Leopard. But I have to agree with solipsism that it hasn't reared it's head in Leopard yet (and yes, I connect to both SMB and AFP shares). I just get a window asking me if I want to disconnect from the share.
OTOH, try browsing through Windows Explorer after network drive mappings have disappeared. Now that's painful. It doesn't bring the system to a halt, but you pretty much lose all file browsing ability and tend to get random hourglass appearances when accessing files in general.
The obvious flaw in Microsoft's campaign, as far as I can tell, is that the people in the video couldn't even identify Vista. How, then, could their opinions be considered credible once they were given the Kool-Aide? It is ridiculous.
Indeed. In fact, one of their key subjects in the video calls Vista a Programme!
the basic message of the marketing campaign seems somewhat clever. wipe out the negative preconceptions that people have of vista and then give them a chance to view the OS with fresh eyes. although, it's also trickery. in fact, it's much like the pizza hut / pasta hut commercials where they serve customers pasta in a restaurant and ask how it was, then reveal that "pizza hut delivered the pasta"
i just wish the participants in this little experiment could have been shown a mac or a linux system as well. i don't use linux, but i have friends who praise it so i can only speak to the mac side of things. most of the little tidbits i watched had people rejoicing over the ability to edit and burn a dvd, stitch some photos together, type in letters to get search results instead of navigating through application paths and file trees, etc. these are such basic activities that should have been done right YEARS ago! oh wait, these little things HAVE been in OSX for years (maybe linux too, i don't know for certain).
i've used vista and my biggest gripe is that too much was changed all at once. well, that and it seemed slow and unreliable. i find windows to be a struggle. it's as though doing a simple task is intended to be met with hurdles such as crashing apps (or 'programs' as i used to call them before switching to a mac), random reboots, missing files, etc. i've experienced all sorts of setbacks with windows xp even that it put me off from using an OS that needs so much troubleshooting. maybe they'll get it right with their next release?
If you sit any user down with vista initial impressions ARE 'Wow, this is really cool, ooh transparent bars, ahh! nice photo stuff' We advise them to purchase a system with XP pro but no, they are sold on the new GUI and bells and whistles.
Its not until they actually have to use it that it turns into
'fuxxing piece of shit, its fuxxing crashed again for no good reason (especialy on laptops after SP1).
or
'for fuxx sakes, its not shutting down again, or if it does shut down when you start it up again you are greeted by a screen stating that vista failed to shut down correctly and that it wants to scan your hard drive'
or
'what the fuxx, my [insert name] software won't fuxxing install'
or
'why the hell can't this connect to wi-fi networks (works on one but not on another identical router????, very common problem' (we supply and install wifi kit to major hotels throughout the UK and this is an growing issue, you can take 2 identical vista laptops, one connects one wont ??)
Ultimately all of this ends up with a call to us at IT support to downgrade their systems to XP Pro.
As usual, Microsoft software is a crapbag for consumers but we IT pros do very VERY nicely from it
Can't wait- bring on the new iPod Touches. But I don't think they would make them more functional than an iPhone- at least not yet. That would cut into iPhone sales. ANd for that reason I don't see Apple adding a camera- but I wish they would and it handles video conferencing.
Has anybody here else noticed that most posts here ignore discussion of merit regarding technology and instead focus on either whining about something or constantly bashing the competition- what a waste of time & energy.
It's one thing for Microsoft to even think about an apologetic website but to go ahead and build one is nuts. Microsoft are just needlessly pointing something out to a lot of Vista users who, beyond those who read forums like this, haven't had any major issue's with Vista.
Point in case is my father-in-law who bought a laptop with Vista installed when it first came out and he's very happy. I tease him but he just looks at me blankly. He lent me the laptop last week and to be honest i don't know what all the fuss is about it. In fact i quite liked Vista, certainly more intuitive that XP, and i've been a Mac head since the early 90's.
Surely the better strategy would be to just get their heads down, fix the bugs and move on.
Good lord...poor M$. When I heard about Ballmer's whining about how Apple has defined Vista, all I could do was laugh. But this really takes the prize. They had to trick people into using Vista. Wow. And of course, they didn't address many of the very real issues it has, such as compatibility, speed on older hardware and lower-end machines, etc.
I've played with Vista a few times on my girlfriend's computer, a 6 month old Dell. It's a consumer level machine. The verdict? I hate it. It's terrible. The good news is that she loves my Mac and really wants to get one now!
One more item: Why does Microsoft think that when an institution like my school district buys new laptops, they get XP instead of Vista? Do they really mean to tell us that our IT people are victims of Apple's marketing campaign?
But it is still fun to come here and rip on ms without worrying about objectivity sometimes
In particular, my favorite part was when the guy talked about "features you could only dream of years ago" when many of the most consumer oriented features (flip3d, gadgets, sidebar) were on tiger in one form or another
Has anybody here else noticed that most posts here ignore discussion of merit regarding technology and instead focus on either whining about something or constantly bashing the competition- what a waste of time & energy.
yeah: yada yada yada, microsoft sucks, we all know that, end of discussion..
so...
new ipod touch eh?
I really really hope they tackled the playlist thing.
it is incredible that we have a device with an OS, that can type letters, and yet it is more primitive in it's functions than the ipod classic.. ???
please, please, please give us the ability to safe an on-the-go playlist, rename it, and make a new one..
I mean, on my classic I could make a couple of playlists on the go. why on earth is this not possible with the touch??
also I like the fact that I could add songs to the list by holding the center button, the way to add songs on the touch is just really awkward. and no way (not that I have found) to add the currently playing song to the playlist..
(but to add to the windows comments: so this 300 million dollar campaign is basically a copy of the mac switcher ad from 2002???)
I watched some of the "so convincing ads" and it is quite hard for me to believe that none of those people (especially the younger ones) haven't seen Vista before. I 'm a Mac User and I never used Windows Vista, but I sure know how it looks like. Everybody at work knows how it looks like. Some of them bought new PCs with Vista pre-installed and some of them just saw Vista because they demo it in every major computer shop, and it is enough to recognize it.
So...... in what Vista-ignorant world do these people (should I say actors or paid stuff) live in?
There is one thing though.... perhaps they disguised the GUI too.
I'm not with my main computer, but I seem to recall paying $9 to upgrade my Touch software to 2.0, which added the app store, a couple other things, and the ability to run the new aps. So 2.1 is probably just the tweak to that. Other Touch users, am I wrong or is this Apple Insider author just out of touch - with reality.
I watched some of the "so convincing ads" and it is quite hard for me to believe that none of those people (especially the younger ones) haven't seen Vista before. I 'm a Mac User and I never used Windows Vista, but I sure know how it looks like. Everybody at work knows how it looks like. Some of them bought new PCs with Vista pre-installed and some of them just saw Vista because they demo it in every major computer shop, and it is enough to recognize it.
So...... in what Vista-ignorant world do these people (should I say actors or paid stuff) live in?
There is one thing though.... perhaps they disguised the GUI too.
Quite suspicious.
They probably just changed the default background picture
Of course if you watch the video you'll see that they are just getting demos - they aren't actually working with the computer. Umm, uhh, yeah... That really defeats the purpose as I doubt anyone would say that Vista doesn't give a great demo (or any other product for that matter) but in actual real world usage is where the problems are. Or maybe those people don't actually have to use computers and are just going to pay MS to use the computer for them...
And come on - giving Vista a 0 - she's obviously either 1) stupid or 2) an actor. I don't like it but I wouldn't give it a 0. a 0 means you can't do ANYTHING on it at all and that's just stupid. I'd probably give it a 5 or 6, XP a 7 maybe 8 on a really good day and Leopard between 8.5 and 9.5 as I haven't run into any problems with it at all (and I installed it on day 1).
I'm not with my main computer, but I seem to recall paying $9 to upgrade my Touch software to 2.0, which added the app store, a couple other things, and the ability to run the new aps. So 2.1 is probably just the tweak to that. Other Touch users, am I wrong or is this Apple Insider author just out of touch - with reality.
I think you're talking the OS version and AppleInsider is talking the hardware (model) version.
Wow! I think Microsoft just proved that a lot of their users are easily influenced, technologically ignorant and could really careless about their computing appliance, as long as it keeps getting email and porn.
I was about to say the same thing...
Reminds me of those inane commercials from the 70's & 80's....
Quote:
Shhhhh!!! We've secretly replaced the finely aged filet mignon at this fancy New Your City steak-house. Instead, we are serving them a steaming pile of horse shit... Now, lets sit back and see if they notice...
I like how Microsoft uses Flash instead of SilverLight for the Mojave website. !
Yeah but it isn't very good Flash. The third and forth videos are linked to the same clip. The loading screen doesn't really load anything and doesn't cache. The cursors don't rollover correctly , on and on. Looks like this was rushed out the door for sure. You got to love the guy that says brown is his favorite color.
I've used Vista, admittedly only for a couple of hours (on my friend's Dell) and it didn't blow me away. Its UI is horrible, and its a memory whore. Because it wasn't my computer I haven't experienced any of the reported issues, but I didn't enjoy using it.
It felt and looked like a tarted up version of XP. I definitely prefer the sleekness of Leopard and how user friendly it is :]
Good lord...poor M$. When I heard about Ballmer's whining about how Apple has defined Vista, all I could do was laugh. But this really takes the prize. They had to trick people into using Vista. Wow. And of course, they didn't address many of the very real issues it has, such as compatibility, speed on older hardware and lower-end machines, etc.
I've played with Vista a few times on my girlfriend's computer, a 6 month old Dell. It's a consumer level machine. The verdict? I hate it. It's terrible. The good news is that she loves my Mac and really wants to get one now!
One more item: Why does Microsoft think that when an institution like my school district buys new laptops, they get XP instead of Vista? Do they really mean to tell us that our IT people are victims of Apple's marketing campaign?
Waitaminnit.... you have a girlfriend? Then what's really wrong with you?
Comments
I use both everyday, and Vista is fine.
And they both suck at different times too - I'm always impressed with Finder's ability to hang my system when it can't connect/disconnect from a server share, and at least I know of a handy terminal command to fix it (sudo shutdown -n -r now).
I used to have this problem all the time prior to Leopard. But I have to agree with solipsism that it hasn't reared it's head in Leopard yet (and yes, I connect to both SMB and AFP shares). I just get a window asking me if I want to disconnect from the share.
OTOH, try browsing through Windows Explorer after network drive mappings have disappeared. Now that's painful. It doesn't bring the system to a halt, but you pretty much lose all file browsing ability and tend to get random hourglass appearances when accessing files in general.
The obvious flaw in Microsoft's campaign, as far as I can tell, is that the people in the video couldn't even identify Vista. How, then, could their opinions be considered credible once they were given the Kool-Aide? It is ridiculous.
Indeed. In fact, one of their key subjects in the video calls Vista a Programme!
i just wish the participants in this little experiment could have been shown a mac or a linux system as well. i don't use linux, but i have friends who praise it so i can only speak to the mac side of things. most of the little tidbits i watched had people rejoicing over the ability to edit and burn a dvd, stitch some photos together, type in letters to get search results instead of navigating through application paths and file trees, etc. these are such basic activities that should have been done right YEARS ago! oh wait, these little things HAVE been in OSX for years (maybe linux too, i don't know for certain).
i've used vista and my biggest gripe is that too much was changed all at once. well, that and it seemed slow and unreliable. i find windows to be a struggle. it's as though doing a simple task is intended to be met with hurdles such as crashing apps (or 'programs' as i used to call them before switching to a mac), random reboots, missing files, etc. i've experienced all sorts of setbacks with windows xp even that it put me off from using an OS that needs so much troubleshooting. maybe they'll get it right with their next release?
If you sit any user down with vista initial impressions ARE 'Wow, this is really cool, ooh transparent bars, ahh! nice photo stuff' We advise them to purchase a system with XP pro but no, they are sold on the new GUI and bells and whistles.
Its not until they actually have to use it that it turns into
'fuxxing piece of shit, its fuxxing crashed again for no good reason (especialy on laptops after SP1).
or
'for fuxx sakes, its not shutting down again, or if it does shut down when you start it up again you are greeted by a screen stating that vista failed to shut down correctly and that it wants to scan your hard drive'
or
'what the fuxx, my [insert name] software won't fuxxing install'
or
'why the hell can't this connect to wi-fi networks (works on one but not on another identical router????, very common problem' (we supply and install wifi kit to major hotels throughout the UK and this is an growing issue, you can take 2 identical vista laptops, one connects one wont ??)
Ultimately all of this ends up with a call to us at IT support to downgrade their systems to XP Pro.
As usual, Microsoft software is a crapbag for consumers but we IT pros do very VERY nicely from it
poor, poor microsoft... I'm speechless.. how they even did the play/pause button wrong! It's just sooo typical microsoft, lol.
haha they fixed it, now it's working properly. Way to go, microsoft! Way to go!
Has anybody here else noticed that most posts here ignore discussion of merit regarding technology and instead focus on either whining about something or constantly bashing the competition- what a waste of time & energy.
Maybe add a HD option and completely replace the Classic? I'd love a 160GB iPod Touch!
I was hoping to at least see no semblance that this whole experiment was rigged.
Point in case is my father-in-law who bought a laptop with Vista installed when it first came out and he's very happy. I tease him but he just looks at me blankly. He lent me the laptop last week and to be honest i don't know what all the fuss is about it. In fact i quite liked Vista, certainly more intuitive that XP, and i've been a Mac head since the early 90's.
Surely the better strategy would be to just get their heads down, fix the bugs and move on.
I've played with Vista a few times on my girlfriend's computer, a 6 month old Dell. It's a consumer level machine. The verdict? I hate it. It's terrible. The good news is that she loves my Mac and really wants to get one now!
One more item: Why does Microsoft think that when an institution like my school district buys new laptops, they get XP instead of Vista? Do they really mean to tell us that our IT people are victims of Apple's marketing campaign?
But it is still fun to come here and rip on ms without worrying about objectivity sometimes
In particular, my favorite part was when the guy talked about "features you could only dream of years ago" when many of the most consumer oriented features (flip3d, gadgets, sidebar) were on tiger in one form or another
Has anybody here else noticed that most posts here ignore discussion of merit regarding technology and instead focus on either whining about something or constantly bashing the competition- what a waste of time & energy.
yeah: yada yada yada, microsoft sucks, we all know that, end of discussion..
so...
new ipod touch eh?
I really really hope they tackled the playlist thing.
it is incredible that we have a device with an OS, that can type letters, and yet it is more primitive in it's functions than the ipod classic.. ???
please, please, please give us the ability to safe an on-the-go playlist, rename it, and make a new one..
I mean, on my classic I could make a couple of playlists on the go. why on earth is this not possible with the touch??
also I like the fact that I could add songs to the list by holding the center button, the way to add songs on the touch is just really awkward. and no way (not that I have found) to add the currently playing song to the playlist..
(but to add to the windows comments: so this 300 million dollar campaign is basically a copy of the mac switcher ad from 2002???)
So...... in what Vista-ignorant world do these people (should I say actors or paid stuff) live in?
There is one thing though.... perhaps they disguised the GUI too.
Quite suspicious.
I watched some of the "so convincing ads" and it is quite hard for me to believe that none of those people (especially the younger ones) haven't seen Vista before. I 'm a Mac User and I never used Windows Vista, but I sure know how it looks like. Everybody at work knows how it looks like. Some of them bought new PCs with Vista pre-installed and some of them just saw Vista because they demo it in every major computer shop, and it is enough to recognize it.
So...... in what Vista-ignorant world do these people (should I say actors or paid stuff) live in?
There is one thing though.... perhaps they disguised the GUI too.
Quite suspicious.
They probably just changed the default background picture
Of course if you watch the video you'll see that they are just getting demos - they aren't actually working with the computer. Umm, uhh, yeah... That really defeats the purpose as I doubt anyone would say that Vista doesn't give a great demo (or any other product for that matter) but in actual real world usage is where the problems are. Or maybe those people don't actually have to use computers and are just going to pay MS to use the computer for them...
And come on - giving Vista a 0 - she's obviously either 1) stupid or 2) an actor. I don't like it but I wouldn't give it a 0. a 0 means you can't do ANYTHING on it at all and that's just stupid. I'd probably give it a 5 or 6, XP a 7 maybe 8 on a really good day and Leopard between 8.5 and 9.5 as I haven't run into any problems with it at all (and I installed it on day 1).
I'm not with my main computer, but I seem to recall paying $9 to upgrade my Touch software to 2.0, which added the app store, a couple other things, and the ability to run the new aps. So 2.1 is probably just the tweak to that. Other Touch users, am I wrong or is this Apple Insider author just out of touch - with reality.
I think you're talking the OS version and AppleInsider is talking the hardware (model) version.
Wow! I think Microsoft just proved that a lot of their users are easily influenced, technologically ignorant and could really careless about their computing appliance, as long as it keeps getting email and porn.
I was about to say the same thing...
Reminds me of those inane commercials from the 70's & 80's....
Shhhhh!!! We've secretly replaced the finely aged filet mignon at this fancy New Your City steak-house. Instead, we are serving them a steaming pile of horse shit... Now, lets sit back and see if they notice...
Give me a flippin break...
Dave
I like how Microsoft uses Flash instead of SilverLight for the Mojave website. !
Yeah but it isn't very good Flash. The third and forth videos are linked to the same clip. The loading screen doesn't really load anything and doesn't cache. The cursors don't rollover correctly , on and on. Looks like this was rushed out the door for sure. You got to love the guy that says brown is his favorite color.
It felt and looked like a tarted up version of XP. I definitely prefer the sleekness of Leopard and how user friendly it is :]
Good lord...poor M$. When I heard about Ballmer's whining about how Apple has defined Vista, all I could do was laugh. But this really takes the prize. They had to trick people into using Vista. Wow. And of course, they didn't address many of the very real issues it has, such as compatibility, speed on older hardware and lower-end machines, etc.
I've played with Vista a few times on my girlfriend's computer, a 6 month old Dell. It's a consumer level machine. The verdict? I hate it. It's terrible. The good news is that she loves my Mac and really wants to get one now!
One more item: Why does Microsoft think that when an institution like my school district buys new laptops, they get XP instead of Vista? Do they really mean to tell us that our IT people are victims of Apple's marketing campaign?
Waitaminnit.... you have a girlfriend?