Apple is not going to release a cheap laptop. They may create a low-cost product offering that would fall into the netbook category, but it will not be a netbook as the term is currently defined. The current definition of a netbook is very broad and encompasses low-cost, low-performance, ultra-portable, and most importantly for Apple, encompasses low-quality. Apple will not release a low-quality offering.
I believe that Apple will redefine the entire netbook category and create something that is not synonymous with cheap, or even laptop. Their product will be something completely different and revolutionary like the iPhone: ?netbook? is just a marketing term after all - there?s a lot of innovation to be had here.
Releasing a cheap notebook would ruin the rest of their product line-up.
Well, the number one thing netbook owners care about is price, which rules out the MacBooks for the general netbook shopper. But as far as FORM FACTOR is concerned, then I think the analyst was right- look at the recent trend towards 10 and even 12 inch netbooks- people are realizing that cramped keyboards and really small screens just don't cut it.
Dude you don't buy Apple computers if you are concerned about price.
So the MacBook can't do what you did with the MacBook Air? You're lying to justify your purchase. You could have completed the exact same tasks, and then some with the MacBook as opposed to the Air. And you could have gotten it done faster.
And I do carry my MacBook around with me, so I know what it's like to travel with it.
The Air is super cool, but if it was priced and marketed as a product closer to its actual specs and capacity I'd say it'd sell in big numbers, and when production ramp goes up I think they could price it way lower.
If Apple wanted to develop an AIR for the consumers for $600 I say they could do it without compensating quality. Like they're doing with the new MacBooks. Wow, they look, feel and perform so hi fi pro polished and still selling at a reasonable price.
I'll quote Arnold: "Give these people AIR".
Okay, so you're saying either
1) start with the MacBook, take out the DVD drive, slow down the chip, reduce the ram, maintain the same build quality, and mass produce. So we go from what... $1100 to $900 I'm guessing?
or
2) start with the MacBook Air, increase the hard disk to 3.5" (from 2.5"), slight chip size increase (remove premium cost components), increase battery size - and knock it down from $1700
Either ends up with a similar end result. If you reduce the screen size you save a fair bit of money as long as the overall size of the laptop is the same - if you reduce the footprint at the same time then the same demands on size come in (so cost increases or performance reduces).
(Or reduce the build quality to keep costs low of course.)
Maybe I should take a step back.
What exactly would you change in a MB (or MBA) to halve the price while maintaining performance and quality. I assume you don't want a netbook so much as a much cheaper laptop.
(I get the "if you produce more it'll reduce the cost" - but nowhere near that much).
Sorry if my intent was not clear. There is "just a little" (wink) difference in the cost of an Atom and the CPU in a MBA. The article I saw quoted the single core 1.6 at $27 and the dual core at $43 which will, no doubt, fall quickly as it has only now been introduced.
Your point, as I took it, was exactly correct. An Atom or other similar class CPU is perfectly adequate for a Netbook or MID as long as you don't shove Vista down its throat (as Dell did with one of them) and its cost is such that an inexpensive device is entirely reasonable.
It is the basis of any number of Netbooks and the price of those devices should fall next year. They are going to sell a bunch of them IMO.
Leave it to Apple to wait until after the holiday rush to unveil a new product--millions lost just so Mr. Jobs can run his dog and pony show in January.
It looks that way but it actually serves 3 purposes
1) it gets rid of existing stock with big sales numbers at Christmas.
2) it doesn't cannibalise sales of available products at Christmas if the release of the brilliant new product is months away
3) the much lower january demand allows them to more slowly ramp up production instead of having huge demand and no products, with bad publicity to go with it.
I would love to see new big releases for December, but I certainly don't think Apple loses any money by doing it the way they do.
An Atom or other similar class CPU is perfectly adequate for a Netbook or MID as long as you don't shove Vista down its throat (as Dell did with one of them) and its cost is such that an inexpensive device is entirely reasonable.
I agree.
There are 2 different approaches to a small netbook device
a) take the current MacBook offerings and make a smaller one, cut back speed, some functionality, but pretty well stick OSX on it as now.
b) build something small and light - specifically to access email, web, IM, video/music, and with a functional keyboard.
I said earlier take the iPhone chip, OS, memory, etc and just give it a larger screen and keyboard, and a word processor. Kind of like how the Newton was made into the eMate. Then we're talking closer to iPod Touch prices.
But really... I was trying to escape the "put full OSX on a really cheap little machine" idea that is easy to fall into.
We know Snow Leopard is being designed with both Mac OSX and iPhone OSX in mind - so hopefully it will also be ideal for a Netbook/MID style machine. It'd have to use a more powerful ARM or Atom and it'd have to set a very clear, specific, lower expectation of what it does.
Apple is great at cutting back the functions and leaving the core/key functions working very well. If Apple produces a Netbook, expect it NOT to do everything OSX does. Millions of people will scream "why did they remove X, Y, & Z? they crippled it!". But its key functions will run well, look good, and be very attractive to more than 50% of people.
Dude you don't buy Apple computers if you are concerned about price.
Uhh... really?
'Cuz I've been buying 'em since the SE/30 days, and I still worry about the price, even though I've got quite a bit of money. Because that's how you get to keep on having a lot of money.
If Apple designs a cheap device with reduced functions geared specifically for web, email, video, audio, simple app-store games/apps, and a basic word processor.... why wouldn't they also make a cheaper desktop version for homes? (no battery, bigger screen?)
You can already buy music & videos directly from an AppleTV or iPhone. You can sync your documents to MobileMe. I know WE want more from our computers, but is there are market for something 'less'?
edit: The more I mull on this the more I think it fits with Snow Leopard rumours - since people with the beta say it won't be ready Q1. A new cut-back device or 2 from Apple with Snow Leopard, a simplified interface, reduced functions, and very specific hardware support could be much closer. Netbook, & home webmachine to start, the AppleTV3, iPhone3, iTablet later, all Macs eventually... same OS core for all.....
.... or something like that.
.... My hopes & insights rarely appear as I envisage...
Who want's a neutered laptop, or bloated iPhone? Build something that fits that size but leverages existing technologies in a way nobody else in the market has any hope of copying for at least two to three years.
I want a tablet that's actually a tablet -- think steno pad sized. That gives you a form factor of 6.5x9.5 and 5/8" thick. 1.5lbs/680 grams or less.
Full wireless connectivity, and auto-synching with your desktop or laptop if it knows where it is on the network--worldwide. Uses your laptop/desktop on the network to get heavy duty tasks done, not quite thin client, but more X-grid/remote desktop like.
Put a 9.5 to 10" widescreen touch sensitive display on it, that's bigger than the original Macintoshes had with about a 1/4" bezel and a great size weight for on the go video. Often, but not always streamed from your own home/work machine! Gotta be able to have enough local storage to watch on a plane/train, or kids in the back seat crossing the wastes of Nebraska.
A battery good for 12 hours in a reasonable conservation mode, 100% non-moving storage. Tons of RAM and lots of flash. It's all local cache for more speed on less power draw.
Killer app? - Sound recording capability and built in sound editing/voice parsing for post meeting/class processing. Farm that work out to the laptop/desktop and save battery. Now you can sit in a meeting or lecture, take time stamped notes and drive a auto-transcript generation utility. This gets even better if you make it Keynote syncable. Just import any PPT slides to Keynote and get the full auto synch for later playback/review. Yeah, there are implementation details here but you get the idea. Never again have some asshat be able to wriggle out of a statement made in a meeting or lecture. Never again have to lug something more than a pound an a half to do notes on or handle quick jottings.
Killer app 2?. When sitting on the desk next to the laptop/desktop and docked for recharging have a mode that would work like an intelligent input device/second monitor simultaneously. I can't begin to tell you how slick that would be for prototyping ideas, or marking up homework, etc.
Throw some other cool app stuff in to boot, I'm sure some of you have some more great ideas. Bottom line is this is not a primary machine replacement, and not a repackaged form factor of anything currently in the market today. It is a new set of functionality in a form factor that could be positioned as the ultimate must have lightweight extension of the current machine into a worldwide computing asset. You are essentially taking your office/home machine's capabilities with you in the size of a steno pad. I probably won't do great for FPS dynamic graphics games, but could probably handle most other genre's just fine, and that's OK because that's FPS is not what it would be designed for.
It would probably also drive a little ecosystem of accessories like on-the-go keyboards, optical drives, GPS navigation and other I/O devices [universal semi-self programming home theater remote? interface] to add things some folks want that others don't.
Shoot for the $499-$599 price point. We are't far off from the capability right now, battery life/form factor and some of the remote software design are pretty damn close right now. Apple already has the underlying technological pieces, just not stitched together in one cohesive manner.
If Apple designs a cheap device with reduced functions geared specifically for web, email, video, audio, simple app-store games/apps, and a basic word processor.... why wouldn't they also make a cheaper desktop version for homes? (no battery, bigger screen?)
You can already buy music & videos directly from an AppleTV or iPhone. You can sync your documents to MobileMe. I know WE want more from our computers, but is there are market for something 'less'?
edit: The more I mull on this the more I think it fits with Snow Leopard rumours - since people with the beta say it won't be ready Q1. A new cut-back device or 2 from Apple with Snow Leopard, a simplified interface, reduced functions, and very specific hardware support could be much closer. Netbook, & home webmachine to start, the AppleTV3, iPhone3, iTablet later, all Macs eventually... same OS core for all.....
.... or something like that.
.... My hopes & insights rarely appear as I envisage...
There is a market for something less. That is why there are so many people building OS X netbooks. I spent $399 for a Mini 9 from the Dell outlet, $24 for 2GB RAM, and $219 for for a 64GB SSD. I had not used all of my installs on my Leopard Family pak, so I saved a little there, and I also already had an external CD/DVD Drive. So that's $642. Would I have spent $699 - $799 to get one from Apple? You bet. I love my iPhone, but there are some things it just can't do, and other things it does not do well. I just want something inbetween my iMac at home, and iPhone that can run full OS X. Apple just does not offer it now, so like others I decided to find out how to make my own.
An Apple design netbook? I can only envision the MacBook mini. A scaled-down version of the current MacBook unibody chassis.
I would buy one…
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro
I want a tablet that's actually a tablet -- think steno pad sized. That gives you a form factor of 6.5x9.5 and 5/8" thick. 1.5lbs/680 grams or less.
Full wireless connectivity, and auto-synching with your desktop or laptop if it knows where it is on the network--worldwide. Uses your laptop/desktop on the network to get heavy duty tasks done, not quite thin client, but more X-grid/remote desktop like.
Preaching to the choir…!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro
Killer app 2?. When sitting on the desk next to the laptop/desktop and docked for recharging have a mode that would work like an intelligent input device/second monitor simultaneously. I can't begin to tell you how slick that would be for prototyping ideas, or marking up homework, etc.
I have envisioned this exact thing when I was working at an architectural studio; I was pushing for the studio to move their day-to-day to the ArchiOffice (FileMaker backend) database. From using the demo version, I knew the interface only enlarged to a certain size, one which would fit perfectly on a notepad sized tablet. My vision had the tablet running the frontend of the database, and 'integrating' itself with the MacPro running a license of ArchiCAD…
Want an Apple netbook? Get a 12" PowerBook refurbished. Inexpensive, small processor, and practical. Maybe a smidge too big but none the less, it'll do the trick just the same.
That's exactly what I did, the day after the MacBook Air came out. I wanted to see the feature set of the MBA to be sure, but the predicted limited connectivity and the lack of a built-in burner/drive were deal breakers in setting I needed to use this particular portable. The 12" PB I got was pretty well maxed-out by the refurb site. With a 1.5Ghz G4, it has just enough "oomph" to handle a Keynote loaded with a bunch of 720x480 QuickTime movies and avoid the embarrassment of using the Dell 630/ WindowsXP /Powerpoint 2003/WMV/AVI crash-and-burn-in-front-of the-International-Board combo that the mothership issues to us drones. Plus it runs the 3 Classic apps that I still need to use once in a blue moon. It really is a handy little beast. I'm probably going to buy one or two more just for spares.
Personally, I think Uncle Steve may have missed the boat on this one. An intel based 12" MBP could have been essentially the Apple version of the IBM Thinkpad X-61: a rugged, little business box that is easy to deal with in airport security lines, and will hook up to a wide variety of projectors and other devices wherever you might land. (It would also have the benefit of not needing an UltraBase). Given the option to boot into OS X or Windows (or run XP/Vista?Linux etc. in Parallels or Fusion), a person could have pretty much everything in one can that could take the beating that today's business style can exact on gear.
Plus, you wouldn't have to have the Chief Technical Officer jump up and do a fart-and-tap-dance for 15 minutes while trying to reboot the Dell because the WMV file just melted everything in the front of the room (never again).
In retrospect, it was kind of funny to hear the room simultaneously mutter, "ugh, Windows", in about 20 different dialects. I guess they have all had their turn in "front of the class".
I'm usually carrying a bag of some kind anyway, so it's not a big deal. Go to the big city and nearly everybody's carrying a bag. I see guys in their 60s still lugging around knapsacks. Sticking another small device in there weighing a couple of pounds isn't awkward at all. A five pound slab of a laptop usually is, though.
Yeah, you know all about them. I suppose your personally "refurbished" Powerbooks include the standard one-year Apple warranty? I didn't think so.
Alright, first off my eBay approval rating is 100%. Thats besides that point. I don't even know what made you question my integrity as a seller. Anyways... Your wording in the first paragraph was good. "Lugging" around knapsacks?. No one wants to do that. Honestly. I'm trying to rid myself of the things I need to carry around with me. Isn't that part of whats great about being a guy? You don't have to lug a freaking bag with you everywhere you go?
Also...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claude427
The 12" PB I got was pretty well maxed-out by the refurb site. With a 1.5Ghz G4, it has just enough "oomph" to handle a Keynote loaded with a bunch of 720x480 QuickTime movies and avoid the embarrassment of using the Dell 630/ WindowsXP /Powerpoint 2003/WMV/AVI crash-and-burn-in-front-of the-International-Board combo that the mothership issues to us drones. Plus it runs the 3 Classic apps that I still need to use once in a blue moon. It really is a handy little beast. I'm probably going to buy one or two more just for spares.
Anyway, yeah get a refurb 12" MBP.
Thank you Claude... I was waiting for someone to help me out there.
For some, the MBA doesn't have certain features that are "deal breakers". For others, like myself, the Air has certain features that are "deal makers". Apple chose to make a machine for those people. They have made lots of money off of it. They have learned a lot from it (the new MB and MBP cases are a direct result of the MBA); IOW, everybody has benefitted from the MBA.
I make CDs and DVDs professionally and do not have a need for a burner on my MBA. Some people don't agree. That's life. This time around, Apple decided to make a computer that fit a particular user's needs set, and not the average user.
As far as this cheap thing is concerned, I would be interested to see the Apple TV obtain a processor and then run apps form the App Store. Add a keyboard and you could type mail; add a mouse and you could draw picts. Lots of people would be happy with a basic device. Libraries could dedicate them to surfing or viewing of stored materials. The uses are limitless.
However, there is a group of people who always think we need more power, more ports blah blah blah. Yes, some people do, and the makers need to provide them with such (I myself have a tricked out MacPro at work). No, most people don't, and makers are going to serve them, too.
Look at the popularity of cell phones; my wife attended a conference last year where three big-whig business leaders all discussed an apparent move away from computers as the phones increase in capability. This was before the iPhone and App Store came to Japan.
Many people want small, cheap devices with inexpensive apps. The App Store sees over 2 million downloads every day; I wonder how that compares to Apple's software download section on their homepage.
Beautiful mock-up. If Apple were to enter the Netbook martket, I envision something similar with one big exception.
Take a look at the new MacBook. The trackpad on that thing is huge. Apple is making gestures a bigger and bigger part of their interface. How are you going to do a four-finger gesture into expose?
This is what I see:
Proximity sensors across the bottom of the open laptop. They know how many hands you're holding over the device. When you have 2 hands over, a keyboard is displayed on a touch display somewhat similar to the Kindle's (only with multi-touch capabilities). When you have only one hand over the device the entire thing turns to a multi-touch track pad. ... And there you have it. The best of both worlds. Full sized keyboard. Huge trackpad. And uh ... oh yeah... I'd make the display occupy the entire footprint.
I'm guessing El Jobso was talking about something similar when he said they had interesting ideas for netbooks. And we all know he loves full sized keyboards.
There is a market for something less. That is why there are so many people building OS X netbooks. I spent $399 for a Mini 9 from the Dell outlet...
When I asked if there was a market for something less - I wasn't meaning OSX on Atom, so much as a cheaper Mac that actually did less but did it very well. At MOST, imagine a cut-back Mac with light versions of iPhoto, iTunes, Pages, QuickView, IM, Mail, Calendar, Safari.... and access to 3rd party (lower power) apps like Dashboard or iPhone Apps. Less configurability, no regular OSX apps.
This could be in the form of a Netbook or low-function home computer. Sync to your home Mac/PC/MobileMe.
When I asked if there was a market for something less - I wasn't meaning OSX on Atom, so much as a cheaper Mac that actually did less but did it very well. At MOST, imagine a cut-back Mac with light versions of iPhoto, iTunes, Pages, QuickView, IM, Mail, Calendar, Safari.... and access to 3rd party (lower power) apps like Dashboard or iPhone Apps. Less configurability, no regular OSX apps.
This could be in the form of a Netbook or low-function home computer. Sync to your home Mac/PC/MobileMe.
Would that appeal to you?
I can't speak for the person this is directed to, but NO. Cut-down, "light" version of applications are fine on a device like the iPhone, which clearly is incapable of running the full versions, but not on a netbook.
If Apple makes a netbook, it must run the same OS X as every other Mac, and be able to run the same apps. Obviously, you're not going to be editing Garageband tracks or using Photoshop on the thing, any more that you would on an old G4.
Comments
The Atom dual core costs $43...just a little different.
I'm seeing 4 Atoms that are 1.6Ghz. They range from $29 to $70. The MBA CPU is $284, so I guess that is only a $250 difference, not $300.
Apple is not going to release a cheap laptop. They may create a low-cost product offering that would fall into the netbook category, but it will not be a netbook as the term is currently defined. The current definition of a netbook is very broad and encompasses low-cost, low-performance, ultra-portable, and most importantly for Apple, encompasses low-quality. Apple will not release a low-quality offering.
I believe that Apple will redefine the entire netbook category and create something that is not synonymous with cheap, or even laptop. Their product will be something completely different and revolutionary like the iPhone: ?netbook? is just a marketing term after all - there?s a lot of innovation to be had here.
Releasing a cheap notebook would ruin the rest of their product line-up.
Check out my recent response to this AppleInsider article...
Dude well said, glad you are not as clueless as a lot of people out there.
Well, the number one thing netbook owners care about is price, which rules out the MacBooks for the general netbook shopper. But as far as FORM FACTOR is concerned, then I think the analyst was right- look at the recent trend towards 10 and even 12 inch netbooks- people are realizing that cramped keyboards and really small screens just don't cut it.
Dude you don't buy Apple computers if you are concerned about price.
So the MacBook can't do what you did with the MacBook Air? You're lying to justify your purchase. You could have completed the exact same tasks, and then some with the MacBook as opposed to the Air. And you could have gotten it done faster.
And I do carry my MacBook around with me, so I know what it's like to travel with it.
Welcome to my ignore list.
The Air is super cool, but if it was priced and marketed as a product closer to its actual specs and capacity I'd say it'd sell in big numbers, and when production ramp goes up I think they could price it way lower.
If Apple wanted to develop an AIR for the consumers for $600 I say they could do it without compensating quality. Like they're doing with the new MacBooks. Wow, they look, feel and perform so hi fi pro polished and still selling at a reasonable price.
I'll quote Arnold: "Give these people AIR".
Okay, so you're saying either
1) start with the MacBook, take out the DVD drive, slow down the chip, reduce the ram, maintain the same build quality, and mass produce. So we go from what... $1100 to $900 I'm guessing?
or
2) start with the MacBook Air, increase the hard disk to 3.5" (from 2.5"), slight chip size increase (remove premium cost components), increase battery size - and knock it down from $1700
Either ends up with a similar end result. If you reduce the screen size you save a fair bit of money as long as the overall size of the laptop is the same - if you reduce the footprint at the same time then the same demands on size come in (so cost increases or performance reduces).
(Or reduce the build quality to keep costs low of course.)
Maybe I should take a step back.
What exactly would you change in a MB (or MBA) to halve the price while maintaining performance and quality. I assume you don't want a netbook so much as a much cheaper laptop.
(I get the "if you produce more it'll reduce the cost" - but nowhere near that much).
I'm seeing 4 Atoms that are 1.6Ghz. They range from $29 to $70. The MBA CPU is $284, so I guess that is only a $250 difference, not $300.
Sorry if my intent was not clear. There is "just a little" (wink) difference in the cost of an Atom and the CPU in a MBA. The article I saw quoted the single core 1.6 at $27 and the dual core at $43 which will, no doubt, fall quickly as it has only now been introduced.
Your point, as I took it, was exactly correct. An Atom or other similar class CPU is perfectly adequate for a Netbook or MID as long as you don't shove Vista down its throat (as Dell did with one of them) and its cost is such that an inexpensive device is entirely reasonable.
It is the basis of any number of Netbooks and the price of those devices should fall next year. They are going to sell a bunch of them IMO.
Cheers
Leave it to Apple to wait until after the holiday rush to unveil a new product--millions lost just so Mr. Jobs can run his dog and pony show in January.
It looks that way but it actually serves 3 purposes
1) it gets rid of existing stock with big sales numbers at Christmas.
2) it doesn't cannibalise sales of available products at Christmas if the release of the brilliant new product is months away
3) the much lower january demand allows them to more slowly ramp up production instead of having huge demand and no products, with bad publicity to go with it.
I would love to see new big releases for December, but I certainly don't think Apple loses any money by doing it the way they do.
An Atom or other similar class CPU is perfectly adequate for a Netbook or MID as long as you don't shove Vista down its throat (as Dell did with one of them) and its cost is such that an inexpensive device is entirely reasonable.
I agree.
There are 2 different approaches to a small netbook device
a) take the current MacBook offerings and make a smaller one, cut back speed, some functionality, but pretty well stick OSX on it as now.
b) build something small and light - specifically to access email, web, IM, video/music, and with a functional keyboard.
I said earlier take the iPhone chip, OS, memory, etc and just give it a larger screen and keyboard, and a word processor. Kind of like how the Newton was made into the eMate. Then we're talking closer to iPod Touch prices.
But really... I was trying to escape the "put full OSX on a really cheap little machine" idea that is easy to fall into.
We know Snow Leopard is being designed with both Mac OSX and iPhone OSX in mind - so hopefully it will also be ideal for a Netbook/MID style machine. It'd have to use a more powerful ARM or Atom and it'd have to set a very clear, specific, lower expectation of what it does.
Apple is great at cutting back the functions and leaving the core/key functions working very well. If Apple produces a Netbook, expect it NOT to do everything OSX does. Millions of people will scream "why did they remove X, Y, & Z? they crippled it!". But its key functions will run well, look good, and be very attractive to more than 50% of people.
Dude you don't buy Apple computers if you are concerned about price.
Uhh... really?
'Cuz I've been buying 'em since the SE/30 days, and I still worry about the price, even though I've got quite a bit of money. Because that's how you get to keep on having a lot of money.
...
If Apple designs a cheap device with reduced functions geared specifically for web, email, video, audio, simple app-store games/apps, and a basic word processor.... why wouldn't they also make a cheaper desktop version for homes? (no battery, bigger screen?)
You can already buy music & videos directly from an AppleTV or iPhone. You can sync your documents to MobileMe. I know WE want more from our computers, but is there are market for something 'less'?
edit: The more I mull on this the more I think it fits with Snow Leopard rumours - since people with the beta say it won't be ready Q1. A new cut-back device or 2 from Apple with Snow Leopard, a simplified interface, reduced functions, and very specific hardware support could be much closer. Netbook, & home webmachine to start, the AppleTV3, iPhone3, iTablet later, all Macs eventually... same OS core for all.....
.... or something like that.
.... My hopes & insights rarely appear as I envisage...
I want a tablet that's actually a tablet -- think steno pad sized. That gives you a form factor of 6.5x9.5 and 5/8" thick. 1.5lbs/680 grams or less.
Full wireless connectivity, and auto-synching with your desktop or laptop if it knows where it is on the network--worldwide. Uses your laptop/desktop on the network to get heavy duty tasks done, not quite thin client, but more X-grid/remote desktop like.
Put a 9.5 to 10" widescreen touch sensitive display on it, that's bigger than the original Macintoshes had with about a 1/4" bezel and a great size weight for on the go video. Often, but not always streamed from your own home/work machine! Gotta be able to have enough local storage to watch on a plane/train, or kids in the back seat crossing the wastes of Nebraska.
A battery good for 12 hours in a reasonable conservation mode, 100% non-moving storage. Tons of RAM and lots of flash. It's all local cache for more speed on less power draw.
Killer app? - Sound recording capability and built in sound editing/voice parsing for post meeting/class processing. Farm that work out to the laptop/desktop and save battery. Now you can sit in a meeting or lecture, take time stamped notes and drive a auto-transcript generation utility. This gets even better if you make it Keynote syncable. Just import any PPT slides to Keynote and get the full auto synch for later playback/review. Yeah, there are implementation details here but you get the idea. Never again have some asshat be able to wriggle out of a statement made in a meeting or lecture. Never again have to lug something more than a pound an a half to do notes on or handle quick jottings.
Killer app 2?. When sitting on the desk next to the laptop/desktop and docked for recharging have a mode that would work like an intelligent input device/second monitor simultaneously. I can't begin to tell you how slick that would be for prototyping ideas, or marking up homework, etc.
Throw some other cool app stuff in to boot, I'm sure some of you have some more great ideas. Bottom line is this is not a primary machine replacement, and not a repackaged form factor of anything currently in the market today. It is a new set of functionality in a form factor that could be positioned as the ultimate must have lightweight extension of the current machine into a worldwide computing asset. You are essentially taking your office/home machine's capabilities with you in the size of a steno pad. I probably won't do great for FPS dynamic graphics games, but could probably handle most other genre's just fine, and that's OK because that's FPS is not what it would be designed for.
It would probably also drive a little ecosystem of accessories like on-the-go keyboards, optical drives, GPS navigation and other I/O devices [universal semi-self programming home theater remote? interface] to add things some folks want that others don't.
Shoot for the $499-$599 price point. We are't far off from the capability right now, battery life/form factor and some of the remote software design are pretty damn close right now. Apple already has the underlying technological pieces, just not stitched together in one cohesive manner.
Ireland even has a workable mock-up of it already!
Umm. Another thought.
If Apple designs a cheap device with reduced functions geared specifically for web, email, video, audio, simple app-store games/apps, and a basic word processor.... why wouldn't they also make a cheaper desktop version for homes? (no battery, bigger screen?)
You can already buy music & videos directly from an AppleTV or iPhone. You can sync your documents to MobileMe. I know WE want more from our computers, but is there are market for something 'less'?
edit: The more I mull on this the more I think it fits with Snow Leopard rumours - since people with the beta say it won't be ready Q1. A new cut-back device or 2 from Apple with Snow Leopard, a simplified interface, reduced functions, and very specific hardware support could be much closer. Netbook, & home webmachine to start, the AppleTV3, iPhone3, iTablet later, all Macs eventually... same OS core for all.....
.... or something like that.
.... My hopes & insights rarely appear as I envisage...
There is a market for something less. That is why there are so many people building OS X netbooks. I spent $399 for a Mini 9 from the Dell outlet, $24 for 2GB RAM, and $219 for for a 64GB SSD. I had not used all of my installs on my Leopard Family pak, so I saved a little there, and I also already had an external CD/DVD Drive. So that's $642. Would I have spent $699 - $799 to get one from Apple? You bet. I love my iPhone, but there are some things it just can't do, and other things it does not do well. I just want something inbetween my iMac at home, and iPhone that can run full OS X. Apple just does not offer it now, so like others I decided to find out how to make my own.
I would buy one…
I want a tablet that's actually a tablet -- think steno pad sized. That gives you a form factor of 6.5x9.5 and 5/8" thick. 1.5lbs/680 grams or less.
Full wireless connectivity, and auto-synching with your desktop or laptop if it knows where it is on the network--worldwide. Uses your laptop/desktop on the network to get heavy duty tasks done, not quite thin client, but more X-grid/remote desktop like.
Preaching to the choir…!
Killer app 2?. When sitting on the desk next to the laptop/desktop and docked for recharging have a mode that would work like an intelligent input device/second monitor simultaneously. I can't begin to tell you how slick that would be for prototyping ideas, or marking up homework, etc.
I have envisioned this exact thing when I was working at an architectural studio; I was pushing for the studio to move their day-to-day to the ArchiOffice (FileMaker backend) database. From using the demo version, I knew the interface only enlarged to a certain size, one which would fit perfectly on a notepad sized tablet. My vision had the tablet running the frontend of the database, and 'integrating' itself with the MacPro running a license of ArchiCAD…
Want an Apple netbook? Get a 12" PowerBook refurbished. Inexpensive, small processor, and practical. Maybe a smidge too big but none the less, it'll do the trick just the same.
That's exactly what I did, the day after the MacBook Air came out. I wanted to see the feature set of the MBA to be sure, but the predicted limited connectivity and the lack of a built-in burner/drive were deal breakers in setting I needed to use this particular portable. The 12" PB I got was pretty well maxed-out by the refurb site. With a 1.5Ghz G4, it has just enough "oomph" to handle a Keynote loaded with a bunch of 720x480 QuickTime movies and avoid the embarrassment of using the Dell 630/ WindowsXP /Powerpoint 2003/WMV/AVI crash-and-burn-in-front-of the-International-Board combo that the mothership issues to us drones. Plus it runs the 3 Classic apps that I still need to use once in a blue moon. It really is a handy little beast. I'm probably going to buy one or two more just for spares.
Personally, I think Uncle Steve may have missed the boat on this one. An intel based 12" MBP could have been essentially the Apple version of the IBM Thinkpad X-61: a rugged, little business box that is easy to deal with in airport security lines, and will hook up to a wide variety of projectors and other devices wherever you might land. (It would also have the benefit of not needing an UltraBase). Given the option to boot into OS X or Windows (or run XP/Vista?Linux etc. in Parallels or Fusion), a person could have pretty much everything in one can that could take the beating that today's business style can exact on gear.
Plus, you wouldn't have to have the Chief Technical Officer jump up and do a fart-and-tap-dance for 15 minutes while trying to reboot the Dell because the WMV file just melted everything in the front of the room (never again).
In retrospect, it was kind of funny to hear the room simultaneously mutter, "ugh, Windows", in about 20 different dialects. I guess they have all had their turn in "front of the class".
Anyway, yeah get a refurb 12" MBP.
I'm usually carrying a bag of some kind anyway, so it's not a big deal. Go to the big city and nearly everybody's carrying a bag. I see guys in their 60s still lugging around knapsacks. Sticking another small device in there weighing a couple of pounds isn't awkward at all. A five pound slab of a laptop usually is, though.
Yeah, you know all about them. I suppose your personally "refurbished" Powerbooks include the standard one-year Apple warranty? I didn't think so.
Alright, first off my eBay approval rating is 100%. Thats besides that point. I don't even know what made you question my integrity as a seller. Anyways... Your wording in the first paragraph was good. "Lugging" around knapsacks?. No one wants to do that. Honestly. I'm trying to rid myself of the things I need to carry around with me. Isn't that part of whats great about being a guy? You don't have to lug a freaking bag with you everywhere you go?
Also...
The 12" PB I got was pretty well maxed-out by the refurb site. With a 1.5Ghz G4, it has just enough "oomph" to handle a Keynote loaded with a bunch of 720x480 QuickTime movies and avoid the embarrassment of using the Dell 630/ WindowsXP /Powerpoint 2003/WMV/AVI crash-and-burn-in-front-of the-International-Board combo that the mothership issues to us drones. Plus it runs the 3 Classic apps that I still need to use once in a blue moon. It really is a handy little beast. I'm probably going to buy one or two more just for spares.
Anyway, yeah get a refurb 12" MBP.
Thank you Claude... I was waiting for someone to help me out there.
For some, the MBA doesn't have certain features that are "deal breakers". For others, like myself, the Air has certain features that are "deal makers". Apple chose to make a machine for those people. They have made lots of money off of it. They have learned a lot from it (the new MB and MBP cases are a direct result of the MBA); IOW, everybody has benefitted from the MBA.
I make CDs and DVDs professionally and do not have a need for a burner on my MBA. Some people don't agree. That's life. This time around, Apple decided to make a computer that fit a particular user's needs set, and not the average user.
As far as this cheap thing is concerned, I would be interested to see the Apple TV obtain a processor and then run apps form the App Store. Add a keyboard and you could type mail; add a mouse and you could draw picts. Lots of people would be happy with a basic device. Libraries could dedicate them to surfing or viewing of stored materials. The uses are limitless.
However, there is a group of people who always think we need more power, more ports blah blah blah. Yes, some people do, and the makers need to provide them with such (I myself have a tricked out MacPro at work). No, most people don't, and makers are going to serve them, too.
Look at the popularity of cell phones; my wife attended a conference last year where three big-whig business leaders all discussed an apparent move away from computers as the phones increase in capability. This was before the iPhone and App Store came to Japan.
Many people want small, cheap devices with inexpensive apps. The App Store sees over 2 million downloads every day; I wonder how that compares to Apple's software download section on their homepage.
Beautiful mock-up. If Apple were to enter the Netbook martket, I envision something similar with one big exception.
Take a look at the new MacBook. The trackpad on that thing is huge. Apple is making gestures a bigger and bigger part of their interface. How are you going to do a four-finger gesture into expose?
This is what I see:
Proximity sensors across the bottom of the open laptop. They know how many hands you're holding over the device. When you have 2 hands over, a keyboard is displayed on a touch display somewhat similar to the Kindle's (only with multi-touch capabilities). When you have only one hand over the device the entire thing turns to a multi-touch track pad. ... And there you have it. The best of both worlds. Full sized keyboard. Huge trackpad. And uh ... oh yeah... I'd make the display occupy the entire footprint.
I'm guessing El Jobso was talking about something similar when he said they had interesting ideas for netbooks. And we all know he loves full sized keyboards.
There is a market for something less. That is why there are so many people building OS X netbooks. I spent $399 for a Mini 9 from the Dell outlet...
When I asked if there was a market for something less - I wasn't meaning OSX on Atom, so much as a cheaper Mac that actually did less but did it very well. At MOST, imagine a cut-back Mac with light versions of iPhoto, iTunes, Pages, QuickView, IM, Mail, Calendar, Safari.... and access to 3rd party (lower power) apps like Dashboard or iPhone Apps. Less configurability, no regular OSX apps.
This could be in the form of a Netbook or low-function home computer. Sync to your home Mac/PC/MobileMe.
Would that appeal to you?
When I asked if there was a market for something less - I wasn't meaning OSX on Atom, so much as a cheaper Mac that actually did less but did it very well. At MOST, imagine a cut-back Mac with light versions of iPhoto, iTunes, Pages, QuickView, IM, Mail, Calendar, Safari.... and access to 3rd party (lower power) apps like Dashboard or iPhone Apps. Less configurability, no regular OSX apps.
This could be in the form of a Netbook or low-function home computer. Sync to your home Mac/PC/MobileMe.
Would that appeal to you?
I can't speak for the person this is directed to, but NO. Cut-down, "light" version of applications are fine on a device like the iPhone, which clearly is incapable of running the full versions, but not on a netbook.
If Apple makes a netbook, it must run the same OS X as every other Mac, and be able to run the same apps. Obviously, you're not going to be editing Garageband tracks or using Photoshop on the thing, any more that you would on an old G4.