I've been reading these message boards for the past two years because of the high level of content that so many users usually post. I have failed to register for an account up till now since I felt that many of my own views were already represented by so many of you.
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
If the IT Dept can't service it- how is that petty?
Other than perhaps changing batteries (which anyone can do about as well as an IT Dept with a phone that allows it), what 'service' does an IT Dept provide for RIM that it cannot/does not/could not/will not (hypothetically) provide for Apple?
I've been reading these message boards for the past two years because of the high level of content that so many users usually post. I have failed to register for an account up till now since I felt that many of my own views were already represented by so many of you.
Welcome to the boards, I'm new here too actually, i like to talk to peep all sortts of peeps!
Quote:
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
Is that right? I didn't know techstud and I was so alike!
Quote:
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Yep, them nasty glary things getting in my ways to seeing them boards and writtin my posts!!
wich buttonm cantn se em, glare in the wa yyy matee!
Quote:
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Yer I do now them nationalities becauase I aksed them arrr!!
como esta? bueno dios amigo! meihco is bueno! arrrs
real mexican food is good, bu tpeople in jersy, never know ho wgood it really is!
Quote:
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Arrr I'm a observer of human behaiviors, an very smart one at it matey! You walk 2 feet I've read yer mind! donna make me a racist, noo I love peeeps especially my familia
comprende bingacovesa rojo grande? heheehe
Quote:
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
arrr me posting is tough all these glarys reflections blocking the screennn arrr!
Quote:
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
arrr welcome to the posting boards here matey! glad to have yer venting your spleen for uss!
thats all it's really is becauese Apple, they do what the want anyway right mate?
arrs yes matey I been tak'n too many sips from rum a dumm dumm jug today and feeeling fine.e....
have drink on me matey! arrrs
annnd materye neverr take me or any ome seriouss!
errrrrrr pink elepehantssss
GOT IT, YER LOOKING FOR A SON TO SCHOOL, first born child you are too
Apple had the advantage the time the iPhone first hit the market with their better UI, even getting 30% compared to RIM 40% However RIM has struck back and now has over 55% of the market compared to iPhone's 19% (next week to increase naturally)
A smart phone is not cheap, a tool justifies itself more than a toy. If I was going to need a smart phone to make money with other RIM oriented businesses, I'll pick a RIM over the iPhone every time, it's because I'm going to pick what and whom I make my money from picks so we are both on the same page.
It's the same old story, like Windows, the business market determines what the consumer is going to use at home eventually. How many smart phones can one own or bother to keep up with?
Apple keeps trying to change the tide, but it always comes back and sweeps them away. It's because they don't start in business and work into the consumer market later.
They try to use the consumer market as a leverage to force change in business.
People will give up their iPhones for Crackberries if their paycheck is at stake, everytime.
Sure us "artists" can act irrational and storm out if they even dare to take our Mac's from us, good artists that can produce talented material and make the company image/money have a little power.
But not the corporate drones, your going to obey or hit the street with the rest of the bums.
And your going to be taking your corporate Crackberry home and training your kids how to use it so they can succeed too.
Sounds like Windows right?
Speaking of hippies have you seen the huge organic garden in front of Steve's house?
Nice house, nice historic neighborhood, he drives a nice car, but a nasty garden right on the front lawn. Strange...
The money he has he could own a whole farm and the workers etc., instead he has it on his front lawn!
Yep and about 10 (edit: foreign workers) working it too. What a eyesore the garden is. (edit to clarify)
OK, since I work for a Fortune 50 company that was part of the initial testing group for the 2.0 OS, I can tell you that from an infrastructure perspective the iPhone is very attractive and especially now since they applied so many enterprise upgrades. BES are expensive pieces of additional equipment and my company struggles justifying that expense - except of course for executive use. If Apple starts making the inroads it seems to be making - look for RIM to scramble to significantly discount their servers (their bread&butter money makers) to maintain share or slow down share erosion. Whether another company we partner with has RIM infrastructure or not is largely immaterial to our own needs. People will give up a lot of things when a paycheck is on the line so your argument is specious at best. Let's look at the history of Windows insertion into the business marketplace. It was successful not because it was the best but because Microsoft essentially gave away the OS initially, and charged for Office. Once the dependency was established, they began charging more and more for the OS, adding on functionality like mail-handling, file/print, webhosting and so on. The primary three revenue streams for Microsoft are the desktop/server OSes and Office period. Nearly every other effort is either marginal or losing them money.
Your comments and speculation reflect a rather disconcerting lack of experience in the large corporate environment. I finally recently registered after observing for so long because commentary like yours is so full of errors and fallacious logic that it needed to be answered from an experienced pov.
If the IT Dept can't service it- how is that petty?
Frequently, corporate technology teams are driven not by what makes sense from an infrastructure perspective but from the needs, wants and desires of the executives. An executive decides he/she likes a technology, and turns around to the technology team and says we need to make this happen. Fortunately most core infrastructure is immune to that influence in most respects, but where handheld devices or computers are concerned - it can be wide-open. And the tech team better be able to onboard support and infrastructure in a timely fashion. Disclaimer: I am a technology manager for a Fortune 50 company.
OK, since I work for a Fortune 50 company that was part of the initial testing group for the 2.0 OS, I can tell you that from an infrastructure perspective the iPhone is very attractive and especially now since they applied so many enterprise upgrades. BES are expensive pieces of additional equipment and my company struggles justifying that expense - except of course for executive use. If Apple starts making the inroads it seems to be making - look for RIM to scramble to significantly discount their servers (their bread&butter money makers) to maintain share or slow down share erosion. Whether another company we partner with has RIM infrastructure or not is largely immaterial to our own needs. People will give up a lot of things when a paycheck is on the line so your argument is specious at best. Let's look at the history of Windows insertion into the business marketplace. It was successful not because it was the best but because Microsoft essentially gave away the OS initially, and charged for Office. Once the dependency was established, they began charging more and more for the OS, adding on functionality like mail-handling, file/print, webhosting and so on. The primary three revenue streams for Microsoft are the desktop/server OSes and Office period. Nearly every other effort is either marginal or losing them money.
Your comments and speculation reflect a rather disconcerting lack of experience in the large corporate environment. I finally recently registered after observing for so long because commentary like yours is so full of errors and fallacious logic that it needed to be answered from an experienced pov.
Sobering up a little here. (I almost wrote slobbering up )
Thank you for your insight there and your point of view is very much welcome, you will make a valuable contribution to this board.
And, I do believe Apple has made some recent changes for the better to appeal to corporate customers.
But my opinion it's a bit too late, the surprise attack ability into RIMs turf has been lost due to inaction by Apple. That's my main point of my argument, not what Apple is doing now, but what they missed by not paying attention and taking the advantage while they could have.
And I must be good at something, I got TWO 2 (dos bingas!) people to sign up to AppleInsider in one post!!
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense. Until SL Server, there is no "taking on". They actually help Micosorft a lot. Want this new shiny iPhone in your business? Buy Exchange server 2007, because without it, you can't even invite people from the Calendar app!
This inviting thig, which is limited only to Exchange (and I don't believe there are any technical hurdles in this), is my personal favourite, as regards the "The Worst Thing About OS 3.0" competition... together with being unable co copy messages in Mail, only move them (= no Gmail tagging). I wouldn't be surprised if there existed a treaty between Apple and MS about supporting invites only when using Exchange 2007. Why in the world would Apple do this on their own? How exactly could they benefit on restricting the feature?
Well, at least we have MMS -- sending a few tens of kb for an outrageous price. Welcome to the past!
You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense.
No, not really. Plenty of companies are moving to outsource their exchange services because it costs them less money to do so, especially when you factor in not only the cost of the server itself, but also the salary / benefits / etc. of the person who maintains it. There are many MANY companies now offering hosted exchange services, so actually having your very own exchange server is not an entry barrier at all.
No, not really. Plenty of companies are moving to outsource their exchange services because it costs them less money to do so, especially when you factor in not only the cost of the server itself, but also the salary / benefits / etc. of the person who maintains it. There are many MANY companies now offering hosted exchange services, so actually having your very own exchange server is not an entry barrier at all.
But that doesn't change the fact that you are dependent on Exchange. Apple simply uses the iPhone momentum to help MS with their Exchange business. And from what I see, I belive it's deliberate.
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense.
Not quite. As an example, our corporate email is hosted by Google for a small monthly fee. Works perfectly well with the iPhone. No Exchange is needed. As already pointed out, there are also hundreds of cost-efficient hosted Exchange providers out there.
I am not suggesting that existing RIM customers will migrate to the iPhone tomorrow. But there is certainly a market segment for which a hosted mail service coupled with iPhones is a far cheaper, easier to maintain and more flexible solution than RIM/Blackberry. This is before you start comparing the handsets themselves. On the latter point, just think of non-US markets in which people communicate in more than one language: the virtual keyboard and multi-language support of the iPhone give it a distinct advantage.
I agree. My original point -- which I withdrew, since I did not want to start a flame war with the IT folks here -- put better, was (sort of) that many IT departments are indeed entrenched and petty. They have too much invested in their own legacy decisions, training, human capital, infrastructure, vendor relations, professional contacts and seminars and conferences, 'ways of doing business,' and sheer laziness, to be open to switching.
Unless that IT guy loves apple or the females offer him favors to switch to iphone .
I've been reading these message boards for the past two years because of the high level of content that so many users usually post. I have failed to register for an account up till now since I felt that many of my own views were already represented by so many of you.
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
Wow
Great post. I hope you hang around and post more often.
i wonder if you went to 6 points would it look like.
<<sixthy>>
off topic time
And what exactly does having two gpu chips in some MBP really mean for the future of apple computing.
Right now they work alone, Either or. But I see some major breakthru's coming. With openCL and GCS .I see the 2 gpu chips working in concert with the cpu chip. I am not a geek so I may mis -speak here and there.
They put this double chip in for a reason other than what was stated. I predict some heavy 3D gaming/graphics coming. Apple is adding some heavy guns and some heavier software to allow doubling of the chips power.
And wouldn't more companies move to apple then ?
And the iphone in a few years will be a very powerful device with the new road apple is on.
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense. Until SL Server, there is no "taking on". They actually help Micosorft a lot. Want this new shiny iPhone in your business? Buy Exchange server 2007, because without it, you can't even invite people from the Calendar app!
Exchange is going nowhere. Mail and exchange in the corporate arena is like a hand in a glove. Every place I worked used Exchange, or eventually got there. It's not out of the realms of possibility but SL Server isn't going to be appearing on many corporate network diagrams an time soon. For the foreseeable future, Apple NEEDS Exchange.
Listen *- I didn't mean "service" in the literal sense, if you even know what that means. The prior responder knew exactly what i meant.
Why do they pick always your words apart ??
Beside's the fact that you don't even own a phone.
Think about your combative style of posting.
Think before you post . Think it thru. The horses you have beaten to death are still dead. AT&T has spotty coverage .We all know that. I refuse to get the phone until verizon get's it .
Move on.
When the new MBP came out you said you would buy a 13" MBP ??
Well
Did you ? And how is it going .
Come on dude stop being a *** joke and join us. Be one of us , LAUGH A LITTLE
RIM has 55% of the market; iPhone 20%. You do the math- ain't gonna happen.
RIM is at their apogee. Apple's iPhone is in it's infancy. The potential and the pace of development of the iPhone OS can not be matched by any company right now. In fact, Android might be better positioned than RIM and may have more room for growth, despite their small current market share. The point is, when you look at the dynamics, not the static picture, the math gets pretty complicated, and there are lots of 'ifs' on the way.
Listen nimrod- I didn't mean "service" in the literal sense, if you even know what that means. The prior responder knew exactly what i meant.
But Masternav didn't talk about what sort of services are missing. Can you provide examples?
Quote:
I'm not going to type a dissertation for you like sloppyism and anukstatdatdaram would.
That was uncalled for. Same with the nimrod comment. I'm going to start handing out infraction points to people involved with name calling. I started with the guy that called you a bozo but definitely not ending it there.
Comments
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
If the IT Dept can't service it- how is that petty?
Other than perhaps changing batteries (which anyone can do about as well as an IT Dept with a phone that allows it), what 'service' does an IT Dept provide for RIM that it cannot/does not/could not/will not (hypothetically) provide for Apple?
I've been reading these message boards for the past two years because of the high level of content that so many users usually post. I have failed to register for an account up till now since I felt that many of my own views were already represented by so many of you.
Welcome to the boards, I'm new here too actually, i like to talk to peep all sortts of peeps!
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
Is that right? I didn't know techstud and I was so alike!
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Yep, them nasty glary things getting in my ways to seeing them boards and writtin my posts!!
wich buttonm cantn se em, glare in the wa yyy matee!
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Yer I do now them nationalities becauase I aksed them arrr!!
como esta? bueno dios amigo! meihco is bueno! arrrs
real mexican food is good, bu tpeople in jersy, never know ho wgood it really is!
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Arrr I'm a observer of human behaiviors, an very smart one at it matey! You walk 2 feet I've read yer mind! donna make me a racist, noo I love peeeps especially my familia
comprende bingacovesa rojo grande? heheehe
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
arrr me posting is tough all these glarys reflections blocking the screennn arrr!
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
arrr welcome to the posting boards here matey! glad to have yer venting your spleen for uss!
thats all it's really is becauese Apple, they do what the want anyway right mate?
arrs yes matey I been tak'n too many sips from rum a dumm dumm jug today and feeeling fine.e....
have drink on me matey! arrrs
annnd materye neverr take me or any ome seriouss!
errrrrrr pink elepehantssss
GOT IT, YER LOOKING FOR A SON TO SCHOOL, first born child you are too
see I knowssss why I gootta get drunk...
Apple had the advantage the time the iPhone first hit the market with their better UI, even getting 30% compared to RIM 40% However RIM has struck back and now has over 55% of the market compared to iPhone's 19% (next week to increase naturally)
A smart phone is not cheap, a tool justifies itself more than a toy. If I was going to need a smart phone to make money with other RIM oriented businesses, I'll pick a RIM over the iPhone every time, it's because I'm going to pick what and whom I make my money from picks so we are both on the same page.
It's the same old story, like Windows, the business market determines what the consumer is going to use at home eventually. How many smart phones can one own or bother to keep up with?
Apple keeps trying to change the tide, but it always comes back and sweeps them away. It's because they don't start in business and work into the consumer market later.
They try to use the consumer market as a leverage to force change in business.
People will give up their iPhones for Crackberries if their paycheck is at stake, everytime.
Sure us "artists" can act irrational and storm out if they even dare to take our Mac's from us, good artists that can produce talented material and make the company image/money have a little power.
But not the corporate drones, your going to obey or hit the street with the rest of the bums.
And your going to be taking your corporate Crackberry home and training your kids how to use it so they can succeed too.
Sounds like Windows right?
Speaking of hippies have you seen the huge organic garden in front of Steve's house?
Nice house, nice historic neighborhood, he drives a nice car, but a nasty garden right on the front lawn. Strange...
The money he has he could own a whole farm and the workers etc., instead he has it on his front lawn!
Yep and about 10 (edit: foreign workers) working it too. What a eyesore the garden is. (edit to clarify)
OK, since I work for a Fortune 50 company that was part of the initial testing group for the 2.0 OS, I can tell you that from an infrastructure perspective the iPhone is very attractive and especially now since they applied so many enterprise upgrades. BES are expensive pieces of additional equipment and my company struggles justifying that expense - except of course for executive use. If Apple starts making the inroads it seems to be making - look for RIM to scramble to significantly discount their servers (their bread&butter money makers) to maintain share or slow down share erosion. Whether another company we partner with has RIM infrastructure or not is largely immaterial to our own needs. People will give up a lot of things when a paycheck is on the line so your argument is specious at best. Let's look at the history of Windows insertion into the business marketplace. It was successful not because it was the best but because Microsoft essentially gave away the OS initially, and charged for Office. Once the dependency was established, they began charging more and more for the OS, adding on functionality like mail-handling, file/print, webhosting and so on. The primary three revenue streams for Microsoft are the desktop/server OSes and Office period. Nearly every other effort is either marginal or losing them money.
Your comments and speculation reflect a rather disconcerting lack of experience in the large corporate environment. I finally recently registered after observing for so long because commentary like yours is so full of errors and fallacious logic that it needed to be answered from an experienced pov.
If the IT Dept can't service it- how is that petty?
Frequently, corporate technology teams are driven not by what makes sense from an infrastructure perspective but from the needs, wants and desires of the executives. An executive decides he/she likes a technology, and turns around to the technology team and says we need to make this happen. Fortunately most core infrastructure is immune to that influence in most respects, but where handheld devices or computers are concerned - it can be wide-open. And the tech team better be able to onboard support and infrastructure in a timely fashion. Disclaimer: I am a technology manager for a Fortune 50 company.
OK, since I work for a Fortune 50 company that was part of the initial testing group for the 2.0 OS, I can tell you that from an infrastructure perspective the iPhone is very attractive and especially now since they applied so many enterprise upgrades. BES are expensive pieces of additional equipment and my company struggles justifying that expense - except of course for executive use. If Apple starts making the inroads it seems to be making - look for RIM to scramble to significantly discount their servers (their bread&butter money makers) to maintain share or slow down share erosion. Whether another company we partner with has RIM infrastructure or not is largely immaterial to our own needs. People will give up a lot of things when a paycheck is on the line so your argument is specious at best. Let's look at the history of Windows insertion into the business marketplace. It was successful not because it was the best but because Microsoft essentially gave away the OS initially, and charged for Office. Once the dependency was established, they began charging more and more for the OS, adding on functionality like mail-handling, file/print, webhosting and so on. The primary three revenue streams for Microsoft are the desktop/server OSes and Office period. Nearly every other effort is either marginal or losing them money.
Your comments and speculation reflect a rather disconcerting lack of experience in the large corporate environment. I finally recently registered after observing for so long because commentary like yours is so full of errors and fallacious logic that it needed to be answered from an experienced pov.
Sobering up a little here. (I almost wrote slobbering up
Thank you for your insight there and your point of view is very much welcome, you will make a valuable contribution to this board.
And, I do believe Apple has made some recent changes for the better to appeal to corporate customers.
But my opinion it's a bit too late, the surprise attack ability into RIMs turf has been lost due to inaction by Apple. That's my main point of my argument, not what Apple is doing now, but what they missed by not paying attention and taking the advantage while they could have.
And I must be good at something, I got TWO 2 (dos bingas!) people to sign up to AppleInsider in one post!!
If the IT Dept can't service it- how is that petty?
Are you serious? You think the IT department 'services' cell phones?
EDIT:
personal attack
take on rivals Research in Motion and Microsoft
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense. Until SL Server, there is no "taking on". They actually help Micosorft a lot. Want this new shiny iPhone in your business? Buy Exchange server 2007, because without it, you can't even invite people from the Calendar app!
This inviting thig, which is limited only to Exchange (and I don't believe there are any technical hurdles in this), is my personal favourite, as regards the "The Worst Thing About OS 3.0" competition... together with being unable co copy messages in Mail, only move them (= no Gmail tagging). I wouldn't be surprised if there existed a treaty between Apple and MS about supporting invites only when using Exchange 2007. Why in the world would Apple do this on their own? How exactly could they benefit on restricting the feature?
Well, at least we have MMS -- sending a few tens of kb for an outrageous price. Welcome to the past!
You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense.
No, not really. Plenty of companies are moving to outsource their exchange services because it costs them less money to do so, especially when you factor in not only the cost of the server itself, but also the salary / benefits / etc. of the person who maintains it. There are many MANY companies now offering hosted exchange services, so actually having your very own exchange server is not an entry barrier at all.
No, not really. Plenty of companies are moving to outsource their exchange services because it costs them less money to do so, especially when you factor in not only the cost of the server itself, but also the salary / benefits / etc. of the person who maintains it. There are many MANY companies now offering hosted exchange services, so actually having your very own exchange server is not an entry barrier at all.
But that doesn't change the fact that you are dependent on Exchange. Apple simply uses the iPhone momentum to help MS with their Exchange business. And from what I see, I belive it's deliberate.
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense.
Not quite. As an example, our corporate email is hosted by Google for a small monthly fee. Works perfectly well with the iPhone. No Exchange is needed. As already pointed out, there are also hundreds of cost-efficient hosted Exchange providers out there.
I am not suggesting that existing RIM customers will migrate to the iPhone tomorrow. But there is certainly a market segment for which a hosted mail service coupled with iPhones is a far cheaper, easier to maintain and more flexible solution than RIM/Blackberry. This is before you start comparing the handsets themselves. On the latter point, just think of non-US markets in which people communicate in more than one language: the virtual keyboard and multi-language support of the iPhone give it a distinct advantage.
I agree. My original point -- which I withdrew, since I did not want to start a flame war with the IT folks here -- put better, was (sort of) that many IT departments are indeed entrenched and petty. They have too much invested in their own legacy decisions, training, human capital, infrastructure, vendor relations, professional contacts and seminars and conferences, 'ways of doing business,' and sheer laziness, to be open to switching.
Unless that IT guy loves apple or the females offer him favors to switch to iphone .
9
Are you serious? You think the IT department 'services' cell phones?
HEY edit no name calling
EDIT: Removed attack from other post
Are you serious? You think the IT department 'services' cell phones? You are such a bozo.
Listen *- I didn't mean "service" in the literal sense, if you even know what that means. The prior responder knew exactly what i meant.
EDIT: Personal attack
I've been reading these message boards for the past two years because of the high level of content that so many users usually post. I have failed to register for an account up till now since I felt that many of my own views were already represented by so many of you.
But now, I'm here to say that I just can't take it anymore. Either MacTripper or techstud seems to fill every message thread with their ridiculously shortsighted opinions that scream of their ignorance of what innovation looks like and why its embraced by so many.
We understand you don't like glossy screens. Seriously, we have heard your complaint loud and clear. We get it. Can you please move on? It's like listening to someone that still complains that Coke was better when it came in bottles. It doesn't matter anymore, move on.
Secondly, a group of people working in a yard in a neighborhood where you don't live deserve as much respect as your own neighbor who hires the local teenager to work in his yard. You neither know their nationality, nor their country of origin. To assume that you do speaks to a level of racism that may not be exaggerated, but is none the less real and offensive.
Thirdly, if you don't work in corporate IT or even in corporate management, then don't speak as if you have an authoritative position on what they would want or demand from a product that it sounds like you don't use. Corporate America is not a conglomerate of companies that check with each other to see if its okay to venture out and try something that is new and innovative. It is made of individuals who have their own passions and ideas about what will drive their businesses forward. Company 'A' doesn't use BB's because company 'B' does; they use them because it is what makes the most sense for them at that time.
Fourthly, take your time to think about what you want to say before you say it. Just because you edit a post doesn't mean that you never said it in the first place. Think, write, and then get out of the way. "The man who talks the most is usually the one who says nothing worth listening to."
Fifthly, if you're not an authority on a topic don't talk like you are one. No one outside ATT and Apple has any idea what the specifics of their contract entail. You don't know how long they are locked in, nor do you know what Verizon was or wasn't willing to concede to them. Judging by the long line of armored trucks backed up to Apple I would guess that their agreement with ATT has been quite profitable for them to date. I for one am grateful for a company that has their head screwed on straight. Financial health today means more innovation tomorrow.
Sorry for so long a post, but I just couldn't take it anymore.
Wow
Great post. I hope you hang around and post more often.
i wonder if you went to 6 points would it look like.
<<sixthy>>
off topic time
And what exactly does having two gpu chips in some MBP really mean for the future of apple computing.
Right now they work alone, Either or. But I see some major breakthru's coming. With openCL and GCS .I see the 2 gpu chips working in concert with the cpu chip. I am not a geek so I may mis -speak here and there.
They put this double chip in for a reason other than what was stated. I predict some heavy 3D gaming/graphics coming. Apple is adding some heavy guns and some heavier software to allow doubling of the chips power.
And wouldn't more companies move to apple then ?
And the iphone in a few years will be a very powerful device with the new road apple is on.
Thoughts?
I fail to see how exactly this "taking" should work.... You actually HAVE TO BUY Exchange in order for iPhone in the enterprise to make sense. Until SL Server, there is no "taking on". They actually help Micosorft a lot. Want this new shiny iPhone in your business? Buy Exchange server 2007, because without it, you can't even invite people from the Calendar app!
Exchange is going nowhere. Mail and exchange in the corporate arena is like a hand in a glove. Every place I worked used Exchange, or eventually got there. It's not out of the realms of possibility but SL Server isn't going to be appearing on many corporate network diagrams an time soon. For the foreseeable future, Apple NEEDS Exchange.
Listen *- I didn't mean "service" in the literal sense, if you even know what that means. The prior responder knew exactly what i meant.
Why do they pick always your words apart ??
Beside's the fact that you don't even own a phone.
Think about your combative style of posting.
Think before you post . Think it thru. The horses you have beaten to death are still dead. AT&T has spotty coverage .We all know that. I refuse to get the phone until verizon get's it .
Move on.
When the new MBP came out you said you would buy a 13" MBP ??
Well
Did you ? And how is it going .
Come on dude stop being a *** joke and join us. Be one of us , LAUGH A LITTLE
.
Peace
9[/quote]
EDIT Removed attacks from BOTH posts
RIM has 55% of the market; iPhone 20%. You do the math- ain't gonna happen.
RIM is at their apogee. Apple's iPhone is in it's infancy. The potential and the pace of development of the iPhone OS can not be matched by any company right now. In fact, Android might be better positioned than RIM and may have more room for growth, despite their small current market share. The point is, when you look at the dynamics, not the static picture, the math gets pretty complicated, and there are lots of 'ifs' on the way.
Listen nimrod- I didn't mean "service" in the literal sense, if you even know what that means. The prior responder knew exactly what i meant.
But Masternav didn't talk about what sort of services are missing. Can you provide examples?
I'm not going to type a dissertation for you like sloppyism and anukstatdatdaram would.
That was uncalled for. Same with the nimrod comment. I'm going to start handing out infraction points to people involved with name calling. I started with the guy that called you a bozo but definitely not ending it there.
It seems like the word "exchange" should be appearing more frequently in this thread.
Apple's foray into the enterprise market is completely based upon exchange support.