Interesting! So there is no worthwhile market for super expensive, ultra-thin BRDs that are slower than the fat, cheap tray loading drives found in your typical notebook? You'd think that if Apple didn't supply them that 3rd-parties would jump at the chance to sell these drives. You'd also think that more than one a single company with a single press release of these prototype drives would exist.
PS: It's common sense, not cleverness. You can't bitch about a device not be offered by a PC vendor when you can't even find a 3rd-party vendor that makes one.
Have you seen the PC laptops in these ads? They're all 1.5 to 2 inches thick. That's why the market for 9.5mm drives is so miniscule, unless someone like Apple is asking for one (which they haven't been, because they want you to spend all of your money at the iTunes Store). That said, there are 12.5mm drives available, and 1.3" laptops with Blu-Ray burners/players; maybe Apple should consider not making their laptops so thin they can't offer the same capabilities as their competitors.
From Best Buy (and we all know we can find better deals)
HP HDX 16: $1,149.99
Minuses: Screen size, DDR2.
Add: $110 for Sony Vegas/ACID for iLife like compatibility. Use Picassa and other free tools to replace iPhoto, iWeb. You can find free AV online too to protect yourself. AVG, Comodo, etc...
Total: $1260 (Add 150 for OS X if we wanted a hackintosh: $1410)
From Apple (and we all know that you can't find a better price that doesn't involve rebates)
MacBook Pro Basic: $2000
Pluses: Screen, DDR3, OS X.
Minus: $80 for iLife (to make comparable to Windows PCs with out that software)
Add: $30 for additional 2GB Ram upgrade. $90 for HDD upgrade to 500gb (assuming we do these upgrades ourselves)
Total: $2040
So yeah... I dunno. Remember, Macs and PCs use the exact same internals! Is your Apple really worth 700 dollars more? To me it isn't. $700 for a label and a sexy case. Keep in mind, I won't buy an HP either. If I were to buy a real laptop: Lenovo. Those are some durable machines!
A new version being released does not automatically mean it'll be anything significant. The evolution of the Final Cut Studio suite has gone from break-neck speeds to a slow crawl ever since Apple started being more interested in selling consumers movies instead of helping professionals make them.
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
So then what are you using? Avid? Premier? Since you're a real film maker, I'm assuming you're involved in post production, in which case you will know that the only truth to all of this is to make sure that whatever you do is interoperable with other users who typically use Avid and Final Cut today.
If you're independent, then whatever you use doesn't matter. This PC vs Apple thing is nonsense and if you are successful using Windows Media Composer, then more power to you.
I met my wife twice before we "officially met." We took no notice of each other the first two times and only realized they existed when talking later, well into our relationship. But, after I became a Mac owner we met a third time and the rest is history.
Coincidence!? I think NOT!
Now THAT is a great pitch for an Apple commercial!!
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
Clearly this young lady didn't bother to read the most recent Consumer Reports before she went shopping. CR has a big article on buying a laptop computer. Apple MacBooks and MacBook Pros were #1 in every category and they were the only company that was Red (above average +) in reliablilty in every category.
If this were all legit, I wonder how many $1ks MS would have to give away before they actually found a "hunter" that actually bought a PC...?
That doesn't matter, it's all about the price, everything is irrelevant, we should make all decisions in life based on price.
You know, if Apple wants to respond to these ads in a meaningful way, how about they just stop skimping on features and shut them the hell up? Truth be told, it is ridiculous that their $2,000 "Pro" laptop doesn't come standard with 4GB of memory (piss on these ads however for ignoring the fact that it's only a $60 upgrade). How about Blu-Ray playback in a $1,500 laptop? Everyone else has it.
So yeah... I dunno. Remember, Macs and PCs use the exact same internals! Is your Apple really worth 700 dollars more? To me it isn't. $700 for a label and a sexy case. Keep in mind, I won't buy an HP either. If I were to buy a real laptop: Lenovo. Those are some durable machines!
No, they don't. You didn't even account for the $150 price difference in the CPU, but why would you when they "use the exact same internals". The same company, Intel, designs the CPUs but since when does having the same company name on an item mean that they are same product. Then there are the component and R&D costs for the newer RAM and the extra shrinkage and consolidation, etc.
If you can even see that the CPU is a different clockspeeds (not even talking about the architecture, L2, FSB, etc.) you can't begin to make a fair comparison. However, you do represent the majority of people who buy computers.
PS: Lenovos are nice, but I recommend Asus to most people I know that want non-Mac notebooks. They make a solid machine that tends to get you more bang for your buck.
I registered just to respond to this. Are you serious?? NO ONE knows the difference between DDR2 and DDR3, except MAYBE people that post on boards like this. People plunk down $2000 for a computer all the time without knowing what is inside it other than asking "will it be fast enough for me."
You have serious delusions of the computer proficiency and tech savvy of the "average" user if you think they have any clue about the type of RAM in their computer.
-p-
So does that mean we shouldn't mention it is a point for the Mac?
With all this bashing of how much memory a 32-bit MS-Windows can access, does anyone have a good reference as to how much memory can be accessed by MacOS X 10.5?
From what I understand MacOS X 10.5 on a 64-bit processor is a 32-bit/64-bit hybrid: the OS is 64-bit, but any userland process is 32-bit. Can anyone elaborate?
check out this series of articles by Daniel Eran Dilger:
About $549 (link) if you buy Sony Vegas directly from Sony's site (you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere. So... let's do a little price breakdown.
PC Route: According to Microsoft's site, the computer is $1049.99 = Software... $549.49= $1598.99 If I were her, I'd go to the 7 Beta and use that instead of Vista and then buy 7 once it's released (I've been testing 7 with Vegas after using OSX with Final Cut Pro) so assuming that the price of upgrading isn't going to move much between Vista and 7... $239.99 http://www.amazon.com/Windows-Vista-...dp_ob_title_sw. So her final price is $1838.98
Mac Route: $1999 for MacBook Pro + $1499 for Final Cut Studio (do not bring up that joke Final Cut Express... it does not handle all of the same codecs that Final Cut Pro and Sony Vegas can do.) = $3498.
Would you like to allaborate on the "add to price" that PCs bring? I've been an editor for about 8 years now on the OSX+Final Cut platform and I have now moved to the PC platform. I'm saving money and getting better turn around time in my business.
I'm a PC and I'm a video editor/filmmaker/Local TV producer.
Yay!
So it looks like you beat me to the punch on the price points before I went to a meeting. I was in the Apple arena in school for film using Final Cut. Now I am working on Avid on a PC, and I did the same when I worked for NBC. The industry is changing to the PC in terms of video editing because of price mainly, and 3rd party add-ons. Harris/Leitch video servers? Ross and Grass Valley video consoles... all hook into Avid. All on PCs from the studios I saw.
Actually, the coolest bit was when I was an editor, I could be rendering the clip while editing it at the same time, and on top of that, the video board could play the clip AS it was being rendered, not after. Sometimes I had edits that were done 30 seconds before they were aired. Hectic, but really cool for that down to the wire situations. I want to see Final Cut do that!
I registered just to respond to this. Are you serious?? NO ONE knows the difference between DDR2 and DDR3, except MAYBE people that post on boards like this. People plunk down $2000 for a computer all the time without knowing what is inside it other than asking "will it be fast enough for me."
You have serious delusions of the computer proficiency and tech savvy of the "average" user if you think they have any clue about the type of RAM in their computer.
-p-
Agreed. I sure didn't. People who post on boards like this (well the majority) are probably in the 1% or 2% most tech savvy. Then there's others like you and I.
The thing I despise most about these commercials is at the end when they say "I'm a PC". It is so ridiculous to claim that you are a computer. You are not a computer, idiot. You are a human being!
The Mac used to be unmatched for years... but Windows 7 is really going to give Apple a run for it's money. You Obviously have an extreme bias... the machine she picked up was really a decent machine and doesn't have the cost near to the Mac route (buying Final Cut Pro). I'm a filmmaker and have been using Macs for 8 years... but I've been very disappointed in the current direction of the company as of late. I wouldn't be so cocky about the superiority of macs... those days are gone.
Just like Vista was supposed to give Apple a run for it's money?
That doesn't matter, it's all about the price, everything is irrelevant, we should make all decisions in life based on price.
I did that once, in my youth, with car insurance. Went to an underwriter who found me the cheapest option. It was so much lower than the All State I had started with and that my father told me to get. I finally was in an accident, not my fault but they didn't have insurance. Took over 6 months to get the car repaired as the insurance company had to send out a rep to okay new repairs for what couldn't be seen and they only did that once every week or two. They also tried so many ways to not pay the medical and car rental bills. To a point that it was stressful and anti-productive to fight with them. Years later, back with All State, a similar occurrence happened again. It was a simple process and well worth the extra money I was paying.
Thats hilarious... "The commercial, which can be seen below, ends before Sheila can begin her search for a viable video editing application to cut her video."
Well in Windows defense you get a bunch of free software such as 60-day trials for anti-virus programs that will provide you with continuous pop-up reminders until you buy, and 60-day trials of MS Office. And if it's an HP you get a list of about 20 boring games that you have to individually purchase to play and if you want to uninstall them, you have to do it one by one. Windows is also really user-friendly because they make sure you know what you are doing by popping up reminders that you must accept like 3 times before you can proceed... the screen even blacks out for a second to really make sure they got your attention (because you are probably already halfway asleep when you were waiting for whatever you clicked to load).
The Mac used to be unmatched for years... but Windows 7 is really going to give Apple a run for it's money. You Obviously have an extreme bias... the machine she picked up was really a decent machine and doesn't have the cost near to the Mac route (buying Final Cut Pro). I'm a filmmaker and have been using Macs for 8 years... but I've been very disappointed in the current direction of the company as of late. I wouldn't be so cocky about the superiority of macs... those days are gone.
Ok Ballimer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnairmedia
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
Not the "real" filmmakers I work with. You have a choice, and you've chosen PC, but you're trolling here. Both can be useful in their own ways. I find the mac superior, and so do most of the creative pros I work with, and that's our opinion and you have yours.
Comments
Interesting! So there is no worthwhile market for super expensive, ultra-thin BRDs that are slower than the fat, cheap tray loading drives found in your typical notebook? You'd think that if Apple didn't supply them that 3rd-parties would jump at the chance to sell these drives. You'd also think that more than one a single company with a single press release of these prototype drives would exist.
PS: It's common sense, not cleverness. You can't bitch about a device not be offered by a PC vendor when you can't even find a 3rd-party vendor that makes one.
Have you seen the PC laptops in these ads? They're all 1.5 to 2 inches thick. That's why the market for 9.5mm drives is so miniscule, unless someone like Apple is asking for one (which they haven't been, because they want you to spend all of your money at the iTunes Store). That said, there are 12.5mm drives available, and 1.3" laptops with Blu-Ray burners/players; maybe Apple should consider not making their laptops so thin they can't offer the same capabilities as their competitors.
From Best Buy (and we all know we can find better deals)
HP HDX 16: $1,149.99
Minuses: Screen size, DDR2.
Add: $110 for Sony Vegas/ACID for iLife like compatibility. Use Picassa and other free tools to replace iPhoto, iWeb. You can find free AV online too to protect yourself. AVG, Comodo, etc...
Total: $1260 (Add 150 for OS X if we wanted a hackintosh: $1410)
From Apple (and we all know that you can't find a better price that doesn't involve rebates)
MacBook Pro Basic: $2000
Pluses: Screen, DDR3, OS X.
Minus: $80 for iLife (to make comparable to Windows PCs with out that software)
Add: $30 for additional 2GB Ram upgrade. $90 for HDD upgrade to 500gb (assuming we do these upgrades ourselves)
Total: $2040
So yeah... I dunno. Remember, Macs and PCs use the exact same internals! Is your Apple really worth 700 dollars more? To me it isn't. $700 for a label and a sexy case. Keep in mind, I won't buy an HP either. If I were to buy a real laptop: Lenovo. Those are some durable machines!
http://blogs.digitalmediaonlineinc.c...erse/entry/529
LOL, sure you are.
A new version being released does not automatically mean it'll be anything significant. The evolution of the Final Cut Studio suite has gone from break-neck speeds to a slow crawl ever since Apple started being more interested in selling consumers movies instead of helping professionals make them.
Have you seen the PC laptops in these ads? They're all 1.5 to 2 inches thick.
Thank you for validating my point as to why BRDs are not possible or viable in Mac notebooks.
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
So then what are you using? Avid? Premier? Since you're a real film maker, I'm assuming you're involved in post production, in which case you will know that the only truth to all of this is to make sure that whatever you do is interoperable with other users who typically use Avid and Final Cut today.
If you're independent, then whatever you use doesn't matter. This PC vs Apple thing is nonsense and if you are successful using Windows Media Composer, then more power to you.
I met my wife twice before we "officially met." We took no notice of each other the first two times and only realized they existed when talking later, well into our relationship. But, after I became a Mac owner we met a third time and the rest is history.
Coincidence!? I think NOT!
Now THAT is a great pitch for an Apple commercial!!
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
And your probably the wanker who made Gigli!
Clearly this young lady didn't bother to read the most recent Consumer Reports before she went shopping. CR has a big article on buying a laptop computer. Apple MacBooks and MacBook Pros were #1 in every category and they were the only company that was Red (above average +) in reliablilty in every category.
If this were all legit, I wonder how many $1ks MS would have to give away before they actually found a "hunter" that actually bought a PC...?
That doesn't matter, it's all about the price, everything is irrelevant, we should make all decisions in life based on price.
You know, if Apple wants to respond to these ads in a meaningful way, how about they just stop skimping on features and shut them the hell up? Truth be told, it is ridiculous that their $2,000 "Pro" laptop doesn't come standard with 4GB of memory (piss on these ads however for ignoring the fact that it's only a $60 upgrade). How about Blu-Ray playback in a $1,500 laptop? Everyone else has it.
Everyone?
Alright, lets do a price point comparison.
[...]
So yeah... I dunno. Remember, Macs and PCs use the exact same internals! Is your Apple really worth 700 dollars more? To me it isn't. $700 for a label and a sexy case. Keep in mind, I won't buy an HP either. If I were to buy a real laptop: Lenovo. Those are some durable machines!
No, they don't. You didn't even account for the $150 price difference in the CPU, but why would you when they "use the exact same internals". The same company, Intel, designs the CPUs but since when does having the same company name on an item mean that they are same product. Then there are the component and R&D costs for the newer RAM and the extra shrinkage and consolidation, etc.
If you can even see that the CPU is a different clockspeeds (not even talking about the architecture, L2, FSB, etc.) you can't begin to make a fair comparison. However, you do represent the majority of people who buy computers.
PS: Lenovos are nice, but I recommend Asus to most people I know that want non-Mac notebooks. They make a solid machine that tends to get you more bang for your buck.
I registered just to respond to this. Are you serious?? NO ONE knows the difference between DDR2 and DDR3, except MAYBE people that post on boards like this. People plunk down $2000 for a computer all the time without knowing what is inside it other than asking "will it be fast enough for me."
You have serious delusions of the computer proficiency and tech savvy of the "average" user if you think they have any clue about the type of RAM in their computer.
-p-
So does that mean we shouldn't mention it is a point for the Mac?
With all this bashing of how much memory a 32-bit MS-Windows can access, does anyone have a good reference as to how much memory can be accessed by MacOS X 10.5?
From what I understand MacOS X 10.5 on a 64-bit processor is a 32-bit/64-bit hybrid: the OS is 64-bit, but any userland process is 32-bit. Can anyone elaborate?
check out this series of articles by Daniel Eran Dilger:
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...e_64_bits.html
About $549 (link) if you buy Sony Vegas directly from Sony's site (you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere. So... let's do a little price breakdown.
PC Route: According to Microsoft's site, the computer is $1049.99 = Software... $549.49= $1598.99 If I were her, I'd go to the 7 Beta and use that instead of Vista and then buy 7 once it's released (I've been testing 7 with Vegas after using OSX with Final Cut Pro) so assuming that the price of upgrading isn't going to move much between Vista and 7... $239.99 http://www.amazon.com/Windows-Vista-...dp_ob_title_sw. So her final price is $1838.98
Mac Route: $1999 for MacBook Pro + $1499 for Final Cut Studio (do not bring up that joke Final Cut Express... it does not handle all of the same codecs that Final Cut Pro and Sony Vegas can do.) = $3498.
Would you like to allaborate on the "add to price" that PCs bring? I've been an editor for about 8 years now on the OSX+Final Cut platform and I have now moved to the PC platform. I'm saving money and getting better turn around time in my business.
I'm a PC and I'm a video editor/filmmaker/Local TV producer.
Yay!
So it looks like you beat me to the punch on the price points before I went to a meeting. I was in the Apple arena in school for film using Final Cut. Now I am working on Avid on a PC, and I did the same when I worked for NBC. The industry is changing to the PC in terms of video editing because of price mainly, and 3rd party add-ons. Harris/Leitch video servers? Ross and Grass Valley video consoles... all hook into Avid. All on PCs from the studios I saw.
Actually, the coolest bit was when I was an editor, I could be rendering the clip while editing it at the same time, and on top of that, the video board could play the clip AS it was being rendered, not after. Sometimes I had edits that were done 30 seconds before they were aired. Hectic, but really cool for that down to the wire situations. I want to see Final Cut do that!
Business uses PC in the video/TV field.
Independent/Film uses Mac most of the time.
I registered just to respond to this. Are you serious?? NO ONE knows the difference between DDR2 and DDR3, except MAYBE people that post on boards like this. People plunk down $2000 for a computer all the time without knowing what is inside it other than asking "will it be fast enough for me."
You have serious delusions of the computer proficiency and tech savvy of the "average" user if you think they have any clue about the type of RAM in their computer.
-p-
Agreed. I sure didn't. People who post on boards like this (well the majority) are probably in the 1% or 2% most tech savvy. Then there's others like you and I.
I just like Macs. I am not into tech talk
The Mac used to be unmatched for years... but Windows 7 is really going to give Apple a run for it's money. You Obviously have an extreme bias... the machine she picked up was really a decent machine and doesn't have the cost near to the Mac route (buying Final Cut Pro). I'm a filmmaker and have been using Macs for 8 years... but I've been very disappointed in the current direction of the company as of late. I wouldn't be so cocky about the superiority of macs... those days are gone.
Just like Vista was supposed to give Apple a run for it's money?
That doesn't matter, it's all about the price, everything is irrelevant, we should make all decisions in life based on price.
I did that once, in my youth, with car insurance. Went to an underwriter who found me the cheapest option. It was so much lower than the All State I had started with and that my father told me to get. I finally was in an accident, not my fault but they didn't have insurance. Took over 6 months to get the car repaired as the insurance company had to send out a rep to okay new repairs for what couldn't be seen and they only did that once every week or two. They also tried so many ways to not pay the medical and car rental bills. To a point that it was stressful and anti-productive to fight with them. Years later, back with All State, a similar occurrence happened again. It was a simple process and well worth the extra money I was paying.
Well in Windows defense you get a bunch of free software such as 60-day trials for anti-virus programs that will provide you with continuous pop-up reminders until you buy, and 60-day trials of MS Office. And if it's an HP you get a list of about 20 boring games that you have to individually purchase to play and if you want to uninstall them, you have to do it one by one. Windows is also really user-friendly because they make sure you know what you are doing by popping up reminders that you must accept like 3 times before you can proceed... the screen even blacks out for a second to really make sure they got your attention (because you are probably already halfway asleep when you were waiting for whatever you clicked to load).
The Mac used to be unmatched for years... but Windows 7 is really going to give Apple a run for it's money. You Obviously have an extreme bias... the machine she picked up was really a decent machine and doesn't have the cost near to the Mac route (buying Final Cut Pro). I'm a filmmaker and have been using Macs for 8 years... but I've been very disappointed in the current direction of the company as of late. I wouldn't be so cocky about the superiority of macs... those days are gone.
Ok Ballimer.
I just want to comment on the first paragraph... in the ad she says that she is a filmmaker, filmmakers DO NOT use ANY of the consumer tools packaged with OSX. The fact comes to this: she will have to purchase a software package of some kind. Either Final Cut Studio ($1499) or something like Sony Vegas ($549). The "out of box" HD editing tools can't support a lot of the industry standards and the DVD authoring tools "out of box" on a mac is a JOKE! For the average latte sipping, hippy "filmmaker"... a Macbook will work for them. Most of us REAL filmmakers are moving back to the PC because Apple is not pushing anything forward on their platform (in terms of Final Cut Studio).
Not the "real" filmmakers I work with. You have a choice, and you've chosen PC, but you're trolling here. Both can be useful in their own ways. I find the mac superior, and so do most of the creative pros I work with, and that's our opinion and you have yours.