Maybe you missed the stories where he recuses himself of meetings when the iPhone comes up? And the stories where the Apple board was fine with his presence all along? They didn't force him away, he left on his own. If they thought he was a threat, they could have forced him to leave, which suggests to me that your paranoia in the case of the board seat is probably unfounded. That somehow you see something they didn't is unlikely.
I suspect, having some experience with company boards, that all was not well for some time, but that politics intervened.
I also suspect the concept that Google wasn't interested in having anything to do with phones was expressed by him more than once to the board, until that position became untenable.
I also wouldn't be surprised to find that he knew far more about Apple's plans than many think. The fact that he recused himself from meetings is almost irrelevant. At that level, he had other ways of finding out, and just speaking to board members in an informal way, information would slip out.
I believe that Google had all of this in mind a long while ago.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
No Google search, no Ad dollars flowing Google's way. The only real way Google makes money is through sponsored search, and Ads.
No search, no Google!
With Android, Google controls Ad space. That's why they bought AdMob out from Apple's offer, and why Apple bought the competition.
The difference is that Google bought them to get Ads for themselves, to make money from it. Apple bought theirs to get Ads for their developers, so that THEY could make some money from it (and perhaps Apple would get their 30% cut, thus paying for the service).
So yes, I do think he was abusing his position. I've seen it before.
Never buy the first revision of the product? Uh, this doesn't seem to be a product plagued by issues, it is plagued by accountability, which all of us expected would happen. You all act as if Android is still on version one, while this phone already is on 2.1, the first revision to 2.0
Hahaha, HTC said to one person regarding poor 3G coverage that the Nexus One doesn't support 3G LOL
Funny how a thread on Google's difficulties delivering satisfactory customer service on their first foray into consumer hardware turns into a thread on how dumb it was to buy a first gen iPhone.
Funny how a thread on Google's difficulties delivering satisfactory customer service on their first foray into consumer hardware turns into a thread on how dumb it was to buy a first gen iPhone.
You may have noticed that it's always the same people who try to hijack a thread about some other bad product, and try to find something bad about Apple instead, usually not very successfully. It's in their constitution. They just aren't happy about Apple's success.
I don't know why those people looking for Nexus One support can't just f*ing Google it. Although it's quite interesting what comes up:
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
You may have noticed that it's always the same people who try to hijack a thread about some other bad product, and try to find something bad about Apple instead, usually not very successfully. It's in their constitution. They just aren't happy about Apple's success.
There wasn't anything bad said about Apple. Being an early adopter had to do with the consumer. Also if you read my posts I stated several times my opinion was based on any technology including early adopters of the Nexus One.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
'Selective reading skills,' huh? Go back, take a look at post #9, and explain 'consumer surplus', a term that you have assiduously (oops, another big word, sorry!) avoided.
If you can't, I'll understand. It would, inconveniently, demolish pretty much everything else you've blathered about in this thread.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
Is this really bypassing the search engine? Using bookmarks might also be a way to bypass search, but really, once I know where a site is, I don't need to use Google for it, it a search wasn't needed for that use. Whether I use the NY Times app or their web site, I don't need Google's search to do that, either way, I already know where to find them. A search is only necessary to find new sources of information.
There wasn't anything bad said about Apple. Being an early adopter had to do with the consumer. Also if you read my posts I stated several times my opinion was based on any technology including early adopters of the Nexus One.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
What does people being willing to stand in line for an iPhone, or paying top dollar possibly knowing the price will inevitably come down, have to do with Google not having a robust customer service infrastructure in place?
This sounds a lot like my crappy 3Gs reception that Apple wont acknowledge. My wifes 3G reception is incredibly better than my 3Gs. I'm not defending Google, but Apple only recently came out from under the covers to acknowledge an issue with the 27inch iMacs too.
I don't know why those people looking for Nexus One support can't just f*ing Google it. Although it's quite interesting what comes up:
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
The thing about an entity like Google getting fastidious about "closed systems" is that their bread and butter technology that makes all their money is totally closed. Google doesn't open source or license their search algorithms, do they? Not eager to let lots of people get in on the ad income and join the party, either.
So they can well afford to come on like your buddy when it comes to devices and services, because the crown jewels are safely locked up. It would be like Apple releasing a totally open source search engine and getting all smug about how it proved they were the good guys.
Google is a fucking advertising monger and their groovy approach to hardware and services is entirely about driving hits. I think it's pretty important to bear that it mind, because it's quite literally true. Anything you purchase from Google is simply a means to an end, as far as they are concerned.
Whereas Apple, closed model and all, are looking to sell product on first order merits. It might seem like a distinction without a difference, but I can't help that the underlying corporate DNA is going to come home to roost, at some point.
Well everything that is new is expensive. Look at video game consoles. The XBox 360 was $499 at launch and now you can get a better one for $299, same goes for the PS3 at launch it was $699 (or 599 I can't remember) and now you can get a slimmer version for $299. It's technology.
Back to Google, they should have a better customer support, especially for a consumer electronic where most customers don't know how to run a computer properly. Maybe Google is taking the same stance with Android that they have with all their other software...BETA. That way you don't have to fully support it, its BETA. Geez, how long has GMAIL been stuck in BETA. I don't believe Chrome or Chrome OS will ever leave BETA.
- I just logged on to GMAIL though Safari, I noticed that it doesn't say BETA under GMAIL anymore, when did this happen, I usually just use GMAIL via Mail.app in OS X, my bad -
'Selective reading skills,' huh? Go back, take a look at post #9, and explain 'consumer surplus', a term that you have assiduously (oops, another big word, sorry!) avoided.
If you can't, I'll understand. It would, inconveniently, demolish pretty much everything else you've blathered about in this thread.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
This has nothing to do with the topic at hand, beyond your pathetic need to try and turn every thread into a conversation about the shortcomings of Apple, it's customers, or both. STFU.
Please make your point without being a jerk... regarding your little banter back and forth with "anantksundaram." You come off as an idiot, which I'll assume you are not... really just a mean idiot. So, as you can read, I don't think it's funny but at least anantksundaram is brushing you off with humor.
The thing about an entity like Google getting fastidious about "closed systems" is that their bread and butter technology that makes all their money is totally closed. Google doesn't open source or license their search algorithms, do they? Not eager to let lots of people get in on the ad income and join the party, either.
So they can well afford to come on like your buddy when it comes to devices and services, because the crown jewels are safely locked up. It would be like Apple releasing a totally open source search engine and getting all smug about how it proved they were the good guys.
Google is a fucking advertising monger and their groovy approach to hardware and services is entirely about driving hits. I think it's pretty important to bear that it mind, because it's quite literally true. Anything you purchase from Google is simply a means to an end, as far as they are concerned.
Whereas Apple, closed model and all, are looking to sell product on first order merits. It might seem like a distinction without a difference, but I can't help that the underlying corporate DNA is going to come home to roost, at some point.
That's a very good post. You're right about all that. Perhaps Apple will make a search engine to rival Google with their data center acquisition and maps + admob purchase. The problem with being too open is that the people who so desperately want to exploit it are spammers and they would try to find loopholes in any open algorithms and could invade privacy.
It's tough to know the right way to do things so that it has the most benefit:
Open source OS like Android means open development, low cost, flexibility, competition driving prices down for consumers but it fragments support - not all android apps run on all android devices and what we have here with multiple manufacturers passing the buck - and competition can lower prices to the point of there being little to no profit.
Open search means businesses don't feel that one company has got a significant level of control over possibly their main revenue stream, which is good but it will also mean it gets exploited by spammers and people who don't deserve high rankings, which can affect legitimate businesses even worse.
I think the most important thing is to always feel in control as a consumer. Google's method makes me feel better as a consumer. Open network provider choices, open software market yet still a good phone. Closed search still lets me find what I want even though the amounts of ads everywhere online now is irritating.
With open source search, there would probably still be ads to support the traffic so not much benefit. With Apple's business model, the consumer is restricted to chosen networks and permitted apps, supported media formats etc. That makes me feel constrained as a consumer.
I don't like spending £700+ for a device and expect to have to pay Apple £60 per year to toy around with it for development and be locked to one carrier when others are cheaper. I don't like not being able to install apps I want on that device like filesystem browsers and use the device for portable storage or sync it with both work and home computers.
It's still very true though that the Nexus One is just an example of being open in one area while protecting the main revenue from a closed system somewhere else, which is the same business model as Apple (open source webkit etc). Companies like Microsoft have ridiculed Apple for that business model saying it can't last but that has to apply to even their own business model. I guess only time will tell.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
At this point, your just been nasty, no education or point of view is left in your posts in this thread. You are now just been a throughly bad person.
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
Not so much fools. Without these folks, the 2nd round would never come out. Sure, we take a risk, and sometimes lose out with a crap product, but on the whole it works. I think that just blanket attacking early adopters is rude on your part. We buy the first rev because we choose to.
Comments
Maybe you missed the stories where he recuses himself of meetings when the iPhone comes up? And the stories where the Apple board was fine with his presence all along? They didn't force him away, he left on his own. If they thought he was a threat, they could have forced him to leave, which suggests to me that your paranoia in the case of the board seat is probably unfounded. That somehow you see something they didn't is unlikely.
I suspect, having some experience with company boards, that all was not well for some time, but that politics intervened.
I also suspect the concept that Google wasn't interested in having anything to do with phones was expressed by him more than once to the board, until that position became untenable.
I also wouldn't be surprised to find that he knew far more about Apple's plans than many think. The fact that he recused himself from meetings is almost irrelevant. At that level, he had other ways of finding out, and just speaking to board members in an informal way, information would slip out.
I believe that Google had all of this in mind a long while ago.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
No Google search, no Ad dollars flowing Google's way. The only real way Google makes money is through sponsored search, and Ads.
No search, no Google!
With Android, Google controls Ad space. That's why they bought AdMob out from Apple's offer, and why Apple bought the competition.
The difference is that Google bought them to get Ads for themselves, to make money from it. Apple bought theirs to get Ads for their developers, so that THEY could make some money from it (and perhaps Apple would get their 30% cut, thus paying for the service).
So yes, I do think he was abusing his position. I've seen it before.
are you trying to fill the vacant TECHSTUD job ??
Try the ignore function, it works great for me and for times you don't feel like killing/feeding trolls.
Hahaha, HTC said to one person regarding poor 3G coverage that the Nexus One doesn't support 3G LOL
Funny how a thread on Google's difficulties delivering satisfactory customer service on their first foray into consumer hardware turns into a thread on how dumb it was to buy a first gen iPhone.
You may have noticed that it's always the same people who try to hijack a thread about some other bad product, and try to find something bad about Apple instead, usually not very successfully. It's in their constitution. They just aren't happy about Apple's success.
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
You may have noticed that it's always the same people who try to hijack a thread about some other bad product, and try to find something bad about Apple instead, usually not very successfully. It's in their constitution. They just aren't happy about Apple's success.
There wasn't anything bad said about Apple. Being an early adopter had to do with the consumer. Also if you read my posts I stated several times my opinion was based on any technology including early adopters of the Nexus One.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
'Selective reading skills,' huh? Go back, take a look at post #9, and explain 'consumer surplus', a term that you have assiduously (oops, another big word, sorry!) avoided.
If you can't, I'll understand. It would, inconveniently, demolish pretty much everything else you've blathered about in this thread.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
Is this really bypassing the search engine? Using bookmarks might also be a way to bypass search, but really, once I know where a site is, I don't need to use Google for it, it a search wasn't needed for that use. Whether I use the NY Times app or their web site, I don't need Google's search to do that, either way, I already know where to find them. A search is only necessary to find new sources of information.
There wasn't anything bad said about Apple. Being an early adopter had to do with the consumer. Also if you read my posts I stated several times my opinion was based on any technology including early adopters of the Nexus One.
Its kind of interesting how so many here have selective reading skills.
What does people being willing to stand in line for an iPhone, or paying top dollar possibly knowing the price will inevitably come down, have to do with Google not having a robust customer service infrastructure in place?
I don't know why those people looking for Nexus One support can't just f*ing Google it. Although it's quite interesting what comes up:
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
The thing about an entity like Google getting fastidious about "closed systems" is that their bread and butter technology that makes all their money is totally closed. Google doesn't open source or license their search algorithms, do they? Not eager to let lots of people get in on the ad income and join the party, either.
So they can well afford to come on like your buddy when it comes to devices and services, because the crown jewels are safely locked up. It would be like Apple releasing a totally open source search engine and getting all smug about how it proved they were the good guys.
Google is a fucking advertising monger and their groovy approach to hardware and services is entirely about driving hits. I think it's pretty important to bear that it mind, because it's quite literally true. Anything you purchase from Google is simply a means to an end, as far as they are concerned.
Whereas Apple, closed model and all, are looking to sell product on first order merits. It might seem like a distinction without a difference, but I can't help that the underlying corporate DNA is going to come home to roost, at some point.
Back to Google, they should have a better customer support, especially for a consumer electronic where most customers don't know how to run a computer properly. Maybe Google is taking the same stance with Android that they have with all their other software...BETA. That way you don't have to fully support it, its BETA. Geez, how long has GMAIL been stuck in BETA. I don't believe Chrome or Chrome OS will ever leave BETA.
- I just logged on to GMAIL though Safari, I noticed that it doesn't say BETA under GMAIL anymore, when did this happen, I usually just use GMAIL via Mail.app in OS X, my bad -
'Selective reading skills,' huh? Go back, take a look at post #9, and explain 'consumer surplus', a term that you have assiduously (oops, another big word, sorry!) avoided.
If you can't, I'll understand. It would, inconveniently, demolish pretty much everything else you've blathered about in this thread.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
This has nothing to do with the topic at hand, beyond your pathetic need to try and turn every thread into a conversation about the shortcomings of Apple, it's customers, or both. STFU.
bla bla bla.
so instead of providing necessary support to the customers, el goog resorts to trolling around. well, this is not new to me.
and all of this is while the google search itself shows this,
boy, it's fun to watch.
everyone back on the topic please.
.
Please make your point without being a jerk... regarding your little banter back and forth with "anantksundaram." You come off as an idiot, which I'll assume you are not... really just a mean idiot. So, as you can read, I don't think it's funny but at least anantksundaram is brushing you off with humor.
The thing about an entity like Google getting fastidious about "closed systems" is that their bread and butter technology that makes all their money is totally closed. Google doesn't open source or license their search algorithms, do they? Not eager to let lots of people get in on the ad income and join the party, either.
So they can well afford to come on like your buddy when it comes to devices and services, because the crown jewels are safely locked up. It would be like Apple releasing a totally open source search engine and getting all smug about how it proved they were the good guys.
Google is a fucking advertising monger and their groovy approach to hardware and services is entirely about driving hits. I think it's pretty important to bear that it mind, because it's quite literally true. Anything you purchase from Google is simply a means to an end, as far as they are concerned.
Whereas Apple, closed model and all, are looking to sell product on first order merits. It might seem like a distinction without a difference, but I can't help that the underlying corporate DNA is going to come home to roost, at some point.
That's a very good post. You're right about all that. Perhaps Apple will make a search engine to rival Google with their data center acquisition and maps + admob purchase. The problem with being too open is that the people who so desperately want to exploit it are spammers and they would try to find loopholes in any open algorithms and could invade privacy.
It's tough to know the right way to do things so that it has the most benefit:
Open source OS like Android means open development, low cost, flexibility, competition driving prices down for consumers but it fragments support - not all android apps run on all android devices and what we have here with multiple manufacturers passing the buck - and competition can lower prices to the point of there being little to no profit.
Open search means businesses don't feel that one company has got a significant level of control over possibly their main revenue stream, which is good but it will also mean it gets exploited by spammers and people who don't deserve high rankings, which can affect legitimate businesses even worse.
I think the most important thing is to always feel in control as a consumer. Google's method makes me feel better as a consumer. Open network provider choices, open software market yet still a good phone. Closed search still lets me find what I want even though the amounts of ads everywhere online now is irritating.
With open source search, there would probably still be ads to support the traffic so not much benefit. With Apple's business model, the consumer is restricted to chosen networks and permitted apps, supported media formats etc. That makes me feel constrained as a consumer.
I don't like spending £700+ for a device and expect to have to pay Apple £60 per year to toy around with it for development and be locked to one carrier when others are cheaper. I don't like not being able to install apps I want on that device like filesystem browsers and use the device for portable storage or sync it with both work and home computers.
It's still very true though that the Nexus One is just an example of being open in one area while protecting the main revenue from a closed system somewhere else, which is the same business model as Apple (open source webkit etc). Companies like Microsoft have ridiculed Apple for that business model saying it can't last but that has to apply to even their own business model. I guess only time will tell.
Attempting to use big words still doesn't make you any less of a twit for standing in line to buy a new product and overpaying for it. Then getting a rebate and having to give it back to Apple.....
However I do understand the system needs fools like you so the rest of us can benefit.
If you give us your address I am sure all the educated consumers would like to send you a thank you note seeing your purchase allowed them to buy their 3Gs for 199.00.
Hey look at it this way you may have paid an extra 300.00 but you but at least got alot less for it.
At this point, your just been nasty, no education or point of view is left in your posts in this thread. You are now just been a throughly bad person.
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
Not so much fools. Without these folks, the 2nd round would never come out. Sure, we take a risk, and sometimes lose out with a crap product, but on the whole it works. I think that just blanket attacking early adopters is rude on your part. We buy the first rev because we choose to.