There seems to me to be two kind of innovation. Incremental - gradually improving on existing solutions, and paradigmatic - fundamentally changing the rules of the game. Apple is no better than the rest of the pack at the first - or are they (i will return to that), but they shure are ahead of them at the latter. Every few years, Appel changes the rules of the game, and every one else plays catchup. So when you and others say that Apple needs competion in order to innovate, you are really saying (or so I understand it) that they should follow the others in incremental innovation.
And true, once Apple has introduced a new paradigm, the stubornly - and rather conservatively, stick to it. But is that so bad? Consumers appear to think it is not! (a few poster here seem to think that is beacuse they are all being fooled - by the millions, year after year ... speaks for itself I guess). Apples conservative minnimalism and theire insistence on not doing anything they cant do really, really well can indeed be frustrating sometimes. But gennerally (with the occasional cockup), I believe we end up with an overall better product because of it. So, I hope Apple keeps its cool - as they usually do - and avoid the race to pile technology on tehcnology and functionality on functionality where it really dosen´t make any great practical difference and does not improve the product in any significant way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin
I don't know why those people looking for Nexus One support can't just f*ing Google it. Although it's quite interesting what comes up:
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
I don't think it's limited to technology. Manufacturers can only do so much testing, the rest is done by us. Technology prices go up and down, the fact Apple gave original iPhone purchasers $100 dollars back was good PR.
The early adopters weren't actually entitled to anything other than the freedom to take their business elsewhere in future. That clearly hasn't happened judging by iPhone sales now has it?
What do you expect from a company who launches online applications used by millions as Betas and keeps them Betas for years? Google does have some experience with hardware though - but it's all in server appliances for enterprise. They deal with corporate IT people, not man-on-the-street who can barely set the clock on his microwave.
I've read your posts over some weeks now and I'm worried about you kid. You really mustn't skip taking the tablets.
Clearly your mum was an early adopter too and clearly she has paid the price for that but (hey!) she stuck with you nevertheless even though there was no compensatory rebate. Kudos to her.
Fool of a fool.
But wait. I am the embodiment of kindness, after all, so here is a beginner's lesson....just for little old you. Learn it well my bozo.
Now repeat slowly after me........
Early adopters are the ones who take the risks and breathe life into innovation.
Without innovation, there is no progress.
Therefore early adopters are the champions, the sponsors, of all progress.
In brief therefore: No early adopters= No, or very slow, progress.
Write it down. Put the paper in your mouth. Chew slowly. Swallow. Digest it well.
Now go stand facing the corner and do ten reps of this axiom by yourself.
Repeat daily for a month.
Anyone with a brain knows that if you want valuable, innovative products, you go where you can find that and you buy, buy, buy. NO hesitation baby! There is risk in everything, just as in your case my little bozo, and early adopters know that. That's why you survived the slops bucket to vent your bitter loser spleen so often here. The point is, unlike you, most thinking people take the risk knowing that, with the right company, they will never be intentionally short-changed. If their purchase is slightly flawed in its first iteration, they will be listened to and a correction will be made. Any company is free to revise its specs or prices without prior notice. I guess that bothers you because you can't stand that. It makes you feel so powerless and weak, boo hoo, mommeee. But guess what? It's true in your case. You ARE powerless and impotently weak. That is the only thing that comes through so strong and clear in your posts. The ONLY thing mind you. I guess you never realised that. The problem isn't WHAT you say my little bozo, but WHY you say what you do.
But it doesn't have to be that way you know. You see, Steve Jobs knows a bozo when he sees one and he is a good man and so the folks at Apple love you too and made sure there's an app for your condition. Errr WTF is it called now? Hmmm. Oh yeah, it's called 'Get a life sucker.' I think it's free for people like you, with TIBS..... That's Terminal Impotence Bitterness Syndrome but hey, why am I telling you that? You knew that already. Eeesh!
I can think of no other company which, having decided to lower its prices so significantly, so soon after a new product release, also gives enough of a damn to lessen any feeling of buyer's remorse among its customers by swiftly offering a gift in recompense. No one asked for or even expected that, my little bozo. There was no commercial reason to do it either. What would have been better IYO my little bozo? Perhaps you would have liked them to go on charging the old, higher, price for as long as they thought they could get away with it? I mean, who (outside Apple) knew it was over-priced? No one. So you got the wrong company dummy. That is why you are my little bozo. You're good at getting things bass-ackwards. You see, your loser friends at MS and GOOG would have cheerfully done that to you and just laughed at their shit on your face and moved on without a thought for your feelings. Hilarious really and you would deserve that. Hilarious really and you would enjoy that too. Hilarious. Just like your TIBS values and principles.
Now do what you do best. Go away and play with yourself whydontcha? You know it's the only thing that makes you feel better nowadays.
Fool of a fool. Really.
It's a kindness I am doing to you, telling you that. I'm giving you pearls here kid. Because there is a cure at the App Store. But you have to take that first step es. On your ownsome es. No one can do that but you my little bozo. I know you find it scary but you gotta try to fix that screwed up UI of yours.
You'll feel better. Promise.
You can dump the tablets afterwards. Promise.
You'll even smile sometimes. Promise.
So do it. You never know. You could even grow some of your own and become........a contender.
Oh boy. Imagine that.
As you can see, I have spent some time trying to help you. But only you can go to the App Store and start to feel better.
I emerged cause besides Quadra I'm the only other Apple evangelist in these forums and I'm proud of that.
To give you some little insight about how much I love apple.
When I create a document in iWork, I NEVER SEND IT TO A NON MAC USER IN A WORD FORMAT, I will send it in PDF or RTF before my cursor even hovers over that sorry excuse for a word processor.
In the past when I went to a site that required IE or Firefox, I simply wrote the site off and decided to find other means to get work done.
If it's not owned by Apple, I don't want it near me in my Apple enviornment.
With the exception of Adobe (but if Aperture X, Gives a better alternative to Adobe, then I will be glad to kiss that POC adobe good bye)
I'm probably more die hard Apple then Quadra now that I think of it. Though he is a Apple Cultist... I put God/jesus first and then Steve Jobs/Apple
I suspect, having some experience with company boards, that all was not well for some time, but that politics intervened.
I also suspect the concept that Google wasn't interested in having anything to do with phones was expressed by him more than once to the board, until that position became untenable.
I also wouldn't be surprised to find that he knew far more about Apple's plans than many think. The fact that he recused himself from meetings is almost irrelevant. At that level, he had other ways of finding out, and just speaking to board members in an informal way, information would slip out.
I believe that Google had all of this in mind a long while ago.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
No Google search, no Ad dollars flowing Google's way. The only real way Google makes money is through sponsored search, and Ads.
No search, no Google!
With Android, Google controls Ad space. That's why they bought AdMob out from Apple's offer, and why Apple bought the competition.
The difference is that Google bought them to get Ads for themselves, to make money from it. Apple bought theirs to get Ads for their developers, so that THEY could make some money from it (and perhaps Apple would get their 30% cut, thus paying for the service).
So yes, I do think he was abusing his position. I've seen it before.
That's a very good post. You're right about all that. Perhaps Apple will make a search engine to rival Google with their data center acquisition and maps + admob purchase. The problem with being too open is that the people who so desperately want to exploit it are spammers and they would try to find loopholes in any open algorithms and could invade privacy.
It's tough to know the right way to do things so that it has the most benefit:
Open source OS like Android means open development, low cost, flexibility, competition driving prices down for consumers but it fragments support - not all android apps run on all android devices and what we have here with multiple manufacturers passing the buck - and competition can lower prices to the point of there being little to no profit.
Open search means businesses don't feel that one company has got a significant level of control over possibly their main revenue stream, which is good but it will also mean it gets exploited by spammers and people who don't deserve high rankings, which can affect legitimate businesses even worse.
I think the most important thing is to always feel in control as a consumer. Google's method makes me feel better as a consumer. Open network provider choices, open software market yet still a good phone. Closed search still lets me find what I want even though the amounts of ads everywhere online now is irritating.
With open source search, there would probably still be ads to support the traffic so not much benefit. With Apple's business model, the consumer is restricted to chosen networks and permitted apps, supported media formats etc. That makes me feel constrained as a consumer.
I don't like spending £700+ for a device and expect to have to pay Apple £60 per year to toy around with it for development and be locked to one carrier when others are cheaper. I don't like not being able to install apps I want on that device like filesystem browsers and use the device for portable storage or sync it with both work and home computers.
It's still very true though that the Nexus One is just an example of being open in one area while protecting the main revenue from a closed system somewhere else, which is the same business model as Apple (open source webkit etc). Companies like Microsoft have ridiculed Apple for that business model saying it can't last but that has to apply to even their own business model. I guess only time will tell.
maybe apple will out souse a basic bare bones search engine
you speak of un faitness om the search market place .
well i run my biz of selling gemstones and i am crushed by liars spammers and large companies taking up the top 5 spots with false promised ads
ebay is the same story
it is a jungle out there
i still have still cheaper better cut gems than most
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
Welcome to the real world. The fact is tomorrow products are always better than todays products whether they are 1st generation or not. Next July when Apple releases the 4th generation iPhone you will say that those who bought the 3GS are fools because they didn't wait for the 4th generation, which we all know will offer at least more capacity and faster speeds for the same price.
If you are going to hold off buying because you are worried that something better and possibly cheaper will come out in the future then you will never buy a thing in your life. People who bought the first iPhone, including myself, bought it because it was the best smartphone at that time and did what we wanted and more. By the way, Edge might seem slow now (3 years later) but so will 3G when 4G starts rolling out.
I guess you think that those who bought a Mac a year ago are fools because they didn't wait until now to buy the newer ones with better specs for the same price or maybe those who bought their cars few years back didn't wait until now for better looking cars with improved performance and safety
I don't believe but its true and at least this is something they developed and not stole code from (hint Word)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
If you don't want it, you don't have to use it. How do you know that Steve doesn't want it, anyway? I highly doubt you know much about what Mr. Jobs wants, judging by your tacky rainbow signature, I doubt you're channeling him very well.
Apple could have made their own rendering engine and made it proprietary rather than collaborate publicly. Instead, they used an open source browser. I recall Google made a Javascript engine for their own browser, and other things that other browsers didn't do yet. Which is part of the idea of the open source ideal, building on existing work rather than reinvent the entire wheel every time.
The reason why Steve doesn't really like chrome is because it doesn't integrate well with OS X. Safari is a Cocoa written Application also thats why it runs GREAT on the Mac. Along with that, Apple can tailor the app accordingly (Thats why having a well intergraded Apple ecosystem benefits users and Pros IMO)
Look Google will be perfectly okay if it sticks to its game plan which is to become dominant on the Windows Platform. Don't step on this cats (meaning Apple's OS X names) territory or you'll get bit. It's nice for people like yourself or others who want to hop on the "chrome is going to be way better then safari, yada yada yada " bandwagon, that's okay. End the end you'll be back on Apple and Steves feet giving them credit again and praising safari.
Also Steve is a business man, he won't publicly say what I said, but behind close doors or with close friends, I'm sure we share the same view.
Oh and BTW the remark about my signature was pretty low, coming from a "moderator"
I expect such comments from a member not a moderator.
When launching the iPhone, Apple staunchly insisted that AT&T and other carrier partners allow it to handle much of the customer support itself, which helped to head off the problem of users being passed back and forth between the hardware vendor, the carrier, and the software developer.
Google is going to learn a lesson in customer service over this one.
If you brand something as yours, expect to shell out the big bucks for a call center and don't expect people to surf the web to fix the phone they just bought from you!
Sure they can had it over to the carrier or HTC or whoever isn't Google, but if the device has Google's name on it, as a consumer, the expectation is Google will support it.
BUT, nobody ever accused Google of trying to enter the consumer market with this device. Everyone already knew this device was for for hardcore geeks who look at specs as opposed to a whole experience. So the geeks got their phone, and now the consumers have learned not to trust Google until they can get their act up to speed and give a damn about the consumer - who is usually stupid when compared to a geek.
Lesson learned, Google. Now go out there and hire some phone support people!
I don't believe but its true and at least this is something they developed and not stole code from (hint Word)
The reason why Steve doesn't really like chrome is because it doesn't integrate well with OS X. Safari is a Cocoa written Application also thats why it runs GREAT on the Mac. Along with that, Apple can tailor the app accordingly (Thats why having a well intergraded Apple ecosystem benefits users and Pros IMO)
Look Google will be perfectly okay if it sticks to its game plan which is to become dominant on the Windows Platform. Don't step on this cats (meaning Apple's OS X names) territory or you'll get bit. It's nice for people like yourself or others who want to hop on the "chrome is going to be way better then safari, yada yada yada " bandwagon, that's okay. End the end you'll be back on Apple and Steves feet giving them credit again and praising safari.
Also Steve is a business man, he won't publicly say what I said, but behind close doors or with close friends, I'm sure we share the same view.
Oh and BTW the remark about my signature was pretty low, coming from a "moderator"
I expect such comments from a member not a moderator.
1. Who the hell are these people who already bought the stupid Google Phone? (GEEKS)
2. How are these (GEEKS) not able to use the damn thing?
3. Who needs/wants phone support in 2010? IMO, Expecting someone over the phone to solve your problems immediately is arrogant and archaic. You're not important just because you had $179 in your checking account before opening up Google.com the other day.
They're actually trying to sell a phone with email support only? That beggars belief.
I applaud it. Every whiney pissant American that need support yesterday who will sit on hold longer than it would take to search for their answers, should be a taught their place.
Customer Service, or what is has become today, is an absolute joke. And Customer Service practices of Fortune 500 companies are Anti-Competitive practices.
This is what companies like Amazon and other large online retailers have bred:
"Hello, this is customer service."
"Waaa!!!"
"Would you like a refund and few extra things for free?"
"Waaaa!!!!!!!!!"
"Well we're trying but the soonest we can get it there would be yesterday."
"Waaaaaaaaaa!!!"
"Thank you very much for your business, is there anything else I can give you today?"
I read it. I just didn't want to call you foolish for standing in line to pay an extra 200.00 only to get 50% of your money back. Which really isn't 50% because you had to give it back to Apple anyways. Hope your money management skills have improved since then.
You seem to think that anyone who doesn't always wait for something to become cheaper is a fool who needs his meds checked.
But tech prices are always coming down, ALWAYS. You can ALWAYS wait for prices to come down.
The time you get to spend actually USING the device while others are waiting for the price drop is actually worth something to some people. It sure was to me.
And you know what? EDGE is a lot faster than NO internet, as a friend of mine said.
Enjoy waiting for things to be cheaper. I'll enjoy using tech I love.
Also, a personal question extremeskater -- you seem really upset about this, and your coming across as a real jerk in your comments. What's up with that?
Welcome to the real world. The fact is tomorrow products are always better than todays products whether they are 1st generation or not. Next July when Apple releases the 4th generation iPhone you will say that those who bought the 3GS are fools because they didn't wait for the 4th generation, which we all know will offer at least more capacity and faster speeds for the same price.
If you are going to hold off buying because you are worried that something better and possibly cheaper will come out in the future then you will never buy a thing in your life. People who bought the first iPhone, including myself, bought it because it was the best smartphone at that time and did what we wanted and more. By the way, Edge might seem slow now (3 years later) but so will 3G when 4G starts rolling out.
I guess you think that those who bought a Mac a year ago are fools because they didn't wait until now to buy the newer ones with better specs for the same price or maybe those who bought their cars few years back didn't wait until now for better looking cars with improved performance and safety
Its sad I have to keep explaining this very simple concept. There is a big difference between being a first adopter and waiting forever to buy something or never buying it at all.
I would go into more detail but I think I have already done that enough in this thread. If you don't get it by now you never will.
Comments
Did you know RTF was invented by Microsoft?
OMG! We haven't seen any posts from MobileMe since the above reply... he didn't go and jump the nearest bridge, did he?
If I'm not mistaken... you (ASCII) could be liable for his death... considering the US Judicial way of seeing things... or?
And true, once Apple has introduced a new paradigm, the stubornly - and rather conservatively, stick to it. But is that so bad? Consumers appear to think it is not! (a few poster here seem to think that is beacuse they are all being fooled - by the millions, year after year ... speaks for itself I guess). Apples conservative minnimalism and theire insistence on not doing anything they cant do really, really well can indeed be frustrating sometimes. But gennerally (with the occasional cockup), I believe we end up with an overall better product because of it. So, I hope Apple keeps its cool - as they usually do - and avoid the race to pile technology on tehcnology and functionality on functionality where it really dosen´t make any great practical difference and does not improve the product in any significant way.
I don't know why those people looking for Nexus One support can't just f*ing Google it. Although it's quite interesting what comes up:
I actually don't have much desire to see Google fail over this. I think Apple did want to partner with Google on the iPhone and Jobs said something to this effect during a keynote. But, not everyone likes Apple's business model - having a closed app store with apps that only run on one device, having the phone locked to one carrier and that device not supporting everything they need.
The only way Apple will step up and improve these things for the consumer is if they face stiff competition. The Android store is building very quickly and the Nexus One hardware is pretty good. Google is also a large brand people recognize and with billions of hits a day, they have a platform to sell their phone in huge numbers. That's a pretty good incentive for Apple to step up.
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
I don't think it's limited to technology. Manufacturers can only do so much testing, the rest is done by us. Technology prices go up and down, the fact Apple gave original iPhone purchasers $100 dollars back was good PR.
The early adopters weren't actually entitled to anything other than the freedom to take their business elsewhere in future. That clearly hasn't happened judging by iPhone sales now has it?
I've read your posts over some weeks now and I'm worried about you kid. You really mustn't skip taking the tablets.
Clearly your mum was an early adopter too and clearly she has paid the price for that but (hey!) she stuck with you nevertheless even though there was no compensatory rebate. Kudos to her.
Fool of a fool.
But wait. I am the embodiment of kindness, after all, so here is a beginner's lesson....just for little old you. Learn it well my bozo.
Now repeat slowly after me........
Early adopters are the ones who take the risks and breathe life into innovation.
Without innovation, there is no progress.
Therefore early adopters are the champions, the sponsors, of all progress.
In brief therefore: No early adopters= No, or very slow, progress.
Write it down. Put the paper in your mouth. Chew slowly. Swallow. Digest it well.
Now go stand facing the corner and do ten reps of this axiom by yourself.
Repeat daily for a month.
Anyone with a brain knows that if you want valuable, innovative products, you go where you can find that and you buy, buy, buy. NO hesitation baby! There is risk in everything, just as in your case my little bozo, and early adopters know that. That's why you survived the slops bucket to vent your bitter loser spleen so often here. The point is, unlike you, most thinking people take the risk knowing that, with the right company, they will never be intentionally short-changed. If their purchase is slightly flawed in its first iteration, they will be listened to and a correction will be made. Any company is free to revise its specs or prices without prior notice. I guess that bothers you because you can't stand that. It makes you feel so powerless and weak, boo hoo, mommeee. But guess what? It's true in your case. You ARE powerless and impotently weak. That is the only thing that comes through so strong and clear in your posts. The ONLY thing mind you. I guess you never realised that. The problem isn't WHAT you say my little bozo, but WHY you say what you do.
But it doesn't have to be that way you know. You see, Steve Jobs knows a bozo when he sees one and he is a good man and so the folks at Apple love you too and made sure there's an app for your condition. Errr WTF is it called now? Hmmm. Oh yeah, it's called 'Get a life sucker.' I think it's free for people like you, with TIBS..... That's Terminal Impotence Bitterness Syndrome but hey, why am I telling you that? You knew that already. Eeesh!
I can think of no other company which, having decided to lower its prices so significantly, so soon after a new product release, also gives enough of a damn to lessen any feeling of buyer's remorse among its customers by swiftly offering a gift in recompense. No one asked for or even expected that, my little bozo. There was no commercial reason to do it either. What would have been better IYO my little bozo? Perhaps you would have liked them to go on charging the old, higher, price for as long as they thought they could get away with it? I mean, who (outside Apple) knew it was over-priced? No one. So you got the wrong company dummy. That is why you are my little bozo. You're good at getting things bass-ackwards. You see, your loser friends at MS and GOOG would have cheerfully done that to you and just laughed at their shit on your face and moved on without a thought for your feelings. Hilarious really and you would deserve that. Hilarious really and you would enjoy that too. Hilarious. Just like your TIBS values and principles.
Now do what you do best. Go away and play with yourself whydontcha? You know it's the only thing that makes you feel better nowadays.
Fool of a fool. Really.
It's a kindness I am doing to you, telling you that. I'm giving you pearls here kid. Because there is a cure at the App Store. But you have to take that first step es. On your ownsome es. No one can do that but you my little bozo. I know you find it scary but you gotta try to fix that screwed up UI of yours.
You'll feel better. Promise.
You can dump the tablets afterwards. Promise.
You'll even smile sometimes. Promise.
So do it. You never know. You could even grow some of your own and become........a contender.
Oh boy. Imagine that.
As you can see, I have spent some time trying to help you. But only you can go to the App Store and start to feel better.
ChandraC
Chandra C
I emerged cause besides Quadra I'm the only other Apple evangelist in these forums and I'm proud of that.
To give you some little insight about how much I love apple.
When I create a document in iWork, I NEVER SEND IT TO A NON MAC USER IN A WORD FORMAT, I will send it in PDF or RTF before my cursor even hovers over that sorry excuse for a word processor.
In the past when I went to a site that required IE or Firefox, I simply wrote the site off and decided to find other means to get work done.
If it's not owned by Apple, I don't want it near me in my Apple enviornment.
With the exception of Adobe (but if Aperture X, Gives a better alternative to Adobe, then I will be glad to kiss that POC adobe good bye)
I'm probably more die hard Apple then Quadra now that I think of it. Though he is a Apple Cultist... I put God/jesus first and then Steve Jobs/Apple
dude i also stand with you
no msft code in my macs
zippo
But YOU become the sucker.
Aren't you and he quick enough to understand the implications of what you've said? Its a self fulfilling prophecy.
If people don't buy the product just because it's a first gen model, how can you tell if it's good? You can't, because no one's bought it.
When it goes from the market, it's not because it was bad, but because it didn't sell, due to a misconceived concept of no one buying the first model.
Ridiculous!
times have changed ole gtan poo bah
these days pro0ducts like the cracked screen PRE are rushed to market
making early buyers at great risk of being f..ed . the 3 rd cycle is 60 percent cheaper and works 3x better
in the past it was only S W that was a risk to use at the start ,
I suspect, having some experience with company boards, that all was not well for some time, but that politics intervened.
I also suspect the concept that Google wasn't interested in having anything to do with phones was expressed by him more than once to the board, until that position became untenable.
I also wouldn't be surprised to find that he knew far more about Apple's plans than many think. The fact that he recused himself from meetings is almost irrelevant. At that level, he had other ways of finding out, and just speaking to board members in an informal way, information would slip out.
I believe that Google had all of this in mind a long while ago.
As soon as it became obvious that people were bypassing Google's search engine on their iPhones and Touches, and getting information directly through their apps, Google became worried. The handwriting was on the wall.
No Google search, no Ad dollars flowing Google's way. The only real way Google makes money is through sponsored search, and Ads.
No search, no Google!
With Android, Google controls Ad space. That's why they bought AdMob out from Apple's offer, and why Apple bought the competition.
The difference is that Google bought them to get Ads for themselves, to make money from it. Apple bought theirs to get Ads for their developers, so that THEY could make some money from it (and perhaps Apple would get their 30% cut, thus paying for the service).
So yes, I do think he was abusing his position. I've seen it before.
welcome back dude
great insight
you was sorley missed here
9
Try the ignore function, it works great for me and for times you don't feel like killing/feeding trolls.
oddly enough i think he truly thinks he is right in his mac tripper like spouts
i mean if i say black he says white
weird
happy new year
That's a very good post. You're right about all that. Perhaps Apple will make a search engine to rival Google with their data center acquisition and maps + admob purchase. The problem with being too open is that the people who so desperately want to exploit it are spammers and they would try to find loopholes in any open algorithms and could invade privacy.
It's tough to know the right way to do things so that it has the most benefit:
Open source OS like Android means open development, low cost, flexibility, competition driving prices down for consumers but it fragments support - not all android apps run on all android devices and what we have here with multiple manufacturers passing the buck - and competition can lower prices to the point of there being little to no profit.
Open search means businesses don't feel that one company has got a significant level of control over possibly their main revenue stream, which is good but it will also mean it gets exploited by spammers and people who don't deserve high rankings, which can affect legitimate businesses even worse.
I think the most important thing is to always feel in control as a consumer. Google's method makes me feel better as a consumer. Open network provider choices, open software market yet still a good phone. Closed search still lets me find what I want even though the amounts of ads everywhere online now is irritating.
With open source search, there would probably still be ads to support the traffic so not much benefit. With Apple's business model, the consumer is restricted to chosen networks and permitted apps, supported media formats etc. That makes me feel constrained as a consumer.
I don't like spending £700+ for a device and expect to have to pay Apple £60 per year to toy around with it for development and be locked to one carrier when others are cheaper. I don't like not being able to install apps I want on that device like filesystem browsers and use the device for portable storage or sync it with both work and home computers.
It's still very true though that the Nexus One is just an example of being open in one area while protecting the main revenue from a closed system somewhere else, which is the same business model as Apple (open source webkit etc). Companies like Microsoft have ridiculed Apple for that business model saying it can't last but that has to apply to even their own business model. I guess only time will tell.
maybe apple will out souse a basic bare bones search engine
you speak of un faitness om the search market place .
well i run my biz of selling gemstones and i am crushed by liars spammers and large companies taking up the top 5 spots with false promised ads
ebay is the same story
it is a jungle out there
i still have still cheaper better cut gems than most
how can i get the word out ??
9
Nothing is wrong with standing in line. What wrong is anyone that knows anything about technology knows early adopters are fools that like to give away their money. Its very hard to argue that point in this case seeing the 4gb iPhone was dropped soon afterwards and the 8gb iPhone had a 200.00 price drop.
iPhone 3Gs users paid 199.00 compared to 599.00 for a phone that is far superior compared to the gen1 model. And the only downside is they weren't the first on their block to have an iPhone.
When it comes to technology any early adopter might as well have sucker stamped on their forehead.
Welcome to the real world. The fact is tomorrow products are always better than todays products whether they are 1st generation or not. Next July when Apple releases the 4th generation iPhone you will say that those who bought the 3GS are fools because they didn't wait for the 4th generation, which we all know will offer at least more capacity and faster speeds for the same price.
If you are going to hold off buying because you are worried that something better and possibly cheaper will come out in the future then you will never buy a thing in your life. People who bought the first iPhone, including myself, bought it because it was the best smartphone at that time and did what we wanted and more. By the way, Edge might seem slow now (3 years later) but so will 3G when 4G starts rolling out.
I guess you think that those who bought a Mac a year ago are fools because they didn't wait until now to buy the newer ones with better specs for the same price or maybe those who bought their cars few years back didn't wait until now for better looking cars with improved performance and safety
Did you know RTF was invented by Microsoft?
If you don't want it, you don't have to use it. How do you know that Steve doesn't want it, anyway? I highly doubt you know much about what Mr. Jobs wants, judging by your tacky rainbow signature, I doubt you're channeling him very well.
Apple could have made their own rendering engine and made it proprietary rather than collaborate publicly. Instead, they used an open source browser. I recall Google made a Javascript engine for their own browser, and other things that other browsers didn't do yet. Which is part of the idea of the open source ideal, building on existing work rather than reinvent the entire wheel every time.
The reason why Steve doesn't really like chrome is because it doesn't integrate well with OS X. Safari is a Cocoa written Application also thats why it runs GREAT on the Mac. Along with that, Apple can tailor the app accordingly (Thats why having a well intergraded Apple ecosystem benefits users and Pros IMO)
Look Google will be perfectly okay if it sticks to its game plan which is to become dominant on the Windows Platform. Don't step on this cats (meaning Apple's OS X names) territory or you'll get bit. It's nice for people like yourself or others who want to hop on the "chrome is going to be way better then safari, yada yada yada " bandwagon, that's okay. End the end you'll be back on Apple and Steves feet giving them credit again and praising safari.
Also Steve is a business man, he won't publicly say what I said, but behind close doors or with close friends, I'm sure we share the same view.
Oh and BTW the remark about my signature was pretty low, coming from a "moderator"
I expect such comments from a member not a moderator.
When launching the iPhone, Apple staunchly insisted that AT&T and other carrier partners allow it to handle much of the customer support itself, which helped to head off the problem of users being passed back and forth between the hardware vendor, the carrier, and the software developer.
This paragraph is positively not true.
If you brand something as yours, expect to shell out the big bucks for a call center and don't expect people to surf the web to fix the phone they just bought from you!
Sure they can had it over to the carrier or HTC or whoever isn't Google, but if the device has Google's name on it, as a consumer, the expectation is Google will support it.
BUT, nobody ever accused Google of trying to enter the consumer market with this device. Everyone already knew this device was for for hardcore geeks who look at specs as opposed to a whole experience. So the geeks got their phone, and now the consumers have learned not to trust Google until they can get their act up to speed and give a damn about the consumer - who is usually stupid when compared to a geek.
Lesson learned, Google. Now go out there and hire some phone support people!
The reason why Steve doesn't really like chrome is because it doesn't integrate well with OS X. Safari is a Cocoa written Application also thats why it runs GREAT on the Mac. Along with that, Apple can tailor the app accordingly (Thats why having a well intergraded Apple ecosystem benefits users and Pros IMO)
Look Google will be perfectly okay if it sticks to its game plan which is to become dominant on the Windows Platform. Don't step on this cats (meaning Apple's OS X names) territory or you'll get bit. It's nice for people like yourself or others who want to hop on the "chrome is going to be way better then safari, yada yada yada " bandwagon, that's okay. End the end you'll be back on Apple and Steves feet giving them credit again and praising safari.
Also Steve is a business man, he won't publicly say what I said, but behind close doors or with close friends, I'm sure we share the same view.
Oh and BTW the remark about my signature was pretty low, coming from a "moderator"
I expect such comments from a member not a moderator.
i love your sig
can i use it ??
1. Who the hell are these people who already bought the stupid Google Phone? (GEEKS)
2. How are these (GEEKS) not able to use the damn thing?
3. Who needs/wants phone support in 2010? IMO, Expecting someone over the phone to solve your problems immediately is arrogant and archaic. You're not important just because you had $179 in your checking account before opening up Google.com the other day.
They're actually trying to sell a phone with email support only? That beggars belief.
I applaud it. Every whiney pissant American that need support yesterday who will sit on hold longer than it would take to search for their answers, should be a taught their place.
Customer Service, or what is has become today, is an absolute joke. And Customer Service practices of Fortune 500 companies are Anti-Competitive practices.
This is what companies like Amazon and other large online retailers have bred:
"Hello, this is customer service."
"Waaa!!!"
"Would you like a refund and few extra things for free?"
"Waaaa!!!!!!!!!"
"Well we're trying but the soonest we can get it there would be yesterday."
"Waaaaaaaaaa!!!"
"Thank you very much for your business, is there anything else I can give you today?"
I read it. I just didn't want to call you foolish for standing in line to pay an extra 200.00 only to get 50% of your money back. Which really isn't 50% because you had to give it back to Apple anyways. Hope your money management skills have improved since then.
You seem to think that anyone who doesn't always wait for something to become cheaper is a fool who needs his meds checked.
But tech prices are always coming down, ALWAYS. You can ALWAYS wait for prices to come down.
The time you get to spend actually USING the device while others are waiting for the price drop is actually worth something to some people. It sure was to me.
And you know what? EDGE is a lot faster than NO internet, as a friend of mine said.
Enjoy waiting for things to be cheaper. I'll enjoy using tech I love.
Also, a personal question extremeskater -- you seem really upset about this, and your coming across as a real jerk in your comments. What's up with that?
Welcome to the real world. The fact is tomorrow products are always better than todays products whether they are 1st generation or not. Next July when Apple releases the 4th generation iPhone you will say that those who bought the 3GS are fools because they didn't wait for the 4th generation, which we all know will offer at least more capacity and faster speeds for the same price.
If you are going to hold off buying because you are worried that something better and possibly cheaper will come out in the future then you will never buy a thing in your life. People who bought the first iPhone, including myself, bought it because it was the best smartphone at that time and did what we wanted and more. By the way, Edge might seem slow now (3 years later) but so will 3G when 4G starts rolling out.
I guess you think that those who bought a Mac a year ago are fools because they didn't wait until now to buy the newer ones with better specs for the same price or maybe those who bought their cars few years back didn't wait until now for better looking cars with improved performance and safety
Its sad I have to keep explaining this very simple concept. There is a big difference between being a first adopter and waiting forever to buy something or never buying it at all.
I would go into more detail but I think I have already done that enough in this thread. If you don't get it by now you never will.