Wrong you forgot Oregon and New Mexico too... however these are not CONSUMER ELECTRONIC DEVICE factories. They are chip fabs and not really the same thing. A factory that makes a CHIP just needs the wafers on which the chips are to be etched onto. So while your Intel factory (factories!) is an interesting bit of information... Their existence doesn't compare to an __insert your favorite CE device__ factory assembly line that needs to combine the raw parts, chips, batteries, cases, screens, etc into a finished product that consumers buy.
So my point stands... No popular/successful CE oriented devices are manufactured in a US factory! Oh and for the record... NO! Buying a case from China, a screen from Taiwan, and a circuit board and power supply from Korea and 'assembling' them on US soil doesn't count either.
And for all the trolls spinning this as Apple's problem alone this from Foxconn's Wikipedia entry...
"Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod, the iPad, and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment.[2][3][4][5]"
The trolls (journalists?) seem to leave this little fact out when bashing Apple for this unfortunate state of affairs.
As long as apple are making the lion share of the industries profits, they will continue to be the segment gaining hte majority of the public pressure
I'm with all of you, I'm going to type a few words in this forum that make it appear that I'm concerned and that I care about suicides in a far away Chinese factory city.
But, wait, maybe I don't really care. Maybe I won't type a few words in this forum about suicides in a far away Chinese factory city.
Either way, I'm still a righteous person who cares about other people around me.
"In Young & Restless in China, FRONTLINE presents intimate portraits of nine young Chinese over the course of four years, examining the reality of their lives as they navigate their way through a country that is changing daily. They are westernized, savvy about today's interconnected world, ambitious - and often torn between their culture and their aspirations."
"SANTA'S WORKSHOP takes you to the real world of China's toy factories. Workers tell us about long working hours, low wages, and dangerous work places. Those who protest or try to organize trade unions risk imprisonment. Low labour costs attract more and more companies to China. Today more than 75% of our toys are made in China. But this industry takes its toll on the workers and on the environment. The European (and American) buyers blame bad conditions on the Chinese suppliers. But they say that increasingly hard competition gives them no option. Who should we believe?"
Yes, everything and everyone has a bias. Learning, studying, and knowing that context is as equally important and meaningful as the content it presents. A documentary, like any body of work, is a point of view. It's the documentarian's perspective. These two works don't speak for all of China, most of China, part of China, nor even a small part of China. They speak for what the film makers chose to include based on their research and their bias. Also, the works are not the foundations to my point of view. I'm posting them because I found them interesting. Perhaps you will, too. Perhaps, not. That I found them interesting speaks to a component of my bias. :-)
And for all the trolls spinning this as Apple's problem alone this from Foxconn's Wikipedia entry...
"Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod, the iPad, and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment.[2][3][4][5]"
The trolls (journalists?) seem to leave this little fact out when bashing Apple for this unfortunate state of affairs.
The fact is that we are all responsible for this, including myself. We can blame the Chinese government all we want, we know damn well China does not care about it's people, so that does make us guilty because we continue to give them business regardless. There needs to be a paradigm shift in our values. Right now we value low price points over human life. If we started making products in the US we would pay more, but there would be more jobs. With higher employment rate we'd have a better economy and with that stronger economy people would be earning more and in return spending more money, which would bring the prices of things back down. And if the prices went up anyways we'd still all buy the neat new products we want, but maybe we'd sacrifice all the crap we don't need to get it... which would probably have a positive affect on the planet and more specifically our own lives. All this will of course never happen though, so I'm wasting my breath.
The World Health Organization indicates the nationwide suicide rate in China is something like 14 per 100,000 people. Foxconn's 10 out of 300,000 in one year is actually lower than that.
Way to go, Team Foxconn! We're beating the Shenzhen factory by one suicide! Keep up the good work. ?One generation plants the trees, and another gets the shade."... and remember, red means quality!
But seriously, with this many people it really is not surprising to see this many deaths. More people = more opportunities for stuff to happen.
The fact is that we are all responsible for this, including myself. We can blame the Chinese government all we want, we know damn well China does not care about it's people, so that does make us guilty because we continue to give them business regardless. There needs to be a paradigm shift in our values. Right now we value low price points over human life. If we started making products in the US we would pay more, but there would be more jobs. With higher employment rate we'd have a better economy and with that stronger economy people would be earning more and in return spending more money, which would bring the prices of things back down. And if the prices went up anyways we'd still all buy the neat new products we want, but maybe we'd sacrifice all the crap we don't need to get it... which would probably have a positive affect on the planet and more specifically our own lives. All this will of course never happen though, so I'm wasting my breath.
Sure, sure. Suicides and murders are virtually impossible here in the US. You never hear about anyone going off their nut and walking into work with a gun... right?
Sure, sure. Suicides and murders are virtually impossible here in the US. You never hear about anyone going off their nut and walking into work with a gun... right?
That's not the same situation. I don't think there's been 10 people who went postal this year in the US. These people live to work and nothing else. They don't even have the opportunity for a social life. The work all day long for what is less than minimum wage in this country.
I don't know if it's the tech giants fault, our fault or the Chinese gov'ts fault. Probably all three. There has to be some kind of change. NOBODY should have to live like this. This has only very little to do with Apple but rather the industry as a whole who only care about maximizing profits at anyone's expense. This is also a major problem in the US as well.
"In Young & Restless in China, FRONTLINE presents intimate portraits of nine young Chinese over the course of four years, examining the reality of their lives as they navigate their way through a country that is changing daily. They are westernized, savvy about today's interconnected world, ambitious - and often torn between their culture and their aspirations."
"SANTA'S WORKSHOP takes you to the real world of China's toy factories. Workers tell us about long working hours, low wages, and dangerous work places. Those who protest or try to organize trade unions risk imprisonment. Low labour costs attract more and more companies to China. Today more than 75% of our toys are made in China. But this industry takes its toll on the workers and on the environment. The European (and American) buyers blame bad conditions on the Chinese suppliers. But they say that increasingly hard competition gives them no option. Who should we believe?"
Yes, everything and everyone has a bias. Learning, studying, and knowing that context is as equally important and meaningful as the content it presents. A documentary, like any body of work, is a point of view. It's the documentarian's perspective. These two works don't speak for all of China, most of China, part of China, nor even a small part of China. They speak for what the film makers chose to include based on their research and their bias. Also, the works are not the foundations to my point of view. I'm posting them because I found them interesting. Perhaps you will, too. Perhaps, not. That I found them interesting speaks to a component of my bias. :-)
Point of order - Apple isn't demanding the lower prices, consumers are.
Every time you see someone complaining about a $500 iPad being too expensive just think back to this story.
I don't know if that's the case. You mention the iPad which most wouldn't consider a necessary device…yet. In the case of smartphones, Apple and others (like Nokia and Google) are charging upwards of 300-350% of the price of the parts itself for an unlocked device. There is something wrong here. it seems to following the Gordon Gecko model of "Greed is Good".
I think all of the manufacturing industries, as a whole, are to blame. The customer doesn't have a choice of a smartphone that isn't made in a sweatshop. There is no longer a respect for humanity; just selfishness and trying to satisfy shareholders.
Comments
No, 14.8 per 100,000 women + 13 per 100,000 men == 27.8 per 200,0000 or ~14 per 100,000
LOL I'm glad I wasn't the only one who noticed that.
Wrong, intel has one in Arizona
Wrong you forgot Oregon and New Mexico too... however these are not CONSUMER ELECTRONIC DEVICE factories. They are chip fabs and not really the same thing. A factory that makes a CHIP just needs the wafers on which the chips are to be etched onto. So while your Intel factory (factories!) is an interesting bit of information... Their existence doesn't compare to an __insert your favorite CE device__ factory assembly line that needs to combine the raw parts, chips, batteries, cases, screens, etc into a finished product that consumers buy.
So my point stands... No popular/successful CE oriented devices are manufactured in a US factory! Oh and for the record... NO! Buying a case from China, a screen from Taiwan, and a circuit board and power supply from Korea and 'assembling' them on US soil doesn't count either.
And for all the trolls spinning this as Apple's problem alone this from Foxconn's Wikipedia entry...
"Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod, the iPad, and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment.[2][3][4][5]"
The trolls (journalists?) seem to leave this little fact out when bashing Apple for this unfortunate state of affairs.
As long as apple are making the lion share of the industries profits, they will continue to be the segment gaining hte majority of the public pressure
But, wait, maybe I don't really care. Maybe I won't type a few words in this forum about suicides in a far away Chinese factory city.
Either way, I'm still a righteous person who cares about other people around me.
Young & Restless In China:
"In Young & Restless in China, FRONTLINE presents intimate portraits of nine young Chinese over the course of four years, examining the reality of their lives as they navigate their way through a country that is changing daily. They are westernized, savvy about today's interconnected world, ambitious - and often torn between their culture and their aspirations."
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...tm_source=grid
- Another perspective on one industry in China:
Santa's Workshop:
"SANTA'S WORKSHOP takes you to the real world of China's toy factories. Workers tell us about long working hours, low wages, and dangerous work places. Those who protest or try to organize trade unions risk imprisonment. Low labour costs attract more and more companies to China. Today more than 75% of our toys are made in China. But this industry takes its toll on the workers and on the environment. The European (and American) buyers blame bad conditions on the Chinese suppliers. But they say that increasingly hard competition gives them no option. Who should we believe?"
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?doc...4947664645042#
Please Note: To head-off a potential flame war...
Yes, everything and everyone has a bias. Learning, studying, and knowing that context is as equally important and meaningful as the content it presents. A documentary, like any body of work, is a point of view. It's the documentarian's perspective. These two works don't speak for all of China, most of China, part of China, nor even a small part of China. They speak for what the film makers chose to include based on their research and their bias. Also, the works are not the foundations to my point of view. I'm posting them because I found them interesting. Perhaps you will, too. Perhaps, not. That I found them interesting speaks to a component of my bias. :-)
And for all the trolls spinning this as Apple's problem alone this from Foxconn's Wikipedia entry...
"Among other things, Foxconn produces the Mac mini, the iPod, the iPad, and the iPhone for Apple Inc.; Intel-branded motherboards for Intel Corp.; various orders for American computer manufacturers Dell and Hewlett-Packard; motherboards for UK computer manufacturer Zoostorm; the PlayStation 2 and PlayStation 3 for Sony; the Wii for Nintendo; the Xbox 360 for Microsoft, cell phones for Motorola, the Amazon Kindle, and Cisco equipment.[2][3][4][5]"
The trolls (journalists?) seem to leave this little fact out when bashing Apple for this unfortunate state of affairs.
+ 1 and more
The World Health Organization indicates the nationwide suicide rate in China is something like 14 per 100,000 people. Foxconn's 10 out of 300,000 in one year is actually lower than that.
Way to go, Team Foxconn! We're beating the Shenzhen factory by one suicide! Keep up the good work. ?One generation plants the trees, and another gets the shade."... and remember, red means quality!
But seriously, with this many people it really is not surprising to see this many deaths. More people = more opportunities for stuff to happen.
The fact is that we are all responsible for this, including myself. We can blame the Chinese government all we want, we know damn well China does not care about it's people, so that does make us guilty because we continue to give them business regardless. There needs to be a paradigm shift in our values. Right now we value low price points over human life. If we started making products in the US we would pay more, but there would be more jobs. With higher employment rate we'd have a better economy and with that stronger economy people would be earning more and in return spending more money, which would bring the prices of things back down. And if the prices went up anyways we'd still all buy the neat new products we want, but maybe we'd sacrifice all the crap we don't need to get it... which would probably have a positive affect on the planet and more specifically our own lives. All this will of course never happen though, so I'm wasting my breath.
Sure, sure. Suicides and murders are virtually impossible here in the US. You never hear about anyone going off their nut and walking into work with a gun... right?
Sure, sure. Suicides and murders are virtually impossible here in the US. You never hear about anyone going off their nut and walking into work with a gun... right?
That's not the same situation. I don't think there's been 10 people who went postal this year in the US. These people live to work and nothing else. They don't even have the opportunity for a social life. The work all day long for what is less than minimum wage in this country.
I don't know if it's the tech giants fault, our fault or the Chinese gov'ts fault. Probably all three. There has to be some kind of change. NOBODY should have to live like this. This has only very little to do with Apple but rather the industry as a whole who only care about maximizing profits at anyone's expense. This is also a major problem in the US as well.
- A take on life in China for a few people:
Young & Restless In China:
"In Young & Restless in China, FRONTLINE presents intimate portraits of nine young Chinese over the course of four years, examining the reality of their lives as they navigate their way through a country that is changing daily. They are westernized, savvy about today's interconnected world, ambitious - and often torn between their culture and their aspirations."
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...tm_source=grid
- Another perspective on one industry in China:
Santa's Workshop:
"SANTA'S WORKSHOP takes you to the real world of China's toy factories. Workers tell us about long working hours, low wages, and dangerous work places. Those who protest or try to organize trade unions risk imprisonment. Low labour costs attract more and more companies to China. Today more than 75% of our toys are made in China. But this industry takes its toll on the workers and on the environment. The European (and American) buyers blame bad conditions on the Chinese suppliers. But they say that increasingly hard competition gives them no option. Who should we believe?"
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?doc...4947664645042#
Please Note: To head-off a potential flame war...
Yes, everything and everyone has a bias. Learning, studying, and knowing that context is as equally important and meaningful as the content it presents. A documentary, like any body of work, is a point of view. It's the documentarian's perspective. These two works don't speak for all of China, most of China, part of China, nor even a small part of China. They speak for what the film makers chose to include based on their research and their bias. Also, the works are not the foundations to my point of view. I'm posting them because I found them interesting. Perhaps you will, too. Perhaps, not. That I found them interesting speaks to a component of my bias. :-)
Absolutely brilliant post btw.
Well Apple is demanding they produce the goods at the lowest possible price, so this is a consequence of that.
Point of order - Apple isn't demanding the lower prices, consumers are.
Every time you see someone complaining about a $500 iPad being too expensive
This does not bode well for Apple.
Why? Why only Apple?
It's all just a part of the religion of the free market. When you value the market above all else individuals are expendable.
So what exactly is your "solution"?
The equivalent of Soviet era cars? No thank you.
Point of order - Apple isn't demanding the lower prices, consumers are.
Every time you see someone complaining about a $500 iPad being too expensive
I don't know if that's the case. You mention the iPad which most wouldn't consider a necessary device…yet. In the case of smartphones, Apple and others (like Nokia and Google) are charging upwards of 300-350% of the price of the parts itself for an unlocked device. There is something wrong here. it seems to following the Gordon Gecko model of "Greed is Good".
I think all of the manufacturing industries, as a whole, are to blame. The customer doesn't have a choice of a smartphone that isn't made in a sweatshop. There is no longer a respect for humanity; just selfishness and trying to satisfy shareholders.
Point of order - Apple isn't demanding the lower prices, consumers are.
Actually, they are both demanding the lowest cost.
Apple wants to make the most profit possible, and it can achieve this by pressuring suppliers margins to the minimum.