If you go through PR, be sure to get a name and an 800 callback number-- if you get switched to Apple Support. The initial PR call is not toll free-- intentionally!
If what you want is a free case, that could be easy or difficult... depending. I suspect the cost of the case is not the issue with you-- rather it is the principal! The same goes for Apple!
I suspect if Apple could resolve the issue with a "free case with every iPhone"-- they would do it, boom... and it would add a buck to their cost of the iPhone 4. 2.5 million phones, so far == $2.5 million... a pittance-- Apple couldn't address the issue with $5 million worth of advertising.
The problem is that the case is a band-aid-- it doesn't fix the issue, it just mitigates it.
I can hear it all now: But I wanted a $50 case; Why do I have to accept that case-- give me a credit, so I can buy what I want; I wanted one with an external battery; Apple didn't fix the problem-- they just provided a iPhone condom (band-aid)... the beat goes on (and on, and on...).
I do hope you get satisfaction! Barring that, I hope you get to where you accept the results. At some point in time, there are bigger windmills that need our attention!
I am not experiencing the problem-- if I were, I'd be pissed! But, hey, $30 isn't sacrificing my principles-- it's just that there are better things to do with my time*...
... I am reminded of my old T-Mobile Nokia, where I had to go n (I forget) menu levels deep to send a text (or do damn near anything)... Never could figure out that phone.
* I am trying to get an app ready for the app store and I spent all day on this thread! Duh!
Peace!
.
Thanks very much for the helpful advice, much appreciated.
I would have thought that Apple could offer only their Bumper, that would keep things simple and I think fair, but nonetheless I'm sure what you're saying would be true for some that ie the bumper won't protect the back, must have leather etc- just like you're saying. But it would be a start and they would overall start building back trust. They'd certainly have a case (no pun intended) that without a case the phone would have no protection etc anyway.
Sadly, for me, my funds are pretty scarce, but yes, I will in the next few days get a case.
I'm massively pleased with the iP4, if I wasn't it would have been an easy decision to just return it. It's just too nice for me to want anything else, despite the problems.
Best of luck with that app. If you want to waste any more time here I'd love to know what it is?
Nowhere does AnandTech's article says it does not affect call quality. In fact they show how the iPhone 4 is affected the most by signal attenuation. Not just a bar display issue.
It doesn't say that anywhere? Maybe you missed:
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
Seems that's exactly what they said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chopper
Well I'd like to believe you but I have it on authority from jragosta that unless "you have real, valid, statistical evidence that the iPhone 4 drops calls more than previous phones under identical conditions, you might have a point. Until then, you're just spewing FUD."
So, instead, you think that Apple should scurry around throwing out useless 'fixes' every time one of the first 1.7 MILLION iPhone users complains about something? It only makes sense to base their actions on factual analysis. And that doesn't depend on a few whiners on AI.
I am usually not a grammar snob... but I gotta' say:
You do not know what the article implies!
You infer that there is in issue based on how you interpret what is in the article!
Here's a test for you:
Nina Simone is not a Caucasian!
What do I imply?
What do you infer?
... sorry to be so pedantic!
.
Thanks for the lesson :-) I'll try it again...
The Apple memo says -
Quote:
d. If you are experiencing this on your iPhone 4, avoid covering the black strip in the lower-left corner of the metal band.
That infers :-) to me that they know there is an issue touching the black strip. A spot many people touch when they naturally hold the phone. That is the issue and the flaw.
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
Hmmm, there's no question the iPhone 4 antenna performs better then the iPhone 3GS. Until you factor in the massive antenna attenuation if you touch the wrong spot. Did you not see their chart ? That is the issue.
Also in his next paragraph, he refers to using the bumper during this day in testing. Which of course fixes this issue.
Clearly you are not understanding the entire article. The below paragraph that was in their final wrapup of the review, gives a better picture of their opinion -
Quote:
The main downside to the iPhone 4 is the obvious lapse in Apple's engineering judgment. The fact that Apple didn't have the foresight to coat the stainless steel antenna band with even a fraction of an ounce worth of non-conductive material either tells us that Apple doesn't care or that it simply doesn't test thoroughly enough. The latter is a message we've seen a few times before with OS X issues, the iPhone 4 simply reinforces it. At the bare minimum Apple should give away its bumper case with every iPhone 4 sold. The best scenario is for Apple to coat the antenna and replace all existing phones with a revised model.The ideal situation is very costly for Apple but it is the right thing to do. Plus it's not like Apple doesn't have the resources to take care of its customers.
Yes but the customers are taking the hit. That's wrong, and simply on a PR level it's bad for Apple. The issues are too severe to play games with. Apple could have saved some face if it at least had offered to help those experiencing issues by offering them a free case to help reduce the problem. I'm sure SJ and his lawyers understand that but they're taking the harder approach. They are betraying their customers, period. This is the first time I personally have experienced bad customer service from Apple all the other times they were all too happy to help.
Yeah, I hear you on this... except customers are lining up to take the hit! I believe if Apple thought they could make it better with a free case they would do it.
But, as this forum (and several others) suggest, a free case could, easily, make it worse! (and the bumper cases are backordered).
I think we need to let Apple decide what's best for Apple (the company), Apple shareholders, Apple Dealers, and Apple customers. Likely, there are a lot of lawyers, regulators and bloggers just waiting to pounce!
So, instead, you think that Apple should scurry around throwing out useless 'fixes' every time one of the first 1.7 MILLION iPhone users complains about something?
No. Did I write that somewhere? Show me.
You make much of the "hysteria" of those who think this is a real issue, but maybe you could pause for a moment and analyse the strident nature of your own responses.
But I'm sure you'll just make some personal attack on me and hopefully add me to your ignore list.
That implies to me that they know there is an issue touching the black strip. A spot many people touch when they naturally hold the phone. That is the issue and the flaw.
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple’s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple?s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
.
It may not be real, but it likely is because it's almost word for word how the Apple technician I spoke to on Tuesday responded.
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple?s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
.
LOL, and I guess all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support are lying too, huh ? Why don't you call Apple Support and see the response you get from them on this issue and report back to us.
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
.
Also, I find your response hilarious. Because a few posts back (post #244) you were quoting what could have been a fake Steve Jobs email. How is that different ? LOL
I'm massively pleased with the iP4, if I wasn't it would have been an easy decision to just return it. It's just too nice for me to want anything else, despite the problems.
This is pretty much where I am at. I have had some annoying reception problems due to the way I hold the phone. I thought about returning the iPhone 4, but it's not worth better reception if I have to go back to the 3G. And I considered the Droid X (carrier is irrelevant to me), but I just love iOS so much more than Android (I've used both).
So, I got a case. It's simple and looks good, and reception problems are completely gone. I ran speed tests that show equal bandwidth whether I am gripping the phone or it is on the table. There was a HUGE discrepancy before I got the case.
It may not be real, but it likely is because it's almost word for word how the Apple technician I spoke to on Tuesday responded.
I will accept that!
I suspect that the Apple tech was given a "policy" answer that he was allowed to provide-- he did not have an agenda, but I think we all can assume that Apple (the policymaker) does have an agenda!
Based on my 32-year history with Apple, I suspect they are being overly cautious, admitting nothing, until the issue is determined/resolved and a fix implemented. There are legal, regulatory and sound business reasons for this policy,
As to the linked site and article-- I believe their history and agenda should be examined too. It could simply be a matter of getting hits... it could be a lot more?
LOL, and I guess all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support are lying too, huh ? Why don't you call Apple Support and see the response you get from them on this issue and report back to us.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
Also, I find your response hilarious. Because a few posts back (post #244) you were quoting what could have been a fake Steve Jobs email. How is that different ? LOL
This is pretty much where I am at. I have had some annoying reception problems due to the way I hold the phone. I thought about returning the iPhone 4, but it's not worth better reception if I have to go back to the 3G. And I considered the Droid X (carrier is irrelevant to me), but I just love iOS so much more than Android (I've used both).
So, I got a case. It's simple and looks good, and reception problems are completely gone. I ran speed tests that show equal bandwidth whether I am gripping the phone or it is on the table. There was a HUGE discrepancy before I got the case.
Very happy with this computerphone now.
Yep, I haven't owned an Android OS phone, the only one I've seen is the Dell Streak and it felt slow, particularly in the browser and jerky too when scrolling and zooming and double tap didn't seem to function, or if it did, very poorly. The iPhone's screens now even make folders look beautiful, they really, I thought, looked ugly on my old 3G. I believe, but I may be wrong, that Android developers aren't allowing people to download the apps onto the SD cards that make up the bulk of the storage. It has something like 2 GB of memory built in, not much.
My experiments with cases showed it made a big difference where I was, however, where the service got thin, then I still lost signal when I held it normally. At those times then I'll have hold it differently, but on the plus side pages load much, much faster than they had on my 3G when they actually load.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
-- 250
-- 1,000
-- 1,000,000
Let's focus on how big a problem this is!
Seriously, I sure would like to know!
.
You are missing my point. You claim that Apple memo could be fake. Fair enough. But yet most of the evidence we have seen so far points to be an accurate document. Yes, I know you don't have the issue. That's great. But go try calling support yourself and see if they don't tell you to hold it differently and avoid touching the seam. The issue, the flaw.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
-- 250
-- 1,000
-- 1,000,000
Let's focus on how big a problem this is!
Seriously, I sure would like to know!
.
My thinking on the numbers who are effected by these issues is that all the phones are probably the same. My phone has less reception issues when I'm not hot and my hands are dry, though it's still there, just less so, maybe by as much as fifty percent. Given that I would expect the issues to be slightly less in cooler climates than warmer climates, though many, especially in the US, live in air-con bubbles most of the time so that might balance things out. Take any iPhone to where I live and pending on the persons hand perspiration primarily, I would think the same problems would arise if they were on the same network.
I think everyone is being told the same thing by Apple. Certainly my nearest Apple store said the same thing as the technician. I'm sure some people are being given replacements for other issues to mask that the phone is being replaced due to the reception issues to placate certain customers, for whatever reasons, but I would think that's a very small percentage. Apple seems pretty determined about this policy at the moment and for good reason because they know full well replacing the phone will make absolutely no difference and of course could cost them a ton of money.
You make much of the "hysteria" of those who think this is a real issue, but maybe you could pause for a moment and analyse the strident nature of your own responses.
But I'm sure you'll just make some personal attack on me and hopefully add me to your ignore list.
So it's hysterical to ask for evidence rather than anecdotal complaints? You are really confused. Hysteria is all the "the sky is falling because I got fewer bars" whining on this board. My response is simply trying to get people to deal with facts INSTEAD OF hysteria.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski1
Hmmm, there's no question the iPhone 4 antenna performs better then the iPhone 3GS. Until you factor in the massive antenna attenuation if you touch the wrong spot. Did you not see their chart ? That is the issue.
Also in his next paragraph, he refers to using the bumper during this day in testing. Which of course fixes this issue.
Clearly you are not understanding the entire article. The below paragraph that was in their final wrapup of the review, gives a better picture of their opinion -
You keep ignoring this paragraph:
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
They did not have ANY dropped calls on the iPhone 4 and found that they were able to connect in places that the iPhone 3GS didn't work. So, EVEN WITH the signal attenuation, they still got better connections.
So where's all the evidence of massive numbers of dropped calls that you keep imagining?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski1
{Response to a person asking for factual numbers} You are missing my point. You claim that Apple memo could be fake. Fair enough. But yet most of the evidence we have seen so far points to be an accurate document. Yes, I know you don't have the issue. That's great. But go try calling support yourself and see if they don't tell you to hold it differently and avoid touching the seam. The issue, the flaw.
No, YOU are missing the point. No one has ever denied that some phones have a drop in the number of bars. What you're being asked for is evidence that a significant number of people are experiencing an increase in the number of dropped calls when using the phone normally. You are clearly unable to provide that evidence - or, apparently, even able to understand that factual evidence is.
My thinking on the numbers who are effected by these issues is that all the phones are probably the same. My phone has less reception issues when I'm not hot and my hands are dry, though it's still there, just less so, maybe by as much as fifty percent. Given that I would expect the issues to be slightly less in cooler climates than warmer climates, though many, especially in the US, live in air-con bubbles most of the time so that might balance things out. Take any iPhone to where I live and pending on the persons hand perspiration primarily, I would think the same problems would arise if they were on the same network.
I think everyone is being told the same thing by Apple. Certainly my nearest Apple store said the same thing as the technician. I'm sure some people are being given replacements for other issues to mask that the phone is being replaced due to the reception issues to placate certain customers, for whatever reasons, but I would think that's a very small percentage. Apple seems pretty determined about this policy at the moment and for good reason because they know full well replacing the phone will make absolutely no difference and of course could cost them a ton of money.
I've been saying since day one to people who have the reproducible signal loss issues whenever the touch the Three-G-Spot* to get a replacement. From a consumer perspective I still hold that as the best option, but from Apple's perspective that may not solve anything.
If you get several defective items in a row you can lose faith in that company or product even if all the items came from the sam batch. If it's a production issue, perhaps they haven't quite pinpointed where the problem starts so they can recall or offer replacements or fixes to those affected model numbers.
If it's a SW fix (for example) for some oddly constructed ? but not bad ? TriQuint chip then replacing new phones with the same iOS version wouldn't do much good, and they'd still have to know which models had this TriQuint chip (which may be impossible) so they could know which phones to expect with the issue and which phone not to sell.
As much as we hate it and as much as we think they are reacting slowly this is still only the 7th day (in my country) that the iPhone 4 has been on shelves. Hell, the iPad which launched in April still hasn't gotten a single bug fix update.
Comments
Good! I wish you satisfaction!
If you go through PR, be sure to get a name and an 800 callback number-- if you get switched to Apple Support. The initial PR call is not toll free-- intentionally!
If what you want is a free case, that could be easy or difficult... depending. I suspect the cost of the case is not the issue with you-- rather it is the principal! The same goes for Apple!
I suspect if Apple could resolve the issue with a "free case with every iPhone"-- they would do it, boom... and it would add a buck to their cost of the iPhone 4. 2.5 million phones, so far == $2.5 million... a pittance-- Apple couldn't address the issue with $5 million worth of advertising.
The problem is that the case is a band-aid-- it doesn't fix the issue, it just mitigates it.
I can hear it all now: But I wanted a $50 case; Why do I have to accept that case-- give me a credit, so I can buy what I want; I wanted one with an external battery; Apple didn't fix the problem-- they just provided a iPhone condom (band-aid)... the beat goes on (and on, and on...).
I do hope you get satisfaction! Barring that, I hope you get to where you accept the results. At some point in time, there are bigger windmills that need our attention!
I am not experiencing the problem-- if I were, I'd be pissed! But, hey, $30 isn't sacrificing my principles-- it's just that there are better things to do with my time*...
... I am reminded of my old T-Mobile Nokia, where I had to go n (I forget) menu levels deep to send a text (or do damn near anything)... Never could figure out that phone.
* I am trying to get an app ready for the app store and I spent all day on this thread! Duh!
Peace!
.
Thanks very much for the helpful advice, much appreciated.
I would have thought that Apple could offer only their Bumper, that would keep things simple and I think fair, but nonetheless I'm sure what you're saying would be true for some that ie the bumper won't protect the back, must have leather etc- just like you're saying. But it would be a start and they would overall start building back trust. They'd certainly have a case (no pun intended) that without a case the phone would have no protection etc anyway.
Sadly, for me, my funds are pretty scarce, but yes, I will in the next few days get a case.
I'm massively pleased with the iP4, if I wasn't it would have been an easy decision to just return it. It's just too nice for me to want anything else, despite the problems.
Best of luck with that app. If you want to waste any more time here I'd love to know what it is?
Nowhere does AnandTech's article says it does not affect call quality. In fact they show how the iPhone 4 is affected the most by signal attenuation. Not just a bar display issue.
It doesn't say that anywhere? Maybe you missed:
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
Seems that's exactly what they said.
Well I'd like to believe you but I have it on authority from jragosta that unless "you have real, valid, statistical evidence that the iPhone 4 drops calls more than previous phones under identical conditions, you might have a point. Until then, you're just spewing FUD."
So, instead, you think that Apple should scurry around throwing out useless 'fixes' every time one of the first 1.7 MILLION iPhone users complains about something? It only makes sense to base their actions on factual analysis. And that doesn't depend on a few whiners on AI.
I am usually not a grammar snob... but I gotta' say:
You do not know what the article implies!
You infer that there is in issue based on how you interpret what is in the article!
Here's a test for you:
Nina Simone is not a Caucasian!
What do I imply?
What do you infer?
... sorry to be so pedantic!
.
Thanks for the lesson :-) I'll try it again...
The Apple memo says -
d. If you are experiencing this on your iPhone 4, avoid covering the black strip in the lower-left corner of the metal band.
That infers :-) to me that they know there is an issue touching the black strip. A spot many people touch when they naturally hold the phone. That is the issue and the flaw.
What a twit!! "I smoke and don't have cancer - therefore there is no such thing as cancer". Let me take a wild guess .... Democrat voter.
There is a PoliticalOutsider forum with special rules where you can spew all the politics you can stand.
But it doesn't belong in here.
Re-read the ToS you agreed to when you signed up.
It doesn't say that anywhere? Maybe you missed:
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
Hmmm, there's no question the iPhone 4 antenna performs better then the iPhone 3GS. Until you factor in the massive antenna attenuation if you touch the wrong spot. Did you not see their chart ? That is the issue.
Also in his next paragraph, he refers to using the bumper during this day in testing. Which of course fixes this issue.
Clearly you are not understanding the entire article. The below paragraph that was in their final wrapup of the review, gives a better picture of their opinion -
The main downside to the iPhone 4 is the obvious lapse in Apple's engineering judgment. The fact that Apple didn't have the foresight to coat the stainless steel antenna band with even a fraction of an ounce worth of non-conductive material either tells us that Apple doesn't care or that it simply doesn't test thoroughly enough. The latter is a message we've seen a few times before with OS X issues, the iPhone 4 simply reinforces it. At the bare minimum Apple should give away its bumper case with every iPhone 4 sold. The best scenario is for Apple to coat the antenna and replace all existing phones with a revised model.The ideal situation is very costly for Apple but it is the right thing to do. Plus it's not like Apple doesn't have the resources to take care of its customers.
Yes but the customers are taking the hit. That's wrong, and simply on a PR level it's bad for Apple. The issues are too severe to play games with. Apple could have saved some face if it at least had offered to help those experiencing issues by offering them a free case to help reduce the problem. I'm sure SJ and his lawyers understand that but they're taking the harder approach. They are betraying their customers, period. This is the first time I personally have experienced bad customer service from Apple all the other times they were all too happy to help.
Yeah, I hear you on this... except customers are lining up to take the hit! I believe if Apple thought they could make it better with a free case they would do it.
But, as this forum (and several others) suggest, a free case could, easily, make it worse! (and the bumper cases are backordered).
I think we need to let Apple decide what's best for Apple (the company), Apple shareholders, Apple Dealers, and Apple customers. Likely, there are a lot of lawyers, regulators and bloggers just waiting to pounce!
This ain't easy!
.
So, instead, you think that Apple should scurry around throwing out useless 'fixes' every time one of the first 1.7 MILLION iPhone users complains about something?
No. Did I write that somewhere? Show me.
You make much of the "hysteria" of those who think this is a real issue, but maybe you could pause for a moment and analyse the strident nature of your own responses.
But I'm sure you'll just make some personal attack on me and hopefully add me to your ignore list.
The Apple memo says -
That implies to me that they know there is an issue touching the black strip. A spot many people touch when they naturally hold the phone. That is the issue and the flaw.
Here's your post:
What does this imply ?
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/...ng-procedures/
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple’s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
.
Here's your post:
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple?s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
.
It may not be real, but it likely is because it's almost word for word how the Apple technician I spoke to on Tuesday responded.
Here's your post:
Don't you understand the English language and the way the world works:
The title of the article on the site you reference says: "Leaked: Apple?s internal iPhone 4 antenna troubleshooting procedures"
Where is there any proof of that? That the memo exists? That it was issued by Apple?
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
Is there anyone out there that would gain from the iPhone 4 getting some bad press?
Who might they be?
How can they maximize the effect of this bad press?
Do you ever consider that the publisher of the article/site might have an agenda?
Even my 14-year-old granddaughter is wiser than that?
.
LOL, and I guess all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support are lying too, huh ? Why don't you call Apple Support and see the response you get from them on this issue and report back to us.
Just because you read something in a newspaper or on the web, do you believe that it is true? Don't you ever question that assertions without substantiation are not facts-- only assertions?
.
Also, I find your response hilarious. Because a few posts back (post #244) you were quoting what could have been a fake Steve Jobs email. How is that different ? LOL
...I will in the next few days get a case.
I'm massively pleased with the iP4, if I wasn't it would have been an easy decision to just return it. It's just too nice for me to want anything else, despite the problems.
This is pretty much where I am at. I have had some annoying reception problems due to the way I hold the phone. I thought about returning the iPhone 4, but it's not worth better reception if I have to go back to the 3G. And I considered the Droid X (carrier is irrelevant to me), but I just love iOS so much more than Android (I've used both).
So, I got a case. It's simple and looks good, and reception problems are completely gone. I ran speed tests that show equal bandwidth whether I am gripping the phone or it is on the table. There was a HUGE discrepancy before I got the case.
Very happy with this computerphone now.
It may not be real, but it likely is because it's almost word for word how the Apple technician I spoke to on Tuesday responded.
I will accept that!
I suspect that the Apple tech was given a "policy" answer that he was allowed to provide-- he did not have an agenda, but I think we all can assume that Apple (the policymaker) does have an agenda!
Based on my 32-year history with Apple, I suspect they are being overly cautious, admitting nothing, until the issue is determined/resolved and a fix implemented. There are legal, regulatory and sound business reasons for this policy,
As to the linked site and article-- I believe their history and agenda should be examined too. It could simply be a matter of getting hits... it could be a lot more?
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LOL, and I guess all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support are lying too, huh ? Why don't you call Apple Support and see the response you get from them on this issue and report back to us.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
-- 250
-- 1,000
-- 1,000,000
Let's focus on how big a problem this is!
Seriously, I sure would like to know!
.
Also, I find your response hilarious. Because a few posts back (post #244) you were quoting what could have been a fake Steve Jobs email. How is that different ? LOL
Ya' got me there! mea culpa.
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This is pretty much where I am at. I have had some annoying reception problems due to the way I hold the phone. I thought about returning the iPhone 4, but it's not worth better reception if I have to go back to the 3G. And I considered the Droid X (carrier is irrelevant to me), but I just love iOS so much more than Android (I've used both).
So, I got a case. It's simple and looks good, and reception problems are completely gone. I ran speed tests that show equal bandwidth whether I am gripping the phone or it is on the table. There was a HUGE discrepancy before I got the case.
Very happy with this computerphone now.
Yep, I haven't owned an Android OS phone, the only one I've seen is the Dell Streak and it felt slow, particularly in the browser and jerky too when scrolling and zooming and double tap didn't seem to function, or if it did, very poorly. The iPhone's screens now even make folders look beautiful, they really, I thought, looked ugly on my old 3G. I believe, but I may be wrong, that Android developers aren't allowing people to download the apps onto the SD cards that make up the bulk of the storage. It has something like 2 GB of memory built in, not much.
My experiments with cases showed it made a big difference where I was, however, where the service got thin, then I still lost signal when I held it normally. At those times then I'll have hold it differently, but on the plus side pages load much, much faster than they had on my 3G when they actually load.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
-- 250
-- 1,000
-- 1,000,000
Let's focus on how big a problem this is!
Seriously, I sure would like to know!
.
You are missing my point. You claim that Apple memo could be fake. Fair enough. But yet most of the evidence we have seen so far points to be an accurate document. Yes, I know you don't have the issue. That's great. But go try calling support yourself and see if they don't tell you to hold it differently and avoid touching the seam. The issue, the flaw.
I am not having the "problem"-- any call to Apple Support would be gratuitous!
Why don't you quantify "all the people claiming that is the exact same response they are receiving from Apple support".
Any reasonably-substantiated number is acceptable! Out of 2.5 million iPhones, is that number:
-- 250
-- 1,000
-- 1,000,000
Let's focus on how big a problem this is!
Seriously, I sure would like to know!
.
My thinking on the numbers who are effected by these issues is that all the phones are probably the same. My phone has less reception issues when I'm not hot and my hands are dry, though it's still there, just less so, maybe by as much as fifty percent. Given that I would expect the issues to be slightly less in cooler climates than warmer climates, though many, especially in the US, live in air-con bubbles most of the time so that might balance things out. Take any iPhone to where I live and pending on the persons hand perspiration primarily, I would think the same problems would arise if they were on the same network.
I think everyone is being told the same thing by Apple. Certainly my nearest Apple store said the same thing as the technician. I'm sure some people are being given replacements for other issues to mask that the phone is being replaced due to the reception issues to placate certain customers, for whatever reasons, but I would think that's a very small percentage. Apple seems pretty determined about this policy at the moment and for good reason because they know full well replacing the phone will make absolutely no difference and of course could cost them a ton of money.
No. Did I write that somewhere? Show me.
You make much of the "hysteria" of those who think this is a real issue, but maybe you could pause for a moment and analyse the strident nature of your own responses.
But I'm sure you'll just make some personal attack on me and hopefully add me to your ignore list.
So it's hysterical to ask for evidence rather than anecdotal complaints? You are really confused. Hysteria is all the "the sky is falling because I got fewer bars" whining on this board. My response is simply trying to get people to deal with facts INSTEAD OF hysteria.
Hmmm, there's no question the iPhone 4 antenna performs better then the iPhone 3GS. Until you factor in the massive antenna attenuation if you touch the wrong spot. Did you not see their chart ? That is the issue.
Also in his next paragraph, he refers to using the bumper during this day in testing. Which of course fixes this issue.
Clearly you are not understanding the entire article. The below paragraph that was in their final wrapup of the review, gives a better picture of their opinion -
You keep ignoring this paragraph:
"From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use."
They did not have ANY dropped calls on the iPhone 4 and found that they were able to connect in places that the iPhone 3GS didn't work. So, EVEN WITH the signal attenuation, they still got better connections.
So where's all the evidence of massive numbers of dropped calls that you keep imagining?
{Response to a person asking for factual numbers} You are missing my point. You claim that Apple memo could be fake. Fair enough. But yet most of the evidence we have seen so far points to be an accurate document. Yes, I know you don't have the issue. That's great. But go try calling support yourself and see if they don't tell you to hold it differently and avoid touching the seam. The issue, the flaw.
No, YOU are missing the point. No one has ever denied that some phones have a drop in the number of bars. What you're being asked for is evidence that a significant number of people are experiencing an increase in the number of dropped calls when using the phone normally. You are clearly unable to provide that evidence - or, apparently, even able to understand that factual evidence is.
My thinking on the numbers who are effected by these issues is that all the phones are probably the same. My phone has less reception issues when I'm not hot and my hands are dry, though it's still there, just less so, maybe by as much as fifty percent. Given that I would expect the issues to be slightly less in cooler climates than warmer climates, though many, especially in the US, live in air-con bubbles most of the time so that might balance things out. Take any iPhone to where I live and pending on the persons hand perspiration primarily, I would think the same problems would arise if they were on the same network.
I think everyone is being told the same thing by Apple. Certainly my nearest Apple store said the same thing as the technician. I'm sure some people are being given replacements for other issues to mask that the phone is being replaced due to the reception issues to placate certain customers, for whatever reasons, but I would think that's a very small percentage. Apple seems pretty determined about this policy at the moment and for good reason because they know full well replacing the phone will make absolutely no difference and of course could cost them a ton of money.
I've been saying since day one to people who have the reproducible signal loss issues whenever the touch the Three-G-Spot* to get a replacement. From a consumer perspective I still hold that as the best option, but from Apple's perspective that may not solve anything.
If you get several defective items in a row you can lose faith in that company or product even if all the items came from the sam batch. If it's a production issue, perhaps they haven't quite pinpointed where the problem starts so they can recall or offer replacements or fixes to those affected model numbers.
If it's a SW fix (for example) for some oddly constructed ? but not bad ? TriQuint chip then replacing new phones with the same iOS version wouldn't do much good, and they'd still have to know which models had this TriQuint chip (which may be impossible) so they could know which phones to expect with the issue and which phone not to sell.
As much as we hate it and as much as we think they are reacting slowly this is still only the 7th day (in my country) that the iPhone 4 has been on shelves. Hell, the iPad which launched in April still hasn't gotten a single bug fix update.
* Thanks Applebaum.