Apple has used SoC designs for several years, culminating in the iPad's custom A4 SoC in early 2010. The A4 has since made its way into the iPhone 4, the iPod touch and the Apple TV.
That's a very misleading way of stating the situation. Microsoft's previous software targeting portable devices, such as Windows CE, have been totally capable of running on a SoC for years as well -- namely, for as long as Windows CE has existed. That decision is totally up to the hardware manufacturer, which in the vast majority of cases, isn't Microsoft.
Quote:
Originally Posted by knightlie
Porting Windows - full Windows - to a new architecture is hardly an "incremental" feature (I'm tempted to add ", Daniel." as this is plainly a DED article). This is a serious development.
You're right, this is absolutely not an "incremental" modification to Windows.
But, keep in mind that Microsoft designed the Windows NT kernel, from the ground up, to be portable to multiple processor architectures, with a "hardware abstraction layer" that isolates the Win32 API from the underlying CPU architecture. Windows NT was originally designed to target both 32-bit x86 as well as Intel's RISC-based i860. Development was initially done on the i860, and then ported back to the x86, specifically so that the engineers would be disciplined to avoid introducing any dependence on x86-specific features. When Intel's marketing of the i860 failed to stir up any significant amount of commercially released hardware, Microsoft abandoned the i860 port in favour of MIPS and Alpha ports; MIPS was complete in time for Windows NT's first commercial release, and Aplha followed shortly after due to DEC's delays in producing working Alpha silicon.
So far, commercial versions of the Windows NT kernel have been released, at various points in the product's history, for x86-32, MIPS, PowerPC, Alpha, Itanium, and x86-64. Now, they're adding ARM to the mix.
One of the biggest surprises at CES is Windows on ARM. Also, NVIDIA is developing ARM chips now. Big stuff. If that's underwhelming, all of CES is underwhelming.
No mention of the next-gen Surface? I thought it was pretty sweet looking. It's only inches thick now and is sensitive enough to read text on a piece of paper you place down on top of it. (Per pixel sensitivity.) It's going to be much more affordable (no specifics) too. Looked very impressive and a step towards consumer price ranges. Can't wait to see more about it.
This is a big year for Apple to prove that it is ahead of the game. Many, many on-the-fence tablet people are drooling over the new stuff. Can't wait to see what Apple offers, and I am interested how far along Apple might be on transitioning higher level Mac OS X stuff to ARM, or if it cares to.
Finally a smart move by ms. They have admitted defeat in tablet space and are content with a small foothold in the phone business. Instead they will focus on areas they do well in, namely xbox and desktop os. Good business model for at least the next 10 years. By that time they may either get smaller in size or actually acquire talent for the next wave of technology.
How is developing Windows for ARM "admitting defeat in the tablet space"? I'm not following you. That could be the only thing that saves Microsoft in the tablet and laptop/sub-laptop space, if they can pull it off in 2 years.
It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.
Staying out of the tablet market for another 18 months just so they can deliver a business focused device is madness.
On one hand it's madness on the other its also madness to try and compete with the iPad right now. Version 2 is about to come out and if version 2 of the iPhone is anything to go by it's going to sell a lot. Irrespective of what they come out with the iPad would beat it because it's Apple. Bit like the Zune trying to compete with an iPod. Waiting a few years like they did with WP7 might give them longer term success rather than releasing something that immediately fails.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
Microsoft had nothing apart from vapourware windows 8 running on ARM, a small blip on the horizon, coming late to a market where Apple already are and Android, WebOS, Blackberry and others soon will be.
I disagree as a software company they should be showing off what they've managed to do, after all they don't sell the final product. A repeat of last year where they showed actual products that then didn't get produced is far worse. This year though is more like a perfect announcement:
1. Reports some success. 8 million Kinnects in 2 months or in other words over a billion in extra revenue over the next year.
2. Announce some new products. New Surface (probably not going to sell a lot but very cool), Avatar Kinnect (showing off that Kinnect can recognize facial expressions), and a bit of the next update to WP7.
3. Show off some future development. Windows 7 running on ARM, haven't people been shouting as MS to do this.
None of it's as exciting as announcing a brand new product, but then Apple only announce 1 brand new product each year and the rest are upgrades. Kinnects only 2 months old so why should they announce anything new.
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
Well, I must admit, I now am not sure. And to be sure, I would have to ask Solipsism what decade he was referring to when he stated, "All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade."
Quote:
Although any period of ten years is a decade,[2][3] a convenient and frequently referenced interval is based on the tens digit of the calendar year, as in using "1960s" to represent the decade from 1960 to 1969.[4][5] Often, for brevity, only the tens part is mentioned (60s or sixties), although this may leave it uncertain which century is meant. These references are frequently used to encapsulate popular culture or other widespread phenomena that dominated such a decade, as in The Great Depression of the 1930s.
Since the common calendar starts from the year 1, its first full decade contained the years from 1 to 10, the second decade from 11 to 20, and so on.[6] So while the "1960s" comprises the years 1960 to 1969, the "197th decade" spans 1961 to 1970.
A decade may also refer to an arbitrary span of 10 years. For example, the statement "during his last decade, Mozart explored chromatic harmony to a degree rare at the time," merely refers to the last 10 years of Mozart's life without regard to which calendar years are encompassed.
Thus, an unqualified reference to, for example, "the decade" or "this decade" may have multiple interpretations depending on the context.
All and as solipsism said, I agree that that this was the best CES MS has had this decade. In every sense, Ballmer said nothing and as such, based on last years debacle in particular, he did quite well.
We watched Ballmer's keynote* as well as followed CNET's live blog and the commentary? certainly was disparaging. And if you take the definition of 'keynote' literally, you have to ask CES's organizers how they can contend that Balmer's commercials could be construed, as they announced, the 2011 CES Keynote Address.
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
'Decade' is an imprecise term in regard to exactly what years are referred to. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decade if you like to use Wikipedia as your font of truth.
A decade can be any 10 year period. eadulf is correct that 2011 is the first year of the second decade of the 21st century. 2011 is also the second year of the 2010s and, for the decade arbitrarily beginning on January 1, 2005, 2011 is the seventh year. However, in the context of solipsism's post, I'm pretty sure that Onhka got it and Tallest Skil is in the uncomfortable position of being pedantic, wrong, and not in on the joke, which was pretty funny.
Microsoft is a slowly dying dinosaur waiting for a comet to put it out of its misery. It's almost painful to watch. But don't mourn for it too long, because it's like the Oracle said: "Everything that has a beginning has an end". The strong rise and the weak fall. Anno 2011 copying others doesn't cut it anymore. Another species, a warm-blooded kind, has developed and will soon become dominant. It's called Apple. It's nesting in a region called Cupertino and its vibrant children iPod, iPhone, iPad and iMac are highly skilled and spreading fast. And that's a good thing because the statement "Whatever device you use... Windows will be there.." will probably give the chills to many of us because it's contradicting what nature stands for. (Hope y'all appreciate the metaphor Cheers from across the big pond.
You think 8 million Kinects is a lot? You guys clearly don't know squat about video games.
Kinect is incredibly popular. 8 million units of an expensive add-on device for a 5 year old console is nothing short of phenomenal... but to do it in 2 months is almost unbelievable.
As a comparison Sony took 5 years to ship 10.5 million (relatively cheap) EyeToys... and that was to a PS2 install base almost three times greater than Microsoft has with Xbox 360.
That means Microsoft have already achieved an attach rate for Kinect (1/6.3) twice as high as Sony managed for the EyeToy (1/13.3)... in two months.
Even compared to games the Kinect is popular. In two months it has outsold and achieved higher attach rates than the most popular PS3 exclusives. e.g. Resistance 3.72m (1/12.3), LittleBigPlanet 4.09m (1/11.2), Uncharted2 4.29m (1/10.6), GT5 4.63m (9.84), MGS4 5.07m (1/9.0).
In any case Kinect will go down in history as one of the most popular add-on accessories for a console. From what I can tell the Wii Balance Board is the most popular. They have sold at least 23m units to an install base of 85m. That's an attach rate of 1/3.7. I'm not sure of exact numbers though. It's probably higher.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukeskymac
There is no doubt, these sales ARE NOT sustainable.
I totally agree. However even if Microsoft never sold another Kinect it still would be seen as a success. And how long do you think it needs to last? This console generation will be over some time next year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukeskymac
2011 will definitely be the year of the Playstation.
No doubt PS3 gamers around the world will have another awesome year... but the only way that 2011 will go down in history as the "year of the Playstation" is if Apple decide to buy out Sony with their spare change, announce the Apple Playstation 4 and rehire Kutargi to be Jobs' personal bitch slave.
I know MS$ is a touchy subject here, but this might give Intel the boot to start trying to compete with ARM processors. Intel may have the next best thing right now, but ARM is taking quite a bit of market share from them between tablets, and now net books and phones. I think phones will really be the computer of the future. Just my opinion.
intel doesn't need to worry much. Oaktrail is in the wings with still better performance than any ARM core and with lower power requiriments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sessamoid
And iPhone case sales will blow away Kinect sales by an order of magnitude! Wow!
Apples and oranges.
Netbook and iPads. Apple and oranges. One works without needing to be enslaved to the other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s
They still have an ARM license though, so who knows what will happen...
MSFT is an ARM licensee, too. What will happen then?
It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.
Neither does RiM, Nokia nor Android. Apple’s still the only modern mobile OS "designed for tablets" on the market.
You see the difference though?
Nokia and Intel are still working on MeeGo which they have stated will be designed for both tablets and phones (I'll leave out my opinions on MeeGo at the moment! ). It's not working, but we know their intention.
RiM have demonstrated the Blackberry Playbook. Not my cup of tea but it's certainly a proper tablet offering. Again, we know their intentions.
After seeing the Xoom preview I think Google can say they have created an OS "designed for tablets". We certainly know their intentions.
Which brings us to Microsoft. Not only have they not released something for the tablet space, they haven't even demonstrated anything. It seems like they have no intention of offering something specifically designed for tablets. All we know is some time in the next 1 to 2 years they will release a full blown Windows version that will run on ARM SOCs.
By that time Intel will have Cedar Trail on 22nm fabrication and getting close to 16nm and if Sandy Bridge is anything to go by the GPU side of their SOC will be respectable.
Not to say that I think getting Windows running on ARM is a bad idea, just that they shouldn't have put their entire tablet strategy (if they have one) on hold whilst they were waiting. They could have released a consumer focused WP7/ARM based tablet to fill in the 1-2 year interim. Applications based on XNA/Silverlight would have been totally portable across WP7/Tablet/Xbox/PC if they decided to change the underlying architecture at a later date.
EDIT: Apparently Microsoft are working on a touch based shell replacement for Windows 8 tablets. It's going to be a difficult job to introduce this if it ends up hitting later on in 2012.
I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind.
While this would be useful for SOHO servers, I sincerely doubt that anyone will be running Oracle RAC on an ARM chip anytime soon, or even Active Directory for that matter. \
OTOH, the chip itself could be certainly useful on consumer-level devices. The only question is, how flexible will the resulting OS sitting atop it be?
Quote:
This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it?ll be fashionable. That?s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.
Nobody wants to ignore a fast-growing consumer product. OTOH, I doubt that they're being leading-edge on this (I can run a full-blown Linux distro on an ARM chip right now, and have been able to for years.) IMHO, more like they're scrambling to put something, anything, onto an ARM chip... just to stay relevant with the end-user.
Kinect sales are indeed impressive, but there are a few things to keep in mind:
1) It's selling into an installed base of XBox owners who number in the millions already
2) Individually, it's significantly cheaper than even the least expensive iPad
3) Ballmer later admitted the 8 million figure was to sales channels worldwide, not to end consumers
Comparing a game controller to a tablet that just created its own market seems stupid. The only reason is so MS can say, "Look! We have something that outsold the iPad!"
And they still have released sales numbers for Windows Phone 7.
Kinect is incredibly popular. 8 million units of an expensive add-on device for a 5 year old console is nothing short of phenomenal... but to do it in 2 months is almost unbelievable.
Not if it's some incredibly overhyped gimmick technology no one has ever used before that was released nearly on holidays season
Quote:
As a comparison Sony took 5 years to ship 10.5 million (relatively cheap) EyeToys... and that was to a PS2 install base almost three times greater than Microsoft has with Xbox 360.
Comparing EyeToys to Kinects is comparing AppleTVs to iPhone 4s...
Quote:
Even compared to games the Kinect is popular. In two months it has outsold and achieved higher attach rates than the most popular PS3 exclusives. e.g. Resistance 3.72m (1/12.3), LittleBigPlanet 4.09m (1/11.2), Uncharted2 4.29m (1/10.6), GT5 4.63m (9.84), MGS4 5.07m (1/9.0).
Even if I forgave you for such comparison (I don't), Microsoft has lower profits with hardware than software licenses. And Kinect software mostly sucks. See the connection?
Quote:
In any case Kinect will go down in history as one of the most popular add-on accessories for a console. From what I can tell the Wii Balance Board is the most popular. They have sold at least 23m units to an install base of 85m. That's an attach rate of 1/3.7. I'm not sure of exact numbers though. It's probably higher.
That still doesn't make it a better platform. As was the case with the Wii.
Quote:
I totally agree. However even if Microsoft never sold another Kinect it still would be seen as a success. And how long do you think it needs to last? This console generation will be over some time next year.
Hah! Microsoft itself said the 360 is expected to last at least until 2014.
Quote:
No doubt PS3 gamers around the world will have another awesome year... but the only way that 2011 will go down in history as the "year of the Playstation" is if Apple decide to buy out Sony with their spare change, announce the Apple Playstation 4 and rehire Kutargi to be Jobs' personal bitch slave.
"Whatever device you use... Windows will be there," said Ballmer during Wednesday's keynote, Engadget reports. "Windows PCs will continue to adapt and evolve. Windows will be everywhere on every device without compromise."
Remember the time when it was everyone else who had to adapt and evolve according to what Microsoft did?
Wait...nevermind. Microsoft stole or copied from everyone else in the first place!
MS is acting like Atom chips are the only thing keep Windows off tablets and other low powered devices. ARM does nothing to simplify the user experience for a tablet device. Sure, you'll get better batter life.... maybe... a lot of other changes will be necessary to do that, but what about the user experience?
ARM will create a big problem that users are not going to cope with easily. x86 programs won't run and an Apple style Rosetta will strain ARM. I don't see that being possible or compatible with battery life goals.
So I need all new apps? Well I need those for Android and iPad anyway, and those apps are designed for touch. Not just recompiled windows apps.
Windows everywhere? Do users really want that?
Now, an ARM server or laptops might be very interesting as more powerful ARM chips ship.
Comments
Apple has used SoC designs for several years, culminating in the iPad's custom A4 SoC in early 2010. The A4 has since made its way into the iPhone 4, the iPod touch and the Apple TV.
That's a very misleading way of stating the situation. Microsoft's previous software targeting portable devices, such as Windows CE, have been totally capable of running on a SoC for years as well -- namely, for as long as Windows CE has existed. That decision is totally up to the hardware manufacturer, which in the vast majority of cases, isn't Microsoft.
Porting Windows - full Windows - to a new architecture is hardly an "incremental" feature (I'm tempted to add ", Daniel." as this is plainly a DED article). This is a serious development.
You're right, this is absolutely not an "incremental" modification to Windows.
But, keep in mind that Microsoft designed the Windows NT kernel, from the ground up, to be portable to multiple processor architectures, with a "hardware abstraction layer" that isolates the Win32 API from the underlying CPU architecture. Windows NT was originally designed to target both 32-bit x86 as well as Intel's RISC-based i860. Development was initially done on the i860, and then ported back to the x86, specifically so that the engineers would be disciplined to avoid introducing any dependence on x86-specific features. When Intel's marketing of the i860 failed to stir up any significant amount of commercially released hardware, Microsoft abandoned the i860 port in favour of MIPS and Alpha ports; MIPS was complete in time for Windows NT's first commercial release, and Aplha followed shortly after due to DEC's delays in producing working Alpha silicon.
So far, commercial versions of the Windows NT kernel have been released, at various points in the product's history, for x86-32, MIPS, PowerPC, Alpha, Itanium, and x86-64. Now, they're adding ARM to the mix.
No mention of the next-gen Surface? I thought it was pretty sweet looking. It's only inches thick now and is sensitive enough to read text on a piece of paper you place down on top of it. (Per pixel sensitivity.) It's going to be much more affordable (no specifics) too. Looked very impressive and a step towards consumer price ranges. Can't wait to see more about it.
This is a big year for Apple to prove that it is ahead of the game. Many, many on-the-fence tablet people are drooling over the new stuff. Can't wait to see what Apple offers, and I am interested how far along Apple might be on transitioning higher level Mac OS X stuff to ARM, or if it cares to.
Finally a smart move by ms. They have admitted defeat in tablet space and are content with a small foothold in the phone business. Instead they will focus on areas they do well in, namely xbox and desktop os. Good business model for at least the next 10 years. By that time they may either get smaller in size or actually acquire talent for the next wave of technology.
How is developing Windows for ARM "admitting defeat in the tablet space"? I'm not following you. That could be the only thing that saves Microsoft in the tablet and laptop/sub-laptop space, if they can pull it off in 2 years.
It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.
Staying out of the tablet market for another 18 months just so they can deliver a business focused device is madness.
On one hand it's madness on the other its also madness to try and compete with the iPad right now. Version 2 is about to come out and if version 2 of the iPhone is anything to go by it's going to sell a lot. Irrespective of what they come out with the iPad would beat it because it's Apple. Bit like the Zune trying to compete with an iPod. Waiting a few years like they did with WP7 might give them longer term success rather than releasing something that immediately fails.
Microsoft had nothing apart from vapourware windows 8 running on ARM, a small blip on the horizon, coming late to a market where Apple already are and Android, WebOS, Blackberry and others soon will be.
I disagree as a software company they should be showing off what they've managed to do, after all they don't sell the final product. A repeat of last year where they showed actual products that then didn't get produced is far worse. This year though is more like a perfect announcement:
1. Reports some success. 8 million Kinnects in 2 months or in other words over a billion in extra revenue over the next year.
2. Announce some new products. New Surface (probably not going to sell a lot but very cool), Avatar Kinnect (showing off that Kinnect can recognize facial expressions), and a bit of the next update to WP7.
3. Show off some future development. Windows 7 running on ARM, haven't people been shouting as MS to do this.
None of it's as exciting as announcing a brand new product, but then Apple only announce 1 brand new product each year and the rest are upgrades. Kinnects only 2 months old so why should they announce anything new.
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
Well, I must admit, I now am not sure. And to be sure, I would have to ask Solipsism what decade he was referring to when he stated, "All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade."
Although any period of ten years is a decade,[2][3] a convenient and frequently referenced interval is based on the tens digit of the calendar year, as in using "1960s" to represent the decade from 1960 to 1969.[4][5] Often, for brevity, only the tens part is mentioned (60s or sixties), although this may leave it uncertain which century is meant. These references are frequently used to encapsulate popular culture or other widespread phenomena that dominated such a decade, as in The Great Depression of the 1930s.
Since the common calendar starts from the year 1, its first full decade contained the years from 1 to 10, the second decade from 11 to 20, and so on.[6] So while the "1960s" comprises the years 1960 to 1969, the "197th decade" spans 1961 to 1970.
A decade may also refer to an arbitrary span of 10 years. For example, the statement "during his last decade, Mozart explored chromatic harmony to a degree rare at the time," merely refers to the last 10 years of Mozart's life without regard to which calendar years are encompassed.
Thus, an unqualified reference to, for example, "the decade" or "this decade" may have multiple interpretations depending on the context.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decade
All and as solipsism said, I agree that that this was the best CES MS has had this decade. In every sense, Ballmer said nothing and as such, based on last years debacle in particular, he did quite well.
We watched Ballmer's keynote* as well as followed CNET's live blog and the commentary? certainly was disparaging. And if you take the definition of 'keynote' literally, you have to ask CES's organizers how they can contend that Balmer's commercials could be construed, as they announced, the 2011 CES Keynote Address.
* http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/e...iveKeynoteDay1
?Particularly to the reference to Avatar Kinect and the porn industry.
Fair enough, considering that this decade is only 6 days old
2010 started this decade.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010s
You are right. My apologies to all.
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
'Decade' is an imprecise term in regard to exactly what years are referred to. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decade if you like to use Wikipedia as your font of truth.
A decade can be any 10 year period. eadulf is correct that 2011 is the first year of the second decade of the 21st century. 2011 is also the second year of the 2010s and, for the decade arbitrarily beginning on January 1, 2005, 2011 is the seventh year. However, in the context of solipsism's post, I'm pretty sure that Onhka got it and Tallest Skil is in the uncomfortable position of being pedantic, wrong, and not in on the joke, which was pretty funny.
The previous claim that it would outsell the iPad look to be correct, and by a large margin.
it also outsold ferraris and zanussi tumble dryers in the same time period.
I was amazed by that !
Is this article serious??? I just finished watching the keynote and I was impressed.
Hopefully Apple is still a step ahead...
A step? MS just announced that they'll introduce copy and paste to Windows Phone 7; a feature that made its way into iOs 19 months ago.
So I think, yeah, it's safe to say they're at least than a step ahead.
... at which point, the audience ran screaming from the building.
You think 8 million Kinects is a lot? You guys clearly don't know squat about video games.
Kinect is incredibly popular. 8 million units of an expensive add-on device for a 5 year old console is nothing short of phenomenal... but to do it in 2 months is almost unbelievable.
As a comparison Sony took 5 years to ship 10.5 million (relatively cheap) EyeToys... and that was to a PS2 install base almost three times greater than Microsoft has with Xbox 360.
That means Microsoft have already achieved an attach rate for Kinect (1/6.3) twice as high as Sony managed for the EyeToy (1/13.3)... in two months.
Even compared to games the Kinect is popular. In two months it has outsold and achieved higher attach rates than the most popular PS3 exclusives. e.g. Resistance 3.72m (1/12.3), LittleBigPlanet 4.09m (1/11.2), Uncharted2 4.29m (1/10.6), GT5 4.63m (9.84), MGS4 5.07m (1/9.0).
In any case Kinect will go down in history as one of the most popular add-on accessories for a console. From what I can tell the Wii Balance Board is the most popular. They have sold at least 23m units to an install base of 85m. That's an attach rate of 1/3.7. I'm not sure of exact numbers though. It's probably higher.
There is no doubt, these sales ARE NOT sustainable.
I totally agree. However even if Microsoft never sold another Kinect it still would be seen as a success. And how long do you think it needs to last? This console generation will be over some time next year.
2011 will definitely be the year of the Playstation.
No doubt PS3 gamers around the world will have another awesome year... but the only way that 2011 will go down in history as the "year of the Playstation" is if Apple decide to buy out Sony with their spare change, announce the Apple Playstation 4 and rehire Kutargi to be Jobs' personal bitch slave.
deleted
I know MS$ is a touchy subject here, but this might give Intel the boot to start trying to compete with ARM processors. Intel may have the next best thing right now, but ARM is taking quite a bit of market share from them between tablets, and now net books and phones. I think phones will really be the computer of the future. Just my opinion.
intel doesn't need to worry much. Oaktrail is in the wings with still better performance than any ARM core and with lower power requiriments.
And iPhone case sales will blow away Kinect sales by an order of magnitude! Wow!
Apples and oranges.
Netbook and iPads. Apple and oranges. One works without needing to be enslaved to the other.
They still have an ARM license though, so who knows what will happen...
MSFT is an ARM licensee, too. What will happen then?
It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.
Neither does RiM, Nokia nor Android. Apple’s still the only modern mobile OS "designed for tablets" on the market.
You see the difference though?
Nokia and Intel are still working on MeeGo which they have stated will be designed for both tablets and phones (I'll leave out my opinions on MeeGo at the moment!
RiM have demonstrated the Blackberry Playbook. Not my cup of tea but it's certainly a proper tablet offering. Again, we know their intentions.
After seeing the Xoom preview I think Google can say they have created an OS "designed for tablets". We certainly know their intentions.
Which brings us to Microsoft. Not only have they not released something for the tablet space, they haven't even demonstrated anything. It seems like they have no intention of offering something specifically designed for tablets. All we know is some time in the next 1 to 2 years they will release a full blown Windows version that will run on ARM SOCs.
By that time Intel will have Cedar Trail on 22nm fabrication and getting close to 16nm and if Sandy Bridge is anything to go by the GPU side of their SOC will be respectable.
Not to say that I think getting Windows running on ARM is a bad idea, just that they shouldn't have put their entire tablet strategy (if they have one) on hold whilst they were waiting. They could have released a consumer focused WP7/ARM based tablet to fill in the 1-2 year interim. Applications based on XNA/Silverlight would have been totally portable across WP7/Tablet/Xbox/PC if they decided to change the underlying architecture at a later date.
EDIT: Apparently Microsoft are working on a touch based shell replacement for Windows 8 tablets. It's going to be a difficult job to introduce this if it ends up hitting later on in 2012.
I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind.
While this would be useful for SOHO servers, I sincerely doubt that anyone will be running Oracle RAC on an ARM chip anytime soon, or even Active Directory for that matter.
OTOH, the chip itself could be certainly useful on consumer-level devices. The only question is, how flexible will the resulting OS sitting atop it be?
This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it?ll be fashionable. That?s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.
Nobody wants to ignore a fast-growing consumer product. OTOH, I doubt that they're being leading-edge on this (I can run a full-blown Linux distro on an ARM chip right now, and have been able to for years.) IMHO, more like they're scrambling to put something, anything, onto an ARM chip... just to stay relevant with the end-user.
1) It's selling into an installed base of XBox owners who number in the millions already
2) Individually, it's significantly cheaper than even the least expensive iPad
3) Ballmer later admitted the 8 million figure was to sales channels worldwide, not to end consumers
Comparing a game controller to a tablet that just created its own market seems stupid. The only reason is so MS can say, "Look! We have something that outsold the iPad!"
And they still have released sales numbers for Windows Phone 7.
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
I'm with you on this one... when I count to 10 I don't usually start with 0 and end with 9.
Kinect is incredibly popular. 8 million units of an expensive add-on device for a 5 year old console is nothing short of phenomenal... but to do it in 2 months is almost unbelievable.
Not if it's some incredibly overhyped gimmick technology no one has ever used before that was released nearly on holidays season
As a comparison Sony took 5 years to ship 10.5 million (relatively cheap) EyeToys... and that was to a PS2 install base almost three times greater than Microsoft has with Xbox 360.
Comparing EyeToys to Kinects is comparing AppleTVs to iPhone 4s...
Even compared to games the Kinect is popular. In two months it has outsold and achieved higher attach rates than the most popular PS3 exclusives. e.g. Resistance 3.72m (1/12.3), LittleBigPlanet 4.09m (1/11.2), Uncharted2 4.29m (1/10.6), GT5 4.63m (9.84), MGS4 5.07m (1/9.0).
Even if I forgave you for such comparison (I don't), Microsoft has lower profits with hardware than software licenses. And Kinect software mostly sucks. See the connection?
In any case Kinect will go down in history as one of the most popular add-on accessories for a console. From what I can tell the Wii Balance Board is the most popular. They have sold at least 23m units to an install base of 85m. That's an attach rate of 1/3.7. I'm not sure of exact numbers though. It's probably higher.
That still doesn't make it a better platform. As was the case with the Wii.
I totally agree. However even if Microsoft never sold another Kinect it still would be seen as a success. And how long do you think it needs to last? This console generation will be over some time next year.
Hah! Microsoft itself said the 360 is expected to last at least until 2014.
No doubt PS3 gamers around the world will have another awesome year... but the only way that 2011 will go down in history as the "year of the Playstation" is if Apple decide to buy out Sony with their spare change, announce the Apple Playstation 4 and rehire Kutargi to be Jobs' personal bitch slave.
Don't know squat about games, do you?
"Whatever device you use... Windows will be there," said Ballmer during Wednesday's keynote, Engadget reports. "Windows PCs will continue to adapt and evolve. Windows will be everywhere on every device without compromise."
Remember the time when it was everyone else who had to adapt and evolve according to what Microsoft did?
Wait...nevermind. Microsoft stole or copied from everyone else in the first place!
ARM will create a big problem that users are not going to cope with easily. x86 programs won't run and an Apple style Rosetta will strain ARM. I don't see that being possible or compatible with battery life goals.
So I need all new apps? Well I need those for Android and iPad anyway, and those apps are designed for touch. Not just recompiled windows apps.
Windows everywhere? Do users really want that?
Now, an ARM server or laptops might be very interesting as more powerful ARM chips ship.