Tim wisely went out of his way at the launch to remark that the 'what is and isn't 4G debate' was better left to others and that Apple wasn't getting involved.
If Apple changes the indicator to "4G" for HSPA+ connections, then it ought to display a "ball-and-chain" icon when AT&T is throttling your connection speeds. Just saying.
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
I have 825G where I live. Since the telecoms believe that they can call any speed whatever they want, I call my home Wi-Fi network 825G. It's faster than 824G, at least.
Why add a 4G to the bar now and diminish the next iPhone model? Won't happen. If Apple considered the phone 4G they would have marketed it that way. They haven't, which means they won't.
This would dumb on AT&T's part. Their network just doesn't hit anywhere near HSPA+ or LTE theoretical speeds on the current network. If they make it display "4G" I can already see the mass of uninformed, confused masses that will start telling people that AT&T's 4G (HSDPA) is soooooooo slow compared to Verizon (LTE) and Sprint (WiMax-LTE) 4G. That would just further ruin the reputation of their network.
nG is an overloaded marketing term. nG between carriers can not be an apples to apples comparison period.
They need to get rid of it. So for AT&T they have every right to call HSPA+ 4G. Its their right, just like its the right of Sprint to call WiMax 4G. Its marketing, and marketing does not have to make any sense.
AT&T is shooting themselves in the foot here. When they actually roll out real 4G, what will their marketing department be able to say? Welcome to 4G - again? They are lowering the marketing value of their future 4G network by trying to use the 4G brand now.
AT&T is shooting themselves in the foot here. When they actually roll out real 4G, what will their marketing department be able to say? Welcome to 4G - again? They are lowering the marketing value of their future 4G network by trying to use the 4G brand now.
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
Why does it matter if we call it 4G or not? Does calling it 4G make it any faster? No, the very existence of terms like 3G and 4G fills me with dismay. Just tell us how fast the thing is and leave it at that. These Fischer Price tags really get my goat. If it gets 14.4 Mbps then great, but you know there'll be idiots out there who still buy the Android phone next to it because it's '4G'. I don't get 14.4Mbps on my home broadband, so I'm skeptical I'll see it on my mobile phone any time soon!
The whole thing is there purely for marketing purposes and people get drawn into technical debates about that these terms mean, as if they mean anything at all!
In 2030 we'll have 9G phones, which of course means...whatever these companies decide it means at the time! There's a reason we have imperial units for measuring things.
Regardless of what you call it - I get 50Mbps download and 5Mbps upload on my home network - maybe not for all websites all the time - but pretty consistently 32Mbps downloads from Apple for example.
How funny. Not a single US phone is capable of true 4G. I see no reason why Apple can't label theirs as 4G. It is no more or less accurate than every other US '4G' phone as none of them meets the minimum requirements for 4G.
The 4G standard indicates a speed of 100 Mbps for high mobility users (such as those on a train) and 1 Gbps for low mobility users (pedestrians) and no carrier here is providing that.
I would actually like some sort of indication if I'm getting the 14 mbps speed as I'm in one of the few areas that supports it.
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
Why does it matter if we call it 4G or not? Does calling it 4G make it any faster?
EXACTLY. This is why Apple seems to be backing away from tech specs and, instead, focusing on customer experience.
AT&T wants Apple to call the iPhone 4S a 4G device? Please. If AT&T thought that calling the iPhone 4S an artichoke would lure customers, AT&T would want Apple to put an artichoke indicator in the status bar. It's all so stupid. Any customer who tries to compare an iPhone to an Android phone or windows phone based on tech specs is an idiot who deserves the lesser user experience.
I have 825G where I live. Since the telecoms believe that they can call any speed whatever they want, I call my home Wi-Fi network 825G. It's faster than 824G, at least.
Holy crap! I only have 256G
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilgto64
Regardless of what you call it - I get 50Mbps download and 5Mbps upload on my home network - maybe not for all websites all the time - but pretty consistently 32Mbps downloads from Apple for example.
I'm not sure what that has to do with this but that's lovely lol. You're VERY unusual to say the least. If you really get 32Mbps from Apple's server I'd be quite surprised tbh. Either way, the VAST majority of people get nothing like 14.4Mbps. I'm the envy of my friends with 9!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2oh1
EXACTLY. This is why Apple seems to be backing away from tech specs and, instead, focusing on customer experience.
AT&T wants Apple to call the iPhone 4S a 4G device? Please. If AT&T thought that calling the iPhone 4S an artichoke would lure customers, AT&T would want Apple to put an artichoke indicator in the status bar. It's all so stupid. Any customer who tries to compare an iPhone to an Android phone or windows phone based on tech specs is an idiot who deserves the lesser user experience.
I want an artichoke indicator!! Those Android phones don't have artichokes!
I hear Apple criticised a lot for not quoting tech specs extensively and you're quite right, they miss the point. The rest of the industry has got bogged down in specs because that's the only differentiator they have because they don't control the software too. It's not a myth, Apple make their stuff work. The iPhone is a perfect example. It's not a million times more powerful than the competition, it's actually less powerful technically, but you'd never guess it using the thing because it WORKS better.
Because the iPhone 4S is capable of 4G-like speeds on HSPA+ networks, AT&T hopes to convince Apple to add a "4G" indicator to the handset's status bar.
The push, revealed in an internal memo leaked to The Verge, would allow AT&T to further differentiate itself from competitors Verizon and Sprint, which run CDMA networks and do not offer HSPA+ connectivity. However, HSPA+ also does not fall under the definition of "true" 4G.
The language of the memo seems to suggest that Apple is open to the idea, and even goes as far as to say that the change will arrive in the form of an update to iOS for AT&T iPhones.
"AT&T is working with Apple to update the network indicator for AT&T's iPhone 4S to read "4G," the memo reads. "This will happen with an iOS release from Apple. Since iPhone 4S is an HSPA+ device, our customers will get 4G speeds from day one. Only AT&T has this unique network advantage."
A redesigned antenna that allows for faster HSPA+ connections is one of the major features of the new iPhone 4S unveiled this week. However, at the company's keynote presentation, Apple executives did not outright declare that the iPhone 4S is a 4G phone.
While Apple has not yet gone as far as to call the iPhone 4S a "4G phone," U.S. carriers AT&T and T-Mobile have advertised their own HSPA+ networks as having "4G" speeds, even though they aren't true fourth-generation technology. AT&T is currently rolling out a true LTE 4G network in the U.S., and the carrier's proposed acquisition of T-Mobile would give it more spectrum to expand its coverage.
Apple executives this week went as far as to say that the iPhone 4S offers data speeds that are competitive with existing 4G networks.
AT&T's official coverage map shows HSPA+ "4G" available in a number of major metropolitan areas across the U.S., though the vast majority of the country receives either traditional 3G "mobile broadband," or even slower EDGE speeds. AT&T's 4G LTE network is available in a total of five cities.
Is the naming of networks the same as the naming of Iphones?
1st Iphone. 2nd Iphone 3G. 3rd Iphone 3GS. 4th Iphone 4 (4 and 4 what a concept). 5th Iphone 4S.
If the device or the network is the next step in advancement or evolution then name it as such. If they are doing an incremental upgrade to the device or the network i guess they can call it whatever they want...or not.
So those complaining about the 5th Iphone being called Iphone 4S, get a grip it is what it is (5th hardware upgrade). Is the HSPA+ better than 3G? Then give it some indication. You choose.
Comments
Tim wisely went out of his way at the launch to remark that the 'what is and isn't 4G debate' was better left to others and that Apple wasn't getting involved.
Which makes me think that talking point is BS
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
I have 825G where I live. Since the telecoms believe that they can call any speed whatever they want, I call my home Wi-Fi network 825G. It's faster than 824G, at least.
They need to get rid of it. So for AT&T they have every right to call HSPA+ 4G. Its their right, just like its the right of Sprint to call WiMax 4G. Its marketing, and marketing does not have to make any sense.
AT&T is shooting themselves in the foot here. When they actually roll out real 4G, what will their marketing department be able to say? Welcome to 4G - again? They are lowering the marketing value of their future 4G network by trying to use the 4G brand now.
4G2: Electric Downloadaloo.
Ooh, a good idea. I like it.
Or better still - have it display how much money your carrier is sucking out of your bank account.
Or maybe a series of smiley to sad faces.
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
Why does it matter if we call it 4G or not? Does calling it 4G make it any faster? No, the very existence of terms like 3G and 4G fills me with dismay. Just tell us how fast the thing is and leave it at that. These Fischer Price tags really get my goat. If it gets 14.4 Mbps then great, but you know there'll be idiots out there who still buy the Android phone next to it because it's '4G'. I don't get 14.4Mbps on my home broadband, so I'm skeptical I'll see it on my mobile phone any time soon!
The whole thing is there purely for marketing purposes and people get drawn into technical debates about that these terms mean, as if they mean anything at all!
In 2030 we'll have 9G phones, which of course means...whatever these companies decide it means at the time! There's a reason we have imperial units for measuring things.
Regardless of what you call it - I get 50Mbps download and 5Mbps upload on my home network - maybe not for all websites all the time - but pretty consistently 32Mbps downloads from Apple for example.
The 4G standard indicates a speed of 100 Mbps for high mobility users (such as those on a train) and 1 Gbps for low mobility users (pedestrians) and no carrier here is providing that.
I would actually like some sort of indication if I'm getting the 14 mbps speed as I'm in one of the few areas that supports it.
Or maybe a series of smiley to sad faces.
I actually really, really like this idea.
Or maybe a series of smiley to sad faces.
Like
Like
lol..easy to implement too. ASCII art
THIS, THIS is why I hate the technology industry sometimes.
Why does it matter if we call it 4G or not? Does calling it 4G make it any faster?
EXACTLY. This is why Apple seems to be backing away from tech specs and, instead, focusing on customer experience.
AT&T wants Apple to call the iPhone 4S a 4G device? Please. If AT&T thought that calling the iPhone 4S an artichoke would lure customers, AT&T would want Apple to put an artichoke indicator in the status bar. It's all so stupid. Any customer who tries to compare an iPhone to an Android phone or windows phone based on tech specs is an idiot who deserves the lesser user experience.
1) iPhone
2) iPhone 3G
3) iPhone 3GS
4) iPhone 4
5) iPhone 4S
-----
6) iPhone 4G
7) iPhone 4GS
8) iPhone 8
9) iPhone 8S
10) iPhone X (Cheetah)
11) iPhone X.1 (Puma)
12) iPhone X.2 (Jaguar)
13) iPhone X.3 (Panther)
14) iPhone X.4 (Tiger)
15) iPhone X.5 (Leopard)
16) iPhone X.6 (Snow Leopard)
17) iPhone X.7 (Lion)
I have 825G where I live. Since the telecoms believe that they can call any speed whatever they want, I call my home Wi-Fi network 825G. It's faster than 824G, at least.
Holy crap! I only have 256G
Regardless of what you call it - I get 50Mbps download and 5Mbps upload on my home network - maybe not for all websites all the time - but pretty consistently 32Mbps downloads from Apple for example.
I'm not sure what that has to do with this but that's lovely lol. You're VERY unusual to say the least. If you really get 32Mbps from Apple's server I'd be quite surprised tbh. Either way, the VAST majority of people get nothing like 14.4Mbps. I'm the envy of my friends with 9!
EXACTLY. This is why Apple seems to be backing away from tech specs and, instead, focusing on customer experience.
AT&T wants Apple to call the iPhone 4S a 4G device? Please. If AT&T thought that calling the iPhone 4S an artichoke would lure customers, AT&T would want Apple to put an artichoke indicator in the status bar. It's all so stupid. Any customer who tries to compare an iPhone to an Android phone or windows phone based on tech specs is an idiot who deserves the lesser user experience.
I want an artichoke indicator!! Those Android phones don't have artichokes!
I hear Apple criticised a lot for not quoting tech specs extensively and you're quite right, they miss the point. The rest of the industry has got bogged down in specs because that's the only differentiator they have because they don't control the software too. It's not a myth, Apple make their stuff work. The iPhone is a perfect example. It's not a million times more powerful than the competition, it's actually less powerful technically, but you'd never guess it using the thing because it WORKS better.
Because the iPhone 4S is capable of 4G-like speeds on HSPA+ networks, AT&T hopes to convince Apple to add a "4G" indicator to the handset's status bar.
The push, revealed in an internal memo leaked to The Verge, would allow AT&T to further differentiate itself from competitors Verizon and Sprint, which run CDMA networks and do not offer HSPA+ connectivity. However, HSPA+ also does not fall under the definition of "true" 4G.
The language of the memo seems to suggest that Apple is open to the idea, and even goes as far as to say that the change will arrive in the form of an update to iOS for AT&T iPhones.
"AT&T is working with Apple to update the network indicator for AT&T's iPhone 4S to read "4G," the memo reads. "This will happen with an iOS release from Apple. Since iPhone 4S is an HSPA+ device, our customers will get 4G speeds from day one. Only AT&T has this unique network advantage."
A redesigned antenna that allows for faster HSPA+ connections is one of the major features of the new iPhone 4S unveiled this week. However, at the company's keynote presentation, Apple executives did not outright declare that the iPhone 4S is a 4G phone.
While Apple has not yet gone as far as to call the iPhone 4S a "4G phone," U.S. carriers AT&T and T-Mobile have advertised their own HSPA+ networks as having "4G" speeds, even though they aren't true fourth-generation technology. AT&T is currently rolling out a true LTE 4G network in the U.S., and the carrier's proposed acquisition of T-Mobile would give it more spectrum to expand its coverage.
Apple executives this week went as far as to say that the iPhone 4S offers data speeds that are competitive with existing 4G networks.
AT&T's official coverage map shows HSPA+ "4G" available in a number of major metropolitan areas across the U.S., though the vast majority of the country receives either traditional 3G "mobile broadband," or even slower EDGE speeds. AT&T's 4G LTE network is available in a total of five cities.
Is the naming of networks the same as the naming of Iphones?
1st Iphone. 2nd Iphone 3G. 3rd Iphone 3GS. 4th Iphone 4 (4 and 4 what a concept). 5th Iphone 4S.
If the device or the network is the next step in advancement or evolution then name it as such. If they are doing an incremental upgrade to the device or the network i guess they can call it whatever they want...or not.
So those complaining about the 5th Iphone being called Iphone 4S, get a grip it is what it is (5th hardware upgrade). Is the HSPA+ better than 3G? Then give it some indication. You choose.