I'm saying Adobe got flash to work fine in Android, and it's a total lie to say it doesn't.
Works fine? Really? We've even had other Android users post here to say otherwise.
Quote:
BTW, the only reason you people are "html5 people" is because the salesman Steve Jobs sold you bs that you gobbled up. He said flash couldn't run on mobile platforms, and also said it was a battery drain. Neither of those things turned out to be true.
Quote:
PS. Do you mind linking to where Steve Jobs said Flash couldn't run on mobile devices?
I think you missed this question. And he was correct on the battery drain as well.
Although I agree with Gruber's overall point, he lost me with the last, bolded sentence. We iOS users didn't "magically" have access to the full web and HTML5/video/animation playback beginning in 2007.
It hasn't been until that past year/year and a half or so that I've been able go to about 90% of my favorite websites and actually get HTML5 compliant video and animations on pages instead of the broken Flash icon. So to say that we've been benefiting since 2007 seems a bit disingenuous.
That is unless I'm not understanding his statement which I probably am
I don't think Gruber's comment is wrong, I think you are comparing today's open webcode to webcode of 2007. Even if Apple bent over backwards for Adobe the only Flash Apple could have possibly added was Flash Lite which wouldn't be the full web either since it wasn't even close to a modern version of Flash.
On top of that, there were years of fervent development that occurred because Apple pointed out Flash's faults (though MS did a lot, too, with Silverlight that also appeared on the scene in 2007). It took Adobe years to get the whole touch system worked out.
Even if that was all these issues were "magically" worked out in 2007, there's still the issue of Flash pages being designed for pointer(mouse) inputs and for larger screens. Yet with the iPhone, the browser was good. It was responsive. It was the first phone that didn't need to have a mobile version of a site for that site to be useful, yet (ironically) because the browser was so useful the web quickly moved to make an iPhone optimized option, even going so far as to add iPhone home screen icons so you can save a site's access to your Home Screen.
PS: When was the video tag added to iOS? I thought it was there since v1.0.
This is terrible news for savvy consumers who want the full web experience on their mobile devices.
ROFLOL - you can't be serious! The full web should not have proprietary technology running it that drains the battery, slows down the entire web experience and clogs the pipes with buggy bloated crapware. Get over yourself.
ROFLOL - you can't be serious! The full web should not have proprietary technology running it that drains the battery, slows down the entire web experience and clogs the pipes with buggy bloated crapware. Get over yourself.
If used correctly, Flash can be a really interesting platform (I develop games in Flash) because of the ease of publishing to multiple devices, etc. Unfortunately, on mobile it is true that the processors of the phones could not handle Flash because Flash unfortunately allows you to be lazy about optimizing, which usually leads to the battery and slow problems.
If used correctly, Flash can be a really interesting platform (I develop games in Flash) because of the ease of publishing to multiple devices, etc. Unfortunately, on mobile it is true that the processors of the phones could not handle Flash because Flash unfortunately allows you to be lazy about optimizing, which usually leads to the battery and slow problems.
Even optimised Flash applications I've seen use more processing power than they really should. Box.net has a file viewer and that works very well - its well optimised and does a cracking job, but why use flash when Javascript/AJAX/jQuery (choose your poison) inside an iFrame can do the same job and work on literally any device without a plugin? The new "Worker" method in Javascript allows true multi-threaded applications in Javascript - Flash still handles single threaded applications whilst creating its own bewildering amount of threads in the background just to get everything to work.
Well, that's certainly one POV. I don't characterize this as "Steve was right." I think Steve was more prescient about the future of mobile web standards. It didn't hurt that he took a hard line on "no plug-ins for mobile Safari" to help force the issue. That includes Microsoft's seldom loved Silverlight plug-in.
Microsoft don't even support the Silverlight plug-in on their own phone or in Metro IE10.
I'd be very surprised if it was Steve's hard-line stance on plug-ins that prevented it from appearing on iOS.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
unfortunately the sync to icloud is a bit new. i do think itunes has run its course but itunes and the ipod were what put apple back on top.
i hope they focus on streamlining itunes and the store and remove the other stuff.
apple doesn't care about you installing itunes on your machine. your machine is a dodo bird. apple will make 'appliances' and itunes etc will all be built in.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
I think you have a problem with your computer. I have a Compaq Presario CQ56 sporting an AMD V140 processor that is far from fast. I can run 720p video in QT just fine with no huge CPU hit.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
My Core2 Duo 2.4Ghz tops out at 40% when playing a 720p QuickTime video from Apple's Movie Trailers website. It hovers between 30%-40% CPU. Not sure what is different about your setup.
My Core2 Duo 2.4Ghz tops out at 40% when playing a 720p QuickTime video from Apple's Movie Trailers website. It hovers between 30%-40% CPU. Not sure what is different about your setup.
The solution shouldn't be find hardware that can run sh*t software, but to avoid sh*t software in the first place.
I can run the same test on good hardware and it doesn't even make a mark...
Comments
I'm saying Adobe got flash to work fine in Android, and it's a total lie to say it doesn't.
Works fine? Really? We've even had other Android users post here to say otherwise.
BTW, the only reason you people are "html5 people" is because the salesman Steve Jobs sold you bs that you gobbled up. He said flash couldn't run on mobile platforms, and also said it was a battery drain. Neither of those things turned out to be true.
PS. Do you mind linking to where Steve Jobs said Flash couldn't run on mobile devices?
I think you missed this question. And he was correct on the battery drain as well.
Although I agree with Gruber's overall point, he lost me with the last, bolded sentence. We iOS users didn't "magically" have access to the full web and HTML5/video/animation playback beginning in 2007.
It hasn't been until that past year/year and a half or so that I've been able go to about 90% of my favorite websites and actually get HTML5 compliant video and animations on pages instead of the broken Flash icon. So to say that we've been benefiting since 2007 seems a bit disingenuous.
That is unless I'm not understanding his statement which I probably am
I don't think Gruber's comment is wrong, I think you are comparing today's open webcode to webcode of 2007. Even if Apple bent over backwards for Adobe the only Flash Apple could have possibly added was Flash Lite which wouldn't be the full web either since it wasn't even close to a modern version of Flash.
On top of that, there were years of fervent development that occurred because Apple pointed out Flash's faults (though MS did a lot, too, with Silverlight that also appeared on the scene in 2007). It took Adobe years to get the whole touch system worked out.
Even if that was all these issues were "magically" worked out in 2007, there's still the issue of Flash pages being designed for pointer(mouse) inputs and for larger screens. Yet with the iPhone, the browser was good. It was responsive. It was the first phone that didn't need to have a mobile version of a site for that site to be useful, yet (ironically) because the browser was so useful the web quickly moved to make an iPhone optimized option, even going so far as to add iPhone home screen icons so you can save a site's access to your Home Screen.
PS: When was the video tag added to iOS? I thought it was there since v1.0.
Flash player 10.1 will kill HTML5
Too bad he didn't get to see this day. It would have been interesting to hear what he would have had to say.
No doubt!
This is terrible news for savvy consumers who want the full web experience on their mobile devices.
ROFLOL - you can't be serious! The full web should not have proprietary technology running it that drains the battery, slows down the entire web experience and clogs the pipes with buggy bloated crapware. Get over yourself.
This is terrible news for savvy consumers who want the full web experience on their mobile devices.
Once Flash becomes obsolete the full web won't consist of Flash content idiot.
This is terrible news for savvy consumers who want the full web experience on their mobile devices.
Eksodos, it appears that a significant percentage of AI posters are humor impaired!
God status achieved.
ROFLOL - you can't be serious! The full web should not have proprietary technology running it that drains the battery, slows down the entire web experience and clogs the pipes with buggy bloated crapware. Get over yourself.
If used correctly, Flash can be a really interesting platform (I develop games in Flash) because of the ease of publishing to multiple devices, etc. Unfortunately, on mobile it is true that the processors of the phones could not handle Flash because Flash unfortunately allows you to be lazy about optimizing, which usually leads to the battery and slow problems.
If used correctly, Flash can be a really interesting platform (I develop games in Flash) because of the ease of publishing to multiple devices, etc. Unfortunately, on mobile it is true that the processors of the phones could not handle Flash because Flash unfortunately allows you to be lazy about optimizing, which usually leads to the battery and slow problems.
Even optimised Flash applications I've seen use more processing power than they really should. Box.net has a file viewer and that works very well - its well optimised and does a cracking job, but why use flash when Javascript/AJAX/jQuery (choose your poison) inside an iFrame can do the same job and work on literally any device without a plugin? The new "Worker" method in Javascript allows true multi-threaded applications in Javascript - Flash still handles single threaded applications whilst creating its own bewildering amount of threads in the background just to get everything to work.
Well, that's certainly one POV. I don't characterize this as "Steve was right." I think Steve was more prescient about the future of mobile web standards. It didn't hurt that he took a hard line on "no plug-ins for mobile Safari" to help force the issue. That includes Microsoft's seldom loved Silverlight plug-in.
Microsoft don't even support the Silverlight plug-in on their own phone or in Metro IE10.
I'd be very surprised if it was Steve's hard-line stance on plug-ins that prevented it from appearing on iOS.
i am not 'html5 people', i am 'all sh*t software needs to go away people'
i guess you still use and sing the praises of RealPlayer too?
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
unfortunately the sync to icloud is a bit new. i do think itunes has run its course but itunes and the ipod were what put apple back on top.
i hope they focus on streamlining itunes and the store and remove the other stuff.
apple doesn't care about you installing itunes on your machine. your machine is a dodo bird. apple will make 'appliances' and itunes etc will all be built in.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
I think you have a problem with your computer. I have a Compaq Presario CQ56 sporting an AMD V140 processor that is far from fast. I can run 720p video in QT just fine with no huge CPU hit.
You know what piece of sh*t software really needs to go away?
Quicktime.
Go to the Apple trailers site on a PC and you're greeted with this...
OK. So 80MB download, 10 minute installation and 8 new background services running and I'm set to go.
This is what my CPU looks like playing a 720p video through Quicktime.
This is what my CPU looks like playing the same trailer using Flash (HTML5 is about the same).
The really stupid thing is that the videos are all there in a HTML5 compatible format, Apple just decide to wrap them in Quicktime.
Actually scratch all that. It's not just Quicktime that needs to go. The whole damn iTunes application needs to go.
My iPhone and iPad can both sync to iCloud. There is absolutly no reason that I should have to install this piece of sh*t on my computer.
Could you imagine if Apple put their weight behind writing a kick-ass version of iTunes that ran fully in HTML5? That would be sweet.
My Core2 Duo 2.4Ghz tops out at 40% when playing a 720p QuickTime video from Apple's Movie Trailers website. It hovers between 30%-40% CPU. Not sure what is different about your setup.
My Core2 Duo 2.4Ghz tops out at 40% when playing a 720p QuickTime video from Apple's Movie Trailers website. It hovers between 30%-40% CPU. Not sure what is different about your setup.
The solution shouldn't be find hardware that can run sh*t software, but to avoid sh*t software in the first place.
I can run the same test on good hardware and it doesn't even make a mark...
The solution shouldn't be find hardware that can run sh*t software, but to avoid sh*t software in the first place.
I can run the same test on good hardware and it doesn't even make a mark...
That's because you hit "pause" on the video playback