There's was nothing to defend. Apple said that all phones suffer from varying degrees of attenuation. And they were right.
I would respectfully disagree. Of all the smartphones we had in our office recently - that is, one 3Gs, two 4, three Androids (Galaxy S and Galaxy Ace), couple of entry level Symbian Nokias (mostly E5) and one odd Blackberry Pearl, all on Vodafone NZ network. iPhones had, by far, the worst reception and most drop calls in general. In addition, both iP4 users had to use case as it was making difference. One was OK with that, other would prefer to keep phone without it.
Above mentioned 3Gs was/is my phone, actually. I found couple of spots around city - 2 of them in local shopping mall, where my phone would do "no signal". Other phones I tried did well on same spots, regardless on grip. iP4 was working - unless held "wrong way", without case.
Now... this is New Zealand and I have no trouble accepting that network coverage is far from optimal, considering country size, geography (quantity of natural obstacles) and low population count. In areas with better coverage, iPhone shortcomings would be less visible to non-existing. But not here.
That being said, iPhones did provide more userfriendly experience to us using them, to a degree where we were willing to forgive poor network performance. It also gave us less problems on average than Android in working within security guidelines company was enforcing (Nokias did fine as well, though, and BB was on completely different level with it's requirements). Guess you cannot have everything.
Urgh... this is just like the advert on that Next Galaxy website with the sheep on it. If you're trying to convince iPhone users to switch to your product, then insulting them by calling them braindead sheep just doesn't seem to be the best way to do it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Because there was no "issue" other than the ones inherent to all phones made by anyone. Don't start that crap again.
It isn't crap. It's the truth. Look at this page from AnandTech, one of the most respected tech websites around. Their tests showed that holding the phone naturally, when compared to not holding the phone at all, resulted in the signal weakening by 19.8 decibels on the iPhone 4, compared to 10.7 on an HTC phone and just 1.9 on the iPhone 3GS. This problem was considerably more serious on the iPhone 4 than on other phones. Saying that there was 'no issue' just makes you look like a fanboy, I'm afraid.
It isn't crap. It's the truth. This problem was considerably more serious on the iPhone 4 than on other phones.
Which explains why Apple kept selling the phone, the complaints stopped after the first few months, and why virtually no one outside the US (AT&T), Australia (giant swaths of nothingness), and the UK reported having the problem. There certainly must have been a 'problem' with the design.
Quote:
Saying that there was 'no issue' just makes you look like a fanboy, I'm afraid.
As this is an Apple fan website, we don't say that here.
It isn't crap. It's the truth. Look at this page from AnandTech, one of the most respected tech websites around. Their tests showed that holding the phone naturally, when compared to not holding the phone at all, resulted in the signal weakening by 19.8 decibels on the iPhone 4, compared to 10.7 on an HTC phone and just 1.9 on the iPhone 3GS. This problem was considerably more serious on the iPhone 4 than on other phones. Saying that there was 'no issue' just makes you look like a fanboy, I'm afraid.
It is crap. You've linked to the AT article yet you've ignored this very important part.
The Antenna is Improved
From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dBm (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use.
What Apple is guilty of is not altering the values of the cellular bars with their improved and superior innovation... unless you want to claim that a more sensitive baseband is some fatal flaw in the design that they are still selling today and remained their flagship device longer than any other.
You saying that because the dB rating drops more means it's inferior has as much merit as saying that frequency or megapixels are how determine the performance quality of CPUs and cameras, respectively. Only those without an understanding of the tech would claim such a thing.
Wouldn't it be funny if there was a DoS around the time this timer clicks to zero....just potulating.
hmmm...
I seems to be counting down in tenths of a second, which would make it Sunday 6th May around 10:45 pm, a strange time a late night television ad maybe.
The TV guide doesn't go that far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smiles77
The countdown is for 96 days from now. What thinks ye that be for?
Tbh, this smells a lot more like a Microsoft campaign than Samsung.
the only thing thing this video makes me want to buy is that belkin product he shows off. the whole video blog feels fake to me. why would he be running his camera and shooting his hand holding the belkin mic just as the bus arrives. it's all too convenient for his "eyewitness account" and long-winded explanation about why he was there in the beginning. are we really supposed to believe samsung organized this entire thing and didn't hire anyone to document it on video and this guy just happened to be there? he's a hired gun no different than the black shirts holding up signs. why didn't he ask them what they were there for? because he signed the same contract as them.
as for their campaign, they're going to need to incorporate this "wake up" thing into every commercial and poster and online ad or this will all be forgotten tomorrow.
either way, it reeks of guerilla marketing and little guy underdog syndrome. that might work for some ignorant consumers but won't go over well in light of giant legal battles with apple over their best selling galaxy phone.
Which explains why Apple kept selling the phone, the complaints stopped after the first few months, and why virtually no one outside the US (AT&T), Australia (giant swaths of nothingness), and the UK reported having the problem. There certainly must have been a 'problem' with the design.
.
What part of there being an issue with the phone is incompatible with the phone continuing to sell well? I have an iPhone 4 myself. I've definitely noticed the problem, but it wasn't big enough to stop me buying the phone, because it had enough other advantages to make it the best choice. The fact that the phone sold well in spite of the flaw doesn't mean that the flaw ceased to exist! Buying technology products is a compromise because all products have weaknesses, and the antenna issue was a weakness of the iPhone 4 which was counteracted by lots of other advantages.
You say that virtually nobody outside the US, UK and Australia (a country with 23 million people and a very high quality of life, incidentally - a little rude to call it 'nothingness') reported the problem. Firstly, if the issue was widely reported in the phone's biggest launch market and two of its most significant international markets at launch, doesn't that indicate a problem to you? Secondly, how do you know that no other markets reported the issue? It would've been easy for you to pick up on reports from the US/UK/Australia, because all speak English. Do you speak French? German? Spanish? Chinese? If you don't, how do you know that those markets weren't reporting issues all along and you just weren't reading the right articles? If the US (AT&T) and UK had issues, it's infeasible that other European markets which use the exact same GSM technology would be immune.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
As this is an Apple fan website, we don't say that here.
Personally, I'd like to think that it's possible to be a fan of a company's products without being so unconditionally supportive as to do the company's marketing work for them.
If I can't use the word 'fanboy', which other word should I use to describe somebody who refuses to recognise any flaws in a company's products? There is a big difference between being a fan and a fanboy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
It is crap. You've linked to the AT article yet you've ignored this very important part.
I don't see how the quality of the baseband hardware, and even the quality of reception in use, impacts in any way upon the fact that the antenna was a flawed design which negatively impacted cellular reception. I don't doubt that the baseband hardware is very sensitive and that the phone can hold onto calls in low-signal areas. But the fact remains that the signal strength varies depending upon how you hold the phone to a much greater extent than other handsets, and that remains an issue.
This is the new president of Samsung’s mobile division, Shin Jong-kyun, he is the man who authorizes everything Samsung mobile does, including lying to the media.
incidentally - a little rude to call it 'nothingness'
Don't misunderstand; going off of population maps, there's a lot of wilderness in Australia.
Firstly, if the issue was widely reported in the phone's biggest launch market and two of its most significant international markets at launch, doesn't that indicate a problem to you?
With fewer complaints than the previous model and fewer returns than the previous model, no.
Quote:
If you don't, how do you know that those markets weren't reporting issues all along and you just weren't reading the right articles?
German, yes. But with the ferocity with which the "problem" was reported in English, they would have jumped on the idea of mentioning that "this is happening everywhere", listing countries with complaints. You know how the media works. I don't recall that, is all.
Quote:
Personally, I'd like to think that it's possible to be a fan of a company's products without being so unconditionally supportive as to do the company's marketing work for them. If I can't use the word 'fanboy', which other word should I use to describe somebody who refuses to recognise any flaws in a company's products? There is a big difference between being a fan and a fanboy.
And you're absolutely right about that; there's no sense in blind faith in a company or its decisions. "Fanboy" is simply demeaning. As any single word used in replacement would be no less demeaning, my suggestion is that people rephrase what they're saying to not require such titles.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant
There's was nothing to defend. Apple said that all phones suffer from varying degrees of attenuation. And they were right.
I would respectfully disagree. Of all the smartphones we had in our office recently - that is, one 3Gs, two 4, three Androids (Galaxy S and Galaxy Ace), couple of entry level Symbian Nokias (mostly E5) and one odd Blackberry Pearl, all on Vodafone NZ network. iPhones had, by far, the worst reception and most drop calls in general. In addition, both iP4 users had to use case as it was making difference. One was OK with that, other would prefer to keep phone without it.
Above mentioned 3Gs was/is my phone, actually. I found couple of spots around city - 2 of them in local shopping mall, where my phone would do "no signal". Other phones I tried did well on same spots, regardless on grip. iP4 was working - unless held "wrong way", without case.
Now... this is New Zealand and I have no trouble accepting that network coverage is far from optimal, considering country size, geography (quantity of natural obstacles) and low population count. In areas with better coverage, iPhone shortcomings would be less visible to non-existing. But not here.
That being said, iPhones did provide more userfriendly experience to us using them, to a degree where we were willing to forgive poor network performance. It also gave us less problems on average than Android in working within security guidelines company was enforcing (Nokias did fine as well, though, and BB was on completely different level with it's requirements). Guess you cannot have everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I don't think that you can call someone 'the next X' until the X has actually gone kaput.
Having said that, It'll be RIM first, then Nokia, then Samsung. Poor guys.
Not sure I fancy a world where there is only one technology supplier
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy
Not sure I fancy a world where there is only one technology supplier
Those aren't the only three companies other than Apple. The ones that refuse to compete and innovate will get cast aside, as they should.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Four fifths of your list is harmful to the point you're trying to make.
Next iPhone in October. Heck, maybe even September, since the iPods don't have the draw they once did.
I see the time line getting longer. So it will be either oct/nov this year and up to Feb 2013
but the 4s was a half upgrade so we may get something sooner
Urgh... this is just like the advert on that Next Galaxy website with the sheep on it. If you're trying to convince iPhone users to switch to your product, then insulting them by calling them braindead sheep just doesn't seem to be the best way to do it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Because there was no "issue" other than the ones inherent to all phones made by anyone. Don't start that crap again.
It isn't crap. It's the truth. Look at this page from AnandTech, one of the most respected tech websites around. Their tests showed that holding the phone naturally, when compared to not holding the phone at all, resulted in the signal weakening by 19.8 decibels on the iPhone 4, compared to 10.7 on an HTC phone and just 1.9 on the iPhone 3GS. This problem was considerably more serious on the iPhone 4 than on other phones. Saying that there was 'no issue' just makes you look like a fanboy, I'm afraid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphonious
It isn't crap. It's the truth. This problem was considerably more serious on the iPhone 4 than on other phones.
Which explains why Apple kept selling the phone, the complaints stopped after the first few months, and why virtually no one outside the US (AT&T), Australia (giant swaths of nothingness), and the UK reported having the problem. There certainly must have been a 'problem' with the design.
Quote:
Saying that there was 'no issue' just makes you look like a fanboy, I'm afraid.
As this is an Apple fan website, we don't say that here.
It is crap. You've linked to the AT article yet you've ignored this very important part.
What Apple is guilty of is not altering the values of the cellular bars with their improved and superior innovation... unless you want to claim that a more sensitive baseband is some fatal flaw in the design that they are still selling today and remained their flagship device longer than any other.
You saying that because the dB rating drops more means it's inferior has as much merit as saying that frequency or megapixels are how determine the performance quality of CPUs and cameras, respectively. Only those without an understanding of the tech would claim such a thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by global.philosopher
wake-up-australia.com.au
There is a countdown on this website.
Wouldn't it be funny if there was a DoS around the time this timer clicks to zero....just potulating.
hmmm...
I seems to be counting down in tenths of a second, which would make it Sunday 6th May around 10:45 pm, a strange time a late night television ad maybe.
The TV guide doesn't go that far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smiles77
The countdown is for 96 days from now. What thinks ye that be for?
Tbh, this smells a lot more like a Microsoft campaign than Samsung.
10's of a second, you're out by a factor of 10.
Is it me or:
Is everything Samsung says is a lie?
Is everything Samsung does staged and faked?
Is everything Samsung makes a knockoff of someone else's IP?
the only thing thing this video makes me want to buy is that belkin product he shows off. the whole video blog feels fake to me. why would he be running his camera and shooting his hand holding the belkin mic just as the bus arrives. it's all too convenient for his "eyewitness account" and long-winded explanation about why he was there in the beginning. are we really supposed to believe samsung organized this entire thing and didn't hire anyone to document it on video and this guy just happened to be there? he's a hired gun no different than the black shirts holding up signs. why didn't he ask them what they were there for? because he signed the same contract as them.
as for their campaign, they're going to need to incorporate this "wake up" thing into every commercial and poster and online ad or this will all be forgotten tomorrow.
either way, it reeks of guerilla marketing and little guy underdog syndrome. that might work for some ignorant consumers but won't go over well in light of giant legal battles with apple over their best selling galaxy phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Beige
Is it me or:
Is everything Samsung says is a lie?
Is everything Samsung does staged and faked?
Is everything Samsung makes a knockoff of someone else's IP?
It's just you.
Nah… flash mobs don't come all together in a bus…. they come from all over and get together because they know other people will be coming too….
Nah… flash mobs don't come all together in a bus…. they come from all over and get together because they know other people will be coming too….
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Which explains why Apple kept selling the phone, the complaints stopped after the first few months, and why virtually no one outside the US (AT&T), Australia (giant swaths of nothingness), and the UK reported having the problem. There certainly must have been a 'problem' with the design.
.
What part of there being an issue with the phone is incompatible with the phone continuing to sell well? I have an iPhone 4 myself. I've definitely noticed the problem, but it wasn't big enough to stop me buying the phone, because it had enough other advantages to make it the best choice. The fact that the phone sold well in spite of the flaw doesn't mean that the flaw ceased to exist! Buying technology products is a compromise because all products have weaknesses, and the antenna issue was a weakness of the iPhone 4 which was counteracted by lots of other advantages.
You say that virtually nobody outside the US, UK and Australia (a country with 23 million people and a very high quality of life, incidentally - a little rude to call it 'nothingness') reported the problem. Firstly, if the issue was widely reported in the phone's biggest launch market and two of its most significant international markets at launch, doesn't that indicate a problem to you? Secondly, how do you know that no other markets reported the issue? It would've been easy for you to pick up on reports from the US/UK/Australia, because all speak English. Do you speak French? German? Spanish? Chinese? If you don't, how do you know that those markets weren't reporting issues all along and you just weren't reading the right articles? If the US (AT&T) and UK had issues, it's infeasible that other European markets which use the exact same GSM technology would be immune.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
As this is an Apple fan website, we don't say that here.
Personally, I'd like to think that it's possible to be a fan of a company's products without being so unconditionally supportive as to do the company's marketing work for them.
If I can't use the word 'fanboy', which other word should I use to describe somebody who refuses to recognise any flaws in a company's products? There is a big difference between being a fan and a fanboy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
It is crap. You've linked to the AT article yet you've ignored this very important part.
I don't see how the quality of the baseband hardware, and even the quality of reception in use, impacts in any way upon the fact that the antenna was a flawed design which negatively impacted cellular reception. I don't doubt that the baseband hardware is very sensitive and that the phone can hold onto calls in low-signal areas. But the fact remains that the signal strength varies depending upon how you hold the phone to a much greater extent than other handsets, and that remains an issue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredaroony
Classy like like drawing other mobile vendors into the iPhone 4's antenna issues...yeah, real classy.
Only if you link "classy" to facing the truth and telling it like it is.
That requires a certain amount of class, perhaps you'd see that too, if you woke up.
This is the new president of Samsung’s mobile division, Shin Jong-kyun, he is the man who authorizes everything Samsung mobile does, including lying to the media.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
Only if you link "classy" to facing the truth and telling it like it is.
That requires a certain amount of class, perhaps you'd see that too, if you woke up.
Your response doesn't surprise me at all and is typical of your Apple can do no wrong attitude.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphonious
incidentally - a little rude to call it 'nothingness'
Don't misunderstand; going off of population maps, there's a lot of wilderness in Australia.
Firstly, if the issue was widely reported in the phone's biggest launch market and two of its most significant international markets at launch, doesn't that indicate a problem to you?
With fewer complaints than the previous model and fewer returns than the previous model, no.
Quote:
If you don't, how do you know that those markets weren't reporting issues all along and you just weren't reading the right articles?
German, yes. But with the ferocity with which the "problem" was reported in English, they would have jumped on the idea of mentioning that "this is happening everywhere", listing countries with complaints. You know how the media works. I don't recall that, is all.
Quote:
Personally, I'd like to think that it's possible to be a fan of a company's products without being so unconditionally supportive as to do the company's marketing work for them. If I can't use the word 'fanboy', which other word should I use to describe somebody who refuses to recognise any flaws in a company's products? There is a big difference between being a fan and a fanboy.
And you're absolutely right about that; there's no sense in blind faith in a company or its decisions. "Fanboy" is simply demeaning. As any single word used in replacement would be no less demeaning, my suggestion is that people rephrase what they're saying to not require such titles.
Wake Up! Free espresso!
Oh, just another f*(&*(ing Android phone? Never mind.