The sickening part is because it is Apple that released this crapware, the sheeple will find any and every excuse for the terrible decision to release the buggy software and then charge users a ton for the new phone. Imagine the backlash if Google, Microsoft, Samsung, or Rim that released this bad app. There is NO excuse for this given the price premium of an iPhone 5. Steve jobs would have LOST IT if this was released, and that is why Apple has already changed, for the worst,
O.k. I'll bite...
In reverse order:
RIMM... Well I suppose we did see what happened when they released "crapware". Time and time again...
Samsung... They are trying to copy Apple so thoroughly that they were brought to court for it. I'm sure Samsung would love to trade sales numbers for paltry maps complaints...
Microsoft... I can't even believe you mentioned them. Hahaha! What have they done that hasn't failed besides windows and office? The former may be added to your list on their next release. The Kin? The Zune? There are many, may other examples. I don't have all night this time. I don't even remember the Kin. I didn't know it even existed at all until I read about it on this site.
Google... They released their version of iOS. I suppose their users say "It doesn't function right, but its just a 'knock off' of Apple so it shouldn't be exactly the same right? Hey Googles' Maps app is cool. I wish the rest of the phone was that cool!"
Something tells me that I might just see the word "BANNED" under your name soon.... Call it woman's intuition. )
Apple made a tough choice for a tough situation. Whatever they did, they probably would have gotten flack for from someone. It's done. We have iOS Maps now. No point in pulling these developers out of the woodwork to whine about something we all know. Maps wasn't ready, so what. Apple has never left anything hanging for long, so it'll be better eventually. So let's give it a rest. These articles are literally flamebait, stirring up controversy just for the sake of it.
This is a riot. "They had months to fix problems," eh? I don't think you have the proper sense of either scale or process.
If you've worked on software you know that you're working flat out right up to the day of release and even so it's never done. And that's just on the software, not counting data. And in this case, the data was monstrous and there was no chance of there not being many thousands of points of error in the data.
As a vendor, do you hold off indefinitely while this stuff gets fixed? Or do you ship it and just keep fixing things incrementally?
With a product like a Garmin GPS incremental fixes were something of a hassle, and they charge kind of a lot of money for them (although about a quarter as much today as they did just a few years ago). Apple, though, can just fix this stuff on the fly as fast as they can and we all benefit.
Put on a little perspective: None of the mapping companies held up products until the map data was particularly polished. Apple's data is, truthfully, better than most at time of launch -- and that includes Google. You all might not remember it, but Google data was pretty darn screwy too until they started sending cars down roads to see where they really went. And Mapquest data is *still* pretty screwy in lots of places despite years and years of user-submitted correction requests. And you probably know someone who Garmin's data sent horribly awry (it routed me and my sportscar up a mountain jeep track once, heading to a point miles from the address I gave it).
Truthfully, Apple's software is about average in this respect. The maps are not that bad. The stuff that *looks* really bad is the stuff where they tried to do something relatively new and fancy. Those wavy roads and melting bridges? They were obviously trying to project satellite images onto topographical data. That looks great as long as the roads follow the topographical form. But they don't always, particularly with bridges. Google Earth does that kind of thing too (or did, I haven't looked recently).
Yea, we all miss Google's search capability, and some of the road data isn't all that accurate. On the other hand, the maps are much better visually, they load a hell of a lot faster than Google's tiles, they load a much larger area so loss of signal is a lot less troublesome, etc. It's good enough. You win some, you lose some. IMO it was definitely good enough to ship, especially when you realize that fixing it was not going to be a matter of months, but of years, no matter what Apple did. And the really egregious stuff? A lot of that has already been fixed.
I can't say I'm particularly a fan of Apple's Maps, but mostly because the traffic data is way more stale than Google's. For basic navigation it's not all that different from the data I get with Garmin or Tomtom and somehow I have survived those products.
He didn't lose it when the iPhone 4's antenna problems were plastered all over the news.
No he just gave out free $29.99 bumpers (which probably cost $1 but that's another story). We could have a least received a warning that we were about to lose StreetView when we upgraded the iOs for crissakes..
The sickening part is because it is Apple that released this crapware, the sheeple will find any and every excuse for the terrible decision to release the buggy software and then charge users a ton for the new phone. Imagine the backlash if Google, Microsoft, Samsung, or Rim that released this bad app. There is NO excuse for this given the price premium of an iPhone 5. Steve jobs would have LOST IT if this was released, and that is why Apple has already changed, for the worst,
Considering this is an issue with iOS 6 and has nothing to do any premium paid for anything I don't get your point. Plus there have been over time myriad examples of this happening on Google maps, it's just that A) no one had anything to compare to esp given the extra functionality and usability that outweighed most mistakes maps have now become a critical app in most folks lives, this wasn't the case when googmaps was going through it's teething pains, and C) this is Apple where now EVERY little thing is criticized ("hey, when I throw my iPhone against a brick wall and then run over it with my Prius it scratches the aluminum on the back, Steve must be rolling in his grave right now").
No he just gave out free $29.99 bumpers (which probably cost $1 but that's another story). We could have a least received a warning that we were about to lose StreetView when we upgraded the iOs for crissakes..
Only most times they aren't known to the software house. Software released with known bugs is a sign of deception.
A developer wouldn't say that. Hmm, scratch that: a knowledgable developer would never say that. You missed this part of the iOS 6 Terms and Conditions that says (it's in all caps in the original legal agreement)
Quote:
7.2YOU EXPRESSLY ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT, TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, USE OF THE iOS SOFTWARE AND ANY SERVICES PERFORMED BY OR ACCESSED THROUGH THE iOS SOFTWARE IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK AND THAT THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO SATISFACTORY QUALITY, PERFORMANCE, ACCURACY AND EFFORT IS WITH YOU.
7.3TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, THE iOS SOFTWARE AND SERVICES ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" AND "AS AVAILABLE", WITH ALL FAULTS AND WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, AND APPLE AND APPLE'S LICENSORS (COLLECTIVELY REFERRED TO AS "APPLE" FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 7 AND 8) HEREBY DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES AND CONDITIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE iOS SOFTWARE AND SERVICES, EITHER EXPRESS, IMPLIED OR STATUTORY, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES AND/OR CONDITIONS OF MERCHANTABILITY, SATISFACTORY QUALITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, ACCURACY, QUIET ENJOYMENT, AND NON-INFRINGEMENT OF THIRD PARTY RIGHTS.
You cannot go before a court and win a lawsuit saying you were "deceived," because Apple made no claim about the lack of defects. They specifically say that iOS is provided "as is" WITH ALL FAULTS. iOS has always had bugs, going all the way back to version 1.0. The only deception going on is you, deceiving yourself.
And I still can't find my house or look down my street- only roofs and top of trees.
Useless.
So you can't find a single use for Apple Maps because it doesn't have a certain feature that is still available on the device? With so much stupidity and hyperbole between you and Apple Maps one has proven to be useless.
I just tested it on an iPhone 5 in the Apple Store this weekend. Maps even "autocompleted" my typing "Columbia" with the option for a red pin next to "Columbia, SC". Guess where that sends you? (In case that's not clear, it goes to South America.)
"Columbia, SC" should send you to Columbia, South Carolina. It's a well-known bug at this point. Apple should fix it. Apple should have fixed it weeks ago. It's server-side info, so it's an easy fix to push.
Why isn't it fixed? If they knew of the issues, why didn't they start rolling in quick fixes for high visibility screw-ups like this? I'm not the biggest Dilger fan, but on Tech Night Owl Live, he does an excellent job pointing out a number of places where Apple's eating it for refusing to fix high visibility mistakes in a timely fashion. As he suggests too, Apple needs to fix these easy to ridicule mistakes. Yesterday.
Who cares about fixing flyover? Fix the information and location issues first, they are more important. And I'm not surprised by this, seeing as apple needed some big features for their new phone (after using Siri last time)
If you've worked on software you know that you're working flat out right up to the day of release and even so it's never done. And that's just on the software, not counting data. And in this case, the data was monstrous and there was no chance of there not being many thousands of points of error in the data.
This glut of errors is exactly why they need to prioritize and fix the high visibility errors first.
if ("Columbia, SC" == strSearch) then
location.lat = 34°00?2?N
location.lon = 81°02?39?W
end if
If you've worked on software, you know sometimes imperfect fixes NOW are a heck of a lot better than waiting on perfection. That doesn't take months. Check that link I included above where Dilger talks about print advertisements that slam points Maps can't find.
If you can't hard code a server-side fix to negate the power of a print ad in 2012, you've got a serious problem. As soon as you knew there was a print ad with a specific point, you include something like the above and everyone who tries the point from the ad goes, "Huh? Apple gets that right." Insane.
Look, I don't have a lot of Apple stock, but I've got over $20k of it (and that's after "profit taking" several times). I like Apple. They've done well. This is crap.
Quote by jimfrost again:
The stuff that *looks* really bad is the stuff where they tried to do something relatively new and fancy.
Hard to let that one go. Columbia, SC, established 1786. "new and fancy" stuff, indeed. You must be British (or Egyptian or Iranian, etc) to call that "relatively new".
Not as a pedestrian- NO.
And will you ever stop lying? The feature is no longer on the device. What app gives you a map with a pin you tap and goes right to streetview?
1) So now you're claiming that there is no maps for pedestrians. If you actually explored the new Maps even once you would realize that pedestrian directions are there; it's public transportation that is now added via 3rd-party support. I guess since pedestrian and public both start with 'p' you got confused.
Comments
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Fattty Nano, touchscreen Nano, buttonless Shuffle, iMovie '08, etc.
And those weren't even BAD!
O.k. I'll bite...
In reverse order:
RIMM... Well I suppose we did see what happened when they released "crapware". Time and time again...
Samsung... They are trying to copy Apple so thoroughly that they were brought to court for it. I'm sure Samsung would love to trade sales numbers for paltry maps complaints...
Microsoft... I can't even believe you mentioned them. Hahaha! What have they done that hasn't failed besides windows and office? The former may be added to your list on their next release. The Kin? The Zune? There are many, may other examples. I don't have all night this time. I don't even remember the Kin. I didn't know it even existed at all until I read about it on this site.
Google... They released their version of iOS. I suppose their users say "It doesn't function right, but its just a 'knock off' of Apple so it shouldn't be exactly the same right? Hey Googles' Maps app is cool. I wish the rest of the phone was that cool!"
Something tells me that I might just see the word "BANNED" under your name soon.... Call it woman's intuition.
Also, for your reading pleasure.
http://bottomline.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/10/09/14324790-microsoft-trims-ceo-ballmers-bonus-after-disappointing-year?lite
This is a riot. "They had months to fix problems," eh? I don't think you have the proper sense of either scale or process.
If you've worked on software you know that you're working flat out right up to the day of release and even so it's never done. And that's just on the software, not counting data. And in this case, the data was monstrous and there was no chance of there not being many thousands of points of error in the data.
As a vendor, do you hold off indefinitely while this stuff gets fixed? Or do you ship it and just keep fixing things incrementally?
With a product like a Garmin GPS incremental fixes were something of a hassle, and they charge kind of a lot of money for them (although about a quarter as much today as they did just a few years ago). Apple, though, can just fix this stuff on the fly as fast as they can and we all benefit.
Put on a little perspective: None of the mapping companies held up products until the map data was particularly polished. Apple's data is, truthfully, better than most at time of launch -- and that includes Google. You all might not remember it, but Google data was pretty darn screwy too until they started sending cars down roads to see where they really went. And Mapquest data is *still* pretty screwy in lots of places despite years and years of user-submitted correction requests. And you probably know someone who Garmin's data sent horribly awry (it routed me and my sportscar up a mountain jeep track once, heading to a point miles from the address I gave it).
Truthfully, Apple's software is about average in this respect. The maps are not that bad. The stuff that *looks* really bad is the stuff where they tried to do something relatively new and fancy. Those wavy roads and melting bridges? They were obviously trying to project satellite images onto topographical data. That looks great as long as the roads follow the topographical form. But they don't always, particularly with bridges. Google Earth does that kind of thing too (or did, I haven't looked recently).
Yea, we all miss Google's search capability, and some of the road data isn't all that accurate. On the other hand, the maps are much better visually, they load a hell of a lot faster than Google's tiles, they load a much larger area so loss of signal is a lot less troublesome, etc. It's good enough. You win some, you lose some. IMO it was definitely good enough to ship, especially when you realize that fixing it was not going to be a matter of months, but of years, no matter what Apple did. And the really egregious stuff? A lot of that has already been fixed.
I can't say I'm particularly a fan of Apple's Maps, but mostly because the traffic data is way more stale than Google's. For basic navigation it's not all that different from the data I get with Garmin or Tomtom and somehow I have survived those products.
jim frost
[email protected]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610
He didn't lose it when FCP X was released.
He didn't lose it when the iPhone 4's antenna problems were plastered all over the news. In fact, he defended Apple.
He didn't lose it when OS X Lion lost "Save As."
So far, the post-Jobs Apple is no worse off than it was during Jobs' watch.
1) I don't edit video, but I'll give you this one.
2) That's because the iPhone 4 doesn't have antenna problems.
3) The lack of “Save As…” pisses me off.
4) Agreed.
I give you 3 out of 4.
“If you don't read the newspaper, you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper, you are misinformed.” —Mark Twain
This was true in his time, and it’s much worse now.
Useless.
No he just gave out free $29.99 bumpers (which probably cost $1 but that's another story). We could have a least received a warning that we were about to lose StreetView when we upgraded the iOs for crissakes..
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon
And I still can't find my house or look down my street- only roofs and top of trees.
Useless.
I find my house, lots of times, I just walk or drive up my street and there it is, right where I left it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apfeltosh
The sickening part is because it is Apple that released this crapware, the sheeple will find any and every excuse for the terrible decision to release the buggy software and then charge users a ton for the new phone. Imagine the backlash if Google, Microsoft, Samsung, or Rim that released this bad app. There is NO excuse for this given the price premium of an iPhone 5. Steve jobs would have LOST IT if this was released, and that is why Apple has already changed, for the worst,
Considering this is an issue with iOS 6 and has nothing to do any premium paid for anything I don't get your point. Plus there have been over time myriad examples of this happening on Google maps, it's just that A) no one had anything to compare to esp given the extra functionality and usability that outweighed most mistakes
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon
[
No he just gave out free $29.99 bumpers (which probably cost $1 but that's another story). We could have a least received a warning that we were about to lose StreetView when we upgraded the iOs for crissakes..
I still have Street view, on my Galaxy Nexus.
It's called "having two phones".
One for each ear?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian
Only most times they aren't known to the software house. Software released with known bugs is a sign of deception.
A developer wouldn't say that. Hmm, scratch that: a knowledgable developer would never say that. You missed this part of the iOS 6 Terms and Conditions that says (it's in all caps in the original legal agreement)
Quote:
7.2 YOU EXPRESSLY ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT, TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, USE OF THE iOS SOFTWARE AND ANY SERVICES PERFORMED BY OR ACCESSED THROUGH THE iOS SOFTWARE IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK AND THAT THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO SATISFACTORY QUALITY, PERFORMANCE, ACCURACY AND EFFORT IS WITH YOU.
7.3 TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, THE iOS SOFTWARE AND SERVICES ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" AND "AS AVAILABLE", WITH ALL FAULTS AND WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, AND APPLE AND APPLE'S LICENSORS (COLLECTIVELY REFERRED TO AS "APPLE" FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 7 AND 8) HEREBY DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES AND CONDITIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE iOS SOFTWARE AND SERVICES, EITHER EXPRESS, IMPLIED OR STATUTORY, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES AND/OR CONDITIONS OF MERCHANTABILITY, SATISFACTORY QUALITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, ACCURACY, QUIET ENJOYMENT, AND NON-INFRINGEMENT OF THIRD PARTY RIGHTS.
You cannot go before a court and win a lawsuit saying you were "deceived," because Apple made no claim about the lack of defects. They specifically say that iOS is provided "as is" WITH ALL FAULTS. iOS has always had bugs, going all the way back to version 1.0. The only deception going on is you, deceiving yourself.
So you can't find a single use for Apple Maps because it doesn't have a certain feature that is still available on the device? With so much stupidity and hyperbole between you and Apple Maps one has proven to be useless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
Auto complete did it for me.
I just tested it on an iPhone 5 in the Apple Store this weekend. Maps even "autocompleted" my typing "Columbia" with the option for a red pin next to "Columbia, SC". Guess where that sends you? (In case that's not clear, it goes to South America.)
"Columbia, SC" should send you to Columbia, South Carolina. It's a well-known bug at this point. Apple should fix it. Apple should have fixed it weeks ago. It's server-side info, so it's an easy fix to push.
Why isn't it fixed? If they knew of the issues, why didn't they start rolling in quick fixes for high visibility screw-ups like this? I'm not the biggest Dilger fan, but on Tech Night Owl Live, he does an excellent job pointing out a number of places where Apple's eating it for refusing to fix high visibility mistakes in a timely fashion. As he suggests too, Apple needs to fix these easy to ridicule mistakes. Yesterday.
Not as a pedestrian- NO.
And will you ever stop lying? The feature is no longer on the device. What app gives you a map with a pin you tap and goes right to streetview?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610
He didn't lose it when FCP X was released.
He didn't lose it when the iPhone 4's antenna problems were plastered all over the news. In fact, he defended Apple.
He didn't lose it when OS X Lion lost "Save As."
So far, the post-Jobs Apple is no worse off than it was during Jobs' watch.
Very good points, and don't forget that recode of iMovie where they lost all that functionality and plugins.....
Course they left the old version available for folks that wanted it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimfrost
If you've worked on software you know that you're working flat out right up to the day of release and even so it's never done. And that's just on the software, not counting data. And in this case, the data was monstrous and there was no chance of there not being many thousands of points of error in the data.
This glut of errors is exactly why they need to prioritize and fix the high visibility errors first.
if ("Columbia, SC" == strSearch) then
location.lat = 34°00?2?N
location.lon = 81°02?39?W
end if
If you've worked on software, you know sometimes imperfect fixes NOW are a heck of a lot better than waiting on perfection. That doesn't take months. Check that link I included above where Dilger talks about print advertisements that slam points Maps can't find.
If you can't hard code a server-side fix to negate the power of a print ad in 2012, you've got a serious problem. As soon as you knew there was a print ad with a specific point, you include something like the above and everyone who tries the point from the ad goes, "Huh? Apple gets that right." Insane.
Look, I don't have a lot of Apple stock, but I've got over $20k of it (and that's after "profit taking" several times). I like Apple. They've done well. This is crap.
Quote by jimfrost again:
The stuff that *looks* really bad is the stuff where they tried to do something relatively new and fancy.
Hard to let that one go. Columbia, SC, established 1786. "new and fancy" stuff, indeed. You must be British (or Egyptian or Iranian, etc) to call that "relatively new".
Nobody lost street view. You can still use the stand alone Streetviewer app, as well as several other solutions.
1) So now you're claiming that there is no maps for pedestrians. If you actually explored the new Maps even once you would realize that pedestrian directions are there; it's public transportation that is now added via 3rd-party support. I guess since pedestrian and public both start with 'p' you got confused.
2) Yep, such a liar: http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/10/04/street-view-for-google-maps-web-app-goes-live-for-some Not to mention the App Store apps that have it.