The Middle Class and these AT&T Employees can thank the Republicans and Trump for their loss of jobs while the rich get richer.
Spoken like a true liberal. Always someone else to blame.
" layoff notices to a large number of landline, legacy service, and home installers spanning the country " Anybody in these kinds of positions has had a very long time to prepare and should have seen the writing on the wall. No one to blame but themselves if they're not prepared to step into another role by now.
Blaming everyone was never a virtue for an actual liberal...hence, the name. But today's left is just as liberal, as Hitler was jew loving... Seriously, why does it have to be explained?
Get back on your meds, man.
You couldn’t have written a more incoherent response... I simply stated that what is called liberalism (dictionary definition) is not what a democratic party of today has to offer. In the “response” to that, you suggested that I needed to get back to my meds... What would you think of a person, if he has told you that you need medication, after you had said that 2+2=4?
Nah, I think you win the incoherence battle. Handily. Stop digging when you’re in a ditch.
Obviously, there is no "good" time for any employee's to be laid off. However, there must have been very good reason for AT&T to do so. The "job" belongs to the company, not the employee. If the company determines that the "job" the employee is doing no longer makes good business sense, then the company has a right and obligation to it's shareholders to eliminate that "job". The employee can and is effected by this, but in the U.S., all employees also have the right to quit such "job" at anytime they want to and go find another.
Case in point, I just dropped my AT&T home phone line and DSL. If DSL is not a viable product for AT&T any longer, then they absolutely have the right to shut down that part of their business and have NO obligation to keep it going just to keep people employed. If they were to do that, then Management would not be being responsible to the business owners (shareholders).
Why Americans allow CEO's to fire workers willy-nilly to make their short-term bottom line look better is beyond me.
Case in point, Germany was the last country to go into the Great Recession of 2008 and the first to come out!
Australia’s employment laws are similar to the US and they haven’t had a recession there for 25 years so what’s your point?
Just that there's a better way...Americans naively place 'Shareholder rights' somehow above all other considerations.
Stevo said Apple spends so much time, energy and money hiring people, that when there's downturn, they avoid laying off people and instead redouble their efforts in R&D and are then ready for the next upturn.
Why Americans allow CEO's to fire workers willy-nilly to make their short-term bottom line look better is beyond me.
Yep, lay them off and put them on the dole. Great.
In Germany, for example, BMW is not allowed to layoff and send them to the unemployment line for the government to pay. First, they have to go on 3/4 time, then half time, then 1/4 time and into a retraining program. Now that's how a responsible company should operate.
Case in point, Germany was the last country to go into the Great Recession of 2008 and the first to come out!
Oh well.
LOL... Here half the full time employees at places like Walmart are already receiving government assistance because of the sub-poverty wages they pay.
Yep...Very good. Most don't realize how much low wage earners are 'subsidized' by taxpayers. Wether it's food stamps, health care, dental care at the emergency room, etc, etc. It's not anti-business to ask businesses to pay a living wage. When 6 Walmart board members have more wealth than the bottom 45% of Americans...something is amiss, afoot, alas.
Why Americans vote against their own best interests (or don't bother to vote at all) is beyond me.
As for the person who mentioned BMW, you cannot compare that as they have a union contract in place. Strict labor laws across Europe may temporarily favor employees but it has also led to workforce stagnation.
Perhaps, I'm just saying there has to be a better way. All good points, btw. ATT may not be the best example of a fwd thinking corporation.
Why Americans allow CEO's to fire workers willy-nilly to make their short-term bottom line look better is beyond me.
Yep, lay them off and put them on the dole. Great.
In Germany, for example, BMW is not allowed to layoff and send them to the unemployment line for the government to pay. First, they have to go on 3/4 time, then half time, then 1/4 time and into a retraining program. Now that's how a responsible company should operate.
Case in point, Germany was the last country to go into the Great Recession of 2008 and the first to come out!
Oh well.
And Germany has world class trade schools and graduates are highly valued by corporations and by society in general
The Middle Class and these AT&T Employees can thank the Republicans and Trump for their loss of jobs while the rich get richer.
Spoken like a true liberal. Always someone else to blame.
" layoff notices to a large number of landline, legacy service, and home installers spanning the country " Anybody in these kinds of positions has had a very long time to prepare and should have seen the writing on the wall. No one to blame but themselves if they're not prepared to step into another role by now.
Blaming everyone was never a virtue for an actual liberal...hence, the name. But today's left is just as liberal, as Hitler was jew loving... Seriously, why does it have to be explained?
Get back on your meds, man.
You couldn’t have written a more incoherent response... I simply stated that what is called liberalism (dictionary definition) is not what a democratic party of today has to offer. In the “response” to that, you suggested that I needed to get back to my meds... What would you think of a person, if he has told you that you need medication, after you had said that 2+2=4?
Nah, I think you win the incoherence battle. Handily. Stop digging when you’re in a ditch.
cool story. The only thing you have been successfully doing all this time is pretending to be a hypocrisy generator. Let me know when you get back to reality and logic, so you can discuss the issue as a normal grown up adult.
The Middle Class and these AT&T Employees can thank the Republicans and Trump for their loss of jobs while the rich get richer.
How do you know it is related to tax reform t blame Republicans and Trump? You should learn that December is time for layoffs and it is normal. Perhaps it was planned layoff and they gave that "bonus" as extra to severance package.
Before you show political wisdom and blame based on popular biases maybe you shoukd get more work expereince to know how layoff work and when they happen and what the process is. Few decades work with different companies would do you good to understand those things better and not to jump gun on politics.
Why Americans allow CEO's to fire workers willy-nilly to make their short-term bottom line look better is beyond me.
Yep, lay them off and put them on the dole. Great.
In Germany, for example, BMW is not allowed to layoff and send them to the unemployment line for the government to pay. First, they have to go on 3/4 time, then half time, then 1/4 time and into a retraining program. Now that's how a responsible company should operate.
Case in point, Germany was the last country to go into the Great Recession of 2008 and the first to come out!
Oh well.
Then you lack work expereince. Quaterly results in finance for example is THE way to judge performance and decide about layoffs. I am operations technology IT in finance and I have seen quite a lot. It works way differently than in tech companies like those in Sillicon Valley. In general IT in tech and in industry operations are way different as well (different development methods, schedules, market reaction etc.).
Corporations are not benevolent organizations dedicated to the welfare of their employees. They are profit-seeking enterprises that will take whatever steps necessary (usually within the law) to maximize revenues, profits, and shareholder value. Yeah. The timing of this sucks, especially for those affected, but the reality is that AT&T is managing in it's own self-interest. Tax cuts have very little influence since most large corporations already employ various techniques to minimize taxes. Apple being one of the most creative tax avoiders...
What evidence do you have that Apple does not pay all the tax it owes? I agree there are pending legal disputes, but do you expect Apple to refuse to pay once a legal determination is made? And I'm curious: are you a "tax avoider" by paying only what you legally owe? Or do you put a few extra dollars in to try to help out?
I didn't get from Karmadave the idea that Apple wasn't paying what it legally owes.There's nothing wrong with tax avoidance. Businesses and individuals do it all the time and there's nothing wrong with it. Flexible savings accounts, 529 plans, IRAs etc are all perfectly legal ways to minimize your taxes.
As for the biotching about Trump and Republicans (not from you 80), I hardly see how they're responsible for slack demand for "legacy services" like copper landlines and horrible satellite tv. AT&T might find uses for these people with advanced obsolete skills, but there's just not the demand for saddle makers or buggy whip fabricators anymore. (And it can happen to you (and me) too.)
Avoidance = trying to get away with something or out of somethIng.
To not meet.
So karmadave was inpyling exactly that Apple was trying to not pay what it owes.
The problem with with that is that Apple didn't owe anything. Some greedy politicians are trying to retroactively apply taxes Apple never owed. It's wrong.
But governments being what what they are, they can steal from you and there is nothing you can do.
Thats really all there is to us to see here.
Of course the haters love love when their is s little mud slinging. The problem is, this slinging it are coveted in it and Apple is still looking sterling, even when the victims of criminal decisions (ie. the Bromwich scandal and the possible EU revisionist debacle).
Corporations are not benevolent organizations dedicated to the welfare of their employees. They are profit-seeking enterprises that will take whatever steps necessary (usually within the law) to maximize revenues, profits, and shareholder value. Yeah. The timing of this sucks, especially for those affected, but the reality is that AT&T is managing in it's own self-interest. Tax cuts have very little influence since most large corporations already employ various techniques to minimize taxes. Apple being one of the most creative tax avoiders...
This is by choice. Companies can be whatever they want to be, including benovelent towards their employees and the community.
Corporation under US Law do not have to be heartless despite what so called investors will tell you.
Corporations are not benevolent organizations dedicated to the welfare of their employees. They are profit-seeking enterprises that will take whatever steps necessary (usually within the law) to maximize revenues, profits, and shareholder value. Yeah. The timing of this sucks, especially for those affected, but the reality is that AT&T is managing in it's own self-interest. Tax cuts have very little influence since most large corporations already employ various techniques to minimize taxes. Apple being one of the most creative tax avoiders...
This is by choice. Companies can be whatever they want to be, including benovelent towards their employees and the community.
Corporation under US Law do not have to be heartless despite what so called investors will tell you.
"Heartless"? It's typically about their competitiveness and profitability. People are not owed jobs and it's just a fact of life in a functioning economy that more people need to get comfortable with. There are no guarantees, so plan accordingly.
Corporations are not benevolent organizations dedicated to the welfare of their employees. They are profit-seeking enterprises that will take whatever steps necessary (usually within the law) to maximize revenues, profits, and shareholder value. Yeah. The timing of this sucks, especially for those affected, but the reality is that AT&T is managing in it's own self-interest. Tax cuts have very little influence since most large corporations already employ various techniques to minimize taxes. Apple being one of the most creative tax avoiders...
What evidence do you have that Apple does not pay all the tax it owes? I agree there are pending legal disputes, but do you expect Apple to refuse to pay once a legal determination is made? And I'm curious: are you a "tax avoider" by paying only what you legally owe? Or do you put a few extra dollars in to try to help out?
I didn't get from Karmadave the idea that Apple wasn't paying what it legally owes.There's nothing wrong with tax avoidance. Businesses and individuals do it all the time and there's nothing wrong with it. Flexible savings accounts, 529 plans, IRAs etc are all perfectly legal ways to minimize your taxes.
As for the biotching about Trump and Republicans (not from you 80), I hardly see how they're responsible for slack demand for "legacy services" like copper landlines and horrible satellite tv. AT&T might find uses for these people with advanced obsolete skills, but there's just not the demand for saddle makers or buggy whip fabricators anymore. (And it can happen to you (and me) too.)
Same with coal, right?
Exactly Republicans hardly suppprt competition when it comes to things like energy. Republicans also support trickle down economics which don’t work. Wealth should travel up not down.
Why Americans allow CEO's to fire workers willy-nilly to make their short-term bottom line look better is beyond me.
Yep, lay them off and put them on the dole. Great.
In Germany, for example, BMW is not allowed to layoff and send them to the unemployment line for the government to pay. First, they have to go on 3/4 time, then half time, then 1/4 time and into a retraining program. Now that's how a responsible company should operate.
Case in point, Germany was the last country to go into the Great Recession of 2008 and the first to come out!
Oh well.
Then you lack work expereince. Quaterly results in finance for example is THE way to judge performance and decide about layoffs. I am operations technology IT in finance and I have seen quite a lot. It works way differently than in tech companies like those in Sillicon Valley. In general IT in tech and in industry operations are way different as well (different development methods, schedules, market reaction etc.).
It has done nothing but travel upward since the implementation of the first communist policies in this country 104 years ago. Stop falling for propaganda and start discovering what economic policies actually increase personal wealth.
Comments
Case in point, I just dropped my AT&T home phone line and DSL. If DSL is not a viable product for AT&T any longer, then they absolutely have the right to shut down that part of their business and have NO obligation to keep it going just to keep people employed. If they were to do that, then Management would not be being responsible to the business owners (shareholders).
Stevo said Apple spends so much time, energy and money hiring people, that when there's downturn, they avoid laying off people and instead redouble their efforts in R&D and are then ready for the next upturn.
Yep...Very good. Most don't realize how much low wage earners are 'subsidized' by taxpayers. Wether it's food stamps, health care, dental care at the emergency room, etc, etc. It's not anti-business to ask businesses to pay a living wage. When 6 Walmart board members have more wealth than the bottom 45% of Americans...something is amiss, afoot, alas.
Why Americans vote against their own best interests (or don't bother to vote at all) is beyond me.
Perhaps, I'm just saying there has to be a better way. All good points, btw. ATT may not be the best example of a fwd thinking corporation.
And the Depression, but we don’t really talk about that anymore. I just realized that it will only be a few more years before we have people posting here who have never known a life other than economic recession… Why, you’re just a member of the “right-wing cult”, so that’s why you think that way.
https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/recips.php?id=D000000076
Detail:
Avoidance = trying to get away with something or out of somethIng.
To not meet.
So karmadave was inpyling exactly that Apple was trying to not pay what it owes.
The problem with with that is that Apple didn't owe anything. Some greedy politicians are trying to retroactively apply taxes Apple never owed. It's wrong.
But governments being what what they are, they can steal from you and there is nothing you can do.
Thats really all there is to us to see here.
Of course the haters love love when their is s little mud slinging. The problem is, this slinging it are coveted in it and Apple is still looking sterling, even when the victims of criminal decisions (ie. the Bromwich scandal and the possible EU revisionist debacle).
Corporation under US Law do not have to be heartless despite what so called investors will tell you.