Apple to adopt a 'go big or go home' strategy for 'Apple Car,' analyst says

Posted:
in General Discussion
Investment bank JP Morgan expects the "Apple Car" to be a fully autonomous vehicle that Apple manufactures itself toward the end of the 2020s.

Credit: AppleInsider
Credit: AppleInsider


In a note to investors seen by AppleInsider, lead analyst Samik Chatterjee outlines some of JP Morgan's predictions about the "Apple Car." That includes what its debut could imply for Apple, the automotive market, and the technology industry.

Chatterjee expects the Cupertino tech giant to adopt a "go big or go home" approach. He expects Apple to look to control the pace of innovation to differentiate the "Apple Car" and position it in the growth market of battery electric vehicles (BEV) that are fully autonomous.

The primary reason why Apple is interested in the car industry, Chatterjee says, is that its total addressable market (TAM) is nearly $2.55 trillion -- far higher than the smartphone market's $420 billion. Apple also has an opportunity on an installed base of 1 billion vehicles, and the autonomous "Apple Car" could also integrate deeply with and expand Services.

Although speculation about an Apple electric vehicle aren't new, the analyst notes that recent press reports "indicate expansion and building momentum of intent to participate in the industry." Rumors of changes in leadership, similarly, are likely an indication of past delayed commercial launches in shifts in direction.

Chatterjee also notes that a lack of feedback from other parties in the automotive and technology industries likely hints that Apple has been focused on developing its own intellectual property in the car space.

There may be a few obstacles to Apple's entrance into the car space. The industry is inherently challenging and risky. Since it's a mature market, any growth has to come at the expense of existing automakers.

Despite that, Chatterjee still forecasts Apple will "go big or go home" and position itself as a full-fledged manufacturer. The analyst points out that Apple is likely eyeing an expected shift toward autonomous vehicles as an opportunity to differentiate its offering.

The relative immaturity of fully autonomous vehicles (AVs) will likely push the "Apple Car's" launch toward the end of the decade, Chatterjee says. However, the sole focus on an electric vehicle could accelerate the timeline.

On the financials, the "Apple Car" will be a premium vehicle and the company will likely prefer outsourced manufacturing to vertical integration at first. Gross margins will likely be much lower than Apple's other hardware products, but revenue could reach $700 billion with a $70 billion to $100 billion TAM in the premium auto category.

The key revenue component, Chatterjee adds, is likely to be Services. Services could improve the vehicle's low margins, particularly if it's a closed ecosystem. Fully autonomous vehicles could also allow for greater monetization of Services.

Other JP Morgan analysts, in Chatterjee's note, expect the "Apple Car" to have a negative impact on other automakers and a positive impact for any OEM chosen as a contract manufacturer.

Chatterjee is maintaining his 12-month AAPL price target of $150, based on JP Morgan's 2022 earnings-per-share estimate of $4.90 and a blended price-to-earnings multiple of about 31x.

Shares of AAPL are trading at $129.86 on the NASDAQ in intra-day trading Monday morning.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 27
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    edited January 2021 SpamSandwichwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 27
    larryjwlarryjw Posts: 1,031member
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Musk is the richest man because the richest Americans got massive tax breaks and PPP money from the Fed. The money had to go somewhere.

    In April 2020, TSLA was about $70. Today it's $850. Richest investors have been infected with the pandemic virus Tesla Speculatis. There is no recovery. 

    Equivalently this about a 75% interest rate, and the price earning ratio is about 1700. 
    tmaymuthuk_vanalingamRayz2016drdavidwatto_cobraglnf
  • Reply 3 of 27
    M68000M68000 Posts: 765member
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Maybe because Apple is known as a computer company who now makes new phones like clockwork every year and oh by the way wants to take over the steaming media industry among other things...  where as Tesla makes vehicles and focused on that.    Samsung also makes refrigerators I think, not that I would ever buy a Samsung kitchen appliance..  should Apple also be working on a refrigerator too? (Sarcasm) .    Also,  it appears there is some belief by Apple or others that a self driving vehicle is somehow needed.   The idea of self driving vehicles is getting to be an obsession with some people,  whether or not it is a good thing or not. Trying to undertake the engineering and building a “regular” vehicle is a huge project,  especially considering Apple has zero experience doing so.  Adding the additional self driving part increases the complexity greatly I would imagine.   @kknopp01 not attacking you but this is my opinion.
    edited January 2021 drdavidwatto_cobrasuperkloton
  • Reply 4 of 27
    larryjw said:
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Musk is the richest man because the richest Americans got massive tax breaks and PPP money from the Fed. The money had to go somewhere.

    In April 2020, TSLA was about $70. Today it's $850. Richest investors have been infected with the pandemic virus Tesla Speculatis. There is no recovery. 

    Equivalently this about a 75% interest rate, and the price earning ratio is about 1700. 
    Hehe i like the Tesla Speculatis virus, no vaccines for that yet?
    watto_cobracornchip
  • Reply 5 of 27
    wood1208wood1208 Posts: 2,917member
    I would tell this analyst, GO HOME! You don't know anything what Apple's plan for Apple EV car.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 27
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    M68000 said:
    building a “regular” vehicle is a huge project,  especially considering Apple has zero experience doing so.  
    And there it is. 🤦🏾‍♂️

    Here are a few other “huge projects” that Apple had zero experience in:

    Music players. 
    Mobile phones. 
    Smart watches 
    In-car entertainment 
    Maps
    Healthcare
    Fitness and well-being
    Green energy (yes, Apple sells that too)
    Processor design
    Automated manufacturing 

    Never understood this weird belief some folk have that it’s somehow impossible to learn something new …


    tmayqwerty52randominternetpersonviclauyycflyingdpXedcanukstormwatto_cobracitylightsapplesuperkloton
  • Reply 7 of 27
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    By the end of the decade Apple will be entering a market that is in the adolescent stage of development.   They will not get a free ride as Tesla did -- and that's not to marginalize anything Tesla has done or is doing.   Rather to point out that they stepped in as everybody else stumbled and hesitated -- they opened a market without any viable competition.

    But, in another 8 years there will be LOTS of competition.
    Apple will likely do what they are doing now:  Building a better product that people like.   And, they'll do that using any and every means necessary -- they won't be constrained by self proclaimed experts saying "This is how you will do it".
    watto_cobramike1
  • Reply 8 of 27
    M68000 said:
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Maybe because Apple is known as a computer company who now makes new phones like clockwork every year and oh by the way wants to take over the steaming media industry among other things...  where as Tesla makes vehicles and focused on that.    Samsung also makes refrigerators I think, not that I would ever buy a Samsung kitchen appliance..  should Apple also be working on a refrigerator too? (Sarcasm)

    I think,  just because it is known as computer company, it makes sense for Apple to go to the EV market. The requirements en the expectation from the near future electric vehicles are so high, that they will be seen more and more like moving computers on 4 wheels. And with such a vehicles, Apple will be able to do easily and deeply integration with Apple’s extended services. (Something that can’t be done with refrigerators)
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 27
    BEVs literally computers on wheels. 

    Tesla got the head start and they are the most vertically integrated manufacturing for BEV. Biggest constraints, currently, of mass producing BEV are the batteries. Tesla is building their own battery factory in Nevada. 

    Apple is the best in logistics with Tim on the helm. They may not have mass produced vehicles before but, everyone at some point has to start and learn how to do it and refine it. Some of the lessons learned from building phones will help them in car productions. They will still have to tackle the supply of materials for batteries and how fast they can be produced. 

    I’m looking forward to what they’ll bring to the market. Tesla, I believe has nothing to worry about Apple entering the market. It’s the legacy car makers that will lose the most. They are very slow in responding to the future and current demand for BEV. They’ve gotten very comfortable in their position as maker of ICE vehicles. And the only way they can sell cars is through dealerships which is set up as a mafia business based on old laws the protects the interest on the car dealers. 

    The legacy car makers are too slow to pivot from ICE to BEV and don’t have the software “savviness” or expertise of tech companies like Tesla, Apple, etc.

    I believe that the BEV industry will follow a trend similar to the dawning age of ICE vehicles where lots of manufacturers at first then will consolidate to the larger players that can react faster to the changes and demands of the market. 

    Disclosure: I’m a shareholder for both Tesla and Apple. 
    GeorgeBMacmuthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobracitylightsappledk49randominternetperson
  • Reply 10 of 27
    But will it come with a charger?:)

     looking forward to how Apple will sell these cars, also the charging stations / infrastructure.
  • Reply 11 of 27
    zimmiezimmie Posts: 651member
    Rayz2016 said:
    M68000 said:
    building a “regular” vehicle is a huge project,  especially considering Apple has zero experience doing so.  
    And there it is. 🤦🏾‍♂️

    Here are a few other “huge projects” that Apple had zero experience in:

    Music players. 
    Mobile phones. 
    Smart watches 
    In-car entertainment 
    Maps
    Healthcare
    Fitness and well-being
    Green energy (yes, Apple sells that too)
    Processor design
    Automated manufacturing 

    Never understood this weird belief some folk have that it’s somehow impossible to learn something new …


    Eh. Most of those are big by tech project standards, but that's about it.

    A music player is just a small computer with weird power considerations.
    A mobile phone is a small computer with weird power considerations and a cell radio.
    Smartwatches are smaller mobile phones with some extra sensors.
    And so on.

    Of the things you listed, bringing processor design in-house is the biggest, most complicated project by far. Like multiple orders of magnitude more effort than any of the others.

    Now consider that none of these things except automated manufacturing carry a significant risk of actively hurting or killing the owner or operator when they go wrong. Compare the number of people injured or killed by iPhone batteries, cables, chargers and so on—both first-party and third-party—to the number of people injured or killed by Takata airbag inflators. A car, self-driving or not, has major safety concerns which Apple has never had to deal with before.

    Then you have the safety risk to people who are entirely unrelated to the operation of the car. I've never heard of any Apple product which even could injure a bystander, let alone one which has. If they really are making a self-driving car, it could potentially injure or kill somebody without a human even being inside.

    Building a safety engineering organization in a company which has never needed one is extraordinarily complicated for a lot of reasons. Definitely not impossible, but not comparable to anything Apple has ever done. At least another order of magnitude more effort than bringing processor design in-house. If this is a thing which Apple is actually doing, I expect it will fundamentally change how the company operates in the same way the iPhone did.
    muthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobra
  • Reply 12 of 27
    First of all, there's no real autonomous vehicle out there, people like me who own a Tesla know that the self-claimed self-driving cars today are really just "toys" or as Steve said "baby software", when you think about it, this is a really difficult and complicated system to build, to Apple this is one of those "core technologies" they want to have in hand; secondly, battery technology today is booming and I'm sure there will be two or three best providers, so heavily investing in battery tech will likely to diminish Apple's dominance in "core technologies", and finally, don't manufacture, find OEM, find contract manufacturers, they'll be the Foxconn in the car industry if Apple has a whole system designed. In the end, vertical integration in autonomous driving and in-car experience would distinguish Apple car from others. 
    edited January 2021 watto_cobra
  • Reply 13 of 27
    On the one hand, it's Apple and of course people are thinking that it's going to be a premium product and priced accordingly.

    On the other hand, it's Apple. The company that brought Apple ]['s and Macintosh to the computing world when machines with similar technologies cost thousands of dollars more.

    There have already been rumors about Apple pioneering cheaper battery technologies. Would an Apple car necessarily have to be priced as if it were a Tesla Model S?
    watto_cobrarandominternetperson
  • Reply 14 of 27
    netroxnetrox Posts: 1,438member
    Why is that they're so sure Apple is building cars? I heard that with Apple TV which never materialized. 


    watto_cobra
  • Reply 15 of 27
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,856moderator
    M68000 said:
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Maybe because Apple is known as a computer company who now makes new phones like clockwork every year and oh by the way wants to take over the steaming media industry among other things...  where as Tesla makes vehicles and focused on that.    Samsung also makes refrigerators I think, not that I would ever buy a Samsung kitchen appliance..  should Apple also be working on a refrigerator too? (Sarcasm) .    Also,  it appears there is some belief by Apple or others that a self driving vehicle is somehow needed.   The idea of self driving vehicles is getting to be an obsession with some people,  whether or not it is a good thing or not. Trying to undertake the engineering and building a “regular” vehicle is a huge project,  especially considering Apple has zero experience doing so.  Adding the additional self driving part increases the complexity greatly I would imagine.   @kknopp01 not attacking you but this is my opinion.
    Self-driving vehicles represent a significant paridigm shift in global transportation and urban and suburban planning. 

     Robotaxis will eliminate the need of an expensive human driver, provide 10x utilization of a vehicle versus private ownership, provide more versatility to consumers, reduce need for parking spaces, lower insurance costs for taxi fleets, reduce road injuries and deaths, etc.

    Next, apply the autonomous driving AI to delivery vans, and short and long haul trucking, busses, shuttles, etc and you gain similar benefits in those segments.  

    Who knows what tangential industries and efficiencies might be found along the way. 

    Add to all of the above greater productivity by those utilizing automated vehicles versus driving themselves to work, to business meetings, etc.  there will come the advent of the mobile office, mobile meeting room, conference room, even remote+mobile company, using work from home and work from rolling office to replace the physical office building compketely.  A configurable matrix to match ever changing needs for meeting and collaborating and accomplishing all corporate administrative tasks.  

    Self driving vehicles will be one of the many new advancements the next generation will ask how we ever managed without.  They will reshape the landscape of cities and suburbs and of work habits, yielding efficiencies yet to be calculated.  
    edited January 2021 watto_cobraqwerty52
  • Reply 16 of 27
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    M68000 said:
    kknopp01 said:
    Elon Musk figured out how to do it in America.  It made him the world's richest man.  Why can't Apple be that smart?
    Maybe because Apple is known as a computer company who now makes new phones like clockwork every year and oh by the way wants to take over the steaming media industry among other things...  where as Tesla makes vehicles and focused on that.    Samsung also makes refrigerators I think, not that I would ever buy a Samsung kitchen appliance..  should Apple also be working on a refrigerator too? (Sarcasm) .    Also,  it appears there is some belief by Apple or others that a self driving vehicle is somehow needed.   The idea of self driving vehicles is getting to be an obsession with some people,  whether or not it is a good thing or not. Trying to undertake the engineering and building a “regular” vehicle is a huge project,  especially considering Apple has zero experience doing so.  Adding the additional self driving part increases the complexity greatly I would imagine.   @kknopp01 not attacking you but this is my opinion.
    Self-driving vehicles represent a significant paridigm shift in global transportation and urban and suburban planning. 

     Robotaxis will eliminate the need of an expensive human driver, provide 10x utilization of a vehicle versus private ownership, provide more versatility to consumers, reduce need for parking spaces, lower insurance costs for taxi fleets, reduce road injuries and deaths, etc.

    Next, apply the autonomous driving AI to delivery vans, and short and long haul trucking, busses, shuttles, etc and you gain similar benefits in those segments.  

    Who knows what tangential industries and efficiencies might be found along the way. 

    Add to all of the above greater productivity by those utilizing automated vehicles versus driving themselves to work, to business meetings, etc.  there will come the advent of the mobile office, mobile meeting room, conference room, even remote+mobile company, using work from home and work from rolling office to replace the physical office building compketely.  A configurable matrix to match ever changing needs for meeting and collaborating and accomplishing all corporate administrative tasks.  

    Self driving vehicles will be one of the many new advancements the next generation will ask how we ever managed without.  They will reshape the landscape of cities and suburbs and of work habits, yielding efficiencies yet to be calculated.  
    But, there is a darker side to that shift, employment:
    Fleets of self driving taxis will decimate employment in the Gig sector and self driving 18 wheelers will decimate employment of long haul truck drivers.  Then add in the combination of self driving delivery services with drones, and we will have yet another paradigm shift away from sectors employing less educated workers.

    That's not an argument against it -- because a nation either stays up to date or it falls behind.   But something we should anticipate -- which is something we do not have a good track record on -- ask any West Virginia coal miner.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 17 of 27
    Some of the biggest ticket items people will ever purchase are houses and cars. Apple should be looking at both as new market potentials.
    watto_cobracornchip
  • Reply 18 of 27
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member
    I personally do not believe apple will make a car, i think their goal is the driving user experience and how people interact with the car. So they are looking to partner with some company who will allow them to control that experience. I do not believe they will take on the entire car design. 
  • Reply 19 of 27
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,953member
    Apple’s car and Apple’s Maps are interrelated. We won’t see an Apple car until Maps has full rollout of “LookAround” - at least in the US.


    maestro64 said:
    I personally do not believe apple will make a car, i think their goal is the driving user experience and how people interact with the car. So they are looking to partner with some company who will allow them to control that experience. I do not believe they will take on the entire car design. 


    I believe history will prove you wrong.


    edited January 2021
  • Reply 20 of 27
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 3,345member
    If Apple does enter this market, I hope it's with a new business model that completely disrupts the market. The popularity of leases and now Uber suggest to me that many people don't want to own a car. And the aspects of car ownership that people like -- personalization and convenience -- can be replicated without ownership. 

    As I've said before, I think Apple should offer transportation as a service, but far better than what Uber has done. 

    When I call an Apple Car from my iPhone, I want a comfortable, safe, personalized ride. My music and video, ready to play on the in-car entertainment system. I want flexibility to pick up friends, drop people off, make multiple stops, have the car wait while I run in to pick something up. No hassle, no constraints. Just a radically better experience. 
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