Apple's attempts to exclude Xbox exec's testimony a 'distraction,' Microsoft says

Posted:
in General Discussion edited May 2021
Microsoft shot back at Apple's attempts to exclude Xbox executive Lori Wright's testimony in the Epic Games v. Apple trial, claiming that Apple is using the accusations as a distraction.

Credit: Microsoft
Credit: Microsoft


Apple has filed multiple motions asking the court to make an adverse credibility claim against Microsoft executive Lori Wright, the latest being lodged on Wednesday night. If granted, it could mean that Wright's testimony will be ignored.

In the Wednesday filing, Apple wrote that "a reasonable observer might wonder whether Epic is serving as a stalking horse for Microsoft," adding that, "Microsoft shielded itself from meaningful discovery in this litigation by not appearing as a party or sending a corporate representative to testify."

In a statement to Bloomberg on Thursday, Microsoft shot down Apple's allegations and said that the Cupertino company was using it as a distraction.

"Apple is trying to distract from legitimate concerns from many companies across the industry about its App Store policies and practices, including its refusal to allow game streaming in the Apple App Store. Epic speaks and acts for itself, and Microsoft and many other companies have raised concerns through our own voices, including directly with Apple itself," Microsoft said.

Microsoft added that Wright took the stand involuntarily, and was both forthright and thoughtful in her testimony. "That Apple does not like Ms. Wright's testimony is clear. That Apple has no basis to challenge the substance of her testimony is equally clear," Microsoft added.

Apple previously asked the court to make an "adverse credibility finding regarding the testimony of Lori Wright" on May 6.

Apple is leaning on a ruling from April 13, when the court warned expert witnesses that if they failed to make a "sufficient production of relevant documents to both parties," the court will "weigh such a failure against the credibility of the testifying witness." Such a failure could "warrant the striking of testimony," something that could benefit Apple's case.

Wright's testimony included a tidbit that Apple's feud with Microsoft over the xCloud service resulted in gaming platform Shadow being pulled from the App Store.

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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 28
    genovellegenovelle Posts: 1,356member
    Microsoft should allow Apple to promote games and movies on Apple’s store and offer cheaper pricing to switchers. 
    ikirwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 28
    cg27cg27 Posts: 168member
    Well if Lori is the one Bill had a fling with I guess I can see why
    pulseimagesdee_deewatto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 28
    22july201322july2013 Posts: 2,911member
    The main problem with the anti-Apple people on these forums is their lack of consistency. They should apply their same wishes to Microsoft, Sony, Google, Epic, and any other company in America. I've asked some of them questions regarding their consistency and they refuse to respond.
    Beatsthtpulseimagesikiruraharawatto_cobra
  • Reply 4 of 28
    PezaPeza Posts: 198member
    Not surprised by Microsoft's comments, I agree with them. Apple is just desperately playing dirty to block any testimonies that show them in a bad light. 
    Still onwards the trial goes..
  • Reply 5 of 28
    BeatsBeats Posts: 2,912member
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    KTRpulseimagesdee_deeikirurahara
  • Reply 6 of 28
    sirlance99sirlance99 Posts: 1,278member
    The main problem with the anti-Apple people on these forums is their lack of consistency. They should apply their same wishes to Microsoft, Sony, Google, Epic, and any other company in America. I've asked some of them questions regarding their consistency and they refuse to respond.
    I could say the same with people on here that defend Apple no matter what. Apple can’t do what they do without every other company that helps them. It’s a symbiotic thing that companies have with each other. 
    muthuk_vanalingamPeza
  • Reply 7 of 28
    sirlance99sirlance99 Posts: 1,278member
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.
    thtmuthuk_vanalingamPezaurahara
  • Reply 8 of 28
    canukstormcanukstorm Posts: 2,573member
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.
    MS is butt hurt because they got crucified in the smartphone & tablet market, a market that is 4X the size of Windows. This is just their way of spiting Apple. And if Apple does & is forced to open iOS to 3rd party app stores or side loading apps then that could potential hurt every closed digital app store, Xbox being one of them

    https://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2021/05/if-tim-cooks-testimony-fails-to-persuade-the-judge-that-the-app-store-isnt-a-monopoly-then-all-of-silicon-valleys-gatekee.html
    fotoformatpulseimageshydrogenikirwatto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 28
    hammeroftruthhammeroftruth Posts: 1,169member
    Microsoft’s solution is simple. Put up or shut up. If they don’t want their testimony stricken, produce the proof that they lose money as they stated. 

    Microsoft can argue all they want about distractions, the rule is there to prevent bullshit statements.  

    If they didn’t want to do that then maybe they shouldn’t have been so chummy with Epic and decide to testify. 


    FileMakerFellerhydrogenforegoneconclusionuraharawatto_cobraDetnator
  • Reply 10 of 28
    gradlygradly Posts: 15member
    They didn’t provide proof/documents. Nothing to see here! 
    watto_cobraDetnator
  • Reply 11 of 28
    pulseimagespulseimages Posts: 446member
    Is Microsoft afraid of the world finding out that Bill Gates dipped his pen in the company ink more than once through meaningful discovery? 
    dee_deewatto_cobra
  • Reply 12 of 28
    Peza said:
    Not surprised by Microsoft's comments, I agree with them. Apple is just desperately playing dirty to block any testimonies that show them in a bad light. 
    Still onwards the trial goes..
    Apple's lawyers are making use of any failure to comply with the court's rules to advance their client's case. I don't think any reasonable person would want this case to be decided on procedural matters like this, but if Apple were to lose the case because their lawyers didn't chase down every possible avenue of success then that's not a good outcome either.

    We want to see justice done, but like the making of sausages we feel better about it all if we only see the end result and not the process.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 13 of 28
    dee_deedee_dee Posts: 80member
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.
    Microsoft is not important anymore.  They need to stay on iOS devices to stay relevant.  
    hydrogenikirwatto_cobra
  • Reply 14 of 28
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,025member
    cg27 said:
    Well if Lori is the one Bill had a fling with I guess I can see why
    Unnecessary.  Keep your gross, sexist thoughts to yourself please.
    muthuk_vanalingamikir
  • Reply 15 of 28
    PezaPeza Posts: 198member
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.
    MS is butt hurt because they got crucified in the smartphone & tablet market, a market that is 4X the size of Windows. This is just their way of spiting Apple. And if Apple does & is forced to open iOS to 3rd party app stores or side loading apps then that could potential hurt every closed digital app store, Xbox being one of them

    https://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2021/05/if-tim-cooks-testimony-fails-to-persuade-the-judge-that-the-app-store-isnt-a-monopoly-then-all-of-silicon-valleys-gatekee.html
    Yes I'm sure that's it, for a company with a current market cap of 1.86 trillion dollars. They must really be sour over the tablet market, for which they sell a more capable device. Like it or not, the majority of new M1 iPad Pro reviews have stated it's a lot of power heavily restricted by iOS. 
    The Surface Pro has had laptop grade hardware for years and runs a full OS, may be Windows but it's certainly my not restricted by its OS in what it can do.
    MS did mess up with the mobile phone market though, but as I pointed out it's hardly had an impact on them.

    And FYI Xbox isn't closed like you claim, they have integrated the EA store into Game Pass and rumours claim Ubisoft+ is also coming to the service. And that's despite the fact your argument is totally and utterly flawed by the fact you can go and buy a game from a multitude of other places from brick and mortar stores to the supermarkets to Amazon. I don't recall the last time I could get an Apple app from the supermarket..... if Apple lose it won't change anything for Xbox.
    edited May 2021 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 16 of 28
    Peza said: And FYI Xbox isn't closed like you claim, they have integrated the EA store into Game Pass and rumours claim Ubisoft+ is also coming to the service.
    LOL...there is no EA "store" on Xbox. There is EA Play, which is part of the Xbox Game Pass service. 
    uraharathtwatto_cobra
  • Reply 17 of 28
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,025member
    Peza said:

    And FYI Xbox isn't closed like you claim, they have integrated the EA store into Game Pass and rumours claim Ubisoft+ is also coming to the service. 
    That doesn't mean it's open, Xbox have just made sweetheart deals with those particular services.  It's certainly not open to all.
    Peza said:

    And that's despite the fact your argument is totally and utterly flawed by the fact you can go and buy a game from a multitude of other places from brick and mortar stores to the supermarkets to Amazon.
    Microsoft get a license cut of every boxed copy sold too.  Mainstream console development is not an open eco system.
    edited May 2021 ikiruraharawatto_cobra
  • Reply 18 of 28
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 17,849member
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.

    I take the middle approach here.  Microsoft did lose the phone and music player wars, and badly.  It has a weird relationship with Apple, and has ever since Jobs came back and got them to develop Office and Explorer for Mac.  This is highly subjective, but I do get the feeling that some important people within Microsoft are always looking to beat Apple at something; to knock them down a peg.  

    We also agree about "killing Microsoft." That won't happen.  Even if Apple did "take Office seriously" and develop real cross-platform alternatives, it would take years and billions of dollars to get competitive enough to have a chance.  And even if that happened, it wouldn't "kill" Office or Microsoft as a result.  Office 365 has 50 million subscribers alone. Microsoft, as you note, is a large company that is everywhere.  Windows revenue alone is nearly $25 billion a year now (22 in 2019, about 10% growth a year).  

    That being said, I don't agree about Apple "tanking" if Google and MS took their apps off the store (you noted "and some other top ranked and used apps," but I don't know what that means).  Apple does have the ability to offer alternatives on its own platforms, and does so now.  The revenue hit would be somewhat significant, but not all that consequential compared to Apple's quarterly profits (I believe total iOS revenue is somewhere over $20 billion annually).  
    muthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobra
  • Reply 19 of 28
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 17,849member
    Peza said:
    Beats said:
    Microsoft LOST in making knockoff iPhones. Had Microsoft won the iKnockoff market their tune would be different.

    What a shi* company after all the respect Apple is giving them on iPhone/iPad. Time for Apple to take office Apps seriously and kill Microsoft.

    Microsoft teaming up against Apple playing dirty.
    What a small minded way of thinking. They need each other and Microsoft is just as important and powerful as Apple. You take MS apps off of the Apple store, people will get other devices that have MS as their businesses run off of MS. 

    In fact, if you took Google, Microsoft and some of the other top ranked and used apps off of the Apple store, Apple would tank fast. No matter what YOU think, the world runs off of them and needs them and nothing Apple has can replace that as of now.
    MS is butt hurt because they got crucified in the smartphone & tablet market, a market that is 4X the size of Windows. This is just their way of spiting Apple. And if Apple does & is forced to open iOS to 3rd party app stores or side loading apps then that could potential hurt every closed digital app store, Xbox being one of them

    https://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2021/05/if-tim-cooks-testimony-fails-to-persuade-the-judge-that-the-app-store-isnt-a-monopoly-then-all-of-silicon-valleys-gatekee.html
    Yes I'm sure that's it, for a company with a current market cap of 1.86 trillion dollars. They must really be sour over the tablet market, for which they sell a more capable device. Like it or not, the majority of new M1 iPad Pro reviews have stated it's a lot of power heavily restricted by iOS. 
    The Surface Pro has had laptop grade hardware for years and runs a full OS, may be Windows but it's certainly my not restricted by its OS in what it can do.
    MS did mess up with the mobile phone market though, but as I pointed out it's hardly had an impact on them.

    And FYI Xbox isn't closed like you claim, they have integrated the EA store into Game Pass and rumours claim Ubisoft+ is also coming to the service. And that's despite the fact your argument is totally and utterly flawed by the fact you can go and buy a game from a multitude of other places from brick and mortar stores to the supermarkets to Amazon. I don't recall the last time I could get an Apple app from the supermarket..... if Apple lose it won't change anything for Xbox.

    Respectfully, you're conflating two issues.  The Surface may be more capable in your opinion.  Perhaps it's a better option for you.  I've used both, and it definitely is not as "good" as an iPad in my view.  And reviewers may agree that the M1 iPad is limited by iOS (though I'd like to see what you're basing "the majority" claim on).  Regardless, that has nothing to do with the market and Microsoft's behavior.  

    Microsoft as a company definitely remembers getting destroyed in three markets:  Music, Phones and Tablets.  Each time, they tried to release an "Apple-killer" device in an established market.  They took "the L" with music and phones, big time.  With tablets, they've been more successful, but they still can't compete with the iPad.  Even now, their ads don't know whether to target the iPad or the MacBook Air.  They try to do both, but it just doesn't work.  I have my own theories as to why, but I'll save that for later.  The point is that Microsoft and Apple have an odd relationship.  They are always competing in OS/platform space, even though MS has the dominant position.  Microsoft keeps attempting to compete directly on hardware, but it keeps getting wrecked.  Of course they remember, and I'm sure some senior people are pretty "butthurt" about it.  They would have to be, because they are doing better with the Surface, and if they are not idiots, they should learn from their mistakes with music and phones.  Then again, judging by their ads, today doesn't appear to be that day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  :)  

    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 20 of 28
    gremlingremlin Posts: 61member
    You know you’re in the right when Microsoft is on the opposing side!
    watto_cobra
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