I believe cnet. I've read reports of theirs from about a week before Apple announcements, and they have always been right for the last 1.5 years or more.
Anyway, I see nothing to complain about. Improved iMacs are a good idea, let's hope the prices improve as well. Jaguar is a good thing, they need to spread that goodness to the consumers.
As for PowerMacs, again, I believe cnet, so let's assume that new displays and powermacs will be announced in August and the speeds will be above 1.2 Ghz. The motherboards must be somewhat improved as well. This is all good. Maybe not up to par with the PC hardware for those who believe the Mhz Myth, but certainly more likely to sell than the current PowerMacs.
Also consider that someone was saying the new PowerMacs will not boot OS 9 anymore. Maybe they will require Jaguar? Even if not, it would be more convenient to ship them with jaguar. The faster OS on the faster hardware would make the new PowerMacs perform much better than current ones.
nVidia and Apple are supposed to have an announcement in August as well. Maybe this is the reason PMs will be delayed until August? (as well as to let the promotion sell more computers)
Remember that the last PMs were not delayed to Jan 28 to avoid bad press, but because nVidia didn't want Apple to announce the GeForce 4 until later on.
Why is the 'Powerful Offer' promo still on Apple's site? It was only good through July 7th. If they updated the promo page with a new offer on the 8th, one would think they could bother to take down the OLD offer. Maybe the're going to extend it to help clear the channel.....
I find that hard to believe, just one day after Apple launched a promo on them.]</strong><hr></blockquote>
No, that's how you clear inventory from the channel. Ingram Micro and other distributors are sitting on a ton of Powermacs - presumably Apple has none. The promo is to get people to snap up what's still sitting around so that Apple doesn't need to cover steeper price protection if the boxes won't move after new hardware ships.
Another thing for EVERYBODY to keep in mind. What everyone is heaving over is obviously not set in stone. If Apple has new Powermacs ready for August, it's not a huge problem for Apple to decide - even now - to roll out at Expo and just push the shipping delay out to what it would have been. Getting the marketing materials together in the next week is tricky, but they've done it before.
It's more a matter of marketing than products being ready IMO. Apple certainly has the final design in testing somewhere and can slap a recent build of Jaguar on it and show it to the world next week, shipping at the end of August.
He needs to be reasonably sure that Jaguar will ship at the right time (new Pro hardware will not ship without Jag, IMO) and that all the other pieces can ramp up in time, AND that the market coverage will be favorable. Consider this:
Apple intros a 17" iMac and new Powermacs. What does the media cover? Most will cover the iMac and largely pan the Powermacs. The photo will almost certainly be the iMac, not the Powermac, and the lead will likely be "MacWorld: Apple introduces new 17" iMac". The Pro line will get almost totally panned. However, wait one month, have a special event, and you get an article dedicated to the new Powermacs.
Not only that, but the Jaguar roll-out gets split. The Expo talk is about iApps, ease of setup, etc. The special event is about Quartz Extreme, performance, new printing architecture, and so on. Again, much better focus.
This is exactly why I think Apple is introducing so many products in special events, and why they SHOULD (IMO) wait for the Powermacs, even if they are ready now. However, there's probably nothing stopping Steve from showing them next week if he wants to do so. For Apple, it's a long way to the show, and it's petty common for products to come out or go in up to the last minute.
Bottom line is that there appear to be some pretty substantial improvements to the Powermac line waiting for us, and while you might have to wait a month to see them, you'll probably not have to wait much longer to play with them than if they were shown at the show.
Are they updating the iMac or just adding a 17" version with the existing specs? If they are updating the iMac specs this will only make more difficult to clear the existing powermac towers.
My hope is
New PowerMac towers that will ship on jaguar release date. With the specs we have been hearing about, Dual 1.4 Ghz etc... With the same price points.
Update iMac (this includes a 17" model) with a price reduced by $100 to $150.
eMac even if it not update, the price should be $999
Some updated iApps..
Apple has to push ahead...they have to clear inventory the old fashion way.....Mark them down so someone who might of bought a iMac because of the price can say "I have a short time to get a protower (which has better specs) for about same amount of money.
<strong>Nobody has commented on my suggestion and the more I read the more it make sense to me; that if the delay in intorduction of new Powermacs is delayed until August, it is because they NEED Jaguar.
I am convinced that this is the most likely reason, and I don't think Steve would want all the press to review his flagship machines with 10.1.5 becuase it (10.1.5) makes the machine look much slower than it really is. If I was Steve Jobs there is no way I would launch them with 10.1.5 I would want the press and not just the Mac press to rave about these new machines.
Think about the speed jump that will be apparent if we get either a G4 1.5ghz with DDR and JAGUAR, or a G5 with the same.
When you think about it, Steve can't let these machines to go to market with 10.1.5 what he wants and Apple need is to make these new machines a revelation.
If I recall, Apple has released computers with a special version of the OS, which was essentially the next OS upgrade. If my memory serves me they did this with 9.2 on either the iBook or iMac's. If they were a month away from the OS release, and they pre-announced the hardware, as they have been doing lately, then there would be no need to hold back an anouncement.
<strong>Why is the 'Powerful Offer' promo still on Apple's site? It was only good through July 7th. If they updated the promo page with a new offer on the 8th, one would think they could bother to take down the OLD offer. Maybe the're going to extend it to help clear the channel.....</strong><hr></blockquote>
Let's face it, from a business standpoint, even if Apple comes out with a 1.4 GHz DDR unit, it will still be less than the Intel crowd has already (from a numbers standpoint). Therefore, from a "WOW " standpoint, it ain't much. A NEW 17" iMac (and/or other mods) has a new "WOW" factor and would be the crowd pleaser in the consumer world.
The PM crowd will buy when the specs get to where each user wants them. If I was Apple I would be taunting the consumer crowd and possible Intel converts to sell to new users, again this leads to the iMacs.
Of course this won't please the 52 people on this board.
Something just hasn't smelled right about all this new iMac nonsense and no powermac, so I decided to do some digging. The whole product inventory, component cost, production line process just doesn't mesh.
Back on 31 May 2002, the Register posted the following: (not that I believe the register, but they do have some good sources). [quote] A report from the heartland of American manufacturing (ie Taiwan) suggests that production of 17 inch and 19 inch versions of the new iMac will begin in Q3 this year.
Local news service Digitimes reports also reports that the industry-wide LCD shortage continues to constrain the number of IMacs that the manufacturer Quanta can ship. Mindful of these shortages, a Q3 production ramp allows Apple time to build inventory in time for a New Year launch.<hr></blockquote>
The Digitimes actual article stated:
[quote]Industry sources said Quanta Computer will start producing the latest 17 and 19-inch iMacs in the third quarter, suggesting a strengthening partnership between the PC contract maker and Apple Computer.<hr></blockquote>
Folks, the supply of 17" LCD's and the actual material cost, don't make it possible for a 17" iMac at MWNY. I just can't see how it could happen. The price would have to be well above the US $2000 mark. Also, start producing does not mean start selling. On an item as complex to produce as the new iMacs, there will be trial runs, to work out the bugs, before there are actual production runs. Then inventory must build to a marketable level before release.
Reality #1 There is a soft market impacting all computer manufacturers, not just Apple. Don't sweat it. Everyone is sitting on inventory and taking hits.
Reality #2 The new iMac production cycle is a fixed factor that cannot vary significantly. From what I have seen, I just do not see the 17" iMac at MWNY. If production was rushed that much, I would seriously fear the quality issues. Most "industry" sources indicate that production is just gearing up. Release to market is "down the road" a ways.
I still believe the new Power Mac will be announced next week with availability in August or as soon as Jaguar is ready to go.
cNet stupidly bit on a "source" that is playing games or doesn't have a clue, and Think Secret, outside of Jaguar news, hasn't been able to get a decent lead and was desperate for any thing hardware wise to announce.
New Power Macs now, new larger screen iMacs later.
Media can be really stupid sometimes. Motorola puts a new chip into production, and starts distribution, and the media announces a new Apple computer the same month. No consideration is given at all for development and production cycles. Probably all that has happened is that the iMac production lines have started to gear up for production of the new larger screen models. It will be months before we see them. And with release imminent for new Power Macs, Apple has already started work or in August will start work on their next great thing. But some insider clerk, or over enthusiastic media type, screws it up with their report.
Last time Apple had anything to say they came out with the new imac.
They are saying that we will get something that will be groundbreaking.
That would exclude a new imac, any system upgrade, heck any upgrade.
That leaves us with hardware, the last time I checked groundbreaking was going to be a start to something.
The only thing I could see that would start us for something new would be a new power mac. I am not going to say what the power mac would have cause I got bashed for that previously and was scolded by an administrator, but I will say that we will get a new powermac 1000% guaranteed.
Folks, the supply of 17" LCD's and the actual material cost, don't make it possible for a 17" iMac at MWNY. I just can't see how it could happen. The price would have to be well above the US $2000 mark. Also, start producing does not mean start selling. On an item as complex to produce as the new iMacs, there will be trial runs, to work out the bugs, before there are actual production runs. Then inventory must build to a marketable level before release.
[quote] Baker credited the increased popularity of the larger display to dramatic price declines and a closing of the price gap between larger and smaller displays. For example, 15-inch flat-panel monitors sold for an average of $550 last summer compared with $1,113 for the larger display. In the year since, the price on 15-inch flat-panel displays dropped to $453, while their 17-inch counterparts dropped to $688.
"When the price is right, consumers are saying, 'For a $600 or $700 difference, I'm not going to move, but for $200 it's worth stepping up,'" Baker said. <hr></blockquote>
If we see 17" iMacs, there is no reason why they will be more that ~$200-250 more than the 15" models. That may force the highest-end model up over $2000, but coupled with an expected price drop in iMac prices, it probably won't. Hell, I'm willing to put even money that the 17" will cost what the current 15 inchers cost ($1400/1600/1900), and the 15" will cost less. Maybe Apple raisd the 15" iMac prices to 'socialize' the new price points on the 17" ones. Then they can claim you are "getting more for the same price."
Finally, BigC makes the most salient point, IMO:
[quote] Let's face it, from a business standpoint, even if Apple comes out with a 1.4 GHz DDR unit, it will still be less than the Intel crowd has already (from a numbers standpoint). Therefore, from a "WOW " standpoint, it ain't much. A NEW 17" iMac (and/or other mods) has a new "WOW" factor and would be the crowd pleaser in the consumer world.
The PM crowd will buy when the specs get to where each user wants them. If I was Apple I would be taunting the consumer crowd and possible Intel converts to sell to new users, again this leads to the iMacs.<hr></blockquote>
Chill out, people. Big things are coming for iMac AND Powermac.
<strong>Now, it seems like everyone on this board reads this as, new Powermacs in August, with high end barely over 1.2 Ghz. I read this as, new Powermacs in August, with the low end over 1.2Ghz. Read that sentence again, and you see what I mean. </strong><hr></blockquote>
I read that to mean that of the new configurations, the slowest will be 1.2; it doesn't mean they won't continue to sell the 1 Ghz model. Who knows, they might even expand the matrix to include 4 PowerMac configurations (they've done so before IIRC). I can't, however, think of a time when they've completely eliminated the former high end machine with one product rev. Regardless, I agree it points to some nice & impressive hardware next month.
all this talk of groundbreaking and new naming converntions (xServe, eMac) could it be that there is not going to be an upgrade for the powermacs because there aren't going to BE powermacs?
The old one's are selling so terribly that channels are clogged up and Apple cannot announce new Powermacs until the old are sold. Hah! That is so funny, Apple is shooting themselves in the foot by offering such antiquated hardware. The tit's run dry! Apple must produce competitive Powermacs or suffer the consequences....they are going to go belly up if they don't get out a new mobo and faster CPUs soon, as in, before Sept.</strong><hr></blockquote>
How could any discussion go without a smackdown from JD?
PowerMacs will be announced, just not shipped until August; unfortunately just speedbumps. The biggies will come later.
iMac 17, hardly worth it if the new G4 form factor looks like the servers and can run the cinema displays at lower prices
<strong>Interesting; but if there's a glut in the channel, Apple could just be cutting production so as not to glut it further. One of the advantages of calling an Apple Event is that you can do it on relatively short notice (the press usually gets their invites three days to a week in advance), so Apple can watch the channel and time the announcement carefully.
Heck, if they offer some discount that makes the current PMs fly off the shelves (free Bugatti with every purchase!) they might even be able to announce at MWNY.
.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Having the PowerMacs End-of-lined is certainly a good sign. This does not guarantee a MWNY intro of new hardware though. However, it certainly does not mean they are cutting back production in any way. It means they are excepting no more orders because they cannot guarantee order fulfillment as the product as been discontinued. Apple will then sell off the remaining inventory through it's own stores. Apple can sell at a discount and still make money as there is no middleman involved.
Anyway, I'll be at MWNY next Wednesday, and I'm putting on my consumer cap as well - for a high end system.
<strong>Nobody has commented on my suggestion and the more I read the more it make sense to me; that if the delay in intorduction of new Powermacs is delayed until August, it is because they NEED Jaguar</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, I don't see how they would need it, exactly. Pretty much every machine capable of running OS X will see an improvement with 10.2. However, if PM sales are stalling and Jaguar is on track to release ahead of schedule, they might well decide to release them together.
<strong>Something just hasn't smelled right about all this new iMac nonsense and no powermac, so I decided to do some digging. The whole product inventory, component cost, production line process just doesn't mesh.</strong><hr></blockquote>
It's a bit of a surprise, I agree.
A few counterpoints:
Retail 17" LCDs are running as low as $600. With Apple's investment in Samsung, volume, etc. I'm sure it's a sub-$500 item for them.
Other component prices - notably Superdrives have dropped as well, so I think a sub $2k box package is realistic. The price delta from the 15" to the 17" is not huge these days.
Apple basically didn't have substantial numbers of 15" iMacs produced in June and based on what's in the channel, I'd say the same will hold true in July. I think that Apple could well have moved up the timetable for 17" based on being ahead in 15" production. It's certainly not as substantial a product ramp-up as the 15" was and pre-production could have been in June while the plants were idle with ramp up in July - still Q3, btw.
What's more, Apple could do something really interesting and bump the whole iMac line to 17" and move the 15" out to .edu in discount bundles like we've seen in the past. It would explain why Apple hasn't reversed the price increase even though component prices dropped - better to not increase prices when the 17" feature hits, then just work on clearing out the 15" inventory.
Oddly enough, Apple isn't taking huge measures to move the 15" iMacs. I can't explain that.
Couple things here. Can we all agree that it seems reasonable based on all information we've heard so far that A) Jaguar will be released in August, and the nVidia Nforce will also be released in August?
If those two things are the case, then it seems to me to be almost a certanity that we will not see new towers until August. Now that doesn't mean Steve won't announce new towers at MacWorld... he'll just say they're shipping in August. But that's something we're all pretty much used to by now, right?
In any case, getting the towers out in August as opposed to next week seems like it would allow Apple to take care of a few things - make sure there's enough chip supply to take care of demand, make sure Jaguar is ready, make sure the nForce is in the new towers, that sort of thing.
As far as iMacs I have no idea. the 17" iMac thing is a pretty strong rumor, and that's the sort of thing that will light up consumers. You tell Average Joe that the new tower has faster ram and busses and he'll look confused and then ask you what the clock speed of the CPU is. But you tell him the new iMac now has a 17" monitor and that's something Joe can immediately identify with and appreciate.
Comments
Anyway, I see nothing to complain about. Improved iMacs are a good idea, let's hope the prices improve as well. Jaguar is a good thing, they need to spread that goodness to the consumers.
As for PowerMacs, again, I believe cnet, so let's assume that new displays and powermacs will be announced in August and the speeds will be above 1.2 Ghz. The motherboards must be somewhat improved as well. This is all good. Maybe not up to par with the PC hardware for those who believe the Mhz Myth, but certainly more likely to sell than the current PowerMacs.
Also consider that someone was saying the new PowerMacs will not boot OS 9 anymore. Maybe they will require Jaguar? Even if not, it would be more convenient to ship them with jaguar. The faster OS on the faster hardware would make the new PowerMacs perform much better than current ones.
nVidia and Apple are supposed to have an announcement in August as well. Maybe this is the reason PMs will be delayed until August? (as well as to let the promotion sell more computers)
Remember that the last PMs were not delayed to Jan 28 to avoid bad press, but because nVidia didn't want Apple to announce the GeForce 4 until later on.
<strong>
I find that hard to believe, just one day after Apple launched a promo on them.]</strong><hr></blockquote>
No, that's how you clear inventory from the channel. Ingram Micro and other distributors are sitting on a ton of Powermacs - presumably Apple has none. The promo is to get people to snap up what's still sitting around so that Apple doesn't need to cover steeper price protection if the boxes won't move after new hardware ships.
Another thing for EVERYBODY to keep in mind. What everyone is heaving over is obviously not set in stone. If Apple has new Powermacs ready for August, it's not a huge problem for Apple to decide - even now - to roll out at Expo and just push the shipping delay out to what it would have been. Getting the marketing materials together in the next week is tricky, but they've done it before.
It's more a matter of marketing than products being ready IMO. Apple certainly has the final design in testing somewhere and can slap a recent build of Jaguar on it and show it to the world next week, shipping at the end of August.
He needs to be reasonably sure that Jaguar will ship at the right time (new Pro hardware will not ship without Jag, IMO) and that all the other pieces can ramp up in time, AND that the market coverage will be favorable. Consider this:
Apple intros a 17" iMac and new Powermacs. What does the media cover? Most will cover the iMac and largely pan the Powermacs. The photo will almost certainly be the iMac, not the Powermac, and the lead will likely be "MacWorld: Apple introduces new 17" iMac". The Pro line will get almost totally panned. However, wait one month, have a special event, and you get an article dedicated to the new Powermacs.
Not only that, but the Jaguar roll-out gets split. The Expo talk is about iApps, ease of setup, etc. The special event is about Quartz Extreme, performance, new printing architecture, and so on. Again, much better focus.
This is exactly why I think Apple is introducing so many products in special events, and why they SHOULD (IMO) wait for the Powermacs, even if they are ready now. However, there's probably nothing stopping Steve from showing them next week if he wants to do so. For Apple, it's a long way to the show, and it's petty common for products to come out or go in up to the last minute.
Bottom line is that there appear to be some pretty substantial improvements to the Powermac line waiting for us, and while you might have to wait a month to see them, you'll probably not have to wait much longer to play with them than if they were shown at the show.
Are they updating the iMac or just adding a 17" version with the existing specs? If they are updating the iMac specs this will only make more difficult to clear the existing powermac towers.
My hope is
New PowerMac towers that will ship on jaguar release date. With the specs we have been hearing about, Dual 1.4 Ghz etc... With the same price points.
Update iMac (this includes a 17" model) with a price reduced by $100 to $150.
eMac even if it not update, the price should be $999
Some updated iApps..
Apple has to push ahead...they have to clear inventory the old fashion way.....Mark them down so someone who might of bought a iMac because of the price can say "I have a short time to get a protower (which has better specs) for about same amount of money.
<strong>Nobody has commented on my suggestion and the more I read the more it make sense to me; that if the delay in intorduction of new Powermacs is delayed until August, it is because they NEED Jaguar.
I am convinced that this is the most likely reason, and I don't think Steve would want all the press to review his flagship machines with 10.1.5 becuase it (10.1.5) makes the machine look much slower than it really is. If I was Steve Jobs there is no way I would launch them with 10.1.5 I would want the press and not just the Mac press to rave about these new machines.
Think about the speed jump that will be apparent if we get either a G4 1.5ghz with DDR and JAGUAR, or a G5 with the same.
When you think about it, Steve can't let these machines to go to market with 10.1.5 what he wants and Apple need is to make these new machines a revelation.
[ 07-10-2002: Message edited by: Addison ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
If I recall, Apple has released computers with a special version of the OS, which was essentially the next OS upgrade. If my memory serves me they did this with 9.2 on either the iBook or iMac's. If they were a month away from the OS release, and they pre-announced the hardware, as they have been doing lately, then there would be no need to hold back an anouncement.
<strong>Why is the 'Powerful Offer' promo still on Apple's site? It was only good through July 7th. If they updated the promo page with a new offer on the 8th, one would think they could bother to take down the OLD offer. Maybe the're going to extend it to help clear the channel.....</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't see it.
ting5
The PM crowd will buy when the specs get to where each user wants them. If I was Apple I would be taunting the consumer crowd and possible Intel converts to sell to new users, again this leads to the iMacs.
Of course this won't please the 52 people on this board.
Back on 31 May 2002, the Register posted the following: (not that I believe the register, but they do have some good sources). [quote] A report from the heartland of American manufacturing (ie Taiwan) suggests that production of 17 inch and 19 inch versions of the new iMac will begin in Q3 this year.
Local news service Digitimes reports also reports that the industry-wide LCD shortage continues to constrain the number of IMacs that the manufacturer Quanta can ship. Mindful of these shortages, a Q3 production ramp allows Apple time to build inventory in time for a New Year launch.<hr></blockquote>
The Digitimes actual article stated:
[quote]Industry sources said Quanta Computer will start producing the latest 17 and 19-inch iMacs in the third quarter, suggesting a strengthening partnership between the PC contract maker and Apple Computer.<hr></blockquote>
Folks, the supply of 17" LCD's and the actual material cost, don't make it possible for a 17" iMac at MWNY. I just can't see how it could happen. The price would have to be well above the US $2000 mark. Also, start producing does not mean start selling. On an item as complex to produce as the new iMacs, there will be trial runs, to work out the bugs, before there are actual production runs. Then inventory must build to a marketable level before release.
Reality #1 There is a soft market impacting all computer manufacturers, not just Apple. Don't sweat it. Everyone is sitting on inventory and taking hits.
Reality #2 The new iMac production cycle is a fixed factor that cannot vary significantly. From what I have seen, I just do not see the 17" iMac at MWNY. If production was rushed that much, I would seriously fear the quality issues. Most "industry" sources indicate that production is just gearing up. Release to market is "down the road" a ways.
I still believe the new Power Mac will be announced next week with availability in August or as soon as Jaguar is ready to go.
cNet stupidly bit on a "source" that is playing games or doesn't have a clue, and Think Secret, outside of Jaguar news, hasn't been able to get a decent lead and was desperate for any thing hardware wise to announce.
New Power Macs now, new larger screen iMacs later.
Media can be really stupid sometimes. Motorola puts a new chip into production, and starts distribution, and the media announces a new Apple computer the same month. No consideration is given at all for development and production cycles. Probably all that has happened is that the iMac production lines have started to gear up for production of the new larger screen models. It will be months before we see them. And with release imminent for new Power Macs, Apple has already started work or in August will start work on their next great thing. But some insider clerk, or over enthusiastic media type, screws it up with their report.
<a href="http://www.apple.com/promo/"; target="_blank">http://www.apple.com/promo/</a>;
Fourth item down.
Apple isn't going to lie to us.
Last time Apple had anything to say they came out with the new imac.
They are saying that we will get something that will be groundbreaking.
That would exclude a new imac, any system upgrade, heck any upgrade.
That leaves us with hardware, the last time I checked groundbreaking was going to be a start to something.
The only thing I could see that would start us for something new would be a new power mac. I am not going to say what the power mac would have cause I got bashed for that previously and was scolded by an administrator, but I will say that we will get a new powermac 1000% guaranteed.
Folks, the supply of 17" LCD's and the actual material cost, don't make it possible for a 17" iMac at MWNY. I just can't see how it could happen. The price would have to be well above the US $2000 mark. Also, start producing does not mean start selling. On an item as complex to produce as the new iMacs, there will be trial runs, to work out the bugs, before there are actual production runs. Then inventory must build to a marketable level before release.
<hr></blockquote>
According the <a href="http://news.com.com/2100-1040-942608.html"; target="_blank">cnet article</a>:
[quote] Baker credited the increased popularity of the larger display to dramatic price declines and a closing of the price gap between larger and smaller displays. For example, 15-inch flat-panel monitors sold for an average of $550 last summer compared with $1,113 for the larger display. In the year since, the price on 15-inch flat-panel displays dropped to $453, while their 17-inch counterparts dropped to $688.
"When the price is right, consumers are saying, 'For a $600 or $700 difference, I'm not going to move, but for $200 it's worth stepping up,'" Baker said. <hr></blockquote>
If we see 17" iMacs, there is no reason why they will be more that ~$200-250 more than the 15" models. That may force the highest-end model up over $2000, but coupled with an expected price drop in iMac prices, it probably won't. Hell, I'm willing to put even money that the 17" will cost what the current 15 inchers cost ($1400/1600/1900), and the 15" will cost less. Maybe Apple raisd the 15" iMac prices to 'socialize' the new price points on the 17" ones. Then they can claim you are "getting more for the same price."
Finally, BigC makes the most salient point, IMO:
[quote] Let's face it, from a business standpoint, even if Apple comes out with a 1.4 GHz DDR unit, it will still be less than the Intel crowd has already (from a numbers standpoint). Therefore, from a "WOW " standpoint, it ain't much. A NEW 17" iMac (and/or other mods) has a new "WOW" factor and would be the crowd pleaser in the consumer world.
The PM crowd will buy when the specs get to where each user wants them. If I was Apple I would be taunting the consumer crowd and possible Intel converts to sell to new users, again this leads to the iMacs.<hr></blockquote>
Chill out, people. Big things are coming for iMac AND Powermac.
ting5
<strong>Now, it seems like everyone on this board reads this as, new Powermacs in August, with high end barely over 1.2 Ghz. I read this as, new Powermacs in August, with the low end over 1.2Ghz. Read that sentence again, and you see what I mean. </strong><hr></blockquote>
I read that to mean that of the new configurations, the slowest will be 1.2; it doesn't mean they won't continue to sell the 1 Ghz model. Who knows, they might even expand the matrix to include 4 PowerMac configurations (they've done so before IIRC). I can't, however, think of a time when they've completely eliminated the former high end machine with one product rev. Regardless, I agree it points to some nice & impressive hardware next month.
k
edit: spelling
edit: spelling, no really this time
[ 07-10-2002: Message edited by: 1bgmnk ]
[ 07-10-2002: Message edited by: 1bgmnk ]</p>
<strong>CONFIRMED: No new Powermacs!
The old one's are selling so terribly that channels are clogged up and Apple cannot announce new Powermacs until the old are sold. Hah! That is so funny, Apple is shooting themselves in the foot by offering such antiquated hardware. The tit's run dry! Apple must produce competitive Powermacs or suffer the consequences....they are going to go belly up if they don't get out a new mobo and faster CPUs soon, as in, before Sept.</strong><hr></blockquote>
How could any discussion go without a smackdown from JD?
PowerMacs will be announced, just not shipped until August; unfortunately just speedbumps. The biggies will come later.
iMac 17, hardly worth it if the new G4 form factor looks like the servers and can run the cinema displays at lower prices
<strong>Interesting; but if there's a glut in the channel, Apple could just be cutting production so as not to glut it further. One of the advantages of calling an Apple Event is that you can do it on relatively short notice (the press usually gets their invites three days to a week in advance), so Apple can watch the channel and time the announcement carefully.
Heck, if they offer some discount that makes the current PMs fly off the shelves (free Bugatti with every purchase!) they might even be able to announce at MWNY.
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Having the PowerMacs End-of-lined is certainly a good sign. This does not guarantee a MWNY intro of new hardware though. However, it certainly does not mean they are cutting back production in any way. It means they are excepting no more orders because they cannot guarantee order fulfillment as the product as been discontinued. Apple will then sell off the remaining inventory through it's own stores. Apple can sell at a discount and still make money as there is no middleman involved.
Anyway, I'll be at MWNY next Wednesday, and I'm putting on my consumer cap as well - for a high end system.
Steve
<strong>Nobody has commented on my suggestion and the more I read the more it make sense to me; that if the delay in intorduction of new Powermacs is delayed until August, it is because they NEED Jaguar</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, I don't see how they would need it, exactly. Pretty much every machine capable of running OS X will see an improvement with 10.2. However, if PM sales are stalling and Jaguar is on track to release ahead of schedule, they might well decide to release them together.
<strong>Something just hasn't smelled right about all this new iMac nonsense and no powermac, so I decided to do some digging. The whole product inventory, component cost, production line process just doesn't mesh.</strong><hr></blockquote>
It's a bit of a surprise, I agree.
A few counterpoints:
Retail 17" LCDs are running as low as $600. With Apple's investment in Samsung, volume, etc. I'm sure it's a sub-$500 item for them.
Other component prices - notably Superdrives have dropped as well, so I think a sub $2k box package is realistic. The price delta from the 15" to the 17" is not huge these days.
Apple basically didn't have substantial numbers of 15" iMacs produced in June and based on what's in the channel, I'd say the same will hold true in July. I think that Apple could well have moved up the timetable for 17" based on being ahead in 15" production. It's certainly not as substantial a product ramp-up as the 15" was and pre-production could have been in June while the plants were idle with ramp up in July - still Q3, btw.
What's more, Apple could do something really interesting and bump the whole iMac line to 17" and move the 15" out to .edu in discount bundles like we've seen in the past. It would explain why Apple hasn't reversed the price increase even though component prices dropped - better to not increase prices when the 17" feature hits, then just work on clearing out the 15" inventory.
Oddly enough, Apple isn't taking huge measures to move the 15" iMacs. I can't explain that.
Couple things here. Can we all agree that it seems reasonable based on all information we've heard so far that A) Jaguar will be released in August, and
If those two things are the case, then it seems to me to be almost a certanity that we will not see new towers until August. Now that doesn't mean Steve won't announce new towers at MacWorld... he'll just say they're shipping in August. But that's something we're all pretty much used to by now, right?
In any case, getting the towers out in August as opposed to next week seems like it would allow Apple to take care of a few things - make sure there's enough chip supply to take care of demand, make sure Jaguar is ready, make sure the nForce is in the new towers, that sort of thing.
As far as iMacs I have no idea. the 17" iMac thing is a pretty strong rumor, and that's the sort of thing that will light up consumers. You tell Average Joe that the new tower has faster ram and busses and he'll look confused and then ask you what the clock speed of the CPU is. But you tell him the new iMac now has a 17" monitor and that's something Joe can immediately identify with and appreciate.