I have this odd sense that there's some serious disinformation going on. There seems to be a G5 2.0-2.4 (maybe 2.6) consensus, which seems too easy to me.
I really wonder if Jobs is lowering expectations for MWSF, so he can then blow us away.
Maybe the surprise is not G5-GHz, but something else.
What we're wanting to figure out is how early one must start waiting in line to get a great seat for the Stevenote.
Does anyone know the number people that get the preferred seating, that would give us an idea of how far back the regular seating starts?
I went to MWSF last year. I got there around 7 something, and the line was SUPER long. Once they begin to seat people, the line breaks up and you get to run for position to some extent. The preferred seating is about six rows, I believe. Next time I go I'm going to get there in the dead of night.
2.6GHz is a good conservative estimate, mpls. SJ said we would have 3GHz a year from the G5's intro in July, so must of us are thinking with the assumption that there will have to be an intermediate update before we get to 3GHz. It would be quite extraordinary to go 1 whole GHz in one revision. Note, additionally, that Power Macs usually aren't introduced at Macworlds.
Well PowerMacs may not have been traditionally introduced at Mac World but lets face it the longer they waite the more likley we will see a jump to 3GHz. The operative words where "with in a year" so there is nothing to hold them back for debut of new machines this month or next.
The other issue that potentially may push them into early release is the need to get the new enterprise product out the door. Of course this could just as well be an excuse to hold off updates to the G5.
All the public comments about this being a very good year for apple products, intoroduction wise, tends to lead me to believe that we are going to see alot of stuff in the next month or two. A big jump in performance of the G5 would help keep momentum going with this product line in light of all of the other product activity. Well we can only wish that it would or that Steve would se it that way.
Thanks
dave
Quote:
Originally posted by Big Mac
I went to MWSF last year. I got there around 7 something, and the line was SUPER long. Once they begin to seat people, the line breaks up and you get to run for position to some extent. The preferred seating is about six rows, I believe. Next time I go I'm going to get there in the dead of night.
2.6GHz is a good conservative estimate, mpls. SJ said we would have 3GHz a year from the G5's intro in July, so must of us are thinking with the assumption that there will have to be an intermediate update before we get to 3GHz. It would be quite extraordinary to go 1 whole GHz in one revision. Note, additionally, that Power Macs usually aren't introduced at Macworlds.
Well PowerMacs may not have been traditionally introduced at Mac World but lets face it the longer they waite the more likley we will see a jump to 3GHz. The operative words where "with in a year" so there is nothing to hold them back for debut of new machines this month or next.
The other issue that potentially may push them into early release is the need to get the new enterprise product out the door. Of course this could just as well be an excuse to hold off updates to the G5.
All the public comments about this being a very good year for apple products, intoroduction wise, tends to lead me to believe that we are going to see alot of stuff in the next month or two. A big jump in performance of the G5 would help keep momentum going with this product line in light of all of the other product activity. Well we can only wish that it would or that Steve would se it that way.
Thanks
dave
I think we'll definitely see an intermediate jump before 3GHz. That's almost certainly why Apple scheduled this year's WWDC for the end of June.
I think we'll definitely see an intermediate jump before 3GHz. That's almost certainly why Apple scheduled this year's WWDC for the end of June.
I agree with you on the first part, but I dont think Apple has set the date for the WWDC after a possible introduction of the 3 ghz powermac. This is because it's probably very (?) difficult the predict the date a hardware product will be ready for introduction, and they are always dependent on how well their suppliers (read IBM) has products ready for them. It's possible Apple has got words or promises from IBM for when the can expect the 3 ghz chips to arrive, but there is always time needed for ironing out bugs, doint test runs and so on, and the 3 ghz powermac is not so big a deal after all. The first G5 was a milestone, the introduction of the 3 ghz G5 will just be a minor update compared to this. And june is probably a bit early for it to arrive too. Not any sooner than August I predict, along with the introduction of a fully 64 bit native OSX 10.4
What we're wanting to figure out is how early one must start waiting in line to get a great seat for the Stevenote.
Does anyone know the number people that get the preferred seating, that would give us an idea of how far back the regular seating starts?
Always an interesting puzzle. Actually two puzzles. How early to arrive and where to try to sit.
The preferred seating is a block in the center. I don't recall how far back it goes ( 20 rows?). You can get close to the stage at either the far left or right.
Last year I got there at about 7:00AM and I was standing just outside the door to Moscone Center. I got a fairly good seat at the far left.
This year I might try to get there a little earlier and aim for something a little more towards the center. I'll trade off a little distance to have a more direct view.
The seating area is a flat floor, not theater type seating. However, the stage is about four feet high so the viewing angle is not bad.
I can't believe Apple will release the iMac G5 before the Powerbook G5.
The powerbook is the portable version of the Powermac and thus the proffessionals Mac. While the iMac is a consumer Mac.
Whadayathink?
I think they will release the G5 iMac first because of these to reasons: The 970 is VERY hot and VERY power hungry, and they will probably have to wait until the 970 moves to another process before we'll see it in a powerbook. It's much easier to come around these limitations in the iMac that has a mains powersupply and have better possibilities of cooling it enough to avoid melt-down. It will probably take another few months before IBM switches processes, and the iMac really needs a faster processor NOW. I wound't dream of buying one of the current iMacs, at least not at the speeds Apple currently offers. The iMac is after all a premium product much like the PowerMac and the PowerBook. It deserves the G5 equally much as the PowerBook in my eyes.
"The iMac is after all a premium product much like the PowerMac and the PowerBook. It deserves the G5 equally much as the PowerBook in my eyes."
Premium in the sense that you pay extra, maybe. Not premium in terms of performance or reliability. Why would the iMac "deserve" a processor equal to a PowerBook or PowerMac? You are mistaken. The iMac is a consumer model Mac, and Apple is very mindful of the demands of that market. Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
Apple has models targeted at different market levels. The iMac is entry level and is always going to be a step or two back in technology from its "Power" named counterparts. The same goes for the iBook.
Steve and co are sitting in a boardroom deciding on when to release the 20" iMac.
Some board member: "We could do it in september!"
Steve: "No"
Some other board member: "We could do it at MWSF!"
Steve: "Hmm, I guess so..."
Yet another board member: "Wait a sec, we should release it before MWSF to throw off the rumor sites! Yeah!"
Steve: "Promotion!"
Guys, AAPL doesn't "Try to throw off the rumor sites." They release what they have when they have it or when they think it will make the most money. The rumor sites predicting things has virtually no effect on sales. It is the major media that they are avoiding publicity from.
"The iMac is after all a premium product much like the PowerMac and the PowerBook. It deserves the G5 equally much as the PowerBook in my eyes."
Premium in the sense that you pay extra, maybe. Not premium in terms of performance or reliability. Why would the iMac "deserve" a processor equal to a PowerBook or PowerMac? You are mistaken. The iMac is a consumer model Mac, and Apple is very mindful of the demands of that market. Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
Apple has models targeted at different market levels. The iMac is entry level and is always going to be a step or two back in technology from its "Power" named counterparts. The same goes for the iBook.
uhg. i wish i wasn't a moderator when i see these posts :P
The iMac and PowerBook have virtually mirrored each other for years now.
I can't believe Apple will release the iMac G5 before the Powerbook G5.
The powerbook is the portable version of the Powermac and thus the proffessionals Mac. While the iMac is a consumer Mac.
Whadayathink?
NETROMac said it best, it is easier to put the G5 into the iMac because it would have an easier time cooling the chip, plus there is a constant supply of power, whereas the PowerBook there is only the battery (worst case scenerio).
However, there is another reason. All of those people who like to edit their iMovies, and then burn them with iDVD. Or how about all of the gamers who want a Mac that matches, or exceeds his PC counter-parts. There are the low-budget Web Designers who would want this, along with anyone who is just amazed at what a G5 can do. The market is there. It is just as rich and diverse as the PowerBook people. To say that it shouldn't because it is consumer, is awfully short sighted.
I also think its time for a G5 iMac. A G5 with a 20" screen is very expensive, the same in an iMac should save some cash. Apple need a machine that nicely hits the pro-consumer, just like the digital camera market has been doing the last year or so. It should only have big screens, bluetooth should be standard, 2 Gig Ram max and a decent graphics card. Perhaps it needs to be a new line (dare I suggest) SuperiMac rather than phase out the existing iMacs which could do with a price drop.
Better yet, as many have suggested, make the screen easily replacable or even just a mounting arm and make the new scvreen form factor allow for easy mounting.
Based on a market point of view, Apple should put the G5 in the iMac and PowerBook at roughly the same time. The Powerbook will be expensive due to it probably using downclocked 0.09 nanometer chips, while the iMac will probably receive the current generation G5s found in the PowerMac, unless there is some heat dissapation problems and the cooler, smaller G5 is needed.
The Imac should come with a Radeon 9600 in by default, all apart from the base model. The G5 should come with a Radeon 9600 pro as standard (only £50 more ffs) and the top end model wih a Radeon 9800, kitting out a G5 at the moment costs a bit too much. There is no need for the nVidia cards IMO, they are slower than the ATi offerings and are not worth much price/performance wise.
I doubt this will happen soon, but we could be surprised.
Comments
I really wonder if Jobs is lowering expectations for MWSF, so he can then blow us away.
Maybe the surprise is not G5-GHz, but something else.
I have an odd feeling about this MWSF.
Originally posted by echo
What we're wanting to figure out is how early one must start waiting in line to get a great seat for the Stevenote.
Does anyone know the number people that get the preferred seating, that would give us an idea of how far back the regular seating starts?
I went to MWSF last year. I got there around 7 something, and the line was SUPER long. Once they begin to seat people, the line breaks up and you get to run for position to some extent. The preferred seating is about six rows, I believe. Next time I go I'm going to get there in the dead of night.
2.6GHz is a good conservative estimate, mpls. SJ said we would have 3GHz a year from the G5's intro in July, so must of us are thinking with the assumption that there will have to be an intermediate update before we get to 3GHz. It would be quite extraordinary to go 1 whole GHz in one revision. Note, additionally, that Power Macs usually aren't introduced at Macworlds.
Originally posted by mattyj
iPod, flash memory based, £65 with 500 song capacity. Wait and see.
That would be 1.5-2 GB flash ram. Any idea how much that costs?
Hint
IBM and Chartered co-sponsor Semico Impact Conference Series in Taipei - 90 Nanometer and Beyond!!
When: January 8, 2004
Where: Taipei, Taiwan, Grand Formosa Regent Taipei
The other issue that potentially may push them into early release is the need to get the new enterprise product out the door. Of course this could just as well be an excuse to hold off updates to the G5.
All the public comments about this being a very good year for apple products, intoroduction wise, tends to lead me to believe that we are going to see alot of stuff in the next month or two. A big jump in performance of the G5 would help keep momentum going with this product line in light of all of the other product activity. Well we can only wish that it would or that Steve would se it that way.
Thanks
dave
Originally posted by Big Mac
I went to MWSF last year. I got there around 7 something, and the line was SUPER long. Once they begin to seat people, the line breaks up and you get to run for position to some extent. The preferred seating is about six rows, I believe. Next time I go I'm going to get there in the dead of night.
2.6GHz is a good conservative estimate, mpls. SJ said we would have 3GHz a year from the G5's intro in July, so must of us are thinking with the assumption that there will have to be an intermediate update before we get to 3GHz. It would be quite extraordinary to go 1 whole GHz in one revision. Note, additionally, that Power Macs usually aren't introduced at Macworlds.
Originally posted by wizard69
Well PowerMacs may not have been traditionally introduced at Mac World but lets face it the longer they waite the more likley we will see a jump to 3GHz. The operative words where "with in a year" so there is nothing to hold them back for debut of new machines this month or next.
The other issue that potentially may push them into early release is the need to get the new enterprise product out the door. Of course this could just as well be an excuse to hold off updates to the G5.
All the public comments about this being a very good year for apple products, intoroduction wise, tends to lead me to believe that we are going to see alot of stuff in the next month or two. A big jump in performance of the G5 would help keep momentum going with this product line in light of all of the other product activity. Well we can only wish that it would or that Steve would se it that way.
Thanks
dave
I think we'll definitely see an intermediate jump before 3GHz. That's almost certainly why Apple scheduled this year's WWDC for the end of June.
Originally posted by gfeier
I think we'll definitely see an intermediate jump before 3GHz. That's almost certainly why Apple scheduled this year's WWDC for the end of June.
I agree with you on the first part, but I dont think Apple has set the date for the WWDC after a possible introduction of the 3 ghz powermac. This is because it's probably very (?) difficult the predict the date a hardware product will be ready for introduction, and they are always dependent on how well their suppliers (read IBM) has products ready for them. It's possible Apple has got words or promises from IBM for when the can expect the 3 ghz chips to arrive, but there is always time needed for ironing out bugs, doint test runs and so on, and the 3 ghz powermac is not so big a deal after all. The first G5 was a milestone, the introduction of the 3 ghz G5 will just be a minor update compared to this. And june is probably a bit early for it to arrive too. Not any sooner than August I predict, along with the introduction of a fully 64 bit native OSX 10.4
Originally posted by echo
What we're wanting to figure out is how early one must start waiting in line to get a great seat for the Stevenote.
Does anyone know the number people that get the preferred seating, that would give us an idea of how far back the regular seating starts?
Always an interesting puzzle. Actually two puzzles. How early to arrive and where to try to sit.
The preferred seating is a block in the center. I don't recall how far back it goes ( 20 rows?). You can get close to the stage at either the far left or right.
Last year I got there at about 7:00AM and I was standing just outside the door to Moscone Center. I got a fairly good seat at the far left.
This year I might try to get there a little earlier and aim for something a little more towards the center. I'll trade off a little distance to have a more direct view.
The seating area is a flat floor, not theater type seating. However, the stage is about four feet high so the viewing angle is not bad.
The powerbook is the portable version of the Powermac and thus the proffessionals Mac. While the iMac is a consumer Mac.
Whadayathink?
Originally posted by eprom
I can't believe Apple will release the iMac G5 before the Powerbook G5.
The powerbook is the portable version of the Powermac and thus the proffessionals Mac. While the iMac is a consumer Mac.
Whadayathink?
I think they will release the G5 iMac first because of these to reasons: The 970 is VERY hot and VERY power hungry, and they will probably have to wait until the 970 moves to another process before we'll see it in a powerbook. It's much easier to come around these limitations in the iMac that has a mains powersupply and have better possibilities of cooling it enough to avoid melt-down. It will probably take another few months before IBM switches processes, and the iMac really needs a faster processor NOW. I wound't dream of buying one of the current iMacs, at least not at the speeds Apple currently offers. The iMac is after all a premium product much like the PowerMac and the PowerBook. It deserves the G5 equally much as the PowerBook in my eyes.
Premium in the sense that you pay extra, maybe. Not premium in terms of performance or reliability. Why would the iMac "deserve" a processor equal to a PowerBook or PowerMac? You are mistaken. The iMac is a consumer model Mac, and Apple is very mindful of the demands of that market. Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
Apple has models targeted at different market levels. The iMac is entry level and is always going to be a step or two back in technology from its "Power" named counterparts. The same goes for the iBook.
Some board member: "We could do it in september!"
Steve: "No"
Some other board member: "We could do it at MWSF!"
Steve: "Hmm, I guess so..."
Yet another board member: "Wait a sec, we should release it before MWSF to throw off the rumor sites! Yeah!"
Steve: "Promotion!"
Guys, AAPL doesn't "Try to throw off the rumor sites." They release what they have when they have it or when they think it will make the most money. The rumor sites predicting things has virtually no effect on sales. It is the major media that they are avoiding publicity from.
Originally posted by stjobs
"The iMac is after all a premium product much like the PowerMac and the PowerBook. It deserves the G5 equally much as the PowerBook in my eyes."
Premium in the sense that you pay extra, maybe. Not premium in terms of performance or reliability. Why would the iMac "deserve" a processor equal to a PowerBook or PowerMac? You are mistaken. The iMac is a consumer model Mac, and Apple is very mindful of the demands of that market. Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
Apple has models targeted at different market levels. The iMac is entry level and is always going to be a step or two back in technology from its "Power" named counterparts. The same goes for the iBook.
uhg. i wish i wasn't a moderator when i see these posts :P
The iMac and PowerBook have virtually mirrored each other for years now.
It'll happen.
Originally posted by stjobs
Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
Originally posted by stjobs
Grandma checking AOL e-mail doesn't need a 90um G5.
People probably used to say, "The iMac doesn't need a G4!"
Originally posted by eprom
I can't believe Apple will release the iMac G5 before the Powerbook G5.
The powerbook is the portable version of the Powermac and thus the proffessionals Mac. While the iMac is a consumer Mac.
Whadayathink?
NETROMac said it best, it is easier to put the G5 into the iMac because it would have an easier time cooling the chip, plus there is a constant supply of power, whereas the PowerBook there is only the battery (worst case scenerio).
However, there is another reason. All of those people who like to edit their iMovies, and then burn them with iDVD. Or how about all of the gamers who want a Mac that matches, or exceeds his PC counter-parts. There are the low-budget Web Designers who would want this, along with anyone who is just amazed at what a G5 can do. The market is there. It is just as rich and diverse as the PowerBook people. To say that it shouldn't because it is consumer, is awfully short sighted.
Better yet, as many have suggested, make the screen easily replacable or even just a mounting arm and make the new scvreen form factor allow for easy mounting.
Yes i know i am dreaming.
Jason
The Imac should come with a Radeon 9600 in by default, all apart from the base model. The G5 should come with a Radeon 9600 pro as standard (only £50 more ffs) and the top end model wih a Radeon 9800, kitting out a G5 at the moment costs a bit too much. There is no need for the nVidia cards IMO, they are slower than the ATi offerings and are not worth much price/performance wise.
I doubt this will happen soon, but we could be surprised.