danvm

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

JamesBrickley said:

..
Ok, so reality check.  I used both the Surface Book and a MacBook Pro and iPad w/Pencil.  I might as well just buy a MacBook Pro and an iPad w/Pencil and be done with it. Switch between the two devices as needed. The whole experience is much nicer.  Holistically speaking, macOS / iOS is so much smoother and more refined and the hardware works so well with it that using Microsoft solutions just feel kludgy and slapped together.  ...  

This is the essence of it. MS Windows and Surface are trying too hard to put everything into a single device and to be all things to all people. The result is too often a single inelegant device that's not as good as either of the separate items. It seems like it ought to be brilliant, but it ends up just being "kludgy."

Think of all the attempts to make a single vehicle that works as both a car and an airplane. It's a nifty concept, but the execution is, so far, always disappointing. As a car it's impractical, uncomfortable, and won't fit in your garage, and as an airplane, it's slow, hard to maneuver, has a small passenger compartment, and has a range not much better than a car. So it seems like it would be nice to go downstairs, pack the family into the flying car, zip across the country and upon arrival, skip the rental, but still be able to tool around town. But no, the flying cars so far are just expensive proofs that you could do it, sort of, but probably wouldn't want to.

Do you think the same when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

We’ve had this conversation before. I’m not going to go any further than this to help you with your per-post fees to promote the Surface. Have a nice day.

For some reason, you think that by posting positive things about the Surface I'm promoting the device, when in reality I'm just talking from my experience with a SP4.  Since you posted that Surface are "kludgy", that's based in your own experience?  How does it compares to an iPad + Smart Keyboard, that forces you work with a screen in vertical position with touch UI and apps?

I’m saying you have a peculiar, longstanding and consistent pattern of coming to this Apple-focused forum specifically to praise and promote Microsoft and specifically Surface devices. Seems like an odd way to spend one’s time if one isn’t receiving some benefit for doing so. So no, I’m not going to take your bait and further debate the relative merits of the devices you’re here to promote. 

So you don't like me to post about the Surface in this Apple forum.  Did you notice that in this Apple website, the editorial is about the Surface?  And what about your post about the Surface?  Should I think that your are receiving benefits from Apple for criticizing the Surface and praising Apple devices?  I hope you don't think that because this is an Apple website, we all should criticize non-Apple devices and praise everything Apple does. 

I have devices from Apple and MS, so I talk from my experience with the devices I own, and I have no problem criticizing the bad things and praising the good things.  In this case, you criticize the Surface for being inelegant and kludgy trying to put everything in a single device.  Isn't that what Apple did when promoting the Apple + Smart Keyboard, a device designed for touch and try to make it work as a touchscreen laptop, but without trackpad?

You're like a guy who brings pork rinds to a kosher health food convention, and then chides everyone for not trying your pork rinds first before saying they don't want any.

You got the wrong comparison.  DED was the one who bring pork to the convention, not me.  See the title of the editorial / article.  I just asked a question and comment on what you already had on the table. 

Ah, but no. DED wrote a tongue-in-cheek headline of ‘where’s all the pork at the kosher health food convention,’ above an editorial that explains why nobody wants any damn pork. Then you (predictably) chime in with praise for pork rinds, and as people say they’re not interested, you continue with ‘yes, but have you tried them?’

So my completely hilarious metaphor works, you’re wrong, and nobody wants your pork rinds. 

Again, I didn't bring the Surface (or pork) to the conversation.  Your post and the article already were talking about the Surface.  You have posted many things, but still no answer to my question.  Do you think the same (inelegant and kludgy) when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

We’ve been over this already. I’m not interested in your question. This is the last time I intend to respond to you (and help you generate your per-post income?), so if you want the last word, go ahead. If it’s a question, it will be left abandoned, flapping in the wind. So make it really profound, o.k..

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

JamesBrickley said:

..
Ok, so reality check.  I used both the Surface Book and a MacBook Pro and iPad w/Pencil.  I might as well just buy a MacBook Pro and an iPad w/Pencil and be done with it. Switch between the two devices as needed. The whole experience is much nicer.  Holistically speaking, macOS / iOS is so much smoother and more refined and the hardware works so well with it that using Microsoft solutions just feel kludgy and slapped together.  ...  

This is the essence of it. MS Windows and Surface are trying too hard to put everything into a single device and to be all things to all people. The result is too often a single inelegant device that's not as good as either of the separate items. It seems like it ought to be brilliant, but it ends up just being "kludgy."

Think of all the attempts to make a single vehicle that works as both a car and an airplane. It's a nifty concept, but the execution is, so far, always disappointing. As a car it's impractical, uncomfortable, and won't fit in your garage, and as an airplane, it's slow, hard to maneuver, has a small passenger compartment, and has a range not much better than a car. So it seems like it would be nice to go downstairs, pack the family into the flying car, zip across the country and upon arrival, skip the rental, but still be able to tool around town. But no, the flying cars so far are just expensive proofs that you could do it, sort of, but probably wouldn't want to.

Do you think the same when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

We’ve had this conversation before. I’m not going to go any further than this to help you with your per-post fees to promote the Surface. Have a nice day.

For some reason, you think that by posting positive things about the Surface I'm promoting the device, when in reality I'm just talking from my experience with a SP4.  Since you posted that Surface are "kludgy", that's based in your own experience?  How does it compares to an iPad + Smart Keyboard, that forces you work with a screen in vertical position with touch UI and apps?

I’m saying you have a peculiar, longstanding and consistent pattern of coming to this Apple-focused forum specifically to praise and promote Microsoft and specifically Surface devices. Seems like an odd way to spend one’s time if one isn’t receiving some benefit for doing so. So no, I’m not going to take your bait and further debate the relative merits of the devices you’re here to promote. 

So you don't like me to post about the Surface in this Apple forum.  Did you notice that in this Apple website, the editorial is about the Surface?  And what about your post about the Surface?  Should I think that your are receiving benefits from Apple for criticizing the Surface and praising Apple devices?  I hope you don't think that because this is an Apple website, we all should criticize non-Apple devices and praise everything Apple does. 

I have devices from Apple and MS, so I talk from my experience with the devices I own, and I have no problem criticizing the bad things and praising the good things.  In this case, you criticize the Surface for being inelegant and kludgy trying to put everything in a single device.  Isn't that what Apple did when promoting the Apple + Smart Keyboard, a device designed for touch and try to make it work as a touchscreen laptop, but without trackpad?

You're like a guy who brings pork rinds to a kosher health food convention, and then chides everyone for not trying your pork rinds first before saying they don't want any.

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

JamesBrickley said:

..
Ok, so reality check.  I used both the Surface Book and a MacBook Pro and iPad w/Pencil.  I might as well just buy a MacBook Pro and an iPad w/Pencil and be done with it. Switch between the two devices as needed. The whole experience is much nicer.  Holistically speaking, macOS / iOS is so much smoother and more refined and the hardware works so well with it that using Microsoft solutions just feel kludgy and slapped together.  ...  

This is the essence of it. MS Windows and Surface are trying too hard to put everything into a single device and to be all things to all people. The result is too often a single inelegant device that's not as good as either of the separate items. It seems like it ought to be brilliant, but it ends up just being "kludgy."

Think of all the attempts to make a single vehicle that works as both a car and an airplane. It's a nifty concept, but the execution is, so far, always disappointing. As a car it's impractical, uncomfortable, and won't fit in your garage, and as an airplane, it's slow, hard to maneuver, has a small passenger compartment, and has a range not much better than a car. So it seems like it would be nice to go downstairs, pack the family into the flying car, zip across the country and upon arrival, skip the rental, but still be able to tool around town. But no, the flying cars so far are just expensive proofs that you could do it, sort of, but probably wouldn't want to.

Do you think the same when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

We’ve had this conversation before. I’m not going to go any further than this to help you with your per-post fees to promote the Surface. Have a nice day.

For some reason, you think that by posting positive things about the Surface I'm promoting the device, when in reality I'm just talking from my experience with a SP4.  Since you posted that Surface are "kludgy", that's based in your own experience?  How does it compares to an iPad + Smart Keyboard, that forces you work with a screen in vertical position with touch UI and apps?

I’m saying you have a peculiar, longstanding and consistent pattern of coming to this Apple-focused forum specifically to praise and promote Microsoft and specifically Surface devices. Seems like an odd way to spend one’s time if one isn’t receiving some benefit for doing so. So no, I’m not going to take your bait and further debate the relative merits of the devices you’re here to promote. 

AppleZulu said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

JamesBrickley said:

..
Ok, so reality check.  I used both the Surface Book and a MacBook Pro and iPad w/Pencil.  I might as well just buy a MacBook Pro and an iPad w/Pencil and be done with it. Switch between the two devices as needed. The whole experience is much nicer.  Holistically speaking, macOS / iOS is so much smoother and more refined and the hardware works so well with it that using Microsoft solutions just feel kludgy and slapped together.  ...  

This is the essence of it. MS Windows and Surface are trying too hard to put everything into a single device and to be all things to all people. The result is too often a single inelegant device that's not as good as either of the separate items. It seems like it ought to be brilliant, but it ends up just being "kludgy."

Think of all the attempts to make a single vehicle that works as both a car and an airplane. It's a nifty concept, but the execution is, so far, always disappointing. As a car it's impractical, uncomfortable, and won't fit in your garage, and as an airplane, it's slow, hard to maneuver, has a small passenger compartment, and has a range not much better than a car. So it seems like it would be nice to go downstairs, pack the family into the flying car, zip across the country and upon arrival, skip the rental, but still be able to tool around town. But no, the flying cars so far are just expensive proofs that you could do it, sort of, but probably wouldn't want to.

Do you think the same when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

We’ve had this conversation before. I’m not going to go any further than this to help you with your per-post fees to promote the Surface. Have a nice day.

radarthekat said:

danvm said:

AppleZulu said:

JamesBrickley said:

..
Ok, so reality check.  I used both the Surface Book and a MacBook Pro and iPad w/Pencil.  I might as well just buy a MacBook Pro and an iPad w/Pencil and be done with it. Switch between the two devices as needed. The whole experience is much nicer.  Holistically speaking, macOS / iOS is so much smoother and more refined and the hardware works so well with it that using Microsoft solutions just feel kludgy and slapped together.  ...  

This is the essence of it. MS Windows and Surface are trying too hard to put everything into a single device and to be all things to all people. The result is too often a single inelegant device that's not as good as either of the separate items. It seems like it ought to be brilliant, but it ends up just being "kludgy."

Think of all the attempts to make a single vehicle that works as both a car and an airplane. It's a nifty concept, but the execution is, so far, always disappointing. As a car it's impractical, uncomfortable, and won't fit in your garage, and as an airplane, it's slow, hard to maneuver, has a small passenger compartment, and has a range not much better than a car. So it seems like it would be nice to go downstairs, pack the family into the flying car, zip across the country and upon arrival, skip the rental, but still be able to tool around town. But no, the flying cars so far are just expensive proofs that you could do it, sort of, but probably wouldn't want to.

Do you think the same when using an iPad with the Smart Keyboard with a touch screen in a vertical position?

The vast majority of iPads are not used in this way.  Most are used as a handheld light tablet with long battery life. So the fact there’s an edge case is not argument to suggest that form factor is more than a compromise solution. It’s not for an iPad used in that edge case and it’s not for the SurfaceBook which forces you into that compromise full-time.