I do suspect they may be effective - my wife of 11 years just bought a PC despite the fact that we already have 4 Macs in the house - one of which is hers a PowerBook G4 fully loaded with RAM and 10.5.x. I have a PC for work and I work on and support offices full of PCs - and I am not shy about expressing my opinion of Mac vs PC - but I guess she never listens to anything I say - because she after she bought it - she asked me which I think is better and she goes on to say that the Macs are too expensive. Coincidentally the next morning after she told me she ordered a PC - my work PC was stuck in a blue screen on boot regardless of safe mode etc as the result of an antivirus program update that moved some device drivers and rendered the system non functional until I took it to my company's IT department and had them run a custom boot disk and repair utility - the process including travel time only took half a day - but hey the PC is cheaper.
To me this sounds like two problems that have little to do with it being a PC
1 it is an antivirus program that did the moving, if you remove the wrong driver from any system it will cause it to be non functional.
2 this is a work system and the IT department that supports that particular computer should have tested the update before it was released to the general office. If you are left to your own devices to update your system, this would be yet another failure by your IT depatment.
I am not a fan of Apple, and it has nothing to do with cost as two of my personal systems were over $5000 each. My complaint is that i dont have the ability to build or work Apple systems. I enjoy building systems Apple does not like me doing it.
As an IT professional i have recommended Apple and PC to differnet people for different reasons, and if Apple were to take off the locks a little i would more than likelty buy one to try them out... again remember many of us PC fans had the Apple IIe
If i misspelled anything sorry i am an IT guy not an english teacher
They are advertising hardware because Apples ads advertise as Microsoft selling the hardware... So microsoft is just playing the same game that apple is.
I think that's their big mistake - never base your ad on your competitor's terms! Why on earth validate the premise of your competitor - especially when it's a deliberately slanted premise. Even though the common perception of most people is that a PC is synonymous with a PC running Windows, this perception is wrong and mostly a result of sloppy errant marketing on the part of both Microsoft and PC manufacturers. Why reinforce it? Especially when it can so easily be exploited by your competition as Apple has done. And it has never been an advantage to MS or pc manufacturers. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people confuse Dell with HP with Compaq, etc.
They had a better campaign with the "I'm a PC too" ads - but then they went and made these ads strictly about cheap hardware and retail stores? Neither of which belong to Microsoft. I'd like to meet the people who sold them on this idea - must have been some smooth talkers.
I think they've given like five actors "money" and thats for an ad?
can't speak about all of them but Lauren was outted as an actress, the rest likely were also.
and here's a fun bit. Microsoft claims they weren't paid. they got the computer and NOTHING else, the only way to get away with that (no filming day salary, no residuals etc) is to film non union. so one of, if not the, largest software company in the country is filming major ad campaigns non-union. Walmart was slammed for this for years. Wonder what the unions would do to Microsoft.
It was a vailid counterpoint, because that link doesn't prove the claim that Macs have the same number of vulnerabilities. That was from one vulnerability. Read what that reply was to:
Quote:
Apples arent any better than PC's, maybe worse. It is proven that Apples have just as many vulnerabilities as PCs.
elroth didn't properly quote it, so I don't know who to attribute that to.
My 3 year old MacBook hard drive died 2 months out of warranty in June. Brought it to an Apple store Genius Bar and the next thing I new I was signing a service order for a new larger hard drive which cost me nothing and I picked it up the next day! I restored everything from Time Machine in about 90 minutes and was back in business. Try to do that with a PC! That's why I use Apple!!
Why do you say they were forced off the air. I saw the "Giampaolo" ad twice last night.
It's illegal in the USA to run an ad that you know is deceptive. I don't know the individual ads, but we are talking about one particular ad out of the series that said you couldn't buy a Mac for "under X price."
I'm assuming that the ad you reference above isn't that ad. If it is that ad then Apple could sue them and win with no problem at all. The law is crystal clear on this issue and ads are pulled all the time for this reason.
The video lady complains about the 2 gb memory on the MBP - that one is still airing. Very misleading.
OK, that ad should be dropped or updated. That was a silly claim in the first place anyways as on my MBP, three screws and $50 in memory gets you 4GB. I think Apple should have been doing 4GB standard anyway given the meager cost of the chips, but the bean counter keeping track of upgrade pricing probably had his say.
How about the claim that the price reduction invalidates a price claim made by Microsoft? That's what the story and this thread is about. I was hoping someone could clarify that one. It's possible I haven't seen a particular ad, but I don't remember any add where a $100 price reduction would have changed anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981
Well apple has some nerve if this is true . They lie in their Im a mac and Im a pc ads also.
That is why i dont think this is true. Why would apple call up Microsoft and ask for the ads to be taken down when they know that they lie in their ads also.
What were those lies? You said it twice but didn't bother to mention any specifics.
It's illegal in the USA to run an ad that you know is deceptive. I don't know the individual ads, but we are talking about one particular ad out of the series that said you couldn't buy a Mac for "under X price."
I'm assuming that the ad you reference above isn't that ad. If it is that ad then Apple could sue them and win with no problem at all. The law is crystal clear on this issue and ads are pulled all the time for this reason.
Why aren't axe ads pulled? Last time I put axe on, I wasn't sexually molested by a large group of sexy women on the beach... But then again, that may have to do with me changing the channel before the jenny craig ad came on.
Apples arent any better than PC's, maybe worse. It is proven that Apples have just as many vulnerabilities as PCs. But Apple make-up less than 5% of the market share for computers, so who do you think hackers and virus programmers are going to focus on? 5% of the market or 95% of the market?
Market Share is not THE reason why there are fewer hackers etc going after Macs. it's that the OS is based on a unix/linux structure. pain in the ass to program a virus for.
Quote:
Yeah, maybe they dropped the prices of their laptops, but that still doesnt reduce the price of replacement parts, or the cost to get an Apple serviced. That is why a business will never use all Apples.
there are lots of companies that use all Macs. Heck the ad company that made the Laptop campaign is a known "Mac House"
Quote:
Anyways, if you haven't figured it out, Apple over-charges for sub-par products, then tells everyone you have to have one to be cool, ie iPod, the airbook, or MacBook Pro. For every single one of those, there is a cheaper version with better features and functions from a different company. People need to wake-up and learn to think for themselves.
same game the luxury car companies play. so why is Apple blasted so much for it. Often simply because it is Apple
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
Well, they showed 5 ads. We don't know how many people they gave money to but came up with footage they couldn't use.
none. it was likely scripted. they might claim off of interviews or paper surveys. but it was not off the cuff anymore than Big Brother et al don't have writers tweaking things to make a hot story for the air
Quote:
Originally Posted by junkie
The video lady complains about the 2 gb memory on the MBP - that one is still airing. Very misleading.
depends on the model she was looking at. I think the least expensive 15" did only have 2 GB at that time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss
A cease and desist letter is not a lawsuit.
No. but it would be the first volley towards one. and it would make Apple look better. "Hey we gave them too chances to fix this and they refused. Now we want the courts to make them fix it, in accordance with laws A, B and C. Thank you."
In my humble experience, when somebody stops midway thru a story to say " hey, this is a true story" it almost always isn't ....... a microsoft exec wouldn't "stretch the truth" just to make his opinion valid, would he ? ..... just askin'
They only objected after MS kept running ads with old Mac models.
It's like Chevy running ads comparing the current Malibu to the old Ford Tempo.
I think the ads are working a little, but they won't clobber Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by holywarrior007
Well this is strange for two reasons; 1. Apple is crying about it when they themselves have been having these PC vs Mac ads for some time and the MS didn't complain, 2. Are these ads really working?
On a lark, I found that this article was linked on the front page of Google News, it was one of the three stories under the tech section. We seem to get a few trolls pop up whenever it's linked from Google News that way.
Why they take five minutes to sign up just to make a single diatribe post is beyond me.
I am confused, which is not out of the ordinary, but did you start on this forum with thousands of posts or did you start with one.
I am not trying to be rude to anyone but all new users to a forum had to start with the first post.
I am not a fan of Apple, and it has nothing to do with cost as two of my personal systems were over $5000 each. My complaint is that i dont have the ability to build or work Apple systems. I enjoy building systems Apple does not like me doing it.
And if Apple did that, everyone would have just as much problem with their Macs as PC users do, the main reason PCs have the problems they do is because of all of the differences in hardware that the OS has to adjust for. Universal Hardware Platform is the reason Apple has so much success, also the reason you don't have problems with Playstations, xBoxes...etc.
I am confused, which is not out of the ordinary, but did you start on this forum with thousands of posts or did you start with one.
I am not trying to be rude to anyone but all new users to a forum had to start with the first post.
I'm not against first posters. That in itself isn't the question or issue.
My point was that there are people that will sign up and make a single post with no intention of ever coming back or following up on that post. Often, this kind of person makes an inflammatory one, making it a troll post. But still, it seems like a waste of time to sign up in the first place.
I'm not against first posters. That in itself isn't the question or issue.
My point was that there are people that will sign up and make a single post with no intention of ever coming back or following up on that post. Often, this kind of person makes an inflammatory one, making it a troll post. But still, it seems like a waste of time to sign up in the first place.
No. but it would be the first volley towards one. and it would make Apple look better. "Hey we gave them too chances to fix this and they refused. Now we want the courts to make them fix it, in accordance with laws A, B and C. Thank you."
Not necessarily. Companies send out cease and desist letters all the time, even when they wouldn't have much of a case if they brought one. It's the routine method of giving notice. So the way the Microsoft guy tells the story smells a little fishy to me. He's trying to make it sound like Apple Legal asked Microsoft to cease and desist when if they were going to do that, it wouldn't be in a phone call.
Anyway, the bottom line on this story is "who cares?" Microsoft's little end zone dance makes them look silly.
Comments
I do suspect they may be effective - my wife of 11 years just bought a PC despite the fact that we already have 4 Macs in the house - one of which is hers a PowerBook G4 fully loaded with RAM and 10.5.x. I have a PC for work and I work on and support offices full of PCs - and I am not shy about expressing my opinion of Mac vs PC - but I guess she never listens to anything I say - because she after she bought it - she asked me which I think is better and she goes on to say that the Macs are too expensive. Coincidentally the next morning after she told me she ordered a PC - my work PC was stuck in a blue screen on boot regardless of safe mode etc as the result of an antivirus program update that moved some device drivers and rendered the system non functional until I took it to my company's IT department and had them run a custom boot disk and repair utility - the process including travel time only took half a day - but hey the PC is cheaper.
To me this sounds like two problems that have little to do with it being a PC
1 it is an antivirus program that did the moving, if you remove the wrong driver from any system it will cause it to be non functional.
2 this is a work system and the IT department that supports that particular computer should have tested the update before it was released to the general office. If you are left to your own devices to update your system, this would be yet another failure by your IT depatment.
I am not a fan of Apple, and it has nothing to do with cost as two of my personal systems were over $5000 each. My complaint is that i dont have the ability to build or work Apple systems. I enjoy building systems Apple does not like me doing it.
As an IT professional i have recommended Apple and PC to differnet people for different reasons, and if Apple were to take off the locks a little i would more than likelty buy one to try them out... again remember many of us PC fans had the Apple IIe
If i misspelled anything sorry i am an IT guy not an english teacher
They are advertising hardware because Apples ads advertise as Microsoft selling the hardware... So microsoft is just playing the same game that apple is.
I think that's their big mistake - never base your ad on your competitor's terms! Why on earth validate the premise of your competitor - especially when it's a deliberately slanted premise. Even though the common perception of most people is that a PC is synonymous with a PC running Windows, this perception is wrong and mostly a result of sloppy errant marketing on the part of both Microsoft and PC manufacturers. Why reinforce it? Especially when it can so easily be exploited by your competition as Apple has done. And it has never been an advantage to MS or pc manufacturers. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people confuse Dell with HP with Compaq, etc.
They had a better campaign with the "I'm a PC too" ads - but then they went and made these ads strictly about cheap hardware and retail stores? Neither of which belong to Microsoft. I'd like to meet the people who sold them on this idea - must have been some smooth talkers.
I think they've given like five actors "money" and thats for an ad?
can't speak about all of them but Lauren was outted as an actress, the rest likely were also.
and here's a fun bit. Microsoft claims they weren't paid. they got the computer and NOTHING else, the only way to get away with that (no filming day salary, no residuals etc) is to film non union. so one of, if not the, largest software company in the country is filming major ad campaigns non-union. Walmart was slammed for this for years. Wonder what the unions would do to Microsoft.
someone provided a link you should see (here it is: http://www.itwire.com/content/view/23941/53/ )
It was a vailid counterpoint, because that link doesn't prove the claim that Macs have the same number of vulnerabilities. That was from one vulnerability. Read what that reply was to:
Apples arent any better than PC's, maybe worse. It is proven that Apples have just as many vulnerabilities as PCs.
elroth didn't properly quote it, so I don't know who to attribute that to.
If the "story" is false, it's just some BS.
If it's true, the average user that makes up the bulk of Apple's market will never find out, nor will they care.
Apple's impressive numbers speak for themselves, anyway.
Did cartwheels down the hallway? Ballmer, is that you?
I'm pretty sure that if Balmer did a hand stand or a cartwheel his arms would snap form the weight. You have to be fit to do an actual cartwheel.
Come to think of it I have yet to see a pic of MS executive that could actually do a cartwheel. I think we are talking "figurative" cartwheels here.
Why do you say they were forced off the air. I saw the "Giampaolo" ad twice last night.
It's illegal in the USA to run an ad that you know is deceptive. I don't know the individual ads, but we are talking about one particular ad out of the series that said you couldn't buy a Mac for "under X price."
I'm assuming that the ad you reference above isn't that ad. If it is that ad then Apple could sue them and win with no problem at all. The law is crystal clear on this issue and ads are pulled all the time for this reason.
The video lady complains about the 2 gb memory on the MBP - that one is still airing. Very misleading.
OK, that ad should be dropped or updated. That was a silly claim in the first place anyways as on my MBP, three screws and $50 in memory gets you 4GB. I think Apple should have been doing 4GB standard anyway given the meager cost of the chips, but the bean counter keeping track of upgrade pricing probably had his say.
How about the claim that the price reduction invalidates a price claim made by Microsoft? That's what the story and this thread is about. I was hoping someone could clarify that one. It's possible I haven't seen a particular ad, but I don't remember any add where a $100 price reduction would have changed anything.
Well apple has some nerve if this is true . They lie in their Im a mac and Im a pc ads also.
That is why i dont think this is true. Why would apple call up Microsoft and ask for the ads to be taken down when they know that they lie in their ads also.
What were those lies? You said it twice but didn't bother to mention any specifics.
It's illegal in the USA to run an ad that you know is deceptive. I don't know the individual ads, but we are talking about one particular ad out of the series that said you couldn't buy a Mac for "under X price."
I'm assuming that the ad you reference above isn't that ad. If it is that ad then Apple could sue them and win with no problem at all. The law is crystal clear on this issue and ads are pulled all the time for this reason.
Why aren't axe ads pulled? Last time I put axe on, I wasn't sexually molested by a large group of sexy women on the beach... But then again, that may have to do with me changing the channel before the jenny craig ad came on.
Apples arent any better than PC's, maybe worse. It is proven that Apples have just as many vulnerabilities as PCs. But Apple make-up less than 5% of the market share for computers, so who do you think hackers and virus programmers are going to focus on? 5% of the market or 95% of the market?
Market Share is not THE reason why there are fewer hackers etc going after Macs. it's that the OS is based on a unix/linux structure. pain in the ass to program a virus for.
Yeah, maybe they dropped the prices of their laptops, but that still doesnt reduce the price of replacement parts, or the cost to get an Apple serviced. That is why a business will never use all Apples.
there are lots of companies that use all Macs. Heck the ad company that made the Laptop campaign is a known "Mac House"
Anyways, if you haven't figured it out, Apple over-charges for sub-par products, then tells everyone you have to have one to be cool, ie iPod, the airbook, or MacBook Pro. For every single one of those, there is a cheaper version with better features and functions from a different company. People need to wake-up and learn to think for themselves.
same game the luxury car companies play. so why is Apple blasted so much for it. Often simply because it is Apple
Well, they showed 5 ads. We don't know how many people they gave money to but came up with footage they couldn't use.
none. it was likely scripted. they might claim off of interviews or paper surveys. but it was not off the cuff anymore than Big Brother et al don't have writers tweaking things to make a hot story for the air
The video lady complains about the 2 gb memory on the MBP - that one is still airing. Very misleading.
depends on the model she was looking at. I think the least expensive 15" did only have 2 GB at that time.
A cease and desist letter is not a lawsuit.
No. but it would be the first volley towards one. and it would make Apple look better. "Hey we gave them too chances to fix this and they refused. Now we want the courts to make them fix it, in accordance with laws A, B and C. Thank you."
...but I guess she never listens to anything I say .
I feel your pain.
It's like Chevy running ads comparing the current Malibu to the old Ford Tempo.
I think the ads are working a little, but they won't clobber Apple.
Well this is strange for two reasons; 1. Apple is crying about it when they themselves have been having these PC vs Mac ads for some time and the MS didn't complain, 2. Are these ads really working?
On a lark, I found that this article was linked on the front page of Google News, it was one of the three stories under the tech section. We seem to get a few trolls pop up whenever it's linked from Google News that way.
Why they take five minutes to sign up just to make a single diatribe post is beyond me.
I am confused, which is not out of the ordinary, but did you start on this forum with thousands of posts or did you start with one.
I am not trying to be rude to anyone but all new users to a forum had to start with the first post.
I am not a fan of Apple, and it has nothing to do with cost as two of my personal systems were over $5000 each. My complaint is that i dont have the ability to build or work Apple systems. I enjoy building systems Apple does not like me doing it.
And if Apple did that, everyone would have just as much problem with their Macs as PC users do, the main reason PCs have the problems they do is because of all of the differences in hardware that the OS has to adjust for. Universal Hardware Platform is the reason Apple has so much success, also the reason you don't have problems with Playstations, xBoxes...etc.
I am confused, which is not out of the ordinary, but did you start on this forum with thousands of posts or did you start with one.
I am not trying to be rude to anyone but all new users to a forum had to start with the first post.
I'm not against first posters. That in itself isn't the question or issue.
My point was that there are people that will sign up and make a single post with no intention of ever coming back or following up on that post. Often, this kind of person makes an inflammatory one, making it a troll post. But still, it seems like a waste of time to sign up in the first place.
I'm not against first posters. That in itself isn't the question or issue.
My point was that there are people that will sign up and make a single post with no intention of ever coming back or following up on that post. Often, this kind of person makes an inflammatory one, making it a troll post. But still, it seems like a waste of time to sign up in the first place.
Gotcha
No. but it would be the first volley towards one. and it would make Apple look better. "Hey we gave them too chances to fix this and they refused. Now we want the courts to make them fix it, in accordance with laws A, B and C. Thank you."
Not necessarily. Companies send out cease and desist letters all the time, even when they wouldn't have much of a case if they brought one. It's the routine method of giving notice. So the way the Microsoft guy tells the story smells a little fishy to me. He's trying to make it sound like Apple Legal asked Microsoft to cease and desist when if they were going to do that, it wouldn't be in a phone call.
Anyway, the bottom line on this story is "who cares?" Microsoft's little end zone dance makes them look silly.