Apple reinventing file access, wireless sharing for iPad

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  • Reply 101 of 507
    takeotakeo Posts: 433member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    What are the uses again? I missed those.



    Typo... I meant to say users. And the answer... as I've said a bunch of times already... are the average joes and computer idiots who just want to write email, surf the web, download music, post on facebook... etc. i.e.... not creative pros or developers or other content creators. Steve made that VERY clear in his presentation. The very first thing he said was that this new creation was something IN BETWEEN a full blown computer and a handheld. You can't fault the iPad for not being OS X. That's what your desktop / laptop is for. No one ever said that the iPad was a replacement for a full blown computer.
  • Reply 102 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I was in advertising for years. It taught me NOT to believe everything. I hope you didn't believe your own junk.



    The point is that Apple likes to make things appear as simple as possible. It likes to put as much under the hood as possible.



    Did you ever use PC DOS, or Windows before 2000? If you aren't too young to have had that lovely experience, you don't know how different the Mac OS was from that. While we were screwing around with interrupts every time we changed, added, or removed boards, on the PC (and found out that there wasn't enough!), we never had to do that with a Mac. Yeah, some PC people thought it was great "managing" that cruft. But it wasn't. It was stupid. The Mac took care of that nonsense so we could just get on with it. Plenty of other examples.



    This is what's happening here. Apple will tell us the basic things so that people in general will see whats it's about. When you get the thing in your hands, you find a lot of details about the way it works that hasn't been mentioned. A lot of things will just work because the OS is taking care of it.



    I really think you're worrying too much here. We're going to see more info coming out over time. Give it a break.



    Actually I remember a different world where the pc offered the first math co-processor allowing artists such as myself to create 3d worlds and environments, in a world which was dominated by power hungry Silicon Graphics and the like. This was before Windows 2k. More like DOS. I run two environments in my studio for the record. My Macbook Pro handles Newtek's Lightwave brilliantly. But Painter, not so much, so that is Windows 7 all the way. And my Fedora environment is great for...well...stuff.



    A computer is a tool. Nobody sells you a wrench and tells you that you can only hammer with it because it consists of a solid metal alloy.
  • Reply 102 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by LTMP View Post


    Does this mean that someone could create an app to view AVI or WMV files?



    YES, Exactly! As a developer, its the most modular, cleanest integration ever, just like OSX. Whatever filetype you can think of as long as theres an app for it, it would open. Even if the files where to be created locally within the Apps, other Apps can see them as well. There are no folders to manage, no files to move, nothing to sort physically. This is a good thing because it prevents you from forgetting where you put the file into, but a "Spotlight" like feature finds all, even if specified right down to the file type. Eg. Why would a Video player app would need to list PDF files if it can't read it?



    Another neat thing is Desktop integration. Just dump any files into it, it will sort itself. No need to create sub folders(although you can, but you don't have to). Great for people who (don't sort) clutter their files on their ~/Desktop
  • Reply 104 of 507
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,238member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    Along with a camera and multitasking? Yes, yes, we have heard this before.



    I don't want to find out that I have purchased an $850 brick with a cheap 64 gig hard drive when I can go out and buy a 500 gig mini pocket drive for under a hundred bucks. I mean, what type of economy does Steve Jobs think this is? To be quite honest, I'm not really comfortable with a watered down OS on ANY device for over $300 dollars.



    It's more complicated that that.



    First of all, this is the first iteration, both for the hardware, and the software. You don't expect next years model to not contain more Flash, more cpu and gpu power, and more sophisticated OS, and just more capability all around?



    We can look at how far the iPhone has come in such a short time, just two years saw three models. Now we'll see the forth after the third year. It will likely be a major upgrade in both hardware and software. Very possible that some of the features of the iPad will find their way back to the iPhone/Touch.



    Talking about $300 as though it's some magic number does no good. You could have said $200, or $400, or $600. Any one of those number would have the same meaning.



    I bought my daughter a $400 netbook for the summer because she just needed Skype, Im internet, and a few other simple things, and wanted to wait for a later MacBook Pro, which we got her in September.



    I've got the thing here. With the 2 Gb RAM upgrade it cost $500. But what a piece of junk! It can't run most software. I even upgraded it to Win 7 just for the heck of it, and it's no better. The iPad seems far more versatile.



    But, according to you, it's a "real" computer, because it's got a full OS, and a 160GB HDD. Nonsense! The iPad looks far more useful, and vastly more capable.
  • Reply 105 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    I don't want to find out that I have purchased an $850 brick with a cheap 64 gig hard drive when I can go out and buy a 500 gig mini pocket drive for under a hundred bucks. I mean, what type of economy does Steve Jobs think this is? To be quite honest, I'm not really comfortable with a watered down OS on ANY device for over $300 dollars.



    That's the beauty; if you use the usual rule for buying a computer -- do I need it NOW, or can I wait -- you don't have to get the first iteration if it's not something you need now.



    Me, I'm going to be using a few of these for a trial run on the next feature I shoot later in the year. I'll give one to each of my department heads (costume, set design, art direction, etc.), so that instead of running up to me with notebook computers to show me some pic to make a choice on (always awkward, but still better than the old Polaroid method from days of yore), they can use a sleeker and easier to handle iPad. I'll be trying to keep my shooting script on the iPad for myself and (if possible) my storyboard. If I can find a way to stream the camera's feed to the iPad (maybe via my MBP which I'll also bring), I'd have a very versatile and mobile monitor as well. Also, any reference footage and graphics will be easy for me to call up. For me, it looks like a very useful tool. But again, this will be a test.
  • Reply 106 of 507
    takeotakeo Posts: 433member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TiAdiMundo View Post


    For me the real problem is about what the iPad wants to be?!



    It is not a PC, I'm OK with that. But like the iPhone is a communication device and the iPod touch is a mobile music/media consumption device, what is the iPad? If it wants to be an internet device it should have flash, a webcam and at least iChat that can run beside other apps. If it wants to be a media consumption device it should have a 16:9 display, stereo speaker, IPTV and full HD video out. If it wants to be a reading device it should have a different display because even this sexy display will hurt your eyes. If it wants to be a digital note book it should have get optional stylus input. Seriously, that notes app is a joke, isn't it? Compare that with MS Office OneNote or even the Journals app coming with Win7



    Yup. That is the issue. I think everyone is trying to wrap their head around what this product's purpose in life is. And it's trying to cover ALL of the media bases. So there are a lot of compromises. As you've outlined. I think the other problem with the iPad is that no one NEEDS one. No one NEEDS an iPad. Everyone needs a computer and a phone. No one needs an iPad. Still... it is a very interesting device. And the app-centric concept is intriguing too... from a usability point of view. It will be fascinating to see how it evolves.
  • Reply 107 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Takeo View Post


    Typo... I meant to say users. And the answer... as I've said a bunch of times already... are the average joes and computer idiots who just want to write email, surf the web, download music, post on facebook... etc. i.e.... not creative pros or developers or other content creators. Steve made that VERY clear in his presentation. The very first thing he said was that this new creation was something IN BETWEEN a full blown computer and a handheld. You can't fault the iPad for not being OS X. That's what your desktop / laptop is for. No one ever said that the iPad was a replacement for a full blown computer.



    But why create an "inbetween" device when you have to pay $850 plus AT&T agreement for a hard drive the $500 price point should give you? For $150 more I can get a regular Macbook WITH-A-FINDER !!!
  • Reply 108 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    That's the beauty; if you use the usual rule for buying a computer -- do I need it NOW, or can I wait -- you don't have to get the first iteration if it's not something you need now.



    Me, I'm going to be using a few of these for a trial run on the next feature I shoot later in the year. I'll give one to each of my department heads (costume, set design, art direction, etc.), so that instead of running up to me with notebook computers to show me some pic to make a choice on (always awkward, but still better than the old Polaroid method from days of yore), they can use a sleeker and easier to handle iPad. I'll be trying to keep my shooting script on the iPad for myself and (if possible) my storyboard. If I can find a way to stream the camera's feed to the iPad (maybe via my MBP which I'll also bring), I'd have a very versatile and mobile monitor as well. Also, any reference footage and graphics will be easy for me to call up. For me, it looks like a very useful tool. But again, this will be a test.



    I can accomplish all the above with a box.net account. Much cheaper.
  • Reply 109 of 507
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,664member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    I totally agree! Apple is selling this idea to idiots in hopes of locking everyone into their own application environment in which they would receive a large piece of the pie for absolutely no work whatsoever. This is all about money. Actually, its down right extortion.



    In there latest quarterly report, Apple specifically said that they run the App Store at a little better than break even. Storage, bandwidth and transaction management aren't free.
  • Reply 110 of 507
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,238member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    Actually I remember a different world where the pc offered the first math co-processor allowing artists such as myself to create 3d worlds and environments, in a world which was dominated by power hungry Silicon Graphics and the like. This was before Windows 2k. More like DOS. I run two environments in my studio for the record. My Macbook Pro handles Newtek's Lightwave brilliantly. But Painter, not so much, so that is Windows 7 all the way. And my Fedora environment is great for...well...stuff.



    A computer is a tool. Nobody sells you a wrench and tells you that you can only hammer with it because it consists of a solid metal alloy.



    You're older than you seem to be. The Mac didn't NEED a math co-proccessor, because other than the first couple of models, the 68xxxx cpu's already had them. And they were 16/32 bit cpus rather than the 8/16 bit ones the PC used for so long.



    Lightwave is a dead weight these days. Congrats for being one of the last pro users.
  • Reply 111 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    It's more complicated that that.



    First of all, this is the first iteration, both for the hardware, and the software. You don't expect next years model to not contain more Flash, more cpu and gpu power, and more sophisticated OS, and just more capability all around?



    We can look at how far the iPhone has come in such a short time, just two years saw three models. Now we'll see the forth after the third year. It will likely be a major upgrade in both hardware and software. Very possible that some of the features of the iPad will find their way back to the iPhone/Touch.



    Talking about $300 as though it's some magic number does no good. You could have said $200, or $400, or $600. Any one of those number would have the same meaning.



    I bought my daughter a $400 netbook for the summer because she just needed Skype, Im internet, and a few other simple things, and wanted to wait for a later MacBook Pro, which we got her in September.



    I've got the thing here. With the 2 Gb RAM upgrade it cost $500. But what a piece of junk! It can't run most software. I even upgraded it to Win 7 just for the heck of it, and it's no better. The iPad seems far more versatile.



    But, according to you, it's a "real" computer, because it's got a full OS, and a 160GB HDD. Nonsense! The iPad looks far more useful, and vastly more capable.



    True, but notice the FREEDOM you had to install another OS, to test out other applications,etc? I can tell you that the iPad will not handle a one-tenth of what a Slate device will be able to handle due to its 1ghz processor. MIght run X-com though. OOOO. Can I install Steam on the iPad? Wait. I can't. The iPAD is sandboxed. :-(
  • Reply 112 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    I can accomplish all the above with a box.net account. Much cheaper.



    Explain please. I'm looking for a tool that I (and my people) can use on set and on location to be a digital script reader, storyboard reference, graphic reference and possibly a monitor for my DP's shooting. What does box.net have to do with that? I don't need a cloud storage identity, I need a physical tool to replace all the notebooks people are running around with on set (which are a bit unwieldy - whereas the iPad looks to be lighter, thinner and less awkward). I'm discussing a tool to use while shooting a feature film.
  • Reply 113 of 507
    takeotakeo Posts: 433member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    But why create an "inbetween" device when you have to pay $850 plus AT&T agreement for a hard drive the $500 price point should give you? For $150 more I can get a regular Macbook WITH-A-FINDER !!!



    I remember when the iPhone first came out it was priced at some ridiculously high amount. Like.... $700 or something insane. Oh... and since the Macbook doesn't have 3G and doesn't require an AT7T agreement... that's not a fair comparison.
  • Reply 114 of 507
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,238member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    But why create an "inbetween" device when you have to pay $850 plus AT&T agreement for a hard drive the $500 price point should give you? For $150 more I can get a regular Macbook WITH-A-FINDER !!!



    As you know, the more compact the device, the more expensive it is.



    That's why laptops are much more expensive for less performance than a desktop or tower. That's just the way it is.



    If you don't need 3G, the $699 device, (it's $829 for the 3G version, not $850) will serve. Last I heard, there's no built-in option for 3G in any Mac laptop, so that's not a fair comparison. There's no GPS or compass either. At least be fair with your comparisons.



    In addition, people in a number of cases seem to be willing to pay five times the price for an SSD that's much smaller than the HDD it replaces. So not everyone would agree with your HDD/Flash comparison either.
  • Reply 115 of 507
    takeotakeo Posts: 433member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    True, but notice the FREEDOM you had to install another OS, to test out other applications,etc? I can tell you that the iPad will not handle a one-tenth of what a Slate device will be able to handle due to its 1ghz processor. MIght run X-com though. OOOO. Can I install Steam on the iPad? Wait. I can't. The iPAD is sandboxed. :-(



    Two different kinds of freedom. The freedom to do whatever the heck you want versus the freedom from having to think too much and learn how to use a complex computer system when all you really want to do is write an email and share pictures of your kids. Please read what I'm writing and try to understand. I'm not trying to argue with you. We actually agree. I have no need for an iPad and would never buy one. Not as it is now. I need a full OS just like you. But I'm not all up in arms about the iPad. Why should I be? It's not aimed at me. And it's not aimed at you. And what's wrong with that?



    This is what I was referring to:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Paradox_of_Choice
  • Reply 116 of 507
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,238member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    True, but notice the FREEDOM you had to install another OS, to test out other applications,etc? I can tell you that the iPad will not handle a one-tenth of what a Slate device will be able to handle due to its 1ghz processor. MIght run X-com though. OOOO. Can I install Steam on the iPad? Wait. I can't. The iPAD is sandboxed. :-(



    Oh please! About 1% of people install another OS. With PCs, most people just get a new computer.



    Your argument is going downhill. You're now bringing things into this that don't apply.



    Just who do you think is going to buy this? Linux geeks?



    The first models of this will be sold mostly to people who want to consume media. And if a few say their collections of music and whatnot are too big, well, fine. People have been complaining about that lack of space on iPods and iPhones too. So far it hasn't seemed to have hurt sales to any extent.



    Much of the rest will go to business people on trips. I've already read articles about why they will want this.



    I'm willing to bet that it will take the market for PC tablets in the medical profession away. Smaller and lighter. The iPhone is already one of the most popular phones with doctors.



    The pro photography sites are awash with articles about how this will be a great thing for them. As that was my business for a long time, I can agree.



    There will be many apps for this, as well as hardware that will extend its use, even if you don't see that.



    This will result in people having much MORE freedom. Just not what you want to envision, because most people don't care about all of that.



    You're stuck on this first edition, and can't seem to imagine that it will advance. Or is it that you'd rather not want to imagine that it will?
  • Reply 117 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    Explain please. I'm looking for a tool that I (and my people) can use on set and on location to be a digital script reader, storyboard reference, graphic reference and possibly a monitor for my DP's shooting. What does box.net have to do with that? I don't need a cloud storage identity, I need a physical tool to replace all the notebooks people are running around with on set (which are a bit unwieldy - whereas the iPad looks to be lighter, thinner and less awkward). I'm discussing a tool to use while shooting a feature film.



    Well if you want to pay me for consulting... :-)



    box.net has an app in the app store. Think of people walking around with cheaper iTouches as opposed to these huge pad devices which are subject to being dropped. I have a workflow worked out with my iPhone being the main device which uploads info to the cloud. Since I can't really PULL info from the cloud because the device is sandboxed, I can at least sync it with my machines at the office. Email me for more info. :-)
  • Reply 118 of 507
    djsherlydjsherly Posts: 1,031member
    What I want to know is whether this is going to be booked to cash or accrued revenue and whether Apple''s going to invoke some magical and wonderful GAAP faux-explanation to charge me $x every three months when the underlying OS is upgraded.



    Otherwise, I'm good to go.
  • Reply 119 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thartist View Post


    ...The iPAD is sandboxed. :-(



    And that is a good thing.

    1.Security. If a sneaky developer decides to create a decoy app to modify let say Mail.app and that reads all of your email addresses and uploads it to their own server. Then you'd blame Apple for getting spam, and that the Mail.app has a security hole. This is why Apps should not talk to each other.

    2. Clean Install/Uninstall. You claim your space back without having random files scattered all over the system.
  • Reply 120 of 507
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Takeo View Post


    Two different kinds of freedom. The freedom to do whatever the heck you want versus the freedom from having to think too much and learn how to use a complex computer system when all you really want to do is write an email and share pictures of your kids. Please read what I'm writing and try to understand. I'm not trying to argue with you. We actually agree. I have no need for an iPad and would never buy one. Not as it is now. I need a full OS just like you. But I'm not all up in arms about the iPad. Why should I be? It's not aimed at me. And it's not aimed at you. And what's wrong with that?



    This is what I was referring to:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Paradox_of_Choice



    For some reason, all I can think of is the marketing that went into Windows ME when reading these posts.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiNWw7h8cEU
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