Based on the wording I thought the focus was on iChat app being simple to add, not that the camera would be simple to add. I was separating a forward-facing camera as being iChat-specific or being named as such when I assume this will just be an API for developers to tie into. Too many threads, too many posts, too much skimming, my fault.
No worries. I'd still like to see the answer to my question, though. I'm not asking you to supply it. The person who made the claim should, IMO.
Killer App from the standpoint of the average non-computer savvy end user who gets an iPad because they are simple and just work?
The grandparents will love the fact that they can video chat with their grandkids just as easily as making a telephone call?
And Killer App from the standpoint that it is not a desktop or laptop; it is not tied down to a desk or a suitable surface for setting a laptop; although laptops can be carried around while video chatting, the two planes make a laptop more cumbersome than a tablet for doing so?
I say we should all lay to rest this whole handheld tablet not gonna be good for video chat thing. There are already three options for stability while video chatting; the Apple carrying case (which can be oriented to stand upright for viewing movies, and is oddly similar to the orientation of a laptop screen/camera?), the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. I am sure third party vendors will also have goods to offer that allow one to easily prop up the iPad for viewing (and video chatting) pleasure?
And even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands while chatting, it is not like you have to hold it extended out at arms length forever? I chat regular with my kids, and they walk around the house with the laptop, the image is still pretty stable. Cradling the iPad in your arm while sitting would also be okay for chatting. The entire idea that the viewer on the other end is gonna see nothing but nose hairs is ridiculous! For that to happen, you would need to be constantly looking above/over the iPad; in my experience of video chatting with iChat, I find that I tend to actually look at the screen, which means I am also orienting my face towards the same plane as the camera is mounted?
"even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands"
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
While video chatting on a tablet is certainly possible. It is far from what I consider a killer-app for the tablet form. If anything, tablets are less suited to video chatting than pretty much every other computing form ever invented. Being required to hold a device in a constant position and orientation is a major pain in the ass and most users will simply choose not to do tasks which require that. Or at least they'll choose a computer form more well suited. The exception would be pocket computers for which the mobility justifies putting up with the form's numerous functional shortcomings.
Users definitely prefer not having to use a handheld camera for video chat. One could reasonably argue that tablets have other advantages that overcome the disadvantage of being required to hold the camera. But it seems that you're claiming that it doesn't matter at all. Is that the case?
"even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands"
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
While video chatting on a tablet is certainly possible. It is far from what I consider a killer-app for the tablet form. If anything, tablets are less suited to video chatting than pretty much every other computing form ever invented. Being required to hold a device in a constant position and orientation is a major pain in the ass and most users will simply choose not to do tasks which require that. Or at least they'll choose a computer form more well suited. The exception would be pocket computers for which the mobility justifies putting up with the form's numerous functional shortcomings.
Users definitely prefer not having to use a handheld camera for video chat. One could reasonably argue that tablets have other advantages that overcome the disadvantage of being required to hold the camera. But it seems that you're claiming that it doesn't matter at all. Is that the case?
So at this point you are still going to totally ignore the references to the three complimentary products Apple is offering for the iPad that would make video chatting a more stable prospect; namely the Apple Carrying Case, the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. All of these items orient the iPad in an upright manner and provide stability for the camera while in use?
And, again, handheld does not mean arms extended out in front of you, iPad suspended in the air? Handheld can be left hand holding right edge of iPad, left forearm supporting iPad from underneath, left edge of iPad nestled against left inner elbow? In a word, cradled?
And, this is the important part!, no matter what the orientation of the iPad, no matter what the angle of the screen/camera; one will still look at the screen when video chatting, meaning that one will still have their face/head properly oriented towards the plane of the camera!!!
Yes!!! Sitting on the couch or in an armchair, one will find video chatting easier and more compelling than getting up and going over to the desktop computer or finding a stable surface for the laptop? Therefore, one just may tend to do quick informal video chats more frequently?!
Come on people, the iPad is a new communications device, and video chatting is a viable means of communication!
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
They have 2 docks and a case that folds into a raised platform for placing it on a table. Apple's surely expecting it to be used at times without being held.
They have 2 docks and a case that folds into a raised platform for placing it on a table. Apple's surely expecting it to be used at times without being held.
The question is, will it be common?
For instance, how many people with pocket computers use one of these?
or one of these
Plenty of manufacturers make these products, but how many people use them?
Docks today are used almost exclusively for charging/syncing/audio-playback. If the intention is to sit down in front of a docked iPad, will users choose instead to just sit down in front of a more full featured computer?
I honestly haven't come up with a definite prediction for how prevalent iPad keyboard-dock usage will be. But I do firmly believe that people will never rely exclusively on tablet computers as their only computer. Tablets will forever be part of a computing ecosystem where people use different devices for different needs.
Which brings us full circle. If people aren't going to be commonly sitting in front of a docked tablet, and video conferencing works best with a non handheld camera, then video conferencing shouldn't really considered a killer-app for the tablet form factor.
So at this point you are still going to totally ignore the references to the three complimentary products Apple is offering for the iPad that would make video chatting a more stable prospect; namely the Apple Carrying Case, the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. All of these items orient the iPad in an upright manner and provide stability for the camera while in use?
And, again, handheld does not mean arms extended out in front of you, iPad suspended in the air? Handheld can be left hand holding right edge of iPad, left forearm supporting iPad from underneath, left edge of iPad nestled against left inner elbow? In a word, cradled?
And, this is the important part!, no matter what the orientation of the iPad, no matter what the angle of the screen/camera; one will still look at the screen when video chatting, meaning that one will still have their face/head properly oriented towards the plane of the camera!!!
Yes!!! Sitting on the couch or in an armchair, one will find video chatting easier and more compelling than getting up and going over to the desktop computer or finding a stable surface for the laptop? Therefore, one just may tend to do quick informal video chats more frequently?!
Come on people, the iPad is a new communications device, and video chatting is a viable means of communication!
Geez?!!!
Nothing has been ignored. We simply disagree about what form factor is best for video chat. And perhaps whether video chat is compelling enough to be used on non-optimal form factors.
The reason why the form factor matters is because it is handheld and thus is held in a variety of positions and orientations. Unless aim-able cameras are used, or multiple cameras, or a wide-angle-lens + cropping, the device will have to held perpendicular to the viewing angle in order for the user to be in the field of view.
While people tend to hold tablets roughly perpendicular to their sight-line, roughly doesn't cut it for video chat. Have you ever tried to video chat with a handheld camera? (That is a serious question) I have and it made video chat vastly less compelling.
My prediction is that video chat won't be popular on tablets until this problem is overcome. Perhaps a wide angle lens with face recognition used to apply cropping and video stabilization... then it might pass the grandma test.
I certainly could be wrong. But the above assertions don't stem from ignorance or Luddite tendencies. Instead, they're rooted in well-reasoned analysis of which computing form factors are suitable for which tasks.
Wont be close to one-to-one for the docks but I do think they'll be more popular than other docks. Look at those small devices. Crap.
For me, the biggest draw to the iPad is the converting case, though it's not overwhelming. I like the idea of that on a plane.
It certainly will be interesting to see how usage pans out from a human factors perspective!
There has really only been three widely successful form factors in computing history. The stationary workstaion, the laptop, and quite recently... the pocket computer. With declining hardware prices and multi-touch, the iPad is poised to finally bring a fourth form factor to the masses. Tablets have been around forever, but it looks like the utility to cost ratio is finally high enough that wide adoption might be realized.
It certainly will be interesting to see how usage pans out from a human factors perspective!
There has really only been three widely successful form factors in computing history. The stationary workstaion, the laptop, and quite recently... the pocket computer. With declining hardware prices and multi-touch, the iPad is poised to finally bring a fourth form factor to the masses. Tablets have been around forever, but it looks like the utility to cost ratio is finally high enough that wide adoption might be realized.
The usability of other tablets has been complex and limiting. Desktop OSes don't work in tablets. iPhone OS App Store apps can scale up okay, but Mac OS X apps won't work (something tablet running Windows tried to sell us), just as "iPad OS" App Store apps aren't going to run on the iPhone.
Again, I have absolutely no use for the iPad but I can see this as the first tablet to be able to easily replace a certain class of user's home computing needs. The device with the keyboard-dock for Mail, Safari, the occasional office doc. it can print, too.i think this might be a trojan horse use that may force Apple to make it more independent, not requiring iTunes for syncing, despite being designed as a complementary device for a PC. Meaning, they may have to make it backup via Time Machines and install updates without iTunes.
Actually something has been ignored, but not by you. My question to McRonin about why Apple would leave out a feature he's so certain is a huge selling point, has been ignored. At least twice now.
Actually something has been ignored, but not by you. My question to McRonin about why Apple would leave out a feature he's so certain is a huge selling point, has been ignored. At least twice now.
First, it is MacRonin, not McRonin… I am not part of some fast food franchise…
The entire thread is stemming from the reported ability of the iPad chassis to house a standard MacBook/Pro style iSight camera…
There are reports on the internet of the possibility of the standard camera opening on the front bezel being seen in some presentations; along with the sense of the actual iPad 'keynote' being changed from its original format, as if some things/functions/areas of the iPad were not ready for showing to the viewing audience…
The iPad has not even shipped yet, and no one has had their hands on one long enough to go over the entire device from either a hardware or a software point of view…
All comments towards the iPad having or not having a camera are, at this point, pure conjecture…
So, outside of Steve Jobs and those in the know at Apple, we cannot really say if Apple has yet left out this feature I am so certain is a huge selling point…
But, it seems logical that, if the iPad does not ship with a built-in iSight on the first revision, a subsequent revision will more than likely have said camera installed…
So, having the ability to do casual video chatting, whether mounted in a dock or handheld, is something I still feel is a must have for the iPad; whether that be when the product first ships or down the road with another revision… It is also something that I feel a vast majority of people will gravitate towards, young & old alike…
And I still maintain, if you are looking at the screen (as you would be when video chatting) then the camera is oriented towards you enough for casual video chatting…!!!
Sorry for mistyping your screen name. I can't promise that it will never happen again.
Yes, I suppose it's possible that Apple will shock us and include a significant hardware feature that they have so far neglected to mention either in a 90 minute presentation on the product or in the hardware specs published on their web site. Possible, but I think you must admit, a huge long shot.
I also have to point out that the "evidence" for the iPad's internal accommodations for a camera is a couple of rumor photos, the authenticity of which is always in question. I would never take that sort of evidence to the bank.
I'm still not clear on why you believe that the camera is a huge feature that Apple must include or have made committed a major blunder. That is what you will say if, as we have every reason to expect at this point, that it won't have one -- right?
Just so we're clear, I think it could be a worthwhile feature too, but with limited appeal, given what we know about the use of video chatting generally. Also I strongly suspect that a camera is not so easy to work out in a computer form factor as different as this one. Apple isn't the sort of company to put a feature in just to say it's there -- if it's going in, they're going to want it to be cool.
Sorry for mistyping your screen name. I can't promise that it will never happen again.
Yes, I suppose it's possible that Apple will shock us and include a significant hardware feature that they have so far neglected to mention either in a 90 minute presentation on the product or in the hardware specs published on their web site. Possible, but I think you must admit, a huge long shot.
I also have to point out that the "evidence" for the iPad's internal accommodations for a camera is a couple of rumor photos, the authenticity of which is always in question. I would never take that sort of evidence to the bank.
I'm still not clear on why you believe that the camera is a huge feature that Apple must include or have made committed a major blunder. That is what you will say if, as we have every reason to expect at this point, that it won't have one -- right?
Just so we're clear, I think it could be a worthwhile feature too, but with limited appeal, given what we know about the use of video chatting generally. Also I strongly suspect that a camera is not so easy to work out in a computer form factor as different as this one. Apple isn't the sort of company to put a feature in just to say it's there -- if it's going in, they're going to want it to be cool.
I can only hope (and it is indeed a stretch) that a camera makes it into rev1, but I fully realize that it is probably not gonna be so?
I would like to think that eventually putting in a camera makes sense, and it is just a matter of Apple getting iChat ported over to the iPhone OS?
But if a camera never happens, I really don't think it would be a deal breaker, it would just make my inner geek a little less happy about the iPad?
I can only hope (and it is indeed a stretch) that a camera makes it into rev1, but I fully realize that it is probably not gonna be so?
I would like to think that eventually putting in a camera makes sense, and it is just a matter of Apple getting iChat ported over to the iPhone OS?
But if a camera never happens, I really don't think it would be a deal breaker, it would just make my inner geek a little less happy about the iPad?
Well that's honest.
Yeah, my inner geek would like to have one too, no question. I've got to tell my inner geek to take a hike sometimes. Inner geek wants to have all sorts of toys that I'll never get much value out of owning. The rest of me says that if Apple can't make it work elegantly then they should probably just leave it out.
A new job posting on Apple's site suggests that the company is preparing to add still and video camera capabilities to its iPad tablet device in the future. The position is for a quality assurance engineer in the Media Systems division of Apple's broader Interactive Media Group and is specifically focused on the "iPad Media" segment of the division.
The Media Systems team is looking for a software quality engineer with a strong technical background to test still, video and audio capture and playback frameworks. Build on your QA experience and knowledge of digital camera technology (still and video) to develop and maintain testing frameworks for both capture and playback pipelines.
According to the job description, the employee will be responsible for assisting the development team by testing performance of their systems and developing appropriate tools for performing the testing.
Familiarity with and interest in photography, video as well as media file formats is highly desirable. Experience with tuning of and image pipeline, including, but not limited to AWB, Color Correction, AutoExposure, FrameRate adjustments is a plus.
The lack of a camera has been seen by many observers as a significant disappointment for the iPad. It does appear, however, that the iPad's enclosure contains an empty space appropriate for a notebook-style iSight camera, and the resulting speculation has included thoughts that Apple had either planned to offer a camera in the iPad but pulled it for unknown reasons or is still planning to offer one in the shipping version but did not include discussion of it during the device's introduction for similarly unknown reasons.
With as anti-tablet-video-chat as my above posts might seem, perhaps I should clarify. It wouldn't be surprising if the iPad has a camera or does not have a camera. The point was really that the tablet form won't make video chat a killer-app. Or that video chat won't be a killer app for the iPad. Thus, it isn't a blunder if the iPad doesn't include one initially.
It seems likely that far more people merely think they want video chat on a tablet, and that once having experienced it, would realize that it isn't that useful/desirable. With that said, it will eventually be a "why-not?" feature. When the price of the hardware/software/support of video chat becomes negligible, including a camera will make sense. In the meantime, it isn't surprising or disastrous in the slightest, to sell iPads sans camera.
My guess is that hardware costs are a consideration for inclusion of what would likely be a seldom used feature. But more significant is likely the R&D cost along with software necessary to make a camera work on a device which is held at various orientations. Support would also likely be non-trivial for apple. Video chat, even on desktop systems with wired network connections, is anything but hassle-free for users.
In other words, would it be horrible to include one? Definitely not. But it also isn't terribly justified at this point in time.
Good points. It's remarkable to me how, after this many years, iChat is still virtually useless. I don't know a single other Mac user who uses it, so when I do video chats, it's over Jabber/Googletalk in the web browser, which is buggy, clunky and erratic. If Apple really wants iChat to be big, and to work well on an iPad, they will probably have to release a Windows version. I don't see Apple being so tremendously committed to video chatting as perhaps others do, and I offer as evidence the continued lack of Jabber support for video conference in iChat on the Mac. And now they're going to put a camera in the iPad -- and for what? To proliferate a feature that fundamentally doesn't work very well?
Good points. It's remarkable to me how, after this many years, iChat is still virtually useless. I don't know a single other Mac user who uses it, so when I do video chats, it's over Jabber/Googletalk in the web browser, which is buggy, clunky and erratic. If Apple really wants iChat to be big, and to work well on an iPad, they will probably have to release a Windows version. I don't see Apple being so tremendously committed to video chatting as perhaps others do, and I offer as evidence the continued lack of Jabber support for video conference in iChat on the Mac. And now they're going to put a camera in the iPad -- and for what? To proliferate a feature that fundamentally doesn't work very well?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage
Amen to that brother!
I feel sorry for poor old Ralph Johns who haunts the Apple forums explaining how to open firewalls and do various other magic to get iChat to work.
C.
I use iChat to remotely connect to machines and I know plenty of typical users that are fine with GTalk or AIM through iChat. I use Adium since I connect to multiple accounts and like the tweaking I can do.
Comments
Based on the wording I thought the focus was on iChat app being simple to add, not that the camera would be simple to add. I was separating a forward-facing camera as being iChat-specific or being named as such when I assume this will just be an API for developers to tie into. Too many threads, too many posts, too much skimming, my fault.
No worries. I'd still like to see the answer to my question, though. I'm not asking you to supply it. The person who made the claim should, IMO.
Killer App from the standpoint of the average non-computer savvy end user who gets an iPad because they are simple and just work?
The grandparents will love the fact that they can video chat with their grandkids just as easily as making a telephone call?
And Killer App from the standpoint that it is not a desktop or laptop; it is not tied down to a desk or a suitable surface for setting a laptop; although laptops can be carried around while video chatting, the two planes make a laptop more cumbersome than a tablet for doing so?
I say we should all lay to rest this whole handheld tablet not gonna be good for video chat thing. There are already three options for stability while video chatting; the Apple carrying case (which can be oriented to stand upright for viewing movies, and is oddly similar to the orientation of a laptop screen/camera?), the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. I am sure third party vendors will also have goods to offer that allow one to easily prop up the iPad for viewing (and video chatting) pleasure?
And even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands while chatting, it is not like you have to hold it extended out at arms length forever? I chat regular with my kids, and they walk around the house with the laptop, the image is still pretty stable. Cradling the iPad in your arm while sitting would also be okay for chatting. The entire idea that the viewer on the other end is gonna see nothing but nose hairs is ridiculous! For that to happen, you would need to be constantly looking above/over the iPad; in my experience of video chatting with iChat, I find that I tend to actually look at the screen, which means I am also orienting my face towards the same plane as the camera is mounted?
"even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands"
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
While video chatting on a tablet is certainly possible. It is far from what I consider a killer-app for the tablet form. If anything, tablets are less suited to video chatting than pretty much every other computing form ever invented. Being required to hold a device in a constant position and orientation is a major pain in the ass and most users will simply choose not to do tasks which require that. Or at least they'll choose a computer form more well suited. The exception would be pocket computers for which the mobility justifies putting up with the form's numerous functional shortcomings.
Users definitely prefer not having to use a handheld camera for video chat. One could reasonably argue that tablets have other advantages that overcome the disadvantage of being required to hold the camera. But it seems that you're claiming that it doesn't matter at all. Is that the case?
"even if one were to hold the iPad in their hands"
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
While video chatting on a tablet is certainly possible. It is far from what I consider a killer-app for the tablet form. If anything, tablets are less suited to video chatting than pretty much every other computing form ever invented. Being required to hold a device in a constant position and orientation is a major pain in the ass and most users will simply choose not to do tasks which require that. Or at least they'll choose a computer form more well suited. The exception would be pocket computers for which the mobility justifies putting up with the form's numerous functional shortcomings.
Users definitely prefer not having to use a handheld camera for video chat. One could reasonably argue that tablets have other advantages that overcome the disadvantage of being required to hold the camera. But it seems that you're claiming that it doesn't matter at all. Is that the case?
So at this point you are still going to totally ignore the references to the three complimentary products Apple is offering for the iPad that would make video chatting a more stable prospect; namely the Apple Carrying Case, the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. All of these items orient the iPad in an upright manner and provide stability for the camera while in use?
And, again, handheld does not mean arms extended out in front of you, iPad suspended in the air? Handheld can be left hand holding right edge of iPad, left forearm supporting iPad from underneath, left edge of iPad nestled against left inner elbow? In a word, cradled?
And, this is the important part!, no matter what the orientation of the iPad, no matter what the angle of the screen/camera; one will still look at the screen when video chatting, meaning that one will still have their face/head properly oriented towards the plane of the camera!!!
Yes!!! Sitting on the couch or in an armchair, one will find video chatting easier and more compelling than getting up and going over to the desktop computer or finding a stable surface for the laptop? Therefore, one just may tend to do quick informal video chats more frequently?!
Come on people, the iPad is a new communications device, and video chatting is a viable means of communication!
Geez?!!!
Are you seriously envisioning iPads being commonly used while not being held in the user's hands?
They have 2 docks and a case that folds into a raised platform for placing it on a table. Apple's surely expecting it to be used at times without being held.
They have 2 docks and a case that folds into a raised platform for placing it on a table. Apple's surely expecting it to be used at times without being held.
The question is, will it be common?
For instance, how many people with pocket computers use one of these?
or one of these
Plenty of manufacturers make these products, but how many people use them?
Docks today are used almost exclusively for charging/syncing/audio-playback. If the intention is to sit down in front of a docked iPad, will users choose instead to just sit down in front of a more full featured computer?
I honestly haven't come up with a definite prediction for how prevalent iPad keyboard-dock usage will be. But I do firmly believe that people will never rely exclusively on tablet computers as their only computer. Tablets will forever be part of a computing ecosystem where people use different devices for different needs.
Which brings us full circle. If people aren't going to be commonly sitting in front of a docked tablet, and video conferencing works best with a non handheld camera, then video conferencing shouldn't really considered a killer-app for the tablet form factor.
The question is, will it be common?
Wont be close to one-to-one for the docks but I do think they'll be more popular than other docks. Look at those small devices. Crap.
For me, the biggest draw to the iPad is the converting case, though it's not overwhelming. I like the idea of that on a plane.
So at this point you are still going to totally ignore the references to the three complimentary products Apple is offering for the iPad that would make video chatting a more stable prospect; namely the Apple Carrying Case, the Apple Dock & the Apple Keyboard Dock. All of these items orient the iPad in an upright manner and provide stability for the camera while in use?
And, again, handheld does not mean arms extended out in front of you, iPad suspended in the air? Handheld can be left hand holding right edge of iPad, left forearm supporting iPad from underneath, left edge of iPad nestled against left inner elbow? In a word, cradled?
And, this is the important part!, no matter what the orientation of the iPad, no matter what the angle of the screen/camera; one will still look at the screen when video chatting, meaning that one will still have their face/head properly oriented towards the plane of the camera!!!
Yes!!! Sitting on the couch or in an armchair, one will find video chatting easier and more compelling than getting up and going over to the desktop computer or finding a stable surface for the laptop? Therefore, one just may tend to do quick informal video chats more frequently?!
Come on people, the iPad is a new communications device, and video chatting is a viable means of communication!
Geez?!!!
Nothing has been ignored. We simply disagree about what form factor is best for video chat. And perhaps whether video chat is compelling enough to be used on non-optimal form factors.
The reason why the form factor matters is because it is handheld and thus is held in a variety of positions and orientations. Unless aim-able cameras are used, or multiple cameras, or a wide-angle-lens + cropping, the device will have to held perpendicular to the viewing angle in order for the user to be in the field of view.
While people tend to hold tablets roughly perpendicular to their sight-line, roughly doesn't cut it for video chat. Have you ever tried to video chat with a handheld camera? (That is a serious question) I have and it made video chat vastly less compelling.
My prediction is that video chat won't be popular on tablets until this problem is overcome. Perhaps a wide angle lens with face recognition used to apply cropping and video stabilization... then it might pass the grandma test.
I certainly could be wrong. But the above assertions don't stem from ignorance or Luddite tendencies. Instead, they're rooted in well-reasoned analysis of which computing form factors are suitable for which tasks.
Wont be close to one-to-one for the docks but I do think they'll be more popular than other docks. Look at those small devices. Crap.
For me, the biggest draw to the iPad is the converting case, though it's not overwhelming. I like the idea of that on a plane.
It certainly will be interesting to see how usage pans out from a human factors perspective!
There has really only been three widely successful form factors in computing history. The stationary workstaion, the laptop, and quite recently... the pocket computer. With declining hardware prices and multi-touch, the iPad is poised to finally bring a fourth form factor to the masses. Tablets have been around forever, but it looks like the utility to cost ratio is finally high enough that wide adoption might be realized.
It certainly will be interesting to see how usage pans out from a human factors perspective!
There has really only been three widely successful form factors in computing history. The stationary workstaion, the laptop, and quite recently... the pocket computer. With declining hardware prices and multi-touch, the iPad is poised to finally bring a fourth form factor to the masses. Tablets have been around forever, but it looks like the utility to cost ratio is finally high enough that wide adoption might be realized.
The usability of other tablets has been complex and limiting. Desktop OSes don't work in tablets. iPhone OS App Store apps can scale up okay, but Mac OS X apps won't work (something tablet running Windows tried to sell us), just as "iPad OS" App Store apps aren't going to run on the iPhone.
Again, I have absolutely no use for the iPad but I can see this as the first tablet to be able to easily replace a certain class of user's home computing needs. The device with the keyboard-dock for Mail, Safari, the occasional office doc. it can print, too.i think this might be a trojan horse use that may force Apple to make it more independent, not requiring iTunes for syncing, despite being designed as a complementary device for a PC. Meaning, they may have to make it backup via Time Machines and install updates without iTunes.
Nothing has been ignored.
Actually something has been ignored, but not by you. My question to McRonin about why Apple would leave out a feature he's so certain is a huge selling point, has been ignored. At least twice now.
Actually something has been ignored, but not by you. My question to McRonin about why Apple would leave out a feature he's so certain is a huge selling point, has been ignored. At least twice now.
First, it is MacRonin, not McRonin… I am not part of some fast food franchise…
The entire thread is stemming from the reported ability of the iPad chassis to house a standard MacBook/Pro style iSight camera…
There are reports on the internet of the possibility of the standard camera opening on the front bezel being seen in some presentations; along with the sense of the actual iPad 'keynote' being changed from its original format, as if some things/functions/areas of the iPad were not ready for showing to the viewing audience…
The iPad has not even shipped yet, and no one has had their hands on one long enough to go over the entire device from either a hardware or a software point of view…
All comments towards the iPad having or not having a camera are, at this point, pure conjecture…
So, outside of Steve Jobs and those in the know at Apple, we cannot really say if Apple has yet left out this feature I am so certain is a huge selling point…
But, it seems logical that, if the iPad does not ship with a built-in iSight on the first revision, a subsequent revision will more than likely have said camera installed…
So, having the ability to do casual video chatting, whether mounted in a dock or handheld, is something I still feel is a must have for the iPad; whether that be when the product first ships or down the road with another revision… It is also something that I feel a vast majority of people will gravitate towards, young & old alike…
And I still maintain, if you are looking at the screen (as you would be when video chatting) then the camera is oriented towards you enough for casual video chatting…!!!
Yes, I suppose it's possible that Apple will shock us and include a significant hardware feature that they have so far neglected to mention either in a 90 minute presentation on the product or in the hardware specs published on their web site. Possible, but I think you must admit, a huge long shot.
I also have to point out that the "evidence" for the iPad's internal accommodations for a camera is a couple of rumor photos, the authenticity of which is always in question. I would never take that sort of evidence to the bank.
I'm still not clear on why you believe that the camera is a huge feature that Apple must include or have made committed a major blunder. That is what you will say if, as we have every reason to expect at this point, that it won't have one -- right?
Just so we're clear, I think it could be a worthwhile feature too, but with limited appeal, given what we know about the use of video chatting generally. Also I strongly suspect that a camera is not so easy to work out in a computer form factor as different as this one. Apple isn't the sort of company to put a feature in just to say it's there -- if it's going in, they're going to want it to be cool.
Sorry for mistyping your screen name. I can't promise that it will never happen again.
Yes, I suppose it's possible that Apple will shock us and include a significant hardware feature that they have so far neglected to mention either in a 90 minute presentation on the product or in the hardware specs published on their web site. Possible, but I think you must admit, a huge long shot.
I also have to point out that the "evidence" for the iPad's internal accommodations for a camera is a couple of rumor photos, the authenticity of which is always in question. I would never take that sort of evidence to the bank.
I'm still not clear on why you believe that the camera is a huge feature that Apple must include or have made committed a major blunder. That is what you will say if, as we have every reason to expect at this point, that it won't have one -- right?
Just so we're clear, I think it could be a worthwhile feature too, but with limited appeal, given what we know about the use of video chatting generally. Also I strongly suspect that a camera is not so easy to work out in a computer form factor as different as this one. Apple isn't the sort of company to put a feature in just to say it's there -- if it's going in, they're going to want it to be cool.
I can only hope (and it is indeed a stretch) that a camera makes it into rev1, but I fully realize that it is probably not gonna be so?
I would like to think that eventually putting in a camera makes sense, and it is just a matter of Apple getting iChat ported over to the iPhone OS?
But if a camera never happens, I really don't think it would be a deal breaker, it would just make my inner geek a little less happy about the iPad?
I can only hope (and it is indeed a stretch) that a camera makes it into rev1, but I fully realize that it is probably not gonna be so?
I would like to think that eventually putting in a camera makes sense, and it is just a matter of Apple getting iChat ported over to the iPhone OS?
But if a camera never happens, I really don't think it would be a deal breaker, it would just make my inner geek a little less happy about the iPad?
Well that's honest.
Yeah, my inner geek would like to have one too, no question. I've got to tell my inner geek to take a hike sometimes. Inner geek wants to have all sorts of toys that I'll never get much value out of owning. The rest of me says that if Apple can't make it work elegantly then they should probably just leave it out.
A new job posting on Apple's site suggests that the company is preparing to add still and video camera capabilities to its iPad tablet device in the future. The position is for a quality assurance engineer in the Media Systems division of Apple's broader Interactive Media Group and is specifically focused on the "iPad Media" segment of the division.
The Media Systems team is looking for a software quality engineer with a strong technical background to test still, video and audio capture and playback frameworks. Build on your QA experience and knowledge of digital camera technology (still and video) to develop and maintain testing frameworks for both capture and playback pipelines.
According to the job description, the employee will be responsible for assisting the development team by testing performance of their systems and developing appropriate tools for performing the testing.
Familiarity with and interest in photography, video as well as media file formats is highly desirable. Experience with tuning of and image pipeline, including, but not limited to AWB, Color Correction, AutoExposure, FrameRate adjustments is a plus.
The lack of a camera has been seen by many observers as a significant disappointment for the iPad. It does appear, however, that the iPad's enclosure contains an empty space appropriate for a notebook-style iSight camera, and the resulting speculation has included thoughts that Apple had either planned to offer a camera in the iPad but pulled it for unknown reasons or is still planning to offer one in the shipping version but did not include discussion of it during the device's introduction for similarly unknown reasons.
It seems likely that far more people merely think they want video chat on a tablet, and that once having experienced it, would realize that it isn't that useful/desirable. With that said, it will eventually be a "why-not?" feature. When the price of the hardware/software/support of video chat becomes negligible, including a camera will make sense. In the meantime, it isn't surprising or disastrous in the slightest, to sell iPads sans camera.
My guess is that hardware costs are a consideration for inclusion of what would likely be a seldom used feature. But more significant is likely the R&D cost along with software necessary to make a camera work on a device which is held at various orientations. Support would also likely be non-trivial for apple. Video chat, even on desktop systems with wired network connections, is anything but hassle-free for users.
In other words, would it be horrible to include one? Definitely not. But it also isn't terribly justified at this point in time.
Good points. It's remarkable to me how, after this many years, iChat is still virtually useless.
Amen to that brother!
I feel sorry for poor old Ralph Johns who haunts the Apple forums explaining how to open firewalls and do various other magic to get iChat to work.
C.
Good points. It's remarkable to me how, after this many years, iChat is still virtually useless. I don't know a single other Mac user who uses it, so when I do video chats, it's over Jabber/Googletalk in the web browser, which is buggy, clunky and erratic. If Apple really wants iChat to be big, and to work well on an iPad, they will probably have to release a Windows version. I don't see Apple being so tremendously committed to video chatting as perhaps others do, and I offer as evidence the continued lack of Jabber support for video conference in iChat on the Mac. And now they're going to put a camera in the iPad -- and for what? To proliferate a feature that fundamentally doesn't work very well?
Amen to that brother!
I feel sorry for poor old Ralph Johns who haunts the Apple forums explaining how to open firewalls and do various other magic to get iChat to work.
C.
I use iChat to remotely connect to machines and I know plenty of typical users that are fine with GTalk or AIM through iChat. I use Adium since I connect to multiple accounts and like the tweaking I can do.