What did Adobe ever do? I first remember, was it Illustrator 7 or 8, where the Mac version was actually a downgrade in order to catch the Windows version up. I was still working in graphics then. So, after getting suckered into paying for it and getting ticked off, I switched to freehand, which in all ways but integration with a paint program was superior. Then Adobe buys Macromedia, shuts down Freehand, does not incorporate any of the advanced features as that may cut into their InDesign (or pagemaker) sales, and turns Flash into a monster. Since then, the capabilities on the Mac side have consistently lagged behind the windows side. Never mind the argument about the advanced stuff only working on windows, 99% of that is complete crap.
And what's this about the Mac OS being responsible. My mac almost never crashes, but when it does its either Flash running or Office (yes, really, I'm not just adding a random MS bash here). Adobe seems to be able to get its other apps running fine. Step up and explain this one in detail guys.
Apple is probably not the easiest company to work with, but Adobe's been nipping at them for a long time, and this might just be the beginning. Apple should either buy Adobe, but that now seems unlikely as it would be counterproductive to destroy the business first, or really compete like they did with Final Cut. But, take it seriously this time.
Is it any wonder that Adobe's products on the Mac lag behind the Windows versions with Apple's attitude towards developers.
I've always wondered why media outlets seem to think that a poll is some measure of the technical validity of various arguments. Probably 95% of the people responding to that poll don't realize that Adobe has STILL not released a full version of Flash for mobile devices so it's impossible for the problem to be on Apple's end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by qualar
Is it any wonder that Adobe's products on the Mac lag behind the Windows versions with Apple's attitude towards developers.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
I've always wondered why media outlets seem to think that a poll is some measure of the technical validity of various arguments. Probably 95% of the people responding to that poll don't realize that Adobe has STILL not released a full version of Flash for mobile devices so it's impossible for the problem to be on Apple's end.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
One only need look at their activity monitor or stop using Click2Flash to
see the deleterious effects of Flash on a Mac.
It's done...stick a fork in it.
Content that's not properly written or optimized will run poorly no matter what language or format it's written in. I have iPhone apps I've purchased that crash before they would even launch. I've had slow loading html pages. You can't attribute poor performance with a product which is perfectly capable of authoring very efficient content. Banners aside, flash is great. Banners included, at least i can disable banners with click2flash or adblock more easily than some other method
You can't even respect the guy after he says that Flash doesn't have a problem with battery life. Every problem he has someone else to blame. Pathetic.
"First, it causes the entire tablet to get quite warm (especially when playing Flash video) and then it murders its battery life. The JooJoo's integrated three-cell battery repeatedly lasted 2.5 hours (just as we predicted!) during our moderate use, which included surfing the Web and playing short videos. JooJoo claims you can get 5 hours if you avoid Flash entirely, but that sort of defeats the purpose, right?"
5 hours... not playing video? vs playing video? That's not even a relative comparison.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
10 years ago there wasn't such a thing as Xcode and the current visual studio wasn't around either. They would have been using Visual C++ on the windows side and Metrowerks CodeWarrior on the mac side. Your argument about IDEs as a reason for Adobe's decisions just doesn't hold water.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
How easy to use an IDE is doesn't seem to be a compelling reason for Adobe or any major software house to focus on Windows development. The truth is that a decade ago Apple still had not fully recovered. Adobe had stuck with Apple through the hard times, but had made a strategic decision that enough was enough and they were going to Windows with OS X as a byproduct that they could continue to siphon. Unfortunately for them, it seems they made a poor bet. Apple's resurgence has placed them in a position where they are not at the mercy of other companies like Adobe, for good or bad. Even while Apple was recovering and becoming so successful, Adobe stayed with their old course of Windows first and Mac second.
I can't fault them for their decisions 10 years ago. It was probably the best decision for them at the time, even while it was not in Apple's best interests. But sometimes, you make make a bad bet and gamble against a horse that ends up winning. They lost this bet.
True, true.. Adobe shot first in public though, didn't they? By commenting in public that Apple is trying to hurt Adobe. Like if Apple's policy is designed to specifically shut out Adobe, and nothing else.
Well well... Actually I'm glad it's not on Apple's Mobile OS X, after all it's (like in 99% of the case) just for commercials and games, and I completely agree with Steve Jobs in that Adobe should make an HTML5 software. It's a golden opportunity. I hope they realize it in time, for their own good.
Besides, I think Adobe's multi platform strategy shines through in the whole CS suite. They got over 20 years of development and research for this.. and still their software crash, misbehave, have a slow and sluggish UI. I imagine this is in part the result of their own multi platform strategy.
Regarding the comment to which you agree with Steve ("Adobe should make an HTML5 software. It's a golden opportunity. I hope they realize it in time, for their own good"), I suspect my ignorance of Flash programming and encoding will now show through badly, but, shouldn't this relatively easy for Adobe to accomplish? I have dabbled a bit in Flash, and I can certainly appreciate how those that have developed alacrity with the interface would be disinclined to bail on that skillset. However, shouldn't this be a rather simple matter for Adobe to just encode the end product differently? I mean, really...it may require them to do some crap "under the hood" to allow a choice of exports, but once that is done, I would think that content developers would be thrilled to stick with an interface they have mastered, and be able to deliver on every platform with a "save" and a "save as" choice. Adobe could reign supreme, and Steve could relax.
Everyone wins? Too hard to do? Pissing match between big players? Abject stubbornness? I would like to be enlightened as to why this is such a big deal.
Comments
What did Adobe ever do? I first remember, was it Illustrator 7 or 8, where the Mac version was actually a downgrade in order to catch the Windows version up. I was still working in graphics then. So, after getting suckered into paying for it and getting ticked off, I switched to freehand, which in all ways but integration with a paint program was superior. Then Adobe buys Macromedia, shuts down Freehand, does not incorporate any of the advanced features as that may cut into their InDesign (or pagemaker) sales, and turns Flash into a monster. Since then, the capabilities on the Mac side have consistently lagged behind the windows side. Never mind the argument about the advanced stuff only working on windows, 99% of that is complete crap.
And what's this about the Mac OS being responsible. My mac almost never crashes, but when it does its either Flash running or Office (yes, really, I'm not just adding a random MS bash here). Adobe seems to be able to get its other apps running fine. Step up and explain this one in detail guys.
Apple is probably not the easiest company to work with, but Adobe's been nipping at them for a long time, and this might just be the beginning. Apple should either buy Adobe, but that now seems unlikely as it would be counterproductive to destroy the business first, or really compete like they did with Final Cut. But, take it seriously this time.
Is it any wonder that Adobe's products on the Mac lag behind the Windows versions with Apple's attitude towards developers.
GET THEM NUMBERS UP!!!!
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-20003829-1.html
GET THEM NUMBERS UP!!!!
I've always wondered why media outlets seem to think that a poll is some measure of the technical validity of various arguments. Probably 95% of the people responding to that poll don't realize that Adobe has STILL not released a full version of Flash for mobile devices so it's impossible for the problem to be on Apple's end.
Is it any wonder that Adobe's products on the Mac lag behind the Windows versions with Apple's attitude towards developers.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
I've always wondered why media outlets seem to think that a poll is some measure of the technical validity of various arguments. Probably 95% of the people responding to that poll don't realize that Adobe has STILL not released a full version of Flash for mobile devices so it's impossible for the problem to be on Apple's end.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
One only need look at their activity monitor or stop using Click2Flash to
see the deleterious effects of Flash on a Mac.
It's done...stick a fork in it.
Content that's not properly written or optimized will run poorly no matter what language or format it's written in. I have iPhone apps I've purchased that crash before they would even launch. I've had slow loading html pages. You can't attribute poor performance with a product which is perfectly capable of authoring very efficient content. Banners aside, flash is great. Banners included, at least i can disable banners with click2flash or adblock more easily than some other method
You can't even respect the guy after he says that Flash doesn't have a problem with battery life. Every problem he has someone else to blame. Pathetic.
Engadget's JooJoo Review (for a real kick check out the video of Flash performance)
"First, it causes the entire tablet to get quite warm (especially when playing Flash video) and then it murders its battery life. The JooJoo's integrated three-cell battery repeatedly lasted 2.5 hours (just as we predicted!) during our moderate use, which included surfing the Web and playing short videos. JooJoo claims you can get 5 hours if you avoid Flash entirely, but that sort of defeats the purpose, right?"
5 hours... not playing video? vs playing video? That's not even a relative comparison.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
10 years ago there wasn't such a thing as Xcode and the current visual studio wasn't around either. They would have been using Visual C++ on the windows side and Metrowerks CodeWarrior on the mac side. Your argument about IDEs as a reason for Adobe's decisions just doesn't hold water.
Nonsense. The problem is that Adobe made a strategic decision about a decade ago to build a native Windows version and then do a half-hearted port to the Mac.
In the case of Flash, that decision is going to end up killing the product.
That is because the development on Windows is far superior to OSX. Visual Studio vs Xcode is a no contest. I use both but can achieve the same task with Visual Studio in a lot less time.
I use both so am not an Apple hater just realistic.
How easy to use an IDE is doesn't seem to be a compelling reason for Adobe or any major software house to focus on Windows development. The truth is that a decade ago Apple still had not fully recovered. Adobe had stuck with Apple through the hard times, but had made a strategic decision that enough was enough and they were going to Windows with OS X as a byproduct that they could continue to siphon. Unfortunately for them, it seems they made a poor bet. Apple's resurgence has placed them in a position where they are not at the mercy of other companies like Adobe, for good or bad. Even while Apple was recovering and becoming so successful, Adobe stayed with their old course of Windows first and Mac second.
I can't fault them for their decisions 10 years ago. It was probably the best decision for them at the time, even while it was not in Apple's best interests. But sometimes, you make make a bad bet and gamble against a horse that ends up winning. They lost this bet.
True, true.. Adobe shot first in public though, didn't they? By commenting in public that Apple is trying to hurt Adobe. Like if Apple's policy is designed to specifically shut out Adobe, and nothing else.
Well well... Actually I'm glad it's not on Apple's Mobile OS X, after all it's (like in 99% of the case) just for commercials and games, and I completely agree with Steve Jobs in that Adobe should make an HTML5 software. It's a golden opportunity. I hope they realize it in time, for their own good.
Besides, I think Adobe's multi platform strategy shines through in the whole CS suite. They got over 20 years of development and research for this.. and still their software crash, misbehave, have a slow and sluggish UI. I imagine this is in part the result of their own multi platform strategy.
Regarding the comment to which you agree with Steve ("Adobe should make an HTML5 software. It's a golden opportunity. I hope they realize it in time, for their own good"), I suspect my ignorance of Flash programming and encoding will now show through badly, but, shouldn't this relatively easy for Adobe to accomplish? I have dabbled a bit in Flash, and I can certainly appreciate how those that have developed alacrity with the interface would be disinclined to bail on that skillset. However, shouldn't this be a rather simple matter for Adobe to just encode the end product differently? I mean, really...it may require them to do some crap "under the hood" to allow a choice of exports, but once that is done, I would think that content developers would be thrilled to stick with an interface they have mastered, and be able to deliver on every platform with a "save" and a "save as" choice. Adobe could reign supreme, and Steve could relax.
Everyone wins? Too hard to do? Pissing match between big players? Abject stubbornness? I would like to be enlightened as to why this is such a big deal.
Thanks
Apple wants stability of their operating system almost as much as I do... Flash needs to run quicker and longer.. any one else have a flash for Flash?