You don't seem to understand exactly how specific the information that they can gather from a flash based player is. It isn't simply that you watched the video and clicked on an ad; it's how long you watched, where you skipped around to, where you started, where you ended, what resolution you watched it at, what volume you used, whether or not you used closed captioning, and most importantly, whether or not you clicked on the embedded ad link (and at what point).
When I was at Macworld back when flash video was first taking off, I saw a demo of all the information that can be gathered from it and what a boon it would be for advertisers. That all has to be done within the player, and HTML5 simply doesn't have that functionality. Or, you know, a definitive codec.
I definitely don't understand all that...don't care really I understand the need to insert commercials, etc, but all that other stuff you mentioned just sounds evil.
I have an idea for a *new* video distribution company. It would allow you to download, not stream, the content using a proprietary DRM and player. The downside is that you need a new player, the upside is that free content could be taken with you anywhere and viewed offline. What I have in mind is the video being broken down into sections and tailored commercials put in to fit the content and viewer's demographic data. It would be exploding, like iTunes movie rentals so you have x-many days to watch it and x-many hours to complete it, and you couldn't FF through ads.
That makes sense. Hulu will eventually move to HTML5 some over the next few years as the implementation becomes more mature in browsers. I expect most sites will.
Adobe really need to enable the export of HTML5 from the Flash IDE. If they don't come up with a solid product some time in the next year or two someone else will.
That makes sense. Hulu will eventually move to HTML5 some over the next few years as the implementation becomes more mature in browsers. I expect most sites will.
Adobe really need to enable the export of HTML5 from the Flash IDE. If they don't come up with a solid product some time in the next year or two someone else will.
No. But HTML5 doesn't really address the need that Flash addresses. HTML5 takes brilliant care of things like video presentation, and even a wide range of interactive content, but some of the more advanced things people do with Flash would require a much greater degree of expertise in HTML5. It would be awesome to have a development environment for this sort of content in HTML5 but it doesn't exist yet, and Adobe, the company that would normally pioneer this sort of thing, probably won't touch it on this scale until they taste more of Flash's blood.
No. But HTML5 doesn't really address the need that Flash addresses. HTML5 takes brilliant care of things like video presentation, and even a wide range of interactive content, but some of the more advanced things people do with Flash would require a much greater degree of expertise in HTML5. It would be awesome to have a development environment for this sort of content in HTML5 but it doesn't exist yet, and Adobe, the company that would normally pioneer this sort of thing, probably won't touch it on this scale until they taste more of Flash's blood.
But adobe would be stupid not to build a serious development platform for html5. If they don't, someone else will. Perhaps we'll see it as an awesome plugin for eclipse.
Hulu as well as anyone else will move to where the money flows, whether it is Flash, HTML5 or anything else that ensures a significant user base. Stating that only Flash can achieve their needs is hardly true. All they have to do is adjust their model to the iPad and the advertising money is flowing from there, too. Millions of iPad users will be hard for Hulu to ignore...
True, but they can ignore it for now. Maybe when there's more like 50 million, then they can't ignore it.
Where are the Flash-lovers? Aren't they also the people who have nothing good to say about DRM? But Flash can be protected -- barely -- and HTML5?
Javascript can surely be used to do the counting for plays and views and the like. So the only real objection here is DRM.
I did do a test of an HTML5 video, and discovered that it can be copied. The Quicktime X player that comes up in the browser doesn't allow copying, but find the right url, paste it in the desktop player, and there's your copy.
After all that tumult over mp3s, does the MPAA and the studios want all this over again? Apparently so.
I'm sure HULU can easily be pursuaded to adopt HTML5 with a little cash infussion from APPLE. And if Apple wants HULU video bad enough............
It's not cash. It's Fox and NBC and whatever other studios participate in Hulu. The same thing happened with Boxee. Hulu wanted to be on it, but since Boxee uses your HD set to show the movies, the studios got antsy. They don't want to encroach on their very rich ad inserts on TV with the cheapo ads on the Web.
hulu's nice, but they really should invest some money in html5. Nobody is asking them to abandon flash, but if they could have a stripped down version of the site only accessible by ipad, I doubt the content will be easily stolen. I mean really, right now, the content can be stolen with screen recorders and an OK sound card. It's not worth the trouble though if the content is available to everyone for free.
I don't understand the people at hulu, I really don't. It used to work great in skyfire on my windows mobile phone, then for no reason they blocked the skyfire browser. I'm still seeing the same ads, so what gives?
Hulu's business model can work, they just need the content (which will draw in viewers of ads.)
You really don't get it to do you? It isn't Hulu. It's the content providers and advertisers. They don't want you to watch Hulu anywhere but on a computer. Period. It's that simple. They've said it over and over. Anything else and they feel it could compromise their other revenue streams.
Quote:
Originally Posted by awmawm
Stating that only Flash can achieve their needs is hardly true.
At this point HTML5 is not capable of delivering the level of detail that they want about users for advertising purposes. Flash can do it, HTML5 cannot. This isn't about just displaying video.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp
You are one bitter hater. Hulu cannot NOT support the iPhone and the iPad..
Yes, they can. The same way they don't support ANYTHING beyond personal computers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the cool gut
iTunes doesn't crash every 10 minutes either.
Try using it (or any Apple software) on Windows. Talk about half assed coding...
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell
They don't have to use HTML5 video to stream to the iPhone or iPad. They only need to stream raw H.264 with no wrapper and QuickTime will play it with no problem.
And they would get all the information that they are contractually bound to deliver to content providers for advertising purposes... where?
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishstick_kitty
I definitely don't understand all that...don't care really I understand the need to insert commercials, etc, but all that other stuff you mentioned just sounds evil.
All that other stuff makes the advertising that much more valuable because it can be more accurately targeted. More value = more $$$ which makes sites like Hulu possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475
That makes sense. Hulu will eventually move to HTML5 some over the next few years as the implementation becomes more mature in browsers. I expect most sites will.
Unless something changes, HTML5 does not allow for code to run in browsers, which is what is needed to gather the level of information that Flash can for advertisers. As a result, it can't deliver what Hulu needs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BUSHMAN4
I'm sure HULU can easily be pursuaded to adopt HTML5 with a little cash infussion from APPLE. And if Apple wants HULU video bad enough............
You do realize that Apple sees Hulu as a competitor to iTunes, right?
I'm curious... does everyone realize that HTML5 isn't a complete standard yet? There seems to be this overt assumption that H.264 will be the video standard that HTML5 uses, when in reality it probably won't be due to licensing costs. Would everyone here be so gung ho about HTML5 if it integrated Ogg Theora or the Google VP8 codec (if they open source it) instead of H.264?
Comments
You don't seem to understand exactly how specific the information that they can gather from a flash based player is. It isn't simply that you watched the video and clicked on an ad; it's how long you watched, where you skipped around to, where you started, where you ended, what resolution you watched it at, what volume you used, whether or not you used closed captioning, and most importantly, whether or not you clicked on the embedded ad link (and at what point).
When I was at Macworld back when flash video was first taking off, I saw a demo of all the information that can be gathered from it and what a boon it would be for advertisers. That all has to be done within the player, and HTML5 simply doesn't have that functionality. Or, you know, a definitive codec.
I definitely don't understand all that...don't care really
If I'm going to pay anything more, I will pay iTunes for missing episodes. Hulu can go @#$! itself.
Hulu has no more purpose for me if they want to become a utility.
I have an idea for a *new* video distribution company. It would allow you to download, not stream, the content using a proprietary DRM and player. The downside is that you need a new player, the upside is that free content could be taken with you anywhere and viewed offline. What I have in mind is the video being broken down into sections and tailored commercials put in to fit the content and viewer's demographic data. It would be exploding, like iTunes movie rentals so you have x-many days to watch it and x-many hours to complete it, and you couldn't FF through ads.
It will be in itunes soon enough.
Adobe really need to enable the export of HTML5 from the Flash IDE. If they don't come up with a solid product some time in the next year or two someone else will.
That makes sense. Hulu will eventually move to HTML5 some over the next few years as the implementation becomes more mature in browsers. I expect most sites will.
Adobe really need to enable the export of HTML5 from the Flash IDE. If they don't come up with a solid product some time in the next year or two someone else will.
CS5 does this already?
CS5 does this already?
No. But HTML5 doesn't really address the need that Flash addresses. HTML5 takes brilliant care of things like video presentation, and even a wide range of interactive content, but some of the more advanced things people do with Flash would require a much greater degree of expertise in HTML5. It would be awesome to have a development environment for this sort of content in HTML5 but it doesn't exist yet, and Adobe, the company that would normally pioneer this sort of thing, probably won't touch it on this scale until they taste more of Flash's blood.
No. But HTML5 doesn't really address the need that Flash addresses. HTML5 takes brilliant care of things like video presentation, and even a wide range of interactive content, but some of the more advanced things people do with Flash would require a much greater degree of expertise in HTML5. It would be awesome to have a development environment for this sort of content in HTML5 but it doesn't exist yet, and Adobe, the company that would normally pioneer this sort of thing, probably won't touch it on this scale until they taste more of Flash's blood.
I haven't scoped it, or tested how well it works, but CS5 does apparently export to html5 http://www.9to5mac.com/Flash-html5-canvas-35409730
I'll check it out when I have time.
But adobe would be stupid not to build a serious development platform for html5. If they don't, someone else will. Perhaps we'll see it as an awesome plugin for eclipse.
...Adobe, the company that would normally pioneer this sort of thing, probably won't touch it on this scale until they taste more of Flash's blood.
That made me think of the Black Knight.
Hulu is supposed to give the content away for free?
Of course they are. That's why there's advertising.
Hulu as well as anyone else will move to where the money flows, whether it is Flash, HTML5 or anything else that ensures a significant user base. Stating that only Flash can achieve their needs is hardly true. All they have to do is adjust their model to the iPad and the advertising money is flowing from there, too. Millions of iPad users will be hard for Hulu to ignore...
True, but they can ignore it for now. Maybe when there's more like 50 million, then they can't ignore it.
Javascript can surely be used to do the counting for plays and views and the like. So the only real objection here is DRM.
I did do a test of an HTML5 video, and discovered that it can be copied. The Quicktime X player that comes up in the browser doesn't allow copying, but find the right url, paste it in the desktop player, and there's your copy.
After all that tumult over mp3s, does the MPAA and the studios want all this over again? Apparently so.
Apple has 60% of the mobile web.
You missed a word out, I think that should read...
Apple has 60% of the mobile web advertising
I'm sure HULU can easily be pursuaded to adopt HTML5 with a little cash infussion from APPLE. And if Apple wants HULU video bad enough............
It's not cash. It's Fox and NBC and whatever other studios participate in Hulu. The same thing happened with Boxee. Hulu wanted to be on it, but since Boxee uses your HD set to show the movies, the studios got antsy. They don't want to encroach on their very rich ad inserts on TV with the cheapo ads on the Web.
That made me think of the Black Knight.
Shouldn't that have read a 'Flash' wound?
Shouldn't that have read a 'Flash' wound?
Updated per your advice.
Whatever. Hulu has no future.
I hope that's not true. If you like to watch old tv shows, Hulu is a lot cheaper than buying tv on DVD.
hulu's nice, but they really should invest some money in html5. Nobody is asking them to abandon flash, but if they could have a stripped down version of the site only accessible by ipad, I doubt the content will be easily stolen. I mean really, right now, the content can be stolen with screen recorders and an OK sound card. It's not worth the trouble though if the content is available to everyone for free.
I don't understand the people at hulu, I really don't. It used to work great in skyfire on my windows mobile phone, then for no reason they blocked the skyfire browser. I'm still seeing the same ads, so what gives?
Hulu's business model can work, they just need the content (which will draw in viewers of ads.)
You really don't get it to do you? It isn't Hulu. It's the content providers and advertisers. They don't want you to watch Hulu anywhere but on a computer. Period. It's that simple. They've said it over and over. Anything else and they feel it could compromise their other revenue streams.
Stating that only Flash can achieve their needs is hardly true.
At this point HTML5 is not capable of delivering the level of detail that they want about users for advertising purposes. Flash can do it, HTML5 cannot. This isn't about just displaying video.
You are one bitter hater. Hulu cannot NOT support the iPhone and the iPad..
Yes, they can. The same way they don't support ANYTHING beyond personal computers.
iTunes doesn't crash every 10 minutes either.
Try using it (or any Apple software) on Windows. Talk about half assed coding...
They don't have to use HTML5 video to stream to the iPhone or iPad. They only need to stream raw H.264 with no wrapper and QuickTime will play it with no problem.
And they would get all the information that they are contractually bound to deliver to content providers for advertising purposes... where?
I definitely don't understand all that...don't care really
All that other stuff makes the advertising that much more valuable because it can be more accurately targeted. More value = more $$$ which makes sites like Hulu possible.
That makes sense. Hulu will eventually move to HTML5 some over the next few years as the implementation becomes more mature in browsers. I expect most sites will.
Unless something changes, HTML5 does not allow for code to run in browsers, which is what is needed to gather the level of information that Flash can for advertisers. As a result, it can't deliver what Hulu needs.
I'm sure HULU can easily be pursuaded to adopt HTML5 with a little cash infussion from APPLE. And if Apple wants HULU video bad enough............
You do realize that Apple sees Hulu as a competitor to iTunes, right?