I can't believe they raised the price on the thing. Spec wise I don't feel it's justified. I have 2 Mac mini's an iPhone and a pile of Apple stock. I live in reality though, I'm not a fanboi. I'm not happy to see the Core 2 Duo still in there and why in heck did they put the SD slot in the back? The back is for stuff that gets plugged in once and stays that way. The slot should be in the front where it can be easily used.
Where in the specs do you factor in the new case and power supply? PC builders can pay anywhere between $20 and $800 on a case, without changing the specs of the computer at all.
It's not hard to understand that there is cost and value associated with the smaller machined aluminum case and the integrated power supply. Someone living in reality shouldn't expect such things for free. Furthermore, using an i5 would require a discrete graphics card or crappy intel integrated graphics. The SD card and power switch are on the back for aesthetic reasons, obviously. There is a tradeoff between ease of access and aesthetics (see the Dell Zino HD for the other extreme). You don't have to agree with the decisions Apple has made, nor do you have to purchase a mac that doesn't meet your expectations, but you should at least try to understand them.
Nice design, looks like it would be a nice computer. (And yay for finally putting the power brick inside the machine) But for 700 dollars, definitely not worth it. What ever happened to our 500 dollar Mac Mini? I guess the current mini's have been selling like hot cakes.
And does the HDMI port mean they were listening to the whole "Mac Mini is an awesome HTPC"? If that were the case, then it should have gone back down to 500 dollars (and possibly added a BR drive... though I can somewhat excuse that)
I wonder if this means there is an aTV refresh in the wings?
"I can tell you as one of the largest sellers of content on the internet to date - price it aggressively and go for volume," Jobs told the audience Wednesday at the D8 Conference...
Indeed, Jobs comments weren't about devices. But it's a MBP13" that's not only missing the screen, but $100 worth of RAM, as well. And a 10 hour battery. And a keyboard. And a mouse/touchpad.
Get real. I'm a raving fanboy myself, and quite an apologist. But this price is absurd.
another quote I liked.
Quote:
Putting Apple's price in perspective:
Let's see how absurdly expensive this latest Mini really is:
Properly outfitted it's $1,984.00.
Before tax.
That's what it costs when you add...
2gigs of RAM to get it up to merely 4gb (add $100.)
24" monitor ($899)
Apple remote (you do want this to be for a HTPC, right?) ($19)
Apple mouse ($49)
Apple keyboard ($69)
AppleCare (let's face it, Macs are seemingly designed to be completely unserviceable by anyone other than your local Genius Bar, so if you have any kind of problem at all, you're gonna get hosed hard on the price. The local Apple store wanted $350 to replace a hard drive that I purchased at BestBuy for $52) ($149)
$1,984. For a 2.4ghz computer with 320gb.
Absolutely absurd.
Never has building a Hackintosh seemed so sensible.
Give me a break, I'd appreciate these worthless analysts more if they'd be HONEST.
This is pricing is an absolute joke. They finally make the Mac Mini a viable media center pc, and want at least $700 for it? WTF? So much for it being a "Switch to Mac" machine anymore. So much for it being worthwhile, at all.
Well, if you take my 3-month posting history, possibly. But take into account a few years of my postings...
That's so weird though, for me, to be considered anti-Apple. Wow. Seriously, it's weird. But, life is short, I gotta call it like I see it nowadays. My opinions are what they are.
Fair enough, maybe I am drifting to the "anti-Apple stance". I just hope my postings are still of value while letting me let off a bit of steam. As long as I don't write personal attacks, I think I'll be fine. This is, after all, Appleinsider.com NOT AppleLover.com
Perhaps I should have said "... based on some of your posting history."
Apple is not going to join in the "race to the bottom" and there are still plenty of sources for existing Mac mini's. The problem is many folks here want more features and power for less money - understandable, but perhaps unrealistic given Apple's track-record.
Apple's recent track record with MacBook and MacBook Pro was more features and power for less money and hardly resulted in a "race to the bottom." Can't speak about the iMac, never paid much attention to that product.
Nice machine, too expensive. I know people get a hard-on about this subject, but after all the fuss SJs made about content being low priced and "go for volume" and the aggressive iPad pricing, it's dissapointing this thing didn't follow suit. The specs are actually weak for the price, given ION 2's aggressive pricing and nice form-factor.
I have the late 2009 Mac Mini and use it as a media center, but it's a mess because none of the media apps can play iTunes videos bought from the iTunes store, and Front Row is tragically lacking in funcitonality (you have to exit to view web videos, or YouTube). In other words, it can't actually be used as a media center, it's a desktop computer connected to a TV.
It pains me to say this (get your sick-bags ready) but Windows 7 based machines make better media centers...
The cube comes to memory. Excellently crafted pice of hardware. Setting new standards in designing desktops
and shrinking them to a nice size - but at the cost of affordability.
To my mind the cube failed because of it's price. I know Apple is selling it's products by quality and design,
but I think the Mini could be in danger to get priced outside of a sensible price range.
And a 16% price raise to update some of the internals to state of the art seems a bit high.
go to best buy and the cheapest PC with a graphics card similar to the Mini's is $650 or so. yes it has more RAM and HD space, but the mini uses laptop parts that are more expensive. Add in bluetooth, wifi and the software and the price is comparable.
did a config on HP's website using the cheapest decent graphics card and once you add in the wifi/bluetooth and bump it to Win 7 Ultimate to get some of the same software functionality the price goes up to $900. only difference is that HP will have i Core CPU's and more HD/RAM due to them being desktop parts.
the only cheap PC's that cost $300 - $500 are those with Intel graphics
the cheapest PC with HDMI and a graphics card like the Mini's is a Dell for $775. still a draw when you factor in the software on the Mini. Believe it or not, Apple has to pay licensing fees for things like HDMI ports
and the Mini is Energy Star qualified which means a lower cost of ownership
Well, it is cheaper and better than the old "better" model and having a HDMI port is a big plus. Mini DP remains to be a failure and nobody else is adopting it. Apple should put Mini-HDMI ports into the portables, the Mini-DP to Dual-Link DVI adapter is not working properly with most machines, so HD resolution has to be sufficient anyhow.
Now, if they would invest at least a little bit of work into FrontRow, or simply make an OS X version of the Apple TV software, I would buy one of these to replace an Apple TV in a heartbeat. But I am not spending 800 EUR for a machine, if I then have to run a GUI disaster like Plex on it.
The server is more attractive than ever, unfortunately my Mini Server is only 4 months old... can't justify that.
I'm not going to comment on whether or not this is a fair price vs. Windows boxes (can't be bothered to look!), but I am a little disappointed the price on this thing has crept up.
I'd like to see Apple find a way to get Mac OS X into wider usage, and if that means having a cheaper machine (with lower specs than the new Mini if necessary), then I think that's worthwhile.
The reason for me wanting that is I suspect the more users of Mac OS X there are, the more software will get developed for it. I (and many others on this board) was delighted when I saw AutoCAD coming back to the Mac. Now I don't know for sure, but I have to assume they had decided there was now enough critical mass out there in Mac land to make developing the software worth their while. I wonder how many more Windows only applications we might see if there were even more people using the Mac?
What I will say for this Mini is, getting all that and a power supply into a box that small is some pretty neat engineering.
go to best buy and the cheapest PC with a graphics card similar to the Mini's is $650 or so. yes it has more RAM and HD space, but the mini uses laptop parts that are more expensive. Add in bluetooth, wifi and the software and the price is comparable.
did a config on HP's website using the cheapest decent graphics card and once you add in the wifi/bluetooth and bump it to Win 7 Ultimate to get some of the same software functionality the price goes up to $900. only difference is that HP will have i Core CPU's and more HD/RAM due to them being desktop parts.
the only cheap PC's that cost $300 - $500 are those with Intel graphics
the cheapest PC with HDMI and a graphics card like the Mini's is a Dell for $775. still a draw when you factor in the software on the Mini. Believe it or not, Apple has to pay licensing fees for things like HDMI ports
and the Mini is Energy Star qualified which means a lower cost of ownership
I think when people look at the price, if they are not using it at a media center then they add on the fact they need to add a monitor, mouse and keyboard and the device is not mobile.
With the devices you are comparing the difference is they are mobile and there is nothing additional to buy.
Also Apple needs to stop with the standard 2GB of RAM in both the Mini and the Macbook. By todays standards using a 64bit OS, 4GB should be standard for any device.
i sit squarely in the "if it had blu-ray i would have already bought it" category, even though i know that Mac's will NEVER have blu-ray.
Steve-O wants you to rent & buy your movies from iTunes - that's the MAIN reason blu-ray isn't coming to mac. when netflix can stream 1080p to a Mini [and my U-verse can handle it - for $10 more a month] i will stop saying "where's blu ray". we're NOT there yet. in the meantime i'm watching DVD's on my 55" 1080p TV.
...and as for price, i would be ok with the $100 bump if a mouse and keyboard were included. [what's apple's cost to produce a mouse and keyboard, like 20 bucks?]
having an IR port so I can use the thing for a universal remote that doesn't suck (along with everything else it does). It's meant to be the center of my media universe so it should act as such.
Comments
and shrinking them to a nice size - but at the cost of affordability.
To my mind the cube failed because of it's price. I know Apple is selling it's products by quality and design,
but I think the Mini could be in danger to get priced outside of a sensible price range.
And a 16% price raise to update some of the internals to state of the art seems a bit high.
Where in the specs do you factor in the new case and power supply? PC builders can pay anywhere between $20 and $800 on a case, without changing the specs of the computer at all.
It's not hard to understand that there is cost and value associated with the smaller machined aluminum case and the integrated power supply. Someone living in reality shouldn't expect such things for free. Furthermore, using an i5 would require a discrete graphics card or crappy intel integrated graphics. The SD card and power switch are on the back for aesthetic reasons, obviously. There is a tradeoff between ease of access and aesthetics (see the Dell Zino HD for the other extreme). You don't have to agree with the decisions Apple has made, nor do you have to purchase a mac that doesn't meet your expectations, but you should at least try to understand them.
The cube comes to memory. Excellently crafted pice of hardware. Setting new standards in designing desktops
and shrinking them to a nice size - but at the cost of affordability.
To my mind the cube failed because of it's price. I know Apple is selling it's products by quality and design,
but I think the Mini could be in danger to get priced outside of a sensible price range.
And a 16% price raise to update some of the internals to state of the art seems a bit high.
As pointed out earlier in this thread, the new mini's specs compare favorably to a similarly priced Dell.
The cube comes to memory. Excellently crafted pice of hardware. Setting new standards in designing desktops
and shrinking them to a nice size - but at the cost of affordability.
To my mind the cube failed because of it's price. I know Apple is selling it's products by quality and design,
but I think the Mini could be in danger to get priced outside of a sensible price range.
And a 16% price raise to update some of the internals to state of the art seems a bit high.
Since Walmart is now an Apple reseller - they will be offering this handsome piece of kit for 164USD less than retail price!
Besides Jony Ive has to be able to upgrade from brandy to fine 30yo cognac somehow...
I see you've been at Ars.
I was going to say the same thing. I'm Hagen on arstechnica and have been posting in that same thread.
some salient quotes from the web.
Hadn't thought about it before, but yeah, the SD card slot being located on the back side is utterly ridiculous.
And does the HDMI port mean they were listening to the whole "Mac Mini is an awesome HTPC"? If that were the case, then it should have gone back down to 500 dollars (and possibly added a BR drive... though I can somewhat excuse that)
I wonder if this means there is an aTV refresh in the wings?
"I can tell you as one of the largest sellers of content on the internet to date - price it aggressively and go for volume," Jobs told the audience Wednesday at the D8 Conference...
Indeed, Jobs comments weren't about devices. But it's a MBP13" that's not only missing the screen, but $100 worth of RAM, as well. And a 10 hour battery. And a keyboard. And a mouse/touchpad.
Get real. I'm a raving fanboy myself, and quite an apologist. But this price is absurd.
another quote I liked.
Putting Apple's price in perspective:
Let's see how absurdly expensive this latest Mini really is:
Properly outfitted it's $1,984.00.
Before tax.
That's what it costs when you add...
2gigs of RAM to get it up to merely 4gb (add $100.)
24" monitor ($899)
Apple remote (you do want this to be for a HTPC, right?) ($19)
Apple mouse ($49)
Apple keyboard ($69)
AppleCare (let's face it, Macs are seemingly designed to be completely unserviceable by anyone other than your local Genius Bar, so if you have any kind of problem at all, you're gonna get hosed hard on the price. The local Apple store wanted $350 to replace a hard drive that I purchased at BestBuy for $52) ($149)
$1,984. For a 2.4ghz computer with 320gb.
Absolutely absurd.
Never has building a Hackintosh seemed so sensible.
Bingo.
Give me a break, I'd appreciate these worthless analysts more if they'd be HONEST.
This is pricing is an absolute joke. They finally make the Mac Mini a viable media center pc, and want at least $700 for it? WTF? So much for it being a "Switch to Mac" machine anymore. So much for it being worthwhile, at all.
Well, if you take my 3-month posting history, possibly. But take into account a few years of my postings...
That's so weird though, for me, to be considered anti-Apple. Wow. Seriously, it's weird. But, life is short, I gotta call it like I see it nowadays. My opinions are what they are.
Fair enough, maybe I am drifting to the "anti-Apple stance". I just hope my postings are still of value while letting me let off a bit of steam. As long as I don't write personal attacks, I think I'll be fine. This is, after all, Appleinsider.com NOT AppleLover.com
Perhaps I should have said "... based on some of your posting history."
Apple is not going to join in the "race to the bottom" and there are still plenty of sources for existing Mac mini's. The problem is many folks here want more features and power for less money - understandable, but perhaps unrealistic given Apple's track-record.
Apple's recent track record with MacBook and MacBook Pro was more features and power for less money and hardly resulted in a "race to the bottom." Can't speak about the iMac, never paid much attention to that product.
I have the late 2009 Mac Mini and use it as a media center, but it's a mess because none of the media apps can play iTunes videos bought from the iTunes store, and Front Row is tragically lacking in funcitonality (you have to exit to view web videos, or YouTube). In other words, it can't actually be used as a media center, it's a desktop computer connected to a TV.
It pains me to say this (get your sick-bags ready) but Windows 7 based machines make better media centers...
Perhaps I should have said "... based on some of your posting history."
No worries. You made me reflect for a while, actually.
The cube comes to memory. Excellently crafted pice of hardware. Setting new standards in designing desktops
and shrinking them to a nice size - but at the cost of affordability.
To my mind the cube failed because of it's price. I know Apple is selling it's products by quality and design,
but I think the Mini could be in danger to get priced outside of a sensible price range.
And a 16% price raise to update some of the internals to state of the art seems a bit high.
go to best buy and the cheapest PC with a graphics card similar to the Mini's is $650 or so. yes it has more RAM and HD space, but the mini uses laptop parts that are more expensive. Add in bluetooth, wifi and the software and the price is comparable.
did a config on HP's website using the cheapest decent graphics card and once you add in the wifi/bluetooth and bump it to Win 7 Ultimate to get some of the same software functionality the price goes up to $900. only difference is that HP will have i Core CPU's and more HD/RAM due to them being desktop parts.
the only cheap PC's that cost $300 - $500 are those with Intel graphics
the cheapest PC with HDMI and a graphics card like the Mini's is a Dell for $775. still a draw when you factor in the software on the Mini. Believe it or not, Apple has to pay licensing fees for things like HDMI ports
and the Mini is Energy Star qualified which means a lower cost of ownership
Now, if they would invest at least a little bit of work into FrontRow, or simply make an OS X version of the Apple TV software, I would buy one of these to replace an Apple TV in a heartbeat. But I am not spending 800 EUR for a machine, if I then have to run a GUI disaster like Plex on it.
The server is more attractive than ever, unfortunately my Mini Server is only 4 months old... can't justify that.
I'd like to see Apple find a way to get Mac OS X into wider usage, and if that means having a cheaper machine (with lower specs than the new Mini if necessary), then I think that's worthwhile.
The reason for me wanting that is I suspect the more users of Mac OS X there are, the more software will get developed for it. I (and many others on this board) was delighted when I saw AutoCAD coming back to the Mac. Now I don't know for sure, but I have to assume they had decided there was now enough critical mass out there in Mac land to make developing the software worth their while. I wonder how many more Windows only applications we might see if there were even more people using the Mac?
What I will say for this Mini is, getting all that and a power supply into a box that small is some pretty neat engineering.
go to best buy and the cheapest PC with a graphics card similar to the Mini's is $650 or so. yes it has more RAM and HD space, but the mini uses laptop parts that are more expensive. Add in bluetooth, wifi and the software and the price is comparable.
did a config on HP's website using the cheapest decent graphics card and once you add in the wifi/bluetooth and bump it to Win 7 Ultimate to get some of the same software functionality the price goes up to $900. only difference is that HP will have i Core CPU's and more HD/RAM due to them being desktop parts.
the only cheap PC's that cost $300 - $500 are those with Intel graphics
the cheapest PC with HDMI and a graphics card like the Mini's is a Dell for $775. still a draw when you factor in the software on the Mini. Believe it or not, Apple has to pay licensing fees for things like HDMI ports
and the Mini is Energy Star qualified which means a lower cost of ownership
I think when people look at the price, if they are not using it at a media center then they add on the fact they need to add a monitor, mouse and keyboard and the device is not mobile.
With the devices you are comparing the difference is they are mobile and there is nothing additional to buy.
Also Apple needs to stop with the standard 2GB of RAM in both the Mini and the Macbook. By todays standards using a 64bit OS, 4GB should be standard for any device.
Steve-O wants you to rent & buy your movies from iTunes - that's the MAIN reason blu-ray isn't coming to mac. when netflix can stream 1080p to a Mini [and my U-verse can handle it - for $10 more a month] i will stop saying "where's blu ray". we're NOT there yet. in the meantime i'm watching DVD's on my 55" 1080p TV.
...and as for price, i would be ok with the $100 bump if a mouse and keyboard were included. [what's apple's cost to produce a mouse and keyboard, like 20 bucks?]
the CPU is not fast enough for HTPC. i don't need to browse the web on my TV, i need to be able to do some hard core trans coding......
I'm using an older model (2.0 Ghz / 9400M ) and playing 1080P without issue. I think you are overestimating the requirements for an HTPC.
I did upgrade the stock memory to 4 GB for about $80 bucks though.
If that is failure, what would be success?
having an IR port so I can use the thing for a universal remote that doesn't suck (along with everything else it does). It's meant to be the center of my media universe so it should act as such.