Apple's iPad "running far ahead" in enterprise adoption

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  • Reply 41 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    Eh, That is called an enterprise app for internal use and not even the issue. Those are easy.



    Now, take a app store app and deploy it to thousands of devices without each user having to have an iTunes account.



    when do you deploy apps to your users not connected with an internal account?
  • Reply 42 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    Yes you can, however you are still at the users mercy to agree to install the profile. Again that may not be an issue for some, but some companies like to know that a configuration is set regardless of whether the users desires to follow instructions or not. We all know users always do what they are told and follow instructions right



    One of the projects I was involved in was for about xxxxx (We'll just say thousands) of iPads and one of the requirements was that the device worked out of the box for the users so we could not leave it up to the user to apply the configuration. The config including all apps, settings backgrounds and activation had to already be completed. All of this with ZERO additional infrastructure such as a MDM.



    So iOS will still let the user use a device with an expired profile?



    Thanks for sharing your experience.
  • Reply 43 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by veblen View Post


    So iOS will still let the user use a device with an expired profile?



    Thanks for sharing your experience.



    Provisioning or configuration profiles? Provisioning profiles notify the users that it will expire. The app will continue to function until it expires. We have had situations were we had to turn the date back on the device because a new profile could not be delivered quickly enough. Typically a new provisioning file (enterprise apps) would provided to the user to install (sometimes the existing one has to be removed first). This is another thing that doesn't go well with enterprise deployments since you are once gain depending on the user to perform the steps. It is my belief that many of the app updates are actually the developer just releasing the app with a later expire date and maybe some minor bug fixes.



    To my knowledge configuration profiles do not expire. They can however be configured to allow removal.
  • Reply 44 of 107
    hirohiro Posts: 2,663member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jivemaster View Post


    It's a shame the practicality isn't there as far as openness is concerned. I use my ipad to read the news and make the odd note here and there, but anything further than remote access apps, it's too locked down to be overly useful. Once competing tablets are released, the ecosystem as a whole will push forward and hopefully the ipad will get more useful.



    The whole enterprise adoption thing is really because there is nothing else in the market at the moment. With practically only one choice in tablets available, its obvious the ipad would be on top. Once honeycomb hits it's game on.



    You obviously haven't seen the power of the cloud integration with an app like EverNote. I have no connection or position in them, I only found that when used on the iPad it utterly changed how I work when away from my desk on walkabouts that don't rate the full power of the laptop -- which is almost all of them.



    You don't need the filesystem the way you think you do. It'a a walkabout notebook (Paper/DayTimer) replacement with near effortless synchronization when using a cloud-enabled app. Given the hours I used to spend re-copying paper based notes and calendar data, the electronic version has already paid for itself in elimination of productivity sinks.
  • Reply 45 of 107
    hirohiro Posts: 2,663member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kingsmuse View Post


    The iPads limitations for corporate/enterprise use are fairly large.

    To improve this situation the iPad would have to have...



    A central accessible file system.

    Simple common printing capabilities.

    The ability to stand alone as a computing device without the need to sync with a PC.

    Microsoft developing apps for it`s corporate software packages available through the app store.

    USB compatibility.



    There are work arounds for everything I`ve mentioned above but Apple should develop some dedicated solutions to these limitations if they want to take off on the corporate environment as quickly as they have in the public area.



    By the way, I`m not a Fandroid.

    More of a Mac cultist.







    Actually the central file system as a cloud service with enterprise hosted apps is more secure. Distributed physical files on mobile systems are a higher security risk by definition.



    Yes, printing is necessary. Fiery just went a long way to fixing that in a lot of enterprises, at no extra charge, just a firmware update.



    Stand alone is not necessary, actually forced synchronization affords security opportunities from an enterprise standpoint. Especially when the forced synchronization points are IT-curated as well.



    MS Apps, maybe maybe not. It will depend on how comfortable folks are with using non-MS software as an alternative. I don't have any insurmountable problems with Keynote, but fully recognize this aspect has more social dependence than technological.



    USB is a critical security vulnerability, its lack is actually a serious security plus. You have no idea how scary USB is in todays world. It is it's own little infect-able microprocessor on the bus.
  • Reply 46 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by veblen View Post


    Here's a link to the Enterprise Deployment Guide



    http://manuals.info.apple.com/en_US/...ment_Guide.pdf



    thanks for the link. this is good stuff.
  • Reply 47 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by storneo View Post


    There are many Android tablets on the market!



    There are!?
  • Reply 48 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Boogerman2000 View Post


    The real competitors are just beginning to arrive ie: Xoom, Touchpad, etc.



    They are!?



    (Wake me up when they do; a press conference does not a market make).
  • Reply 49 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    Yes you can, however you are still at the users mercy to agree to install the profile. Again that may not be an issue for some, but some companies like to know that a configuration is set regardless of whether the users desires to follow instructions or not. We all know users always do what they are told and follow instructions right



    One of the projects I was involved in was for about xxxxx (We'll just say thousands) of iPads and one of the requirements was that the device worked out of the box for the users so we could not leave it up to the user to apply the configuration. The config including all apps, settings backgrounds and activation had to already be completed. All of this with ZERO additional infrastructure such as a MDM.



    Apple has an existing capability that could rather easily be enhanced.



    The iPhone and iPad can be remote locked and/or remote wiped.



    This feature could be expanded to include:

    -- expiring provisioning profiles (already implemented for developers)

    -- remote lock of device except access to remote provisioning site

    -- OTA remote provisioning

    -- OTA provisioning verification

    -- OTS remote unlock
  • Reply 50 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    They are!?



    (Wake me up when they do; a press conference does not a market make).



    Im crying on the inside for you Anant. You and Mel, both.... Oy vey!
  • Reply 51 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    I hear you, but so far the MDM's such as MobileIron just allow you to basically say these apps are approved. Then there is Boxtone which doesn't meet our needs at all. So we have talked to numerous developers. They are not facilitating the deployment of the non enterprise apps to the devices in an automated manner. I've had numerous calls with Apple and vendors. Simply put they can't, anything done today to try to distribute app store apps would be a violation of Apples agreements. What MDM's are great for TODAY is managing the settings.



    Help me understand what you are asking for.



    1) How many 3rd-party apps are we talking about: tens, hundreds, thousands, all.



    2) if you could acquire the rights to distribute these apps, how would you distribute them:

    --- a) Push to each device

    --- b) Pull to each device



    3) How will you handle update notifications and the actual updates?

    -- a) data/file changes introduced by updates



    4) How will you verify that each device has the correct:

    -- a) version of iOS

    -- b) version of enterprise apps

    -- c) version 3rd-party apps

    -- d) version of device/system profile settings and provisions.



    5) What will you do when any or all conditions aren't met?





    6) How do you currently handle the above issues for any existing mobile device, regardless of manufacturer or or device type (laptop, smart phone tablet, etc.)





    7) Will the inability of resolving any or all of the above issues prevent you from deploying an iPad solution?

    -- a) Why

    -- b) why not
  • Reply 52 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    One of the projects I was involved in was for about xxxxx (We'll just say thousands) of iPads and one of the requirements was that the device worked out of the box for the users so we could not leave it up to the user to apply the configuration. The config including all apps, settings backgrounds and activation had to already be completed. All of this with ZERO additional infrastructure such as a MDM.



    With any project it's easy to fall into the trap of turning "nice to have" into "must have" and ending up with impossible to achieve goals. This sounds a lot like that situation - all ipads must magically work in our corporation with no effort expended on our part.



    Sure, out of the box, zero configuration and zero infrastructure would be nice but companies managed for years with much more complex technology deployment procedures and they will manage just fine with the iPad.
  • Reply 53 of 107
    veblenveblen Posts: 201member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post


    Provisioning or configuration profiles? Provisioning profiles notify the users that it will expire. The app will continue to function until it expires. We have had situations were we had to turn the date back on the device because a new profile could not be delivered quickly enough. Typically a new provisioning file (enterprise apps) would provided to the user to install (sometimes the existing one has to be removed first). This is another thing that doesn't go well with enterprise deployments since you are once gain depending on the user to perform the steps. It is my belief that many of the app updates are actually the developer just releasing the app with a later expire date and maybe some minor bug fixes.



    To my knowledge configuration profiles do not expire. They can however be configured to allow removal.





    Configuration profile. It looks like you can setup your SCEP certificate to expire. When it does it forces the user to update with your Profile Server. I'm thinking that would be a way for me to force my users to get my Configuration profile changes at regular intervals, even if they disregard my emails or sms messages.



    "Similarly, when a certificate installed using SCEP expires or is otherwise invalidated, the device asks the user to update the profile. When the user authorizes the request, the device repeats the above process to obtain a new certificate and profile." page 26 of the Enterprise Deployment Guide



    "Configuration profile updates are not pushed to users automatically. If you need to make other profile updates without waiting for the profiles to expire, you must distribute them manually or require users to re-enroll. " - http://developer.apple.com/library/i...009505-CH3-SW1



    I think I'm going to lobby for my organization to purchase an MDM solution when we do our iPad rollout. Have you tried out any MDM solutions?
  • Reply 54 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by felipur View Post


    With any project it's easy to fall into the trap of turning "nice to have" into "must have" and ending up with impossible to achieve goals. This sounds a lot like that situation - all ipads must magically work in our corporation with no effort expended on our part.



    Sure, out of the box, zero configuration and zero infrastructure would be nice but companies managed for years with much more complex technology deployment procedures and they will manage just fine with the iPad.





    That is very well said!



    Maybe you've defined a new IT term: "creeping administratibility"





    Sometimes, ya' just gotta' say what you have is is good enough, and go with it -- the benefits outweigh the comfort of staying with the status quo.



    In my 16 + years with IBM, I was involved in hundreds of installations and conversions,



    At some point in the process, you have made all the plans, covered all the bases, backed up all the data, provided for contingincies, run production parallels, etc.



    You know that something unantiioipated will happen and some things will go wrong...



    But, then comes the time to throw the switch -- so you can move forward.





    It's called progress!
  • Reply 55 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jivemaster View Post


    It's a shame the practicality isn't there as far as openness is concerned. I use my ipad to read the news and make the odd note here and there, but anything further than remote access apps, it's too locked down to be overly useful. Once competing tablets are released, the ecosystem as a whole will push forward and hopefully the ipad will get more useful.



    The whole enterprise adoption thing is really because there is nothing else in the market at the moment. With practically only one choice in tablets available, its obvious the ipad would be on top. Once honeycomb hits it's game on.



    Android sucks in enterprise environment period. Our IT department tried the original Motorola Droid to outift our field managers but when complaints about the general usability of the device poured in the company simply put a halt on further purchase and upgrade. Now that the iPhone is on Verizon, our IT department will be switching to iPhone. And once iPad 2 comes out, we don't even need to think twice.
  • Reply 56 of 107
    Reality: Budgets. Approvals, Projects and lead time



    I am retired now. so am not up to speed on how things are done currently





    In my day, most enterprises had an annual budget process (submission, approval, implementation) that roughly coincided with a calendar year-- mostly:

    -- projects were conceived/bloomed in the Jan-Jun timeframe

    -- projects/budgets were submitted for approval in the Jul-Sep timeframe

    -- projects/budgets were approved in the Oct-Nov timeframe

    -- projects began implementation early in the next calendar year



    If this still holds, the 2011 enterprise projects and budgets are already in place.



    Unless some executives were willing to bet on the future, those projects use the iPad - with all its advantages and all its warts.



    It was the only thing available for planning and budgeting (the budget cycle) -- in reality, the iPad still is the only tablet available.



    So, I am thinking that regardless, of PlayBook/QNX, Xoom/HoneyComb, TouchPad/WebOS -- and any other products pending -- maybe to be released sometime, at some price, with some specs, and some potential SDK, some planned applications...



    Enterprise and IT already have the only tangible solution for 2011 -- the iPad.



    Say, Motorola releases the Xoom for $500 and the Honeycomb SDK is ready to go -- both by March 1.



    Or, the same for the Touchpad, or Playbook -- competitive hardware, OS and SDK by March 1, 2011.





    Will enterprise/IT put their current plans on hold, or switch to a different solution?





    Again. my experience in this tells me no -- but my experience is dated.





    Would some of you who are currently involved in enterprise/IT projects bring me up to speed on how the budget/project cycle works in today's world?



    TIA



    Dick
  • Reply 57 of 107
    One of the reasons that iPads are becoming the standard tablet in schools and other enterprise systems, is a very simple one- the ability to have the wifi work with the network proxy.



    As a teacher, I've seen a several people, including myself, with Android phones and tablets (I have an Android phone) who were a bit shocked to find out that they will not work in our school because we need to be able to set up the SSID with a proxy URL. Those with iPhones and iPads haven't had that problem. The spot for that entry is right in the wifi set up.



    For whatever reason, Google left that out of the basic Android OS. To get it, one has to root the device and either load a third party app or flash a new, third party ROM. Both of course, will more than likely void the warranty.



    When I moved from my Blackberry to an Android (T-Mobile's MyTouch 4g), I was incredibly disappointed to find this out. The network signal is weak at best, and the wifi is useless.



    When the iPad first came out, I was not terribly impressed. It was little more than a large iTouch. With the improvements in the OS (namely multitasking), the boatload of apps that have arrived designed with the iPad in mind, the product has improved dramatically. When it takes its next jump forward, in a couple of month with iPad2, I'll be online to buy one.
  • Reply 58 of 107
    z3r0z3r0 Posts: 229member
    All this talk about the enterprise considering that Apple pretty much killed their only true enterprise grade product.



    Xserve.



    Instead of Apple building an ecosystem around the Xserve to manage mobile devices thus promoting greater adoption of said devices and the Xserve for management, they run away.



    Apple needs to wake up and create, deliver, and promote enterprise solutions. Fo real this time.



    The oh its not selling excuse is called lack of real effort. Apple is lazy in regards to the enterprise. Imagine all the good the could do if the put the same effort as they put in creating and marketing their consumer products into the enterprise sector.



    Apple does disappoint in this area.
  • Reply 59 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by z3r0 View Post


    All this talk about the enterprise considering that Apple pretty much killed their only true enterprise grade product.



    Xserve.



    Instead of Apple building an ecosystem around the Xserve to manage mobile devices thus promoting greater adoption of said devices and the Xserve for management, they run away.



    Using iPads and iPhones to drive adoption of xserves is far more likely to decrease iDevice sales than it is to increase xserve sales. Apple needs configuration and management tools that run on the hardware enterprises have. And it is moving that direction.



    Quote:

    Apple needs to wake up and create, deliver, and promote enterprise solutions. Fo real this time.



    The oh its not selling excuse is called lack of real effort. Apple is lazy in regards to the enterprise. Imagine all the good the could do if the put the same effort as they put in creating and marketing their consumer products into the enterprise sector.



    Apple does disappoint in this area.



    I don't think it's laziness, it's an unwillingness to become the kind of company that providing "enterprise solutions" requires becoming. Enterprise is not one market, it's thousands of tiny markets. To succeed in enterprise solutions requires huge amounts of customization flexibility and product variations. IBM is very successful in enterprise because they shifted from hardware to support, offering custom solutions, configurations, maintenance, etc. Every customer is a unique solution.



    Apple doesn't want to become IBM, it wants to focus on very large markets addressable by a small number of products.



    It's not laziness, it's staying as a focused company.
  • Reply 60 of 107
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by felipur View Post


    I don't think it's laziness, it's an unwillingness to become the kind of company that providing "enterprise solutions" requires becoming. Enterprise is not one market, it's thousands of tiny markets. To succeed in enterprise solutions requires huge amounts of customization flexibility and product variations. IBM is very successful in enterprise because they shifted from hardware to support, offering custom solutions, configurations, maintenance, etc. Every customer is a unique solution.



    Apple doesn't want to become IBM, it wants to focus on very large markets addressable by a small number of products.



    It's not laziness, it's staying as a focused company.



    And it's why Apple contracted with Unisys to provide this level of marketing and support.
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