iWeb still works in Lion, so there's no reason there to delay upgrading. Also, you can use iWeb to publish to your own host via FTP. It's true Apple won't be updating iWeb anymore, but iDVD has already gone through two iLife cycles without an update and it still works. As long as you don't need MobileMe and publish your site to a new host, you'll be able to use iWeb for at least another few years.
Thanks for the explanation, thefinite. Good to know!
I may be cynical but I think a big chunk of this is that they want to be able to show how fast Lion is taken up versus windows 7. Found an old graph from Q1-2010 and take up of 10.6 wasn't that impressive. They want the equivalent graph this time to be more impressive
It certainly makes it more appealing at WWDC because developers using the new APIs like the iCloud APIs would like to know that there are enough people out there to actually benefit from the effort and the install base vs competing systems helps too.
That graph shows pretty clearly that people just don't take the time to upgrade systems even if the upgrades are inexpensive and take a few minutes and the more full-featured operating systems become, the less need there is to upgrade anyway.
I voted last week - bought my new iMac so I didn't have to put out 50% of its cost replacing hardware and software which requires Rosetta. For just $30 I will be able to install Lion on a second volume, after the first couple of updates make it stable. Just as well Apple had recently refreshed the iMac.
Why wouldn't it? Hold the option key upon startup and OSX shows you all available boot devices. Unless you have reason to believe that Lion will specifically prohibit this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bregalad
If you buy an early 2011 MBP or iMac you may or may not be able to boot it using your old Snow Leopard install. It's possible that you'll have to track down the special Snow Leopard DVD for that particular model in order to get it to work.
If you buy a mid 2011 Mac of any kind it will ONLY boot Lion.
iOS 5 is not delayed. It's Apple's schedule, not yours.
As a developer, I've used Lion. You want to use it. It's an improvement over snow leopard.
To AI, iCloud is slated for the fall when iOS 5 is released. While I'm sure Apple wants the platform ready, people purchasing Macs with Lion next month are not going to have access to iCloud yet.
But yes, a hardware refresh shipping with the new software is better than trying to get everyone to pay $30 a month or two after they bought the computer. Lion is a big enough new experience that they want people upgraded and that's a good thing.
To Mr. Rosetta, if your HP printer never had its drivers updated, shame on HP, not Apple.
If running legacy and outdated software is very important or vital to somebody, then they can simply keep their old hardware just in case. Do what I do. I still have older machines running OS 9 if I absolutely need to use some old software, which is quite rare in my case at least.
I don't know if Quicken is "outdated software". It runs on my Mac today. I hate them for not updating their app but unfortunately I have years of Quicken data. I might have to look into migrating my Quicken data to Windows version of Quicken just in case anything happens to my Mac.
Well, I would love to "step into the new century", but that can be a challenge when you are on a budget. I would love to buy the latest and greatest of everything, but have to pace my self and my wallet.
You've had 5 years to pace yourself and your wallet. What do you use that is so good that new software isnt free or much better at a reasonable price?
That graph shows pretty clearly that people just don't take the time to upgrade systems even if the upgrades are inexpensive and take a few minutes and the more full-featured operating systems become, the less need there is to upgrade anyway.
In many ways, this is a good thing. It just means the OS along with the apps we have running on our Macs is working great.
Touch is where it's at. I hardly ever use a mouse anymore and I probably won't ever buy one again for as long as I live. The Magic Trackpad is great, and I would recommend that everybody gets one.
I second this, except for when my fingers stick to the pad and I wish I had a mouse. Needs to be a bit more silky smooth.
Instead, the Mac maker is said to be locked on waiting till it can image the new notebooks with a Gold Master build of Lion so that buyers are afforded the latest and greatest Apple experience. <snip>
The same methodology is believed to be in place for Thunderbolt-equipped versions of the Mac mini and LED Cinema Display
So, the LED cinema Display is being held back so that it can ship with Lion?
The only possible reason would be touch, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchelljd
Honestly, adding touchscreen capability to the entire laptop product line ought to be possible and an easy manufacturing upgrade for Apple to accomplish. They could do it in the same form factor without major changes.
MacBook Airs make sense as the first laptop to add touch. Touch makes a lot of sense as an addition (not replacement) to the mouse or trackpad - once you use the iPad and iPhone everywhere you can find yourself reaching for the screen on the laptop occasionally.
But it's not enough of a benefit yet. I don't think Apple will do this throughout their products until the extra cost of touch is minimal.
iCloud is slated for the fall when iOS 5 is released. While I'm sure Apple wants the platform ready, people purchasing Macs with Lion next month are not going to have access to iCloud yet.
I'm pretty sure that for Lion and iCloud they said July. iOS 5 was fall.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
In addition to seamlessly syncing data, contacts and calendars across multiple devices -- including Macs and PCs -- Apple's iCloud also promises to simplify users' lives, making it easy to access photos, videos and personal files without the need to manually transfer or back up. Apple has boasted that its offering will be more full-featured than its rivals, namely Google and Amazon, as well as third-party services like Dropbox.
Where did iCloud promise access to videos or personal files? I get that iDisk can store your documents folder, and I get that individual apps can now store their data on the cloud instead of on your computer - but that's not quite the same is it?
1- New Mac Pro's with better thunderbolt accessories
2- New Apple HD Monitor with Built in HD cam + which is touch screen capable
3- New Mac-Mini with Thunderbolt
4- Macbook with touchscreen and combo Hard drive SSD drive.
5- Macbook Air with touchscreen and combo Hard drive SSD drive.
6- Macbook Pro with touchscreen?
Honestly, adding touchscreen capability to the entire laptop product line ought to be possible and an easy manufacturing upgrade for Apple to accomplish. They could do it in the same form factor without major changes.
The only upgrade as an option i would like is Blu-Ray Recording, even for storage. At this point Apple is ridiculous by not offering it in their desktop line. BD is widely adopted, and a great format for sharing movies on in HD.
not everyone wants to be connected to internet and stream everything.
Where have you been? Touch screens are not an option, and for so many reasons. Thats why we have multi-touch built into our software, and multi-touch mice now shipping with our desktops.
Win/win... Apple is not only coordinating a hardware and OS upgrade. When the reviews come in declaring MBA the must have gadget of 2011 the company won't bump into a 4 week backorder. Sounds the they've been hoarding MBAs!
I've seen Lion and I wasn't too impressed with the GUI changes. It is ok. Maybe I just need more time with it. It was only preview 3 or something like that though. For $29 bucks I'll get it anyway.
Bull. There was never a public schedule for iOS 5, so how would you know it was delayed?
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
Iphone 5 delayed because Ios5 delayed
Bull. There was never a public schedule for iPhone 5, so how would you know it was delayed?
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
Ipad2 still has huge production problems. Was about 2 month late when released.
Says who? Apple never announced a schedule for iPad 2. In fact, most of the iOS devices are updated on roughly yearly schedules, so iPad 2 was early. And "still has huge production problems"? Baloney. They're shipping millions of units and current lead time is 1-2 weeks from Apple.com - and they're in stock at most Apple stores.
If you want to talk about production problems, compare it to something like the Wii - which was impossible to find in stores even 2 years after the launch - even though sales had dropped off dramatically.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
The new Imac: People who ordered custom build SSD imacs has waited 4-6 weeks and still not got the imacs
So? Somehow the inability of a supplier to get Apple enough SSDs means that Apple has failed without Jobs? You're delusional.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
no macmini refresh for a year
How does this indicate a failure? The mini was never state of the art and was always a low-end entry level machine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
no macbook air refresh almost a year
February 2011 is 'almost a year' ago? Wow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shompa
no macbook refresh almost a year
no macpro refresh over a year. New intel CPUs released 2 month ago. MacPro usually got newest CPU a couple of month before official release.
Ipod classic not updated for almost 2 years. There are hard drives that could enable a 320gig model.
Time capsule has not been updated for years. 3 terra disk available.
Obviously low priority products or Apple doesn't see the value in updating them. How does the fact that Apple has not updated a few products in a few months indicate that Apple is failing?.
The bottom line is that Apple continues to do extremely well. They're leading the entire industry not only in profitability and market cap, but also continue to provide the leadership that everyone else wants to follow.
It really amazes me how people will actively look for evidence to support what is, essentially, a stupid thesis (that Apple is failing since Jobs isn't there).
what would be the benefit of downgrading to Snow Leopard?
Seriously? Where have you been hiding the last 3 months? Ever here of Rosetta?
Quote:
Originally Posted by davida
If there is no built-in Rosetta, and you can't buy it from the app store, then a lot of people will be frustrated to find that they have data they need in some old app, and they can't get to it.
An example: say you need to calculate tax basis for some stock purchased several years ago, and you want to find out exactly when you bought it and for how much. An easy search in Quicken. Until you find out you can't use it anymore.
Certainly Apple could pay for maintaining Rosetta if they sold it on the app store. They would also avoid many pissed off customers who only find out they need it after migration to Lion.
While I think it's a mistake for Apple to dump Rosetta at this time (eventually yes, but just seems to soon to me), it's an ever bigger mistake how they are handling it. Lion is only weeks away and Apple has said nothing about the loss of Rosetta. The only people who even know about it are the small percentage of people who read Apple blogs and news sites. Apple needs to be upfront and clearly communicate this change to any potential upgrader before they purchase Lion and install it. It will be a very rude awakening when people find out the hard way that they can't run some of their software.
They need to create and release some sort of Can I Upgrade utility to check the person's computer for PPC software so they know what they will lose if they upgrade. They did too good of a job with Rosetta making it nearly impossible for the average user to know they are even running PPC software. With Classic it was obvious if your software was OS 9 software. They should have demoted Rosetta in Lion and made it somewhat inconvenient/obvious to run PPC software. A nag-ware type prompt or something to warm the user they are running deprecated software that will soon be unsupported in the next OS version.
I think there are going to be a lot of surprised people who find they have software that no longer works. But Apple doesn't seem to care. Welcome to the new Apple.
USB 3.0 drives are available today from pretty much any place that sells computer peripherals. Prices are only slightly higher than USB 2.0 ones. Thunderbolt peripherals, hmmm, still waiting to see one and expecting it to cost $$$$$.
Intel is supposed to be including USB 3.0 support in their Ivy Bridge chipsets. Thus new Mac models introduced in 2012 should support USB 3.0.
While you're right that Thunderbolt peripherals will likely be considerably more expensive than their USB 3.0 counterparts (just like FW peripherals were vs. USB 2.0), a simple fix is a USB 3.0 hub that should cost <$30 and should give 4 USB 3.0 ports that go into 1 Thunderbolt port.
Comments
iWeb still works in Lion, so there's no reason there to delay upgrading. Also, you can use iWeb to publish to your own host via FTP. It's true Apple won't be updating iWeb anymore, but iDVD has already gone through two iLife cycles without an update and it still works. As long as you don't need MobileMe and publish your site to a new host, you'll be able to use iWeb for at least another few years.
Thanks for the explanation, thefinite. Good to know!
I may be cynical but I think a big chunk of this is that they want to be able to show how fast Lion is taken up versus windows 7. Found an old graph from Q1-2010 and take up of 10.6 wasn't that impressive. They want the equivalent graph this time to be more impressive
It certainly makes it more appealing at WWDC because developers using the new APIs like the iCloud APIs would like to know that there are enough people out there to actually benefit from the effort and the install base vs competing systems helps too.
That graph shows pretty clearly that people just don't take the time to upgrade systems even if the upgrades are inexpensive and take a few minutes and the more full-featured operating systems become, the less need there is to upgrade anyway.
By a lot of folks, do you mean, like, 37?
I voted last week - bought my new iMac so I didn't have to put out 50% of its cost replacing hardware and software which requires Rosetta. For just $30 I will be able to install Lion on a second volume, after the first couple of updates make it stable. Just as well Apple had recently refreshed the iMac.
Not if the new machine won't boot Snow Leopard.
Why wouldn't it? Hold the option key upon startup and OSX shows you all available boot devices. Unless you have reason to believe that Lion will specifically prohibit this?
If you buy an early 2011 MBP or iMac you may or may not be able to boot it using your old Snow Leopard install. It's possible that you'll have to track down the special Snow Leopard DVD for that particular model in order to get it to work.
If you buy a mid 2011 Mac of any kind it will ONLY boot Lion.
Has that been confirmed? Or is that speculation?
iOS 5 is not delayed. It's Apple's schedule, not yours.
As a developer, I've used Lion. You want to use it. It's an improvement over snow leopard.
To AI, iCloud is slated for the fall when iOS 5 is released. While I'm sure Apple wants the platform ready, people purchasing Macs with Lion next month are not going to have access to iCloud yet.
But yes, a hardware refresh shipping with the new software is better than trying to get everyone to pay $30 a month or two after they bought the computer. Lion is a big enough new experience that they want people upgraded and that's a good thing.
To Mr. Rosetta, if your HP printer never had its drivers updated, shame on HP, not Apple.
If running legacy and outdated software is very important or vital to somebody, then they can simply keep their old hardware just in case. Do what I do. I still have older machines running OS 9 if I absolutely need to use some old software, which is quite rare in my case at least.
I don't know if Quicken is "outdated software". It runs on my Mac today. I hate them for not updating their app but unfortunately I have years of Quicken data. I might have to look into migrating my Quicken data to Windows version of Quicken just in case anything happens to my Mac.
Well, I would love to "step into the new century", but that can be a challenge when you are on a budget. I would love to buy the latest and greatest of everything, but have to pace my self and my wallet.
You've had 5 years to pace yourself and your wallet. What do you use that is so good that new software isnt free or much better at a reasonable price?
That graph shows pretty clearly that people just don't take the time to upgrade systems even if the upgrades are inexpensive and take a few minutes and the more full-featured operating systems become, the less need there is to upgrade anyway.
In many ways, this is a good thing. It just means the OS along with the apps we have running on our Macs is working great.
Touch is where it's at. I hardly ever use a mouse anymore and I probably won't ever buy one again for as long as I live. The Magic Trackpad is great, and I would recommend that everybody gets one.
I second this, except for when my fingers stick to the pad and I wish I had a mouse. Needs to be a bit more silky smooth.
Instead, the Mac maker is said to be locked on waiting till it can image the new notebooks with a Gold Master build of Lion so that buyers are afforded the latest and greatest Apple experience. <snip>
The same methodology is believed to be in place for Thunderbolt-equipped versions of the Mac mini and LED Cinema Display
So, the LED cinema Display is being held back so that it can ship with Lion?
The only possible reason would be touch, right?
Honestly, adding touchscreen capability to the entire laptop product line ought to be possible and an easy manufacturing upgrade for Apple to accomplish. They could do it in the same form factor without major changes.
MacBook Airs make sense as the first laptop to add touch. Touch makes a lot of sense as an addition (not replacement) to the mouse or trackpad - once you use the iPad and iPhone everywhere you can find yourself reaching for the screen on the laptop occasionally.
But it's not enough of a benefit yet. I don't think Apple will do this throughout their products until the extra cost of touch is minimal.
So are we there yet?
iCloud is slated for the fall when iOS 5 is released. While I'm sure Apple wants the platform ready, people purchasing Macs with Lion next month are not going to have access to iCloud yet.
I'm pretty sure that for Lion and iCloud they said July. iOS 5 was fall.
In addition to seamlessly syncing data, contacts and calendars across multiple devices -- including Macs and PCs -- Apple's iCloud also promises to simplify users' lives, making it easy to access photos, videos and personal files without the need to manually transfer or back up. Apple has boasted that its offering will be more full-featured than its rivals, namely Google and Amazon, as well as third-party services like Dropbox.
Where did iCloud promise access to videos or personal files? I get that iDisk can store your documents folder, and I get that individual apps can now store their data on the cloud instead of on your computer - but that's not quite the same is it?
I wonder if holding back on new macs will mean:
1- New Mac Pro's with better thunderbolt accessories
2- New Apple HD Monitor with Built in HD cam + which is touch screen capable
3- New Mac-Mini with Thunderbolt
4- Macbook with touchscreen and combo Hard drive SSD drive.
5- Macbook Air with touchscreen and combo Hard drive SSD drive.
6- Macbook Pro with touchscreen?
Honestly, adding touchscreen capability to the entire laptop product line ought to be possible and an easy manufacturing upgrade for Apple to accomplish. They could do it in the same form factor without major changes.
The only upgrade as an option i would like is Blu-Ray Recording, even for storage. At this point Apple is ridiculous by not offering it in their desktop line. BD is widely adopted, and a great format for sharing movies on in HD.
not everyone wants to be connected to internet and stream everything.
Where have you been? Touch screens are not an option, and for so many reasons. Thats why we have multi-touch built into our software, and multi-touch mice now shipping with our desktops.
Has that been confirmed? Or is that speculation?
No model of computer can run an earlier version of software than the first version with which that model was shipped.
Io5 delayed. Almost 4month after schedule
Bull. There was never a public schedule for iOS 5, so how would you know it was delayed?
Iphone 5 delayed because Ios5 delayed
Bull. There was never a public schedule for iPhone 5, so how would you know it was delayed?
Ipad2 still has huge production problems. Was about 2 month late when released.
Says who? Apple never announced a schedule for iPad 2. In fact, most of the iOS devices are updated on roughly yearly schedules, so iPad 2 was early. And "still has huge production problems"? Baloney. They're shipping millions of units and current lead time is 1-2 weeks from Apple.com - and they're in stock at most Apple stores.
If you want to talk about production problems, compare it to something like the Wii - which was impossible to find in stores even 2 years after the launch - even though sales had dropped off dramatically.
The new Imac: People who ordered custom build SSD imacs has waited 4-6 weeks and still not got the imacs
So? Somehow the inability of a supplier to get Apple enough SSDs means that Apple has failed without Jobs? You're delusional.
no macmini refresh for a year
How does this indicate a failure? The mini was never state of the art and was always a low-end entry level machine.
no macbook air refresh almost a year
February 2011 is 'almost a year' ago? Wow.
no macbook refresh almost a year
no macpro refresh over a year. New intel CPUs released 2 month ago. MacPro usually got newest CPU a couple of month before official release.
Ipod classic not updated for almost 2 years. There are hard drives that could enable a 320gig model.
Time capsule has not been updated for years. 3 terra disk available.
Obviously low priority products or Apple doesn't see the value in updating them. How does the fact that Apple has not updated a few products in a few months indicate that Apple is failing?.
The bottom line is that Apple continues to do extremely well. They're leading the entire industry not only in profitability and market cap, but also continue to provide the leadership that everyone else wants to follow.
It really amazes me how people will actively look for evidence to support what is, essentially, a stupid thesis (that Apple is failing since Jobs isn't there).
what would be the benefit of downgrading to Snow Leopard?
Seriously? Where have you been hiding the last 3 months? Ever here of Rosetta?
If there is no built-in Rosetta, and you can't buy it from the app store, then a lot of people will be frustrated to find that they have data they need in some old app, and they can't get to it.
An example: say you need to calculate tax basis for some stock purchased several years ago, and you want to find out exactly when you bought it and for how much. An easy search in Quicken. Until you find out you can't use it anymore.
Certainly Apple could pay for maintaining Rosetta if they sold it on the app store. They would also avoid many pissed off customers who only find out they need it after migration to Lion.
While I think it's a mistake for Apple to dump Rosetta at this time (eventually yes, but just seems to soon to me), it's an ever bigger mistake how they are handling it. Lion is only weeks away and Apple has said nothing about the loss of Rosetta. The only people who even know about it are the small percentage of people who read Apple blogs and news sites. Apple needs to be upfront and clearly communicate this change to any potential upgrader before they purchase Lion and install it. It will be a very rude awakening when people find out the hard way that they can't run some of their software.
They need to create and release some sort of Can I Upgrade utility to check the person's computer for PPC software so they know what they will lose if they upgrade. They did too good of a job with Rosetta making it nearly impossible for the average user to know they are even running PPC software. With Classic it was obvious if your software was OS 9 software. They should have demoted Rosetta in Lion and made it somewhat inconvenient/obvious to run PPC software. A nag-ware type prompt or something to warm the user they are running deprecated software that will soon be unsupported in the next OS version.
I think there are going to be a lot of surprised people who find they have software that no longer works. But Apple doesn't seem to care. Welcome to the new Apple.
USB 3.0 drives are available today from pretty much any place that sells computer peripherals. Prices are only slightly higher than USB 2.0 ones. Thunderbolt peripherals, hmmm, still waiting to see one and expecting it to cost $$$$$.
Intel is supposed to be including USB 3.0 support in their Ivy Bridge chipsets. Thus new Mac models introduced in 2012 should support USB 3.0.
While you're right that Thunderbolt peripherals will likely be considerably more expensive than their USB 3.0 counterparts (just like FW peripherals were vs. USB 2.0), a simple fix is a USB 3.0 hub that should cost <$30 and should give 4 USB 3.0 ports that go into 1 Thunderbolt port.