San Francisco to cease Mac purchases without EPEAT certification

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  • Reply 61 of 195
    hellacoolhellacool Posts: 759member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    And what really pissed me off about San Francisco, is that they're supposed to be known as some progressive and hip city, and I was traveling through a bunch of US states a while ago, and I am a weed connoisseur, and can you believe that out of all of the states which I visited, which were many, just about the only place where I didn't manage to buy any weed was in San Francisco? What a joke. Every other state was easy. Maybe it was just extremely bad luck, but that didn't help San Francisco's image much in my opinion.





    This is our future.image

  • Reply 62 of 195
    rot'napplerot'napple Posts: 1,839member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by agramonte View Post


     


     


    If you live in the USA you need San Francisco.



    Because???  Actually, I think the US would be better off without.

  • Reply 63 of 195

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jmgregory1 View Post



    For those that complain that Apple is going backward with the recycle-ability of their computers are missing the point. The problem isn't Apple or their products, it's the EPEAT certification that has not kept up with advances and changes in computer product manufacturing. I can just see the conversations Apple had with EPEAT people. Apple, "So we've made our products better with less or no toxic chemicals and they are fully recyclable and we'd like you to update the certification protocol to address this." EPEAT staff, "But Apple, none of the other manufacturers are able to produce their computers in the same way and they would all become out of spec if we made the change - so we're not going to change until the majority of other computer manufacturers copy your production methods."

    Apple's response, "Go screw yourselves. We'll create our own program that makes your antiquated system look like exactly what it is - worthless."

    I would make bets that I'm not far off from how things played out.


     


    Except they created THIS program. 


     


     


    Quote:


    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


     


    They're ordering boatloads of iPads. iPads are immune.



     


    Maybe in some cases, but that's not an answer and the original poster was correct. In speaking to my mother just yesterday, since shes retiring in August she's planned out everything to December and they too have just cancelled their next cycle of Mac replacements on her for this reason; not because they want to, but have to. Apple may have something else in place sometime soon, but this definitely seems like they jumped the gun on ripping out of this first. 

  • Reply 64 of 195
    kpluckkpluck Posts: 500member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by knightlie View Post



    Not surprising, this was bound to happen. It's very disappointing that Apple have chosen to go in this direction.


     


    Actually, it is great that they are doing it. They looked at their market and decided that pointless, feel-good B.S. was going to interfere with their business. Then, they took appropriate action to eliminate the interference.


     


    They should be applauded for their actions.


     


    -kpluck

  • Reply 65 of 195

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    A bunch of really sick people live in San Francisco. Isn't that the same city that banned happy meals a while ago? Those people are batshit insane. And they've also considered banning pets? Is that an actual American city or is it some little communist town run by radical, authoritarian, dictator wannabes? It's like a prison for freaks.


     


    As for San Fran banning Macs from being bought by city agencies, who cares? As the article said, Macs only make up a percent or two of their complete usage, so let 'em ban what they want. Apple doesn't need San Fran, and neither do I.



     


    Wow, what an angry, uninformed post. A couple of things:


     


    1) Apple practically owes its existence to San Francisco and its culture. Do you think free-wheeling, acid-dropping Steve Jobs of the 70's would've turned out the same had he grown up in Middle America? 


     


    2)  The US has the fattest, unhealthiest kids in the developed world. Not only are millions of them expected to live shorter lives than their parents, but it costs the US some $150-200 billion a year. Some would say it's insane to incentivize kids' eating of burgers and fried chicken fast food with toys.


     


    3) The proposed law banned the sale of animals; it did not ban pets. 


     


    But yes, I guess if you have a different point of view, that makes San Francisco "batshit insane...radical, authoritarian dictator wannabes". Dramatic much? 

  • Reply 66 of 195
    ssquirrelssquirrel Posts: 1,196member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by lightknight View Post


    Talking about iPads... I wonder if Apple will ever do a "Product RED iPad". I'd buy that in a heartbeat, even if they make it more expensive :D



     


    They make a Product Red iPad cover and Smart Case I believe.


     


    Ever since the story about removing theircomputers from EPEAT hit I have been waiting for Greenpeace to claim Apple is the devil again :)  I have my popcorn, I just hope it won't go stale waiting.

  • Reply 67 of 195
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,509member
    Without San Francisco, Sir Jony might just pack up and head back to England.

    As for Apple ]['s tragic weed experience, it would be good to remember that:

    1. most pot is sold through dispensaries now, you need a prescription, and there's not much on the streets, and:

    2., what street weed you might find would not be available to one with the social skills of Apple ][.
  • Reply 68 of 195
    enjournienjourni Posts: 254member


    This smells of apple taking their ball and going home. Makes no sense otherwise. Why would they pull EPEAT from old products? A vote of no-confidence in EPEAT? A political move?


     


    The speed of San Fran's response is pretty startling. And the fact this will have a domino effect killing all government Mac sales is very bad news.


     


    I find it hard to believe apple could have screwed up this badly. They must have a VERY strong internal reason for doing this. The 64K question is, what is that reason? This can't be just typical apple posturing, like they did when they pulled Flash from iOS. If it was, why wouldn't they come out with some explanation for the move?


     


    Something very serious is going on that we don't know about.

  • Reply 69 of 195
    iluomoiluomo Posts: 25member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Pooch View Post


    [only a] nobody calls it 'san fran'.



     


    I have lived here for almost 20 years and I've never heard a local frown on 'san fran'.  The term "Frisco" is the one long time SF'ers have told me they don't like.  But no one I know bristles at "san fran".  As if it matters...


     


    I have a complex relationship with my adopted hometown.  I still think it's gorgeous physically and I think in terms of value to quality there's no better place to eat out in the US.  Other than NYC, I can't imagine living anywhere else, at least for the time being.


     


    But I also think the City run primarily by left-wing, morally high-handed, puritanical ideologues.  Not surprising given all the self-absorbed degenerates who populate the city itself (myself and friends excluded, of course!).  This move against Apple is hardly a shock.

  • Reply 70 of 195
    lilgto64lilgto64 Posts: 1,147member


    So on the basis of the EPEAT listing - government agencies will now buy non-Apple products and replace them every two years - thus keeping the recycling economy flowing - instead of buying Apple products that last two to three times as long but which cannot be as easily recycled. 


     


    I suspect that the request to remove all Apple products from the list likely stems from items such as not wanting to paint a giant question mark on the latest products asking why are they not on the list - or constant pestering about when they will be added to the list. Also, there very well may be some sort of on-going licensing or other fees - and dropping from the program entirely eliminates those costs. If most of the products on the list are end of life then not having them officially listed makes no difference in sales since you can't sell something that you stopped making (after the existing pipeline runs dry). 


     
  • Reply 71 of 195
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,743member

    So, governements should tailor their decisions to big companies possible business decisions rather than the public good?

    Don't they already do that?
  • Reply 72 of 195
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 6,952member


    Funny how posters here assume that Apple shot itself in the foot. Do you think Apple did this in a daze without considering the ramifications? Do you think Apple doesn't have something in the works to address this? Do you think Tim Cook is stupid? The rumor is that Apple will propose new EPEAT standards that update the reality of environmentally safe manufacturing. 

  • Reply 73 of 195
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,574member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Flaneur View Post



    Without San Francisco, Sir Jony might just pack up and head back to England.

    As for Apple ]['s tragic weed experience, it would be good to remember that:

    1. most pot is sold through dispensaries now, you need a prescription, and there's not much on the streets, and:

    2., what street weed you might find would not be available to one with the social skills of Apple ][.


    1. It seems like a lot of those dispensaries are being raided and shutdown, left and right. 


     


    2. My social skills didn't pose any problems in any other state that I visited during that trip. Weed was everywhere and easy to get, as long as you had the cash. But in progressive and hip San Francisco? Not so. I visited around 15 states during that trip.

  • Reply 74 of 195
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    1) Apple practically owes its existence to San Francisco and its culture. Do you think free-wheeling, acid-dropping Steve Jobs of the 70's would've turned out the same had he grown up in Middle America? 

    Do you think Apple owes San Francisco anything whatsoever?
    Some would say it's insane to incentivize kids' eating of burgers and fried chicken fast food with toys.

    Even more would say it's insane that someone else thinks they can tell me what I can eat and in what quantities.
  • Reply 75 of 195
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 6,952member

    Quote:


    Originally Posted by enjourni View Post


     


    I find it hard to believe apple could have screwed up this badly. They must have a VERY strong internal reason for doing this. The 64K question is, what is that reason? This can't be just typical apple posturing, like they did when they pulled Flash from iOS. If it was, why wouldn't they come out with some explanation for the move?


     


    Something very serious is going on that we don't know about.



     


    You think? Meanwhile the environmental hand wringing crescendos to a fever pitch. EVIL Apple they cry! 

  • Reply 76 of 195
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,743member
    enjourni wrote: »
    This smells of apple taking their ball and going home. Makes no sense otherwise.

    We didn't understand the iPad, either.

    We didn't understand their decision about Flash.

    We couldn't imagine how an App Store model could be better than scattered online downloads.

    Now everyone else agrees with, or is doing (or trying to do) all of the above.

    There's probably a plan in place already at Apple. I doubt any of this new comes as a surprise to them.

    Is it fair to say Apple Knows Best? That's probably reaching, but if you want a poster-child for that idiom, Apple usually comes closest.
  • Reply 77 of 195
    conrailconrail Posts: 489member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


     


    I know what you're saying. Even though I'm bashing San Francisco here, the politicians in my city aren't much better. In my city, the mini-Stalin of a mayor is banning soda! Somebody needs to remind these people that this is the USA and not North Korea.



    Wow, talk about your first world problems.  He's right up there with Stalin, for sure.  

  • Reply 78 of 195
    Except they created THIS program. 

    Maybe in some cases, but that's not an answer and the original poster was correct. In speaking to my mother just yesterday, since shes retiring in August she's planned out everything to December and they too have just cancelled their next cycle of Mac replacements on her for this reason; not because they want to, but have to. Apple may have something else in place sometime soon, but this definitely seems like they jumped the gun on ripping out of this first. 

    Apple helped create the program years ago - but times changed. And Apple's manufacturing procedures changed. I'm guessing they've been talking with EPEAT about changing their certification policy, but EPEAT now also has a lot of pc manufacturers who are completely happy to do things the same way they've been doing them for the past decade. They won't change for Apple as that will make the pc makers out of compliance.

    So, just for fun, let's say Apple figures out a way to make their computers not just recyclable, but completely bio-nuetral as they make them out of dirt and they can be used as fertilizer when you're done using them (I know, that isn't going to happen, but bare with me). So, these new green Apple computers (not to be mistaken for Green Apples) do NOT meet the EPEAT certifications. So that makes it the right thing for governments or businesses or consumers to not buy and use these new computers because they are not EPEAT compliant?
  • Reply 79 of 195
    mugzymugzy Posts: 38member


    Here is my take, far-fetched as it may be:


     


    Apple helped to create these standards in the first place knowing what direction their manufacturing was going.


    They also knew the iPhone and iPad would be exempt. (don't forget that iOS was made for a tablet before it came out on the iPhone...)


     


    Now all other manufacturers hold back their designs to comply with this standard while Apple simply moves past it with the iPad and everything else.


    Apple knows how much revenue (or how little) comes from adhering to EPEAT.  If they give it up, they leave it for the other manufacturers to fight over while Apple moves forward. The others stagnate.  

  • Reply 80 of 195


    No big deal really.  Since all the PC manufacturers are taking design cues from Apple,all of their products should lose their EPEAT certification soon as well.  Then who are you going to buy from SF?

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