Then I don't believe you understand what you're talking about. To alleviate the problem, you need to change the angle (orientation), not position.
Perhaps. I don't claim to be any sort of photographer, my specialty is audio.
If a strong light source was all the way on the right edge of a photo, wouldn't moving the camera ever so slightly to the left alleviate the problem?
When I've taken pictures using regular cameras before (not iPhones), and there were strong light sources on the edge, the tiniest movement would change the image drastically.
for those brainless users Apple should include a feature that blocks the photo app when it shows this issue, an alert, just like what you have in any compact camera in low light when you have the flash off.
Really? Sounds to me like people tried to splitting hair here. Look at the photo, delete the flare (suppose no sun there) what will you get with the black leaves and white sky? Oh, Chromatic aberration around the edge of the leaves. Now put in the sun, we have the flare and this aberration is amplified by the much higher contrast so the tint is much more pronounced and mixed with the flare but we can't call this change in color (from black leaves and white sky to purple) Chromatic aberration? Please...
You can shoot directly at the sun with no tint. Even iPhone 5 can. The appearance of the tint is what it's called CA. I'm glad I'm not academic person so I don't have to splitting hair in real life.
Well you and AI are wrong.
Chromat Aberrations exist in all lens to some extent. Such defects do not depend upon what you are pointing at assuming a normal spectrum of light. That is you will get the same CA on the test bench that you see in the field. The reason being is that this defect depends upon the physical design of the lens elements and how well they are corrected for the various focus points of the different wavelengths of light.
The issues being seen here are for the most part related to flare. Flare can produce the gross image defects seen here but it can also negatively impact contrast.
Beyond that this is not simply a problem with digital cameras, AI states this but I have to wonder if any of them have actually used a film based camera. To put it bluntly I have, and all of them can be forced into flare conditions. This includes 35 mm SLRs, 6x7 medium format cameras, twin lens reflex and others I have used. Lens design is an exercise in compromise that is why ligitimate camera and lens reviews test systems for a number of aberrations. Further such reviews don't go off on any one characteristic of a lens unless the feature/issue is significant.
[" url="/t/153202/apple-support-document-addresses-iphone-5-purple-haze#post_2206755"]
Perhaps. I don't claim to be any sort of photographer, my specialty is audio.
If a strong light source was all the way on the right edge of a photo, wouldn't moving the camera ever so slightly to the left alleviate the problem?
When I've taken pictures using regular cameras before (not iPhones), and there were strong light sources on the edge, the tiniest movement would change the image drastically.
I would bet that most of that movement is an unconscious rotation. True linear movement does practically nothing relatively speaking. I'll have to figure out how to explain why this is.
Really? Sounds to me like people tried to splitting hair here. Look at the photo, delete the flare (suppose no sun there) what will you get with the black leaves and white sky? Oh, Chromatic aberration around the edge of the leaves. Now put in the sun, we have the flare and this aberration is amplified by the much higher contrast so the tint is much more pronounced and mixed with the flare but we can't call this change in color (from black leaves and white sky to purple) Chromatic aberration? Please...
You can shoot directly at the sun with no tint. Even iPhone 5 can. The appearance of the tint is what it's called CA. I'm glad I'm not academic person so I don't have to splitting hair in real life.
Take a look at what dpreview says about this problem. Chromatic aberration occurs when the lens can't focus all colors sharply at the same time. Lens flare occurs when stray light gets in and bounces around between the elements of the lens.
Actually, it is both flare and chromatic aberration. The severity of the lens flare in the picture exposes the chromatic aberrant behavior in the camera — hence the purple fringing. In a system without chromatic aberrant behavior, the flare is a whitish haze overpowering part or all of the image. It may or may not include speculate highlights.
Call it "splitting hair" if you want, but your "explanation" brings no information to light.
Flaring and fringing are totally different effects, resulting from totally different causes, with totally different remedies.
The purple color of the flair is probably a result of thin film diffraction somewhere along the line where the flare hits a coating on a lens or possibly the sapphire lens protector.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07
Really? Sounds to me like people tried to splitting hair here. Look at the photo, delete the flare (suppose no sun there) what will you get with the black leaves and white sky? Oh, Chromatic aberration around the edge of the leaves. Now put in the sun, we have the flare and this aberration is amplified by the much higher contrast so the tint is much more pronounced and mixed with the flare but we can't call this change in color (from black leaves and white sky to purple) Chromatic aberration? Please...
You can shoot directly at the sun with no tint. Even iPhone 5 can. The appearance of the tint is what it's called CA. I'm glad I'm not academic person so I don't have to splitting hair in real life.
It has been observed countless times; a person at first opening the iPhone box will grin, make chuckling sounds or even break out in laughter. This unexplainable phenomenon seems to be totally unique to new iPhone owners and has not been seen in the wild among the intelligence challenged purchasers of other OS phones.
You should write much less when you don't know what you are talking about.
This is not an example of the (axial OR transverse) chromatic aberration you reference. If you look at the hands of the sculpture in this image, you will see an example of the "purple fringing" resulting from chromatic aberration.
Bullshit.
You can see it yourself when you point your iPhone 5 at a bright light source, tilt the phone a few degrees, move it a few fractions of an inch or shade it with your hand and watch the "purple haze" vanish.
What next?
Apple is "copying" every camera manual ever written.
Apple should not use their arrogant tactic, “You’re taking pictures wrong.”
'Sapphire glass' is problem.
------------------------------
We’ve just learned that the iPhone 5 camera may be faulty, showing a purple haze (yep, I said it) in certain lighting conditions. If you take a picture with the iPhone 5, and there’s a bright light that’s outside of the frame, you’ll see a purple tint come across the image.
This is possibly due to the Sapphire glass used in the camera’s lens.
This is good news for Apple, who can now patent the never before heard of phenomenon called 'lens flare' and sue everyone else for patent infringement, starting with Adobe Photoshop.
This is good news for Apple, who can now patent the never before heard of phenomenon called 'lens flare' and sue everyone else for patent infringement, starting with Adobe Photoshop.
I support the idea of Apple suing everyone for the use of lens flare on the sole condition that when they win the lawsuit, no one else can ever use it again. And since Apple themselves wouldn't use it, the world will be a better place.
There is no such thing as a lens "without CA behavior." Also, although a flare is proportional to it's brightness, CA is a constant that does not "increase in severity" due to the brightness of the light. It appears consistently (relative to the distance from the focal point) throughout the image, but is most easily noticed at edges with high contrast (e.g. an edge where whit and black meet abruptly.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by macaholic_1948
To those arguing about what this is, read:
Actually, it is both flare and chromatic aberration. The severity of the lens flare in the picture exposes the chromatic aberrant behavior in the camera — hence the purple fringing. In a system without chromatic aberrant behavior, the flare is a whitish haze overpowering part or all of the image. It may or may not include speculate highlights.
I would bet that most of that movement is an unconscious rotation. True linear movement does practically nothing relatively speaking. I'll have to figure out how to explain why this is.
I think you guys are just splitting hairs here. Moving the camera will indeed correct the problem just as slight tilting will. It's also really unlikely that the average user could tilt the iPhone while still having it remain in a fixed position just as you note the unlikeliness of moving the camera without also tilting it somehow.
Moving the camera so you are not facing the sun or do not have the sun either in, or to the edge of, your composition will obviously fix the problem, as will tilting it "just so," to change the angle of reflection. Overall I still think the rational way to talk about the problem is just to tell people not to violate what is probably the first rule of photography by having their light source in front of them instead of behind them.
The real problem is a whole new class of people who are avidly taking pictures without ever having owned a real camera or had any instruction in photography. This is all fine as long as these people do not expect perfection from their photographs (and they generally don't). The ruckus is being caused by the small subset of that group who know nothing about taking pictures, yet do expect the camera to automatically turn every shot they make into perfection.
You can see it yourself when you point your iPhone 5 at a bright light source, tilt the phone a few degrees, move it a few fractions of an inch or shade it with your hand and watch the "purple haze" vanish.
In all this discussion of lens flare one important thing seems to always get overlooked. Pointing your lens at the sun, regardless if it is an iPhone or a DSLR, has the potential of damaging the imaging sensor.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
Then I don't believe you understand what you're talking about. To alleviate the problem, you need to change the angle (orientation), not position.
Perhaps. I don't claim to be any sort of photographer, my specialty is audio.
If a strong light source was all the way on the right edge of a photo, wouldn't moving the camera ever so slightly to the left alleviate the problem?
When I've taken pictures using regular cameras before (not iPhones), and there were strong light sources on the edge, the tiniest movement would change the image drastically.
for those brainless users Apple should include a feature that blocks the photo app when it shows this issue, an alert, just like what you have in any compact camera in low light when you have the flash off.
It can be solved with a software update.
Well you and AI are wrong.
Chromat Aberrations exist in all lens to some extent. Such defects do not depend upon what you are pointing at assuming a normal spectrum of light. That is you will get the same CA on the test bench that you see in the field. The reason being is that this defect depends upon the physical design of the lens elements and how well they are corrected for the various focus points of the different wavelengths of light.
The issues being seen here are for the most part related to flare. Flare can produce the gross image defects seen here but it can also negatively impact contrast.
Beyond that this is not simply a problem with digital cameras, AI states this but I have to wonder if any of them have actually used a film based camera. To put it bluntly I have, and all of them can be forced into flare conditions. This includes 35 mm SLRs, 6x7 medium format cameras, twin lens reflex and others I have used. Lens design is an exercise in compromise that is why ligitimate camera and lens reviews test systems for a number of aberrations. Further such reviews don't go off on any one characteristic of a lens unless the feature/issue is significant.
I would bet that most of that movement is an unconscious rotation. True linear movement does practically nothing relatively speaking. I'll have to figure out how to explain why this is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07
Really? Sounds to me like people tried to splitting hair here. Look at the photo, delete the flare (suppose no sun there) what will you get with the black leaves and white sky? Oh, Chromatic aberration around the edge of the leaves. Now put in the sun, we have the flare and this aberration is amplified by the much higher contrast so the tint is much more pronounced and mixed with the flare but we can't call this change in color (from black leaves and white sky to purple) Chromatic aberration? Please...
You can shoot directly at the sun with no tint. Even iPhone 5 can. The appearance of the tint is what it's called CA. I'm glad I'm not academic person so I don't have to splitting hair in real life.
Take a look at what dpreview says about this problem. Chromatic aberration occurs when the lens can't focus all colors sharply at the same time. Lens flare occurs when stray light gets in and bounces around between the elements of the lens.
Funny stuff. Now do we all need to throw our iphone5's on the stage, dowse with iLighter Fluid (tm) and burn, baby, burn? (with apology to Jimi).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][
Go buy a $10,000 camera, if you can afford it, and point it at the sun or a lightbulb and see what happens, you pathetic idiot.
Look, dude - is it possible for you to make a point without name-calling?
Actually, it is both flare and chromatic aberration. The severity of the lens flare in the picture exposes the chromatic aberrant behavior in the camera — hence the purple fringing. In a system without chromatic aberrant behavior, the flare is a whitish haze overpowering part or all of the image. It may or may not include speculate highlights.
Um . . . No.
Call it "splitting hair" if you want, but your "explanation" brings no information to light.
Flaring and fringing are totally different effects, resulting from totally different causes, with totally different remedies.
The purple color of the flair is probably a result of thin film diffraction somewhere along the line where the flare hits a coating on a lens or possibly the sapphire lens protector.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07
Really? Sounds to me like people tried to splitting hair here. Look at the photo, delete the flare (suppose no sun there) what will you get with the black leaves and white sky? Oh, Chromatic aberration around the edge of the leaves. Now put in the sun, we have the flare and this aberration is amplified by the much higher contrast so the tint is much more pronounced and mixed with the flare but we can't call this change in color (from black leaves and white sky to purple) Chromatic aberration? Please...
You can shoot directly at the sun with no tint. Even iPhone 5 can. The appearance of the tint is what it's called CA. I'm glad I'm not academic person so I don't have to splitting hair in real life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney
My iPhone is actin' funny and I don't know why
Ah, Now we have clown-gate.
It has been observed countless times; a person at first opening the iPhone box will grin, make chuckling sounds or even break out in laughter. This unexplainable phenomenon seems to be totally unique to new iPhone owners and has not been seen in the wild among the intelligence challenged purchasers of other OS phones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DESuserIGN
AI staff writer,
You should write much less when you don't know what you are talking about.
This is not an example of the (axial OR transverse) chromatic aberration you reference. If you look at the hands of the sculpture in this image, you will see an example of the "purple fringing" resulting from chromatic aberration.
Bullshit.
You can see it yourself when you point your iPhone 5 at a bright light source, tilt the phone a few degrees, move it a few fractions of an inch or shade it with your hand and watch the "purple haze" vanish.
What next?
Apple is "copying" every camera manual ever written.
Apple should not use their arrogant tactic, “You’re taking pictures wrong.”
'Sapphire glass' is problem.
------------------------------
We’ve just learned that the iPhone 5 camera may be faulty, showing a purple haze (yep, I said it) in certain lighting conditions. If you take a picture with the iPhone 5, and there’s a bright light that’s outside of the frame, you’ll see a purple tint come across the image.
This is possibly due to the Sapphire glass used in the camera’s lens.
http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/26/the-iphone-5s-camera-is-faulty-shows-a-purple-haze/
Originally Posted by 845032
Apple should not use their arrogant tactic, “You’re taking pictures wrong.”
'Sapphire glass' is problem.
Run away, Samsung shill. Run long. Run far.
This is good news for Apple, who can now patent the never before heard of phenomenon called 'lens flare' and sue everyone else for patent infringement, starting with Adobe Photoshop.
Originally Posted by AnalogJack
This is good news for Apple, who can now patent the never before heard of phenomenon called 'lens flare' and sue everyone else for patent infringement, starting with Adobe Photoshop.
I support the idea of Apple suing everyone for the use of lens flare on the sole condition that when they win the lawsuit, no one else can ever use it again. And since Apple themselves wouldn't use it, the world will be a better place.
And . . . nope.
There is no such thing as a lens "without CA behavior." Also, although a flare is proportional to it's brightness, CA is a constant that does not "increase in severity" due to the brightness of the light. It appears consistently (relative to the distance from the focal point) throughout the image, but is most easily noticed at edges with high contrast (e.g. an edge where whit and black meet abruptly.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by macaholic_1948
To those arguing about what this is, read:
Actually, it is both flare and chromatic aberration. The severity of the lens flare in the picture exposes the chromatic aberrant behavior in the camera — hence the purple fringing. In a system without chromatic aberrant behavior, the flare is a whitish haze overpowering part or all of the image. It may or may not include speculate highlights.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
I would bet that most of that movement is an unconscious rotation. True linear movement does practically nothing relatively speaking. I'll have to figure out how to explain why this is.
I think you guys are just splitting hairs here. Moving the camera will indeed correct the problem just as slight tilting will. It's also really unlikely that the average user could tilt the iPhone while still having it remain in a fixed position just as you note the unlikeliness of moving the camera without also tilting it somehow.
Moving the camera so you are not facing the sun or do not have the sun either in, or to the edge of, your composition will obviously fix the problem, as will tilting it "just so," to change the angle of reflection. Overall I still think the rational way to talk about the problem is just to tell people not to violate what is probably the first rule of photography by having their light source in front of them instead of behind them.
The real problem is a whole new class of people who are avidly taking pictures without ever having owned a real camera or had any instruction in photography. This is all fine as long as these people do not expect perfection from their photographs (and they generally don't). The ruckus is being caused by the small subset of that group who know nothing about taking pictures, yet do expect the camera to automatically turn every shot they make into perfection.
3866 posts and nothing intelligent to say.
What a surprise!
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
Bullshit.
You can see it yourself when you point your iPhone 5 at a bright light source, tilt the phone a few degrees, move it a few fractions of an inch or shade it with your hand and watch the "purple haze" vanish.
In all this discussion of lens flare one important thing seems to always get overlooked. Pointing your lens at the sun, regardless if it is an iPhone or a DSLR, has the potential of damaging the imaging sensor.