There is no need to pay out on people who feel it is over priced, its their opinion. This is not a US election, right? Having said that i believe that it is $329 because the ipod touch is $299, but it is probably worth it as you are paying a bit more for quality.
Would have to disagree on both points - On reading, You can set your font to resemble a paperback on a 7 inch screen easily (both size and content) so that is a non issue - On movies - this is not 1979, no reason to watch a movie on a 4:3 screen.
Well, I have been reading books on the iPad and on the Kindle (several generations of both). I strongly feel that the Kindle does not give you anywhere enough area (the current one is 6" diagonal, 212ppi) for regular paperback-type reading [I use it because it is very light, very easy on the eyes, and has infinite battery life, at least in standby mode]. For professional reading (equations, graphs, etc) it's horribly inadequate, 7" is presumably better, but not better enough (Kindle DX was still not acceptable amount of area, but it came a bit closer). For movies, I have no objection to 16:9, my point is simply that at that physical size (7" idagonal, 16:9), you simply cannot tell the difference between 720p and 1080p, unless you are part eagle.
For those of us who read a lot, I think the iPad Maxi is the optimal size and screen res. I believe the Android tablets are way too small. Is the iPad mini the right size? Don't know, but 40% more area is a good start.
A semi-good point. Semi, because at least where I live BMWs and Minis are sold in different dealerships. From personal experience, what they actually do is try to sell you a used BMW (the used market is quasi-non-existent in the electronics world, however, at least relatively to the car world).
It's a fair price, but if the purpose was suck all the air out of the room for 7" tablets, they might have dumped them on the market at a break-even price point. Just as Windows did to Mac back in the day. But they may marginalize the others anyway, only time will tell.
The Apple strategy is not to have 90% market share, but to have 90% share of the profits. In this they have succeeded admirably in every market they are in, and it seems that the 7.x tablet market is going to be another example.
did not know I was posting in a location where within the context used "soda" would not refer to anything but a carbonated soft drink wich "Veuve Clicquot" is not.. I will need to be more precise in the future I suppose.
The ONLY reason this products is $329 and not $299 is because the iPod touch is $299.
Agreed. I took a trip to B&N and Staples and tested out the Nook Tablet and Nook Color, the Amazon Kindle HD and the Google Nexus 7.
1. The Kindle HD seems like a plastic toy. Not fun to use.
2. The B&N Nook Tablet and Nook Color are so slow when it comes to browsing the web (especially the Color model). Resizing web pages is terrible. Scrolling was painful.
3. The Nexus 7 was a nice tablet experience. No slowdown with the OS and only one hiccup / slowdown using the browser.
After playing with each of them I really have no problems paying extra for the iPad Mini compared to the Nexus 7 if the iPad Mini has the same quality construction I have come to expect from Apple. Yes, $299 is a more reasonable price, but the iPod Touch plays a role in the pricing. Plus, Apple want to suck an extra $30 per sale as pure profit. Why do you think they are sitting on more than $14 billion? I will just chalk the extra $30 up to an Apple Tax which covers better customer service compared to Google and the option of hitting a local Apple Store if I have problems.
Like I said yesterday, $329 is a fine price for the Mini.
If you think that it's too much, then don't buy one, go buy something else. Apple is going to move plenty of iPad Minis at the $329 price point. You should be glad that the bogus 8GB rumor turned out to be false.
That will be the test how well they move. I thought the Mini would come in at 299.00 but I don't see that much of an issue with 329.00. The only price point I thought was high yesterday was the new Macbook Pro 13". It isn't really 500.00 less than the 15" if you take into consideration that you get the larger retina screen you also get a 256 solid state and a dedicated gpu. If someone gets an education discount on the 15" it's 200.00 on the 13" its 100.00 which makes the 15" a far better deal.
Price isn't much of a problem... as a laptop user I wanted something more portable than standard iPad but I didn't want to deal with Android. The iPad mini is exactly what I wanted. I'm a little miffed about the $100 for the first additional 16gb of storage. That's getting a little ridiculous but meh... I'm not about to jump to Android over that. I don't care that it doesn't have retina. Frankly, I want a go anywhere, just-works device for reading and browsing. For high-photo editing from my 20 mpx SLR, I've got a 24" monitor so I wasn't going to use an iPad for that anyway. I know for a fact that we're getting at least two of these this holiday season.... just hope availability isn't too much of a problem.
You and probably 20 million other people will feel the same way. The iPad mini is about losing weight and size to make it easier to use as a reader. I predict a lot of people will eventually own an iPad mini and an iPad.
Apple isn't charging a premium. The iPad mini is allegedly one of Apple's lowest margin products. The reality is that Google and Amazon are selling at cost or at a loss to get a user base and they make money other ways (search and content). That isn't Apple's business model. Apple makes good products and sells them for a fair price.
Wasn't it just 2.5 years ago when everyone was hoping for Apple to release an 8-10 inch mobile device under $1000? Apple shocked the world with an entry price of $499. Fast forward 2.5 years.... Apple delivers an almost 8 inch device at $329 and everyone is bitching? What gives?
Agreed. I took a trip to B&N and Staples and tested out the Nook Tablet and Nook Color, the Amazon Kindle HD and the Google Nexus 7.
1. The Kindle HD seems like a plastic toy. Not fun to use.
2. The B&N Nook Tablet and Nook Color are so slow when it comes to browsing the web (especially the Color model). Resizing web pages is terrible. Scrolling was painful.
3. The Nexus 7 was a nice tablet experience. No slowdown with the OS and only one hiccup / slowdown using the browser.
After playing with each of them I really have no problems paying extra for the iPad Mini compared to the Nexus 7 if the iPad Mini has the same quality construction I have come to expect from Apple. Yes, $299 is a more reasonable price, but the iPod Touch plays a role in the pricing. Plus, Apple want to suck an extra $30 per sale as pure profit. Why do you think they are sitting on more than $14 billion? I will just chalk the extra $30 up to an Apple Tax which covers better customer service compared to Google and the option of hitting a local Apple Store if I have problems.
The pricing on the iPod isn't the reason. Duh....its the cost to build it. Obviously it costs more to build an 8 inch device than a 4 inch device. There is more metal, more battery, more glass. My guess is that there is less margin on the iPad mini than the iPod Touch (although maybe the higher res screen makes up the difference). What do you want to bet that the margins on the iPad mini and the iPod touch are pretty close to the same.
No matter what people say or think, Apple has to pick some profit margin. Why wouldn't they optimize their profit margin? Wouldn't it be stupid not to? Also, they are sitting on more like a $100 billion in cash equivalents, not $14 billion. And the reason they have this kind of money is not from overcharging. You make that kind of money by selling a product that people want at a price they can afford. Apple's profits come from efficient manufacturing. Apple manufactures better products more cheaply than its competitors. Some of that value is passed on to customers (which is why they sell so many devices), but most of it is captured by Apple, which is why they have 100 billion in the bank.
Apple's intent was obviously not to compete with the Fire or Nexus 7. I was waiting for this product to come out but as soon as I saw the price tag, I ordered my Kindle Fire. If it grows up to replace my laptop than I might consider it over that, but I am not going to spend that much $ on a consumption device. They could have done $249 even $299 but $329 is ridiculous.
Apple's intent was obviously not to compete with the Fire or Nexus 7. I was waiting for this product to come out but as soon as I saw the price tag, I ordered my Kindle Fire. If it grows up to replace my laptop than I might consider it over that, but I am not going to spend that much $ on a consumption device. They could have done $249 even $299 but $329 is ridiculous.
Well, have fun with your Kindle Fire.
Though, I have to admit that I find it strange that somebody would make the effort to sign up to a forum in order to announce that they're not going to buy a certain product. But to each his own. Whatever floats your boat.
As for me, I'm not going to buy a Kindle Fire, it's simply too cheap, and I am offended by cheap products that don't offer what I'm looking for, but I doubt that I'm going to make the effort to sign up to some Kindle forum and state my case.
One decent study that says why someone wouldn't pay $329 when they believe they're getting something worth at least $329 -- instead of your marketing gobbledygook -- will suffice.
I'll wait.
That's a study I'm sure doesn't exist and has nothing to do with my point
Tim Cook: Well, what's the price point for the Mini?
Employee 1: $299
Tim Cook: How many do you think we can sell at that point?
Employee 1: 8.5 million in this quarter
Tim Cook: How many can we make?
Employee 2: We're a bit constrained but we can make 7 million.
Tim Cook: Hmmm... how many can we sell at $329
Employee 1: 7.75 million in this quarter
Tim Cook: $329 it is. Now get the f*ck out of here.
[changed my figures to be more in line with what I actually predict]
OMG he actually just trundled out that "if people pay it, it isn't too high" bullish*t.
Very sad.
One can sell a lot of things at a ridiculously high price, that doesn't mean it's fair or right.
Also, ... did anyone else but me think the screen size comparisons were a bit dubious? A lot of browsers do full-screen now. Technically, Chrome on Android still doesn't, but removing the menu bars etc. as part of the "analysis" is still a bit disingenuous viewed that way.
It felt kind of dirty to me to present it that way.
1) If people pay it it isn't too high is kind of the way the free market goes. I price something at X and people DON'T buy it in droves, I clearly screwed something up. Drop the price to X-50 and look at them fly off the shelves. Apple already has a good idea what price points people will accept thanks to all their other lines of devices and I won't be surprised at all to hear 10 or 12M iPad Minis this holiday season, provided they can maintain production.
2) When Phil did that he cut away menus and only showed the actual content. How is taking away menu bars that block screen space when trying to show how much of content you can actually view in a browser not accurate? These comparisons aren't done w/an alternate browser on the otehr device or with different settings, it's done stock. Most people run their devices stock, something a lot of tech geeks find scary and revolting, but it's true. A lot of folks don't know any better and if they get frustrated just end up getting rid of the device or it goes in a drawer and never emerges until a garage sale. I don't see how that comparison was flawed at all.
I bought the Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.7" when it first came out and that cost me 500. It's all in the eye of the consumer, it's up to he/she to find value in it. I think 330 isn't bad at all for the quality you get. I do have to say I use my Nook Tablet a lot more. Not that I'm comparing iOS to the Nooks OS or Android, I just own a ton of content for the Nook, mostly O'reilly books, Magazines and Comics for my son.
The only thing that still really bothers me about the iPad is the lack of MiniSD and a filemanager.
The Nexus isn't a bad tablet at all but I'd much rather have the mini.
I just played with a Nexus 7 a couple of days ago, not to shabby for 250. I was expecting something on the cheap side but it's well built, feel's solid and very responsive. I personally wouldn't want one but Google is defiantly doing things right with their hardware. Their new Chromebook ARM for instance at 250 is quite the deal, even the Nexus phone at 350.
I love the size of the iPad Mini, it hit's that sweet spot for me.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
Actually 720p is 1280x720, so 1024x768 is slightly LESS than 720p, not more.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }I eat my words.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }
Quote:
Originally Posted by agramonte
Would have to disagree on both points - On reading, You can set your font to resemble a paperback on a 7 inch screen easily (both size and content) so that is a non issue - On movies - this is not 1979, no reason to watch a movie on a 4:3 screen.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }Well, I have been reading books on the iPad and on the Kindle (several generations of both). I strongly feel that the Kindle does not give you anywhere enough area (the current one is 6" diagonal, 212ppi) for regular paperback-type reading [I use it because it is very light, very easy on the eyes, and has infinite battery life, at least in standby mode]. For professional reading (equations, graphs, etc) it's horribly inadequate, 7" is presumably better, but not better enough (Kindle DX was still not acceptable amount of area, but it came a bit closer). For movies, I have no objection to 16:9, my point is simply that at that physical size (7" idagonal, 16:9), you simply cannot tell the difference between 720p and 1080p, unless you are part eagle.
For those of us who read a lot, I think the iPad Maxi is the optimal size and screen res. I believe the Android tablets are way too small. Is the iPad mini the right size? Don't know, but 40% more area is a good start.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney
If you went into the BMW dealer near me and whined about the price of a BMW, they would try to sell you a Mini (Cooper).
So it really is a lot like Apple.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }A semi-good point. Semi, because at least where I live BMWs and Minis are sold in different dealerships. From personal experience, what they actually do is try to sell you a used BMW (the used market is quasi-non-existent in the electronics world, however, at least relatively to the car world).
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber
It's a fair price, but if the purpose was suck all the air out of the room for 7" tablets, they might have dumped them on the market at a break-even price point. Just as Windows did to Mac back in the day. But they may marginalize the others anyway, only time will tell.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }The Apple strategy is not to have 90% market share, but to have 90% share of the profits. In this they have succeeded admirably in every market they are in, and it seems that the 7.x tablet market is going to be another example.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }
Quote:
Originally Posted by agramonte
did not know I was posting in a location where within the context used "soda" would not refer to anything but a carbonated soft drink wich "Veuve Clicquot" is not.. I will need to be more precise in the future I suppose.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }Welcome to the rarefied world of Appleinsider, where Veuve Cliquot is just soda, and the iPad is just a tablet.
#next_pages_container { width: 5px; hight: 5px; position: absolute; top: -100px; left: -100px; z-index: 2147483647 !important; }
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpenzone
The ONLY reason this products is $329 and not $299 is because the iPod touch is $299.
Agreed. I took a trip to B&N and Staples and tested out the Nook Tablet and Nook Color, the Amazon Kindle HD and the Google Nexus 7.
1. The Kindle HD seems like a plastic toy. Not fun to use.
2. The B&N Nook Tablet and Nook Color are so slow when it comes to browsing the web (especially the Color model). Resizing web pages is terrible. Scrolling was painful.
3. The Nexus 7 was a nice tablet experience. No slowdown with the OS and only one hiccup / slowdown using the browser.
After playing with each of them I really have no problems paying extra for the iPad Mini compared to the Nexus 7 if the iPad Mini has the same quality construction I have come to expect from Apple. Yes, $299 is a more reasonable price, but the iPod Touch plays a role in the pricing. Plus, Apple want to suck an extra $30 per sale as pure profit. Why do you think they are sitting on more than $14 billion? I will just chalk the extra $30 up to an Apple Tax which covers better customer service compared to Google and the option of hitting a local Apple Store if I have problems.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][
Like I said yesterday, $329 is a fine price for the Mini.
If you think that it's too much, then don't buy one, go buy something else. Apple is going to move plenty of iPad Minis at the $329 price point. You should be glad that the bogus 8GB rumor turned out to be false.
That will be the test how well they move. I thought the Mini would come in at 299.00 but I don't see that much of an issue with 329.00. The only price point I thought was high yesterday was the new Macbook Pro 13". It isn't really 500.00 less than the 15" if you take into consideration that you get the larger retina screen you also get a 256 solid state and a dedicated gpu. If someone gets an education discount on the 15" it's 200.00 on the 13" its 100.00 which makes the 15" a far better deal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by msalganik
Price isn't much of a problem... as a laptop user I wanted something more portable than standard iPad but I didn't want to deal with Android. The iPad mini is exactly what I wanted. I'm a little miffed about the $100 for the first additional 16gb of storage. That's getting a little ridiculous but meh... I'm not about to jump to Android over that. I don't care that it doesn't have retina. Frankly, I want a go anywhere, just-works device for reading and browsing. For high-photo editing from my 20 mpx SLR, I've got a 24" monitor so I wasn't going to use an iPad for that anyway. I know for a fact that we're getting at least two of these this holiday season.... just hope availability isn't too much of a problem.
You and probably 20 million other people will feel the same way. The iPad mini is about losing weight and size to make it easier to use as a reader. I predict a lot of people will eventually own an iPad mini and an iPad.
Apple isn't charging a premium. The iPad mini is allegedly one of Apple's lowest margin products. The reality is that Google and Amazon are selling at cost or at a loss to get a user base and they make money other ways (search and content). That isn't Apple's business model. Apple makes good products and sells them for a fair price.
Wasn't it just 2.5 years ago when everyone was hoping for Apple to release an 8-10 inch mobile device under $1000? Apple shocked the world with an entry price of $499. Fast forward 2.5 years.... Apple delivers an almost 8 inch device at $329 and everyone is bitching? What gives?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing
Agreed. I took a trip to B&N and Staples and tested out the Nook Tablet and Nook Color, the Amazon Kindle HD and the Google Nexus 7.
1. The Kindle HD seems like a plastic toy. Not fun to use.
2. The B&N Nook Tablet and Nook Color are so slow when it comes to browsing the web (especially the Color model). Resizing web pages is terrible. Scrolling was painful.
3. The Nexus 7 was a nice tablet experience. No slowdown with the OS and only one hiccup / slowdown using the browser.
After playing with each of them I really have no problems paying extra for the iPad Mini compared to the Nexus 7 if the iPad Mini has the same quality construction I have come to expect from Apple. Yes, $299 is a more reasonable price, but the iPod Touch plays a role in the pricing. Plus, Apple want to suck an extra $30 per sale as pure profit. Why do you think they are sitting on more than $14 billion? I will just chalk the extra $30 up to an Apple Tax which covers better customer service compared to Google and the option of hitting a local Apple Store if I have problems.
The pricing on the iPod isn't the reason. Duh....its the cost to build it. Obviously it costs more to build an 8 inch device than a 4 inch device. There is more metal, more battery, more glass. My guess is that there is less margin on the iPad mini than the iPod Touch (although maybe the higher res screen makes up the difference). What do you want to bet that the margins on the iPad mini and the iPod touch are pretty close to the same.
No matter what people say or think, Apple has to pick some profit margin. Why wouldn't they optimize their profit margin? Wouldn't it be stupid not to? Also, they are sitting on more like a $100 billion in cash equivalents, not $14 billion. And the reason they have this kind of money is not from overcharging. You make that kind of money by selling a product that people want at a price they can afford. Apple's profits come from efficient manufacturing. Apple manufactures better products more cheaply than its competitors. Some of that value is passed on to customers (which is why they sell so many devices), but most of it is captured by Apple, which is why they have 100 billion in the bank.
No need for that.
Apple's intent was obviously not to compete with the Fire or Nexus 7. I was waiting for this product to come out but as soon as I saw the price tag, I ordered my Kindle Fire. If it grows up to replace my laptop than I might consider it over that, but I am not going to spend that much $ on a consumption device. They could have done $249 even $299 but $329 is ridiculous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xocolatl
Apple's intent was obviously not to compete with the Fire or Nexus 7. I was waiting for this product to come out but as soon as I saw the price tag, I ordered my Kindle Fire. If it grows up to replace my laptop than I might consider it over that, but I am not going to spend that much $ on a consumption device. They could have done $249 even $299 but $329 is ridiculous.
Well, have fun with your Kindle Fire.
Though, I have to admit that I find it strange that somebody would make the effort to sign up to a forum in order to announce that they're not going to buy a certain product. But to each his own. Whatever floats your boat.
As for me, I'm not going to buy a Kindle Fire, it's simply too cheap, and I am offended by cheap products that don't offer what I'm looking for, but I doubt that I'm going to make the effort to sign up to some Kindle forum and state my case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
Actually 720p is 1280x720, so 1024x768 is slightly LESS than 720p, not more.
Also the Nexus 7 is 1280x800 so even better.
The Nexus isn't a bad tablet at all but I'd much rather have the mini.
Extremely likely this happened.
One can debate about the fact whether the iPad mini is really 100$ better compared to the cheapest Android tablets.
Maybe for some people it is just xx$ better in specs/build-quality, but no one can't deny it is better.
I don't get the whole fuzz about this small amount of money.
Let us put things in perspective.
Compare it historically:
In the 80's and 90's my father spent 3000 dollars on a MacPlus, I spent over 250$ on a a top-end Aiwa Walkman (in the 80's and 90's price!!).
People forget at what price we get our toys these days.
Compare it with other stuff:
I use my iDevices every day a few hours, over the lifetime this would come down to just a few cents a day over the years.
I spent a whole lot more on shoes alone...
Bottom line: thanks for the technological advancements and also thank you China.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee
OMG he actually just trundled out that "if people pay it, it isn't too high" bullish*t.
Very sad.
One can sell a lot of things at a ridiculously high price, that doesn't mean it's fair or right.
Also, ... did anyone else but me think the screen size comparisons were a bit dubious? A lot of browsers do full-screen now. Technically, Chrome on Android still doesn't, but removing the menu bars etc. as part of the "analysis" is still a bit disingenuous viewed that way.
It felt kind of dirty to me to present it that way.
1) If people pay it it isn't too high is kind of the way the free market goes. I price something at X and people DON'T buy it in droves, I clearly screwed something up. Drop the price to X-50 and look at them fly off the shelves. Apple already has a good idea what price points people will accept thanks to all their other lines of devices and I won't be surprised at all to hear 10 or 12M iPad Minis this holiday season, provided they can maintain production.
2) When Phil did that he cut away menus and only showed the actual content. How is taking away menu bars that block screen space when trying to show how much of content you can actually view in a browser not accurate? These comparisons aren't done w/an alternate browser on the otehr device or with different settings, it's done stock. Most people run their devices stock, something a lot of tech geeks find scary and revolting, but it's true. A lot of folks don't know any better and if they get frustrated just end up getting rid of the device or it goes in a drawer and never emerges until a garage sale. I don't see how that comparison was flawed at all.
I bought the Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.7" when it first came out and that cost me 500. It's all in the eye of the consumer, it's up to he/she to find value in it. I think 330 isn't bad at all for the quality you get. I do have to say I use my Nook Tablet a lot more. Not that I'm comparing iOS to the Nooks OS or Android, I just own a ton of content for the Nook, mostly O'reilly books, Magazines and Comics for my son.
The only thing that still really bothers me about the iPad is the lack of MiniSD and a filemanager.
I just played with a Nexus 7 a couple of days ago, not to shabby for 250. I was expecting something on the cheap side but it's well built, feel's solid and very responsive. I personally wouldn't want one but Google is defiantly doing things right with their hardware. Their new Chromebook ARM for instance at 250 is quite the deal, even the Nexus phone at 350.
I love the size of the iPad Mini, it hit's that sweet spot for me.