The developer situation is interesting. Android has outsold iOS for quite some time... but there haven't been too many Android-exclusive apps that I'm aware of. We're at the point now where most of the "top 100" apps are on both platforms... but there are still quite a few iOS-exclusive apps.
Yep, the major apps are on both platforms. (The only one I'm missing on Android is the iOS Optimum online app that lets me watch TV on my iPad.)
One major difference is that Android has lots of interesting control apps and widgets. Stock iOS doesn't allow such things.
Android handsets are supposedly selling a million per day. That's a lot of units. But I can't recall any developer who dropped iOS in favor of Android. I think the iOS ecosystem is still a massive draw for developers.
The biggest problem with any market is getting people to find your app. In the Apple App Store, half of US app revenue goes to just 25 developers.
At the same time, I've read of a few developers dropping Android because of not getting enough returns there, either.
...and that the plan she wanted is not available for the iPhone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
What plan was that?
I don't remember the details. Her carrier had some deal on a combination of minutes, data and add-ons that appealed to her, but it wasn't available for the iPhone. I don't know why. I have long since given up trying to understand how Canadian carriers get away with abusing their customers the way they do.
I don't remember the details. Her carrier had some deal on a combination of minutes, data and add-ons that appealed to her, but it wasn't available for the iPhone. I don't know why.
I know why; because the carriers are idiots and restrict iPhones. Ugh… That really shouldn't be allowed.
Companies go out of business when they run out of money... not because of their ranking on a market share chart.
But since you like charts... here is the preliminary forecast of the Top 5 OEMs for 2012: Smartphones
28% Samsung
20% Apple
5% Nokia
5% HTC
5% RIM ALL Phones
29% Samsung
24% Nokia
10% Apple
6% ZTE
4% LG
Apple is 2nd place in global smartphone sales... and 3rd place in ALL phones sold in the world... 20% and 10% respectively. That's actually not bad considering they only make one new phone a year... and it's a rather expensive phone. Smartphone Platforms
75% Android
14% iOS
Those particular numbers might look scary... but hold on.
Apple made $8.2 billion in profit last quarter. That's an incredible number whether they are in 1st place or last place. That's why I don't think market share ranking is a big deal.
Apple may be a distant 2nd on that chart... but they are not having a yard sale to liquidate their assets.
Yes... I think RIM is in trouble. They are having trouble moving units and they are laying off people at an alarming rate.
Apple isn't. They are selling iPhones as fast as they can make them. They are hiring more employees. They are building a new headquarters to house them all. Apple is the complete opposite of RIM.
The developer situation is interesting. Android has outsold iOS for quite some time... but there haven't been too many Android-exclusive apps that I'm aware of. We're at the point now where most of the "top 100" apps are on both platforms... but there are still quite a few iOS-exclusive apps.
Android handsets are supposedly selling a million per day. That's a lot of units. But I can't recall any developer who dropped iOS in favor of Android. I think the iOS ecosystem is still a massive draw for developers.
This article sheds some light on it: http://www.knowyourmobile.com/features/1639307/android_vs_ios_a_developers_perspective_on_the_big_two.html
Drawback to developing for Android include: fewer paying customers, piracy, less-mature APIs, device inconsistency, and Android version adoption.
This is just one developer's experience... but clearly something is going on. With so many Android devices out in the world... you'd think developers would be fawning all over Android.
So... Android outsells iOS... but developers prefer iOS anyway. And Android phones outsells iPhones... but Apple still makes a healthy amount of money.
Maybe that's just how it will be.
you are contradicting yourself with RIM. It's market share in the top EU countries is 15%. And yet people see it as doomed. My suspicion is that - on this American dominated site - were Apples share in the US equal to its world share there would be more panic.
I am tired of hearing about profit, too. I made the point that profit follows marketshare for platforms. And Apples profit share is decreasing.
There will be a cheap phone. Apple is not going to compete forever with one high end phone released every year.
And given the long tail, the cross-platform apps are the apps most people use. There are plenty for both platforms, and neither platform is going away.
I don't understand the fervor in this forum to eliminate consumer choice. There's no harm to anyone if someone else prefers a different OS.
I like chocolate cake, someone else likes cheesecake. How many posts can there be about something so trivial?
Interesting straw man. The debate is between people who think that Androids acceleration in market share is nothing to worry about, and those who think it is something to worry about. Absolutely nobody is arguing that Android is going to 0%.
you are contradicting yourself with RIM. It's market share in the top EU countries is 15%. And yet people see it as doomed. My suspicion is that - on this American dominated site - were Apples share in the US equal to its world share there would be more panic.
I am tired of hearing about profit, too. I made the point that profit follows marketshare for platforms. And Apples profit share is decreasing.
There will be a cheap phone. Apple is not going to compete forever with one high end phone released every year.
Those figures I listed were worldwide.
RIM worldwide is only 5% in smartphones and they don't even rank in the top 5 in ALL phones.
So is RIM doomed? Maybe not. Are they paying their bills? They are laying off people... which could indicate some problems.
You can't discredit profit though... profit is what actually makes companies run. You can't pay your rent by showing your landlord a market share graph
But if RIM isn't doomed... then Apple sure as hell isn't either.
The debate is between people who think that Androids acceleration in market share is nothing to worry about, and those who think it is something to worry about. Absolutely nobody is arguing that Android is going to 0%
What's to worry about?
Apple had 1% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 5% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 10% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple has 14% of the smart phone market... and is profitable.
Sorry to keep mentioning profits... but that's what makes the world go around. There's even a song about it
It apparently doesn't matter what the other guys are doing... as Apple has this uncanny ability to make money despite intense competition.
Apple may not sell the most units... but the ones they do sell earn them serious income.
The biggest problem with any market is getting people to find your app. In the Apple App Store, half of US app revenue goes to just 25 developers.
At the same time, I've read of a few developers dropping Android because of not getting enough returns there, either.
That's a problem in any business though.
If you want to sell a physical product... the holy grail is Wal-Mart. But you're still competing with eyeballs among tens of thousand of other products on the shelves.
Marketing comes into play. However, most small dev teams don't have money to spend on advertising.
Your best bet is to send your app to people who review apps... or get them mentioned on some blogs or whatever.
I've seen this so often... an amazing app that no one has ever heard of. Who's fault is that?
The developer's jobs doesn't end once they've uploaded it to iTunes.
The old rules still apply whether you sell apps or physical goods.... you can't sit there and wait for your customers to come to you.
* Android users establish no ties to Android
* They generally find using Android and the hardware it runs on a frustrating experience, for various reasons
* They switch to Apple because they just want their phones to work without fuss and confusion
Let me briefly address this.
"*Android users establish no ties to Android"
This is a strange claim because the Android ~ecosystem~ does exist. Mainly through Google cloud services but there are a lot of apps that one does become fond of, and there are things like Swype typing that become absolutely indispensable.
"*They generally find using Android and the hardware it runs on a frustrating experience, for various reasons"
No doubt any hardware before Android 4 is frustrating and virtually unusable. That's why I am highlighting marquee phones like Droid DNA, S2, S3, OneX, OneXL, OneX+ and even the humble Xperia S. Plus what's coming out in 2013 with Android 4.1 or above is going to be pretty slick. Don't just take my word for it, check out what happens next year.
"* They switch to Apple because they just want their phones to work without fuss and confusion"
I have no doubt some of this happens, but I am saying that my personal experience is that people go the other way as well because of a desire of something more "exciting". Even with Android 4.x there is some perseverance needed initially but that's why the younger generation, enthusiasts and "IT" people are considering Android more and more. In my situation I have an iPhone 5 and iPad 3 to fallback on but I found that after a few weeks, I could do everything I needed on an Android smartphone and an Android tablet. Google cloud services are also actually more reliable than iCloud ~ for example, the iCloud website is pretty but somewhat cumbersome to use.
Those figures I listed were worldwide.
RIM worldwide is only 5% in smartphones and they don't even rank in the top 5 in ALL phones.
So is RIM doomed? Maybe not. Are they paying their bills? They are laying off people... which could indicate some problems.
You can't discredit profit though... profit is what actually makes companies run. You can't pay your rent by showing your landlord a market share graph
But if RIM isn't doomed... then Apple sure as hell isn't either.
What's to worry about?
Apple had 1% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 5% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 10% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple has 14% of the smart phone market... and is profitable.
Sorry to keep mentioning profits... but that's what makes the world go around. There's even a song about it
It apparently doesn't matter what the other guys are doing... as Apple has this uncanny ability to make money despite intense competition.
Apple may not sell the most units... but the ones they do sell earn them serious income.
I'll be clear. I don't care about profits. I own no stock. I care that my investment in Apple - which is in iTunes, apps, the ecosystem - pays off and the platform continues to get the best apps first from all devs, as it has been doing.
And as I said, declines in market share trend to declines in profit over time.
I'll be clear. I don't care about profits. I own no stock. I care that my investment in Apple - which is in iTunes, apps, the ecosystem - pays off and the platform continues to get the best apps first from all devs, as it has been doing.
And as I said, declines in market share trend to declines in profit over time.
Apple's shipment market share has been declining for the last year or two yet their profit share remains the same or continues to rise.
The PC market is not the same as the smart phone market. Apparently many Android users buy phones just to make calls hence all the usage stats favoring Apple.
Apple is setting records every quarter because the smart market is a expanding.
Apple's shipment market share has been declining for the last year or two yet their profit share remains the same or continues to rise.
The PC market is not the same as the smart phone market. Apparently many Android users buy phones just to make calls hence all the usage stats favoring Apple.
Apple is setting records every quarter because the smart market is a expanding.
I suppose I needn't have bothered saying that I didn't care about profit share ( which is in fact declining, Profit isn't but profit share is).
I'll be clear. I don't care about profits. I own no stock. I care that my investment in Apple - which is in iTunes, apps, the ecosystem - pays off and the platform continues to get the best apps first from all devs, as it has been doing.
And as I said, declines in market share trend to declines in profit over time.
You should be in good shape then. Despite having a fraction of the market share of Android... developers tend to favor iOS. They even like Passbook according to an article I just read today.
I don't think Apple will ever be in a situation like Palm was... where they were forced to sell themselves because people stopped buying their stuff.
Again... Apple might not have as much market share... but iOS devices and platform are insanely popular in their own right.
What annoys me is that some of them still severely restrict options even off contract.
How about: My contract is up. I bought a new phone. I have to pay the carrier an ACTIVATION FEE to use it. Wait, that's not the good part yet.
Now my kid wants to use the old phone as a WiFi-only iPod, but before she can do that I have to pay the carrier $50 to unlock it! I have to PAY them for the privilege of using my own property!
How about: My contract is up. I bought a new phone. I have to pay the carrier an ACTIVATION FEE to use it. Wait, that's not the good part yet.
Now my kid wants to use the old phone as a WiFi-only iPod, but before she can do that I have to pay the carrier $50 to unlock it! I have to PAY them for the privilege of using my own property!
That is really bad. I understand restrictions when they have money invested in it. I find them to be ridiculous at other times. I mean your contract on that device is up right? At that point it should be a fully owned device.
How about: My contract is up. I bought a new phone. I have to pay the carrier an ACTIVATION FEE to use it. Wait, that's not the good part yet.
Now my kid wants to use the old phone as a WiFi-only iPod, but before she can do that I have to pay the carrier $50 to unlock it! I have to PAY them for the privilege of using my own property!
Two words. Jail. Break. Sorted. Also, consider Android phones in the future because this is less likely to happen because you can make modifications to the phones easier to avoid such dodgy stuff from naughty carriers.
I'll be clear. I don't care about profits. I own no stock. I care that my investment in Apple - which is in iTunes, apps, the ecosystem - pays off and the platform continues to get the best apps first from all devs, as it has been doing.
And as I said, declines in market share trend to declines in profit over time.
That's interesting. Do you believe there is any "risk" to Apple at this stage? Or is it all just "Fandroid" hype?
Most Android users turn off the Wifi, Bluetooth and GPS because doing so actually results in an appreciable increase in their device's battery life. Android's power management is, in fact, that bad.
Comments
deleted
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
The developer situation is interesting. Android has outsold iOS for quite some time... but there haven't been too many Android-exclusive apps that I'm aware of. We're at the point now where most of the "top 100" apps are on both platforms... but there are still quite a few iOS-exclusive apps.
Yep, the major apps are on both platforms. (The only one I'm missing on Android is the iOS Optimum online app that lets me watch TV on my iPad.)
One major difference is that Android has lots of interesting control apps and widgets. Stock iOS doesn't allow such things.
Android handsets are supposedly selling a million per day. That's a lot of units. But I can't recall any developer who dropped iOS in favor of Android. I think the iOS ecosystem is still a massive draw for developers.
The biggest problem with any market is getting people to find your app. In the Apple App Store, half of US app revenue goes to just 25 developers.
At the same time, I've read of a few developers dropping Android because of not getting enough returns there, either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
...and that the plan she wanted is not available for the iPhone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
What plan was that?
I don't remember the details. Her carrier had some deal on a combination of minutes, data and add-ons that appealed to her, but it wasn't available for the iPhone. I don't know why. I have long since given up trying to understand how Canadian carriers get away with abusing their customers the way they do.
Originally Posted by v5v
I don't remember the details. Her carrier had some deal on a combination of minutes, data and add-ons that appealed to her, but it wasn't available for the iPhone. I don't know why.
I know why; because the carriers are idiots and restrict iPhones. Ugh… That really shouldn't be allowed.
…Canadian carriers…
I'm so sorry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I know why; because the carriers are idiots and restrict iPhones. Ugh… That really shouldn't be allowed.
I don't know if I'd call it "restricting" iPhones, more like "profiteering" on iPhones. When demand exceeds supply they can get away with gouging.
you are contradicting yourself with RIM. It's market share in the top EU countries is 15%. And yet people see it as doomed. My suspicion is that - on this American dominated site - were Apples share in the US equal to its world share there would be more panic.
I am tired of hearing about profit, too. I made the point that profit follows marketshare for platforms. And Apples profit share is decreasing.
There will be a cheap phone. Apple is not going to compete forever with one high end phone released every year.
Interesting straw man. The debate is between people who think that Androids acceleration in market share is nothing to worry about, and those who think it is something to worry about. Absolutely nobody is arguing that Android is going to 0%.
deleted
Those figures I listed were worldwide.
RIM worldwide is only 5% in smartphones and they don't even rank in the top 5 in ALL phones.
So is RIM doomed? Maybe not. Are they paying their bills? They are laying off people... which could indicate some problems.
You can't discredit profit though... profit is what actually makes companies run. You can't pay your rent by showing your landlord a market share graph
But if RIM isn't doomed... then Apple sure as hell isn't either.
What's to worry about?
Apple had 1% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 5% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple had 10% of the smart phone market... and was profitable.
Apple has 14% of the smart phone market... and is profitable.
Sorry to keep mentioning profits... but that's what makes the world go around. There's even a song about it
It apparently doesn't matter what the other guys are doing... as Apple has this uncanny ability to make money despite intense competition.
Apple may not sell the most units... but the ones they do sell earn them serious income.
That's a problem in any business though.
If you want to sell a physical product... the holy grail is Wal-Mart. But you're still competing with eyeballs among tens of thousand of other products on the shelves.
Marketing comes into play. However, most small dev teams don't have money to spend on advertising.
Your best bet is to send your app to people who review apps... or get them mentioned on some blogs or whatever.
I've seen this so often... an amazing app that no one has ever heard of. Who's fault is that?
The developer's jobs doesn't end once they've uploaded it to iTunes.
The old rules still apply whether you sell apps or physical goods.... you can't sit there and wait for your customers to come to you.
Let me briefly address this.
"*Android users establish no ties to Android"
This is a strange claim because the Android ~ecosystem~ does exist. Mainly through Google cloud services but there are a lot of apps that one does become fond of, and there are things like Swype typing that become absolutely indispensable.
"*They generally find using Android and the hardware it runs on a frustrating experience, for various reasons"
No doubt any hardware before Android 4 is frustrating and virtually unusable. That's why I am highlighting marquee phones like Droid DNA, S2, S3, OneX, OneXL, OneX+ and even the humble Xperia S. Plus what's coming out in 2013 with Android 4.1 or above is going to be pretty slick. Don't just take my word for it, check out what happens next year.
"* They switch to Apple because they just want their phones to work without fuss and confusion"
I have no doubt some of this happens, but I am saying that my personal experience is that people go the other way as well because of a desire of something more "exciting". Even with Android 4.x there is some perseverance needed initially but that's why the younger generation, enthusiasts and "IT" people are considering Android more and more. In my situation I have an iPhone 5 and iPad 3 to fallback on but I found that after a few weeks, I could do everything I needed on an Android smartphone and an Android tablet. Google cloud services are also actually more reliable than iCloud ~ for example, the iCloud website is pretty but somewhat cumbersome to use.
I'll be clear. I don't care about profits. I own no stock. I care that my investment in Apple - which is in iTunes, apps, the ecosystem - pays off and the platform continues to get the best apps first from all devs, as it has been doing.
And as I said, declines in market share trend to declines in profit over time.
Apple's shipment market share has been declining for the last year or two yet their profit share remains the same or continues to rise.
The PC market is not the same as the smart phone market. Apparently many Android users buy phones just to make calls hence all the usage stats favoring Apple.
Apple is setting records every quarter because the smart market is a expanding.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
Apple's shipment market share has been declining for the last year or two yet their profit share remains the same or continues to rise.
The PC market is not the same as the smart phone market. Apparently many Android users buy phones just to make calls hence all the usage stats favoring Apple.
Apple is setting records every quarter because the smart market is a expanding.
I suppose I needn't have bothered saying that I didn't care about profit share ( which is in fact declining, Profit isn't but profit share is).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I know why; because the carriers are idiots and restrict iPhones. Ugh… That really shouldn't be allowed.
I'm so sorry.
What annoys me is that some of them still severely restrict options even off contract.
You should be in good shape then. Despite having a fraction of the market share of Android... developers tend to favor iOS. They even like Passbook according to an article I just read today.
I don't think Apple will ever be in a situation like Palm was... where they were forced to sell themselves because people stopped buying their stuff.
Again... Apple might not have as much market share... but iOS devices and platform are insanely popular in their own right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm
What annoys me is that some of them still severely restrict options even off contract.
How about: My contract is up. I bought a new phone. I have to pay the carrier an ACTIVATION FEE to use it. Wait, that's not the good part yet.
Now my kid wants to use the old phone as a WiFi-only iPod, but before she can do that I have to pay the carrier $50 to unlock it! I have to PAY them for the privilege of using my own property!
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
How about: My contract is up. I bought a new phone. I have to pay the carrier an ACTIVATION FEE to use it. Wait, that's not the good part yet.
Now my kid wants to use the old phone as a WiFi-only iPod, but before she can do that I have to pay the carrier $50 to unlock it! I have to PAY them for the privilege of using my own property!
That is really bad. I understand restrictions when they have money invested in it. I find them to be ridiculous at other times. I mean your contract on that device is up right? At that point it should be a fully owned device.
Two words. Jail. Break. Sorted. Also, consider Android phones in the future because this is less likely to happen because you can make modifications to the phones easier to avoid such dodgy stuff from naughty carriers.
That's interesting. Do you believe there is any "risk" to Apple at this stage? Or is it all just "Fandroid" hype?
Most Android users turn off the Wifi, Bluetooth and GPS because doing so actually results in an appreciable increase in their device's battery life. Android's power management is, in fact, that bad.