If you read the support thread you'll find the schools involved in the discussion didn't choose to update to iOS7 nor download it in the first place. With that said they didn't actively block Apple from sending the update to student-issued iPads either. https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5379636?tstart=0
Exactly. The schools gave students a system that had not been properly configured for security and then complained when there was a security problem.
Nonsense. Only someone who doesn't write software would think that way. It is mathematically impossible not to have bugs. And as a system gets more capability, it will get more bugs. That's the nature of the beast. All you can hope for minimizing them.
There isn't any "lost their way of excellence." The fact that there are so FEW bugs shows that they have a high degree of QA. No offense, but you're no tech prodigy.
Spoken like a true coder that has no clue of reality. Some of us know both side of the equation. I never once stated that there should never be bugs. You created that delusion all on your own. Fact is there are some fundamental user interface flaws that exist that are in no way like the Apple I have come to know and love.
But thanks for responding and including an insult non the less.
Apple is at fault here, but so are the school districts. You NEVER implement a major upgrade without testing it in your own system and with your own particular setup.
ABSOLUTELY! Putting the blame to Apple (which is deserverd) aside, what IT department just implements a major update like that without testing? Crazy and irresponsible. Someone should lose their job for that.
If you read the support thread you'll find the schools involved in the discussion didn't choose to update to iOS7 nor download it in the first place. With that said they didn't actively block Apple from sending the update to student-issued iPads either. https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5379636?tstart=0
So iOS 7 just magically appeared on these devices? I know my mom just updated to iOS 7 on her iPad but she got a specific message saying an updated was available for install. It didn't install on her device without her knowing. I still haven't updated my 3rd gen iPad and have no plans to do so.
There were rumors of a point release coming out next week. Hopefully that will include a fix for this issue. Last thing Apple needs is an issue that Microsoft can easily exploit.
Spoken like a true coder that has no clue of reality. Some of us know both side of the equation. I never once stated that there should never be bugs. You created that delusion all on your own. Fact is there are some fundamental user interface flaws that exist that are in no way like the Apple I have come to know and love.
But thanks for responding and including an insult non the less.
Are "user interface flaws" really bugs? I think there are some design aspects of iOS 7 that feel unfinished but I don't know that I'd call them bugs. I have installed on my phone and haven't had one issue yet.
ABSOLUTELY! Putting the blame to Apple (which is deserverd) aside, what IT department just implements a major update like that without testing? Crazy and irresponsible. Someone should lose their job for that.
:rolleyes: They didn't implement it without testing. They didn't choose to implement it at all according to support threads. I think some are misunderstanding how the update got there.
According to posts the OS push-update bypassed all the other controls that school IT departments put in place to keep students from modifying their devices, something that at least some of those schools didn't anticipate tho perhaps they should have. Dunno. Even the well-regarded Kilted Tim on Apple support forums said "There is no more possibility that the download happened by itself than there is that the Earth is flat and only 6000 years old." . He changed his mind rather than re-mapping the Earth of course when he found his own company's iPads downloading iOS all on their own.
@ Rogifan: Students saw and approved the update on their school-issued iPads. It wasn't the IT departments that approved it and rolled it out.
This appears to be a known issue because out IT team that handles iPhones security sent an email about the need to update the security profiles prior to iOS7 installation. I am not aware of everything that went on or why but they knew it would need to be done.
Oh my god the children we must protect the children from evil web content. Yeah if you want someone attention on something calling in the children.
Really did apple screw up here or did the company who provide the nanny product that schools are obviously loading on ipad is at fault, Apple does not verify if 3rd party apps continue to work, thus the reason they allow you to beta test the product before it is release. Someone else already said it the schools screwed up why would they whole sale update to the new iOS until you know it does not cause a problem. Especially if you are worried about protecting the children.
Hell I told my family not to update yet and we have not since I know enough that these updates always break stuff and Apple said that not all the apps have been update to support ios. I beginning to see app I use being listed as fix for iOS so it broke things why deal with the hassle. Not like in the past where you can downgrade if the problems are too unmanageable.
Just an observation: 4 of the people in this thread posting that the sky is falling because Apple QC has really dropped off each have a couple dozen posts. One almost think there is a coordinated effort to spread FUD about Apple for popular forums. Then media outlets can say that there is widespread dissatisfaction and cause for alarm. I wonder who would have an incentive to do something like that.
1. You set a rule that the students not upgrade until the school says it's okay because it might break apps they need for class and if they break this rule they can't use it as an excuse and will fail every days works until the issue is fixed even if it means they fail the term. No appeals on this
2. You spot check devices at least once a week to insure compliance with this, with not deleting profiles (ie LAUSD) etc
3. If the schools told the students to do the upgrade it's on them
4. This issue might also happen if they were using outside MDM that hadn't tested yet. And doesn't block OTA updates. Or at least require a password the kids don't have.
5 how do we know the kids weren't restoring on a computer to try to remove the profiles on purpose if they do block Internet etc. This could be another LAUSD trick. They try to remove the profiles only to discover theirs ARE passworded so they DFU etc. Might have little to do with iOS 7 at least at some schools
Still better than Android or Windows, but it's been a while since Apple's "it just works" mentality.
Total misquote. Apple has never said that their stuff is without issue, particularly for all users or use cases
"It just works" was a statement made in response to the complicated install etc process of windows computers at the time of the comment. Unlike Apple where you turn it in and it's ready to go -- it just works
I love Apple and what they are all about. This is one example of where they have lost their way of excellence. There are a number of things both in iOS7 and also in the desktop OS that make you question who is watching some of the details.
The bar is set high by them and they need to step up to stay there.
I might agree with your example if Apple was an education tech or business tech company. As their primary focus.
But they are not. They aren't even a creative pro focused company anymore. They are a general use company with a couple of small side products. Education and MDM are infants in their world, particularly in terms of hard core restrictions, etc. There are other companies that have been doing this kind of thing longer even in iOS that have also screwed up (it is an outside company that LAUSD is using! which doesn't passcode their profiles so the kiddies can remove them in under five seconds)
It was more the students that updated to iOS7 when it was offered. Apple automatically downloaded the update to those students' iPads.
Or it didn't. More often than not a finger hits a button rather than an auto download
And a smart IT would have thought of iOS updates causing an issue with needed apps if nothing else and asked apple for the server address to bar it the same as Facebook etc. Sure that won't stop some kid from doing a DFU on his home computer so he can update to the new version of minecraft etc. But it would slow things down
Just an observation: 4 of the people in this thread posting that the sky is falling because Apple QC has really dropped off each have a couple dozen posts. One almost think there is a coordinated effort to spread FUD about Apple for popular forums. Then media outlets can say that there is widespread dissatisfaction and cause for alarm. I wonder who would have an incentive to do something like that.
That's fairly standard in forums like this. There is a lot of Apple bashing that appears to be orchestrated by their competition. There's even more that's orchestrated by media that benefits from putting Apple down.
Learn how to deploy upgrades via wifi. Or use a vendor like Airwatch to build your supervisory profiles.
After seeing this article I asked an IT director at my local bank if they experienced the same problem with their iPads - and the answer was a simple "No". They use Airwatch.
That's the company LAUSD allegedly uses. With the easy to remove profiles.
Guess the folks at your bank are either dumber and never thought it could be that simple, or more mature
ABSOLUTELY! Putting the blame to Apple (which is deserverd) aside, what IT department just implements a major update like that without testing? Crazy and irresponsible. Someone should lose their job for that.
The fact that iOS 7 was in preview all summer (when the kiddies likely didn't have the iPads) doesn't help.
$99 a year for access to those previews is a small price to pay for early testing. Or doing things like asking for that server address etc
Apple is at fault here, but so are the school districts. You NEVER implement a major upgrade without testing it in your own system and with your own particular setup.
I've yet to find a compelling reason to upgrade iOS 7, especially as the bug reports keep rolling out. The software is two weeks old and we're already up to three bug fix updates?
I'm curious why software updates weren't disabled in the iPads. Any updates to such devices should be controlled, I would think. Arrange to do them over the Summer, when presumably the kids don't get to keep them. Why do kids in school need the latest cutting edge updates? My textbooks in the 80s were published in the 50s. I think kids can do with last years software.
I mean what happens when the iPads no longer support the current updates or apps in three years? Is LAUSD really going to buy brand new iPads for the entire district to get the latest software? Doubtful.
I'm still confused by a couple things. One, did these schools not have beta versions of iOS 7 that they were testing? One would assume if they did these security issues would have been discovered during one of the betas. Do these IT departments have the ability to control whether software updates are pushed to students devices or not? If they tested all of this and it was fine, but had issues when iOS 7 went live then that's obviously a big problem. Either way Apple needs to fix (and according to the Verge a fix is coming this month).
Comments
Exactly. The schools gave students a system that had not been properly configured for security and then complained when there was a security problem.
Nonsense. Only someone who doesn't write software would think that way. It is mathematically impossible not to have bugs. And as a system gets more capability, it will get more bugs. That's the nature of the beast. All you can hope for minimizing them.
There isn't any "lost their way of excellence." The fact that there are so FEW bugs shows that they have a high degree of QA. No offense, but you're no tech prodigy.
Spoken like a true coder that has no clue of reality. Some of us know both side of the equation. I never once stated that there should never be bugs. You created that delusion all on your own. Fact is there are some fundamental user interface flaws that exist that are in no way like the Apple I have come to know and love.
But thanks for responding and including an insult non the less.
Exactly.
Apple is at fault here, but so are the school districts. You NEVER implement a major upgrade without testing it in your own system and with your own particular setup.
ABSOLUTELY! Putting the blame to Apple (which is deserverd) aside, what IT department just implements a major update like that without testing? Crazy and irresponsible. Someone should lose their job for that.
There were rumors of a point release coming out next week. Hopefully that will include a fix for this issue. Last thing Apple needs is an issue that Microsoft can easily exploit.
Are "user interface flaws" really bugs? I think there are some design aspects of iOS 7 that feel unfinished but I don't know that I'd call them bugs. I have installed on my phone and haven't had one issue yet.
:rolleyes: They didn't implement it without testing. They didn't choose to implement it at all according to support threads. I think some are misunderstanding how the update got there.
According to posts the OS push-update bypassed all the other controls that school IT departments put in place to keep students from modifying their devices, something that at least some of those schools didn't anticipate tho perhaps they should have. Dunno. Even the well-regarded Kilted Tim on Apple support forums said "There is no more possibility that the download happened by itself than there is that the Earth is flat and only 6000 years old." . He changed his mind rather than re-mapping the Earth of course when he found his own company's iPads downloading iOS all on their own.
@ Rogifan: Students saw and approved the update on their school-issued iPads. It wasn't the IT departments that approved it and rolled it out.
This appears to be a known issue because out IT team that handles iPhones security sent an email about the need to update the security profiles prior to iOS7 installation. I am not aware of everything that went on or why but they knew it would need to be done.
Oh my god the children we must protect the children from evil web content. Yeah if you want someone attention on something calling in the children.
Really did apple screw up here or did the company who provide the nanny product that schools are obviously loading on ipad is at fault, Apple does not verify if 3rd party apps continue to work, thus the reason they allow you to beta test the product before it is release. Someone else already said it the schools screwed up why would they whole sale update to the new iOS until you know it does not cause a problem. Especially if you are worried about protecting the children.
Hell I told my family not to update yet and we have not since I know enough that these updates always break stuff and Apple said that not all the apps have been update to support ios. I beginning to see app I use being listed as fix for iOS so it broke things why deal with the hassle. Not like in the past where you can downgrade if the problems are too unmanageable.
Just an observation: 4 of the people in this thread posting that the sky is falling because Apple QC has really dropped off each have a couple dozen posts. One almost think there is a coordinated effort to spread FUD about Apple for popular forums. Then media outlets can say that there is widespread dissatisfaction and cause for alarm. I wonder who would have an incentive to do something like that.
2. You spot check devices at least once a week to insure compliance with this, with not deleting profiles (ie LAUSD) etc
3. If the schools told the students to do the upgrade it's on them
4. This issue might also happen if they were using outside MDM that hadn't tested yet. And doesn't block OTA updates. Or at least require a password the kids don't have.
5 how do we know the kids weren't restoring on a computer to try to remove the profiles on purpose if they do block Internet etc. This could be another LAUSD trick. They try to remove the profiles only to discover theirs ARE passworded so they DFU etc. Might have little to do with iOS 7 at least at some schools
Total misquote. Apple has never said that their stuff is without issue, particularly for all users or use cases
"It just works" was a statement made in response to the complicated install etc process of windows computers at the time of the comment. Unlike Apple where you turn it in and it's ready to go -- it just works
I might agree with your example if Apple was an education tech or business tech company. As their primary focus.
But they are not. They aren't even a creative pro focused company anymore. They are a general use company with a couple of small side products. Education and MDM are infants in their world, particularly in terms of hard core restrictions, etc. There are other companies that have been doing this kind of thing longer even in iOS that have also screwed up (it is an outside company that LAUSD is using! which doesn't passcode their profiles so the kiddies can remove them in under five seconds)
Or it didn't. More often than not a finger hits a button rather than an auto download
And a smart IT would have thought of iOS updates causing an issue with needed apps if nothing else and asked apple for the server address to bar it the same as Facebook etc. Sure that won't stop some kid from doing a DFU on his home computer so he can update to the new version of minecraft etc. But it would slow things down
That's fairly standard in forums like this. There is a lot of Apple bashing that appears to be orchestrated by their competition. There's even more that's orchestrated by media that benefits from putting Apple down.
That's the company LAUSD allegedly uses. With the easy to remove profiles.
Guess the folks at your bank are either dumber and never thought it could be that simple, or more mature
The fact that iOS 7 was in preview all summer (when the kiddies likely didn't have the iPads) doesn't help.
$99 a year for access to those previews is a small price to pay for early testing. Or doing things like asking for that server address etc
Exactly.
Apple is at fault here, but so are the school districts. You NEVER implement a major upgrade without testing it in your own system and with your own particular setup.
Best post!
Users have no control over the auto download. It seems some number of iOS users didn't realize that, catching them by surprise.
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5403258
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5387196
I'm curious why software updates weren't disabled in the iPads. Any updates to such devices should be controlled, I would think. Arrange to do them over the Summer, when presumably the kids don't get to keep them. Why do kids in school need the latest cutting edge updates? My textbooks in the 80s were published in the 50s. I think kids can do with last years software.
I mean what happens when the iPads no longer support the current updates or apps in three years? Is LAUSD really going to buy brand new iPads for the entire district to get the latest software? Doubtful.