You're right that I have never used a Surface. I have seen it at Best Buy a few times, so I do know how it looks in person. I'm no fan of Windows, so right there, that is a big negative against the Surface, at least as far as I'm concerned.
You're comparing the Surface keyboard to typing on an iPad, why not compare it to a Macbook Air or Macbook Pro?
If I need to type something long on my iPad, I'll just pair my Apple bluetooth keyboard.
Your right, I should have compared it to my MacBook Air, it's very comparable now, the older version was a mess, specifically the trackpad, so when I bought the Surface Pro 3 I purposely didn't buy the keyboard since, I use either my MS Wedge or Apple keyboard for everything anyway. One of the doctors here also has a Surface Pro 3 so I asked if I could use it for the day, which he graciously offered. I liked it immediately, especially now that it attaches in a way where it gives it some angle, much more comfortable, the keys are also a lot stiffer, not in a bad way, it's just the last version seemed a bit too spongy for my liking. Great improvement all way around, so I ordered one off of Amazon along with an UAG tough case, I don't know what it is me and tough cases but I love them and I also got the docking station.
This is what I meant about the keyboard now connecting at a angle;
Here is what the UAG tough case looks like;
Adding from my post above, here is what I meant about a good angle for drawing and using Photoshop;
The docking station, which I will defiantly use my MS Wedge keyboard and mouse with, along with one of NEC 29" monitors until I can get another Lenovo ThinkVision 4K touch monitor;
Everything you see above can be had for about 2,400, including the i7, 8GB, 256GB, Surface Pro 3 model, not bad if you ask me.
The problem with the SP3 is the poor home button placement. I know I've seen that it inhibits drawing because you keep brushing against it with your hand.
I know MS was supposedly working on a software control to fix that but I don't know if they've finished it.
Not sure what accounting you're familiar with. Revenue minus costs equals profit/loss. Microsofts costs here are higher than their revenue, so that's a loss...
It all depends on how costs and revenues are tabulated. R&D is placed in a whole other column in real world accounting.
Look it up. Others on here can explain it better than I (Anan) but I understand the simplified version of the procedure.
They aren't even close to doing everything a desktop does.
Yes, but for 99% of people they do enough. That's why most people have stopped buying desktops and buy laptops.
There's a place for the iPad as well there, I think. Apple doesn't even need to provide a keyboard, they only need to do a bigger screen and those who need a keyboard will buy it separately. Most apps on OS X are already touch ready : look at the Messages app, simply add a virtual keyboard and it works.
Add to that -- we have not yet seen a blueprint of the A8X chip ... 3 CPU cores seems a bit odd ...
It may seem odd but that is only because of what you are use to. Due to the low power requirements though adding but one core actually makes a lot of sense.
Please amplify ... Would a 3rd core be used to augment the 2 existing cores for general processing; set aside to working [when needed] with another chip, say, a DSP, for video encoding; or for some other process ...
It is interesting that we having seen a tear down yet of the iPad and the resultant look at the core of the A8X. Make me wonder what is taking so long here. However the interesting thing with the A8 was how much of the chip area was taken up with logic that has not been identified yet. This is not area dedicated to the compute units which is easy to identify. Given that it is pretty obvious from the photos we do have of the A8 that the CPU cores take up little actual space on the die.
Yeah, I get the impression that something is being hidden right in front of our face!
It could be that the Pro iPad uses a more robust A8X or even 2 A8X chips ... or early A9X chips ...
They could just bump up the clock rate. Faster RAM or enhanced cache areas could also help performance with out going into an extensive redesign. The point here is that A8X might already be good enough for iPad Maxi.
Your cache comment is interesting ... that's SRAM isn't it?
i kind of doubt that Apple would do two A8X chips in this device. Mainly because software doesn't currently support such implementations well. I'm doubting that the A8X can support SMP type multi chip installations.
The thing that makes 2 APU chips attractive is their low cost to Apple -- even if one were dedicated to running system software in support of certain types of operations -- may be more applicable to a new AppleTV / Gaming console.
And what happened to those rumors that the Lightening connector is capable of supporting USB 3.1?
Good question? I haven't even looked at the specs to know what iPad Air 2 supports.
And, since Apple designed Thunderbolt -- could it be included in an iPad pro?
It certainly could be included. Such a port would allow one to realize a bunch of cool possibilities for a tablet. One of those possibilities would be a docking station that bridges the tablet to the Mac OS world.
Higher speed connections would allow an iPad to be an additional screen to a Mac ... say for digitizer graphics input for CAD, Medicine or Photography ... or as a customizable touch control surface for video editing ...
To an extent that can be done now. Obviously a faster port helps.
I really enjoy reading comments such as yours -- they bring a different perspective and experience set to these forums -- I learn a lot ... and realize that I have much to learn ...
@Wizard69 might want to correct me if i'm wrong about this ...
I did some surfing a while back about x86 code on current Intel chips. To oversimplify what I found:
Current Intel chips do not run x86 CISC code natively.
Rather, they real-time (JIT?) translate it into RISC code which is then executed by the hardware.
RISC is what the ARM chips (and Power Chips) run -- so if Apple (or anyone) could contract the proprietary CISC to RICS translation [hardware? Software?] from Intel -- conceivably, a powerful enough ARM chip could run native x86 code.
Your right, Intel processors translate x86 code to an internal format. Its not JIT because that's software translation and extremely slow in comparison.
This hardware translation can be compared to micro code execution of older processors (one instruction results in several CPU actions) but is more advanced.
You found the underlying reason why ARM processors will ultimately triumph over Intel, because hardware translation takes chip area away and eats power.
AHA! Yes, the hardware is there taking space and power whether needed or not.
Question, wouldn't it be practical to take an x86 app and do a one-time translation to sift the app into the native RISC code -- and store that output for any subsequent execution? a kind of Thin Binary?
The iPad sales have already cannibalized some MacBook Air sales. The high-end 128GB iPad overlaps the low-end 128GB 11" MBA in price, and I'd argue now, performance as well. Apple has made public statements about not worrying about cannibalization. So Tim Cook would disagree with your statement.
Cannibalizing one tiny slice of the product line is not the same as potentially -- and unnecessarily -- jeopardizing the whole line.
As to Cook's comment, I don't expect him to say anything else (similar to how Jobs used to talk about iPods vis-a-vis iPhones).
Technically, but it quickly stinks when you turn the iPad sideways.
I agree, and I have mentioned a few times before that the speakers would be better if placed landscape, since that is how most people will watch media and play many games. Also, landscape would allow the speakers to be placed farther apart, so stereo would be easier to detect.
Been playing with my new baby a bit. Even at very low volume, the speakers are noticeably better than my iPad 2!
You're right that I have never used a Surface. I have seen it at Best Buy a few times, so I do know how it looks in person. I'm no fan of Windows, so right there, that is a big negative against the Surface, at least as far as I'm concerned.
You're comparing the Surface keyboard to typing on an iPad, why not compare it to a Macbook Air or Macbook Pro?
If I need to type something long on my iPad, I'll just pair my Apple bluetooth keyboard.
Your right, I should have compared it to my MacBook Air, it's very comparable now, the older version was a mess, specifically the trackpad, so when I bought the Surface Pro 3 I purposely didn't buy the keyboard since, I use either my MS Wedge or Apple keyboard for everything anyway. One of the doctors here also has a Surface Pro 3 so I asked if I could use it for the day, which he graciously offered. I liked it immediately, especially now that it attaches in a way where it gives it some angle, much more comfortable, the keys are also a lot stiffer, not in a bad way, it's just the last version seemed a bit too spongy for my liking. Great improvement all way around, so I ordered one off of Amazon along with an UAG tough case, I don't know what it is me and tough cases but I love them and I also got the docking station.
@Relic: I can see that the above layouts would be fine some instances -- like sitting around a large table in a board room or meeting room ... But, it would be totally unusable on a small desk, a lap, an airplane table or, correct me if I'm wrong -- on a hospital bed table. (I spent 9 days in hospital in 2009 and tried to use an AluBook 17" ... It was very difficult to use).
Finally, the above shows a minimum obtuse angle vis a vis a potential kb in front of the display ... It's a pretty good angle, but even there, a clamshell laptop can function with the display at an acute angle to the kb -- useful on an airplane (seat in front tilted back) or in hospital where the laptop is on your bed table or torso (slightly above your head).
They're not "targeting" Microsoft. Microsoft's tablets have been trivial in the marketplace. A heavy tablet with reduced battery life, coupled with a slow laptop with a poor keyboard? Worst of both worlds! Charitably: there is a small niche for that. Small is the key word.
The Slate may fail from competition that has better and cheaper solutions. The Slate is expensive compared to the competition.
With that said, the 12" iPad sounds like a niche product that probably isn't needed or wanted by most people. Like the 17" MacBook Pro. Same could be said for all or most iWatches and the Apple Hifi speaker system.
You're outdoing yourself this week with stupid comments.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
What's with the personal attack? Usually you're above that sort of thing. I even remember a member here assuring me in PM's that you're one of the good ones who doesn't attack people. Are you still upset about Tim Cook coming out? Anger is the next step after denial. I guess it'll just take some time for you to work thru it?
EDIT: I just noticed the Y at the end of this poster's name and the low post count. Is this someone pretending to be the real Soli? My apologies to the real Soli if this is the case. Very confusing to see a new screen name combined with a new posting style.
Like 'wisely' friend I really would like a 12" iPad to replace my magazine subscriptions even if it is heavier than an iPad Air 2 who's screen is not large enough for my needs in that department... looking forward to see what Apple comes up with.
@Relic: I can see that the above layouts would be fine some instances -- like sitting around a large table in a board room or meeting room ... But, it would be totally unusable on a small desk, a lap, an airplane table or, correct me if I'm wrong -- on a hospital bed table. (I spent 9 days in hospital in 2009 and tried to use an AluBook 17" ... It was very difficult to use).
Finally, the above shows a minimum obtuse angle vis a vis a potential kb in front of the display ... It's a pretty good angle, but even there, a clamshell laptop can function with the display at an acute angle to the kb -- useful on an airplane (seat in front tilted back) or in hospital where the laptop is on your bed table or torso (slightly above your head).
As I stated in a earlier post the virtual keyboard is also very good, so using it on a airplane wouldn't be a problem. In the hospital I use my little MS Wedge keyboard mostly but the Surface keyboard fits fine on the hospital tray as well, that's the versatility of the Surface, let be tablet mode, laptop or desktop you'll be able to find a comfortable position to do your work in. I'm not saying it makes a better iPad or MacBook but those seeking for a single device it comes pretty darn close.
Me too. I'm tired of almost working styluses on iPad. I get that it's not for everyone,
The aren't for everyone which is probably why Apple would not support a stylus. Beyond that Apple's current Touch technology isn't really designed to support a Stylus. They could certainly update the hardware but I don't see that as a slam dunk as the root mode for operating na iPad is via Touch.
You do understand that when people hope for a stylus-enabled iPad, they aren’t hoping that the stylus will be the only form of touch input, right?
but a Pro version of the iPad is exactly the excuse needed to offer a stylus that is perfect for artists and notetakers.
A Stylus is useless for note taking unless Apple can deliver outstanding hand writing recognition.
You don’t recognise your own handwriting?
A stylus is perfect for note taking, and a requirement if said notes are going to include any kind of diagrams, drawings, charts, complex equations etc.
Styluses are also great for marking-up other documents such as PDFs.
It has the low latency, the beautiful screens, the best most quickly developing software. Just no real stylus or mechanism for accurate sensing of one.
Exactly! The hardware i currently designed to support Touch not Styluses. It would be a major refactoring to bring decent Stylus support to iOS hardware.
You do know the Surface Pro 3 has capacitive multi-touch and a dedicated stylus digitiser? There’s no reason the two can’t co-exist on the same device. Adding proper active pen support to the iPad needn’t have an impact on its capacitive multi-touch.
You do understand that when people hope for a stylus-enabled iPad, they aren’t hoping that the stylus will be the only form of touch input, right?
You don’t recognise your own handwriting?
A stylus is perfect for note taking, and a requirement if said notes are going to include any kind of diagrams, drawings, charts, complex equations etc.
Styluses are also great for marking-up other documents such as PDFs.
You do know the Surface Pro 3 has capacitive multi-touch and a dedicated stylus digitiser? There’s no reason the two can’t co-exist on the same device. Adding proper active pen support to the iPad needn’t have an impact on its capacitive multi-touch.
+1, I've wanted a stylus for the iPad since it was introduced. Don't worry though, once Apple releases one they will change their mind. They always put down technology that Apple doesn't currently offer until they do, then it's the next best thing.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
He won't like them until Apple releases one themselves, it's the nature of the beast here on AI, hate everything that isn't Apple until it is.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
He won't like them until Apple releases one themselves, it's the nature of the beast here on AI, hate everything that isn't Apple until it is.
You've been able to use stylii on the iPad for several years.
Cannibalizing one tiny slice of the product line is not the same as potentially -- and unnecessarily -- jeopardizing the whole line.
As to Cook's comment, I don't expect him to say anything else (similar to how Jobs used to talk about iPods vis-a-vis iPhones).
Why would that be? If Apple makes money selling you the new thing to replace the thing you used to have and still earn a healthy profit margin on the new thing, why would they be concerned if the new thing replaces the old thing? That's progress. I used to have an iPod, a flip phone, and a PDA. Now I just carry an iPhone. That's cannibalization. Apple doesn't care if you listen to music on your iPhone instead of your iPod.
Comments
You're right that I have never used a Surface. I have seen it at Best Buy a few times, so I do know how it looks in person. I'm no fan of Windows, so right there, that is a big negative against the Surface, at least as far as I'm concerned.
You're comparing the Surface keyboard to typing on an iPad, why not compare it to a Macbook Air or Macbook Pro?
If I need to type something long on my iPad, I'll just pair my Apple bluetooth keyboard.
Your right, I should have compared it to my MacBook Air, it's very comparable now, the older version was a mess, specifically the trackpad, so when I bought the Surface Pro 3 I purposely didn't buy the keyboard since, I use either my MS Wedge or Apple keyboard for everything anyway. One of the doctors here also has a Surface Pro 3 so I asked if I could use it for the day, which he graciously offered. I liked it immediately, especially now that it attaches in a way where it gives it some angle, much more comfortable, the keys are also a lot stiffer, not in a bad way, it's just the last version seemed a bit too spongy for my liking. Great improvement all way around, so I ordered one off of Amazon along with an UAG tough case, I don't know what it is me and tough cases but I love them and I also got the docking station.
This is what I meant about the keyboard now connecting at a angle;
Here is what the UAG tough case looks like;
Adding from my post above, here is what I meant about a good angle for drawing and using Photoshop;
The docking station, which I will defiantly use my MS Wedge keyboard and mouse with, along with one of NEC 29" monitors until I can get another Lenovo ThinkVision 4K touch monitor;
Everything you see above can be had for about 2,400, including the i7, 8GB, 256GB, Surface Pro 3 model, not bad if you ask me.
I know MS was supposedly working on a software control to fix that but I don't know if they've finished it.
Not sure what accounting you're familiar with. Revenue minus costs equals profit/loss. Microsofts costs here are higher than their revenue, so that's a loss...
It all depends on how costs and revenues are tabulated. R&D is placed in a whole other column in real world accounting.
Look it up. Others on here can explain it better than I (Anan) but I understand the simplified version of the procedure.
They aren't even close to doing everything a desktop does.
Yes, but for 99% of people they do enough. That's why most people have stopped buying desktops and buy laptops.
There's a place for the iPad as well there, I think. Apple doesn't even need to provide a keyboard, they only need to do a bigger screen and those who need a keyboard will buy it separately. Most apps on OS X are already touch ready : look at the Messages app, simply add a virtual keyboard and it works.
Please amplify ... Would a 3rd core be used to augment the 2 existing cores for general processing; set aside to working [when needed] with another chip, say, a DSP, for video encoding; or for some other process ...
Yeah, I get the impression that something is being hidden right in front of our face!
Your cache comment is interesting ... that's SRAM isn't it?
The thing that makes 2 APU chips attractive is their low cost to Apple -- even if one were dedicated to running system software in support of certain types of operations -- may be more applicable to a new AppleTV / Gaming console.
I really enjoy reading comments such as yours -- they bring a different perspective and experience set to these forums -- I learn a lot ... and realize that I have much to learn ...
AHA! Yes, the hardware is there taking space and power whether needed or not.
Question, wouldn't it be practical to take an x86 app and do a one-time translation to sift the app into the native RISC code -- and store that output for any subsequent execution? a kind of Thin Binary?
Cannibalizing one tiny slice of the product line is not the same as potentially -- and unnecessarily -- jeopardizing the whole line.
As to Cook's comment, I don't expect him to say anything else (similar to how Jobs used to talk about iPods vis-a-vis iPhones).
Technically, but it quickly stinks when you turn the iPad sideways.
I agree, and I have mentioned a few times before that the speakers would be better if placed landscape, since that is how most people will watch media and play many games. Also, landscape would allow the speakers to be placed farther apart, so stereo would be easier to detect.
Been playing with my new baby a bit. Even at very low volume, the speakers are noticeably better than my iPad 2!
If anything, it would be called the iPad Plus.
But without the bending.
@Relic: I can see that the above layouts would be fine some instances -- like sitting around a large table in a board room or meeting room ... But, it would be totally unusable on a small desk, a lap, an airplane table or, correct me if I'm wrong -- on a hospital bed table. (I spent 9 days in hospital in 2009 and tried to use an AluBook 17" ... It was very difficult to use).
Finally, the above shows a minimum obtuse angle vis a vis a potential kb in front of the display ... It's a pretty good angle, but even there, a clamshell laptop can function with the display at an acute angle to the kb -- useful on an airplane (seat in front tilted back) or in hospital where the laptop is on your bed table or torso (slightly above your head).
They're not "targeting" Microsoft. Microsoft's tablets have been trivial in the marketplace. A heavy tablet with reduced battery life, coupled with a slow laptop with a poor keyboard? Worst of both worlds! Charitably: there is a small niche for that. Small is the key word.
The Slate may fail from competition that has better and cheaper solutions. The Slate is expensive compared to the competition.
With that said, the 12" iPad sounds like a niche product that probably isn't needed or wanted by most people. Like the 17" MacBook Pro. Same could be said for all or most iWatches and the Apple Hifi speaker system.
Really? Did you just wake up from a long nap?
You're outdoing yourself this week with stupid comments.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
What's with the personal attack? Usually you're above that sort of thing. I even remember a member here assuring me in PM's that you're one of the good ones who doesn't attack people. Are you still upset about Tim Cook coming out? Anger is the next step after denial. I guess it'll just take some time for you to work thru it?
EDIT: I just noticed the Y at the end of this poster's name and the low post count. Is this someone pretending to be the real Soli? My apologies to the real Soli if this is the case. Very confusing to see a new screen name combined with a new posting style.
@Relic: I can see that the above layouts would be fine some instances -- like sitting around a large table in a board room or meeting room ... But, it would be totally unusable on a small desk, a lap, an airplane table or, correct me if I'm wrong -- on a hospital bed table. (I spent 9 days in hospital in 2009 and tried to use an AluBook 17" ... It was very difficult to use).
Finally, the above shows a minimum obtuse angle vis a vis a potential kb in front of the display ... It's a pretty good angle, but even there, a clamshell laptop can function with the display at an acute angle to the kb -- useful on an airplane (seat in front tilted back) or in hospital where the laptop is on your bed table or torso (slightly above your head).
As I stated in a earlier post the virtual keyboard is also very good, so using it on a airplane wouldn't be a problem. In the hospital I use my little MS Wedge keyboard mostly but the Surface keyboard fits fine on the hospital tray as well, that's the versatility of the Surface, let be tablet mode, laptop or desktop you'll be able to find a comfortable position to do your work in. I'm not saying it makes a better iPad or MacBook but those seeking for a single device it comes pretty darn close.
You do understand that when people hope for a stylus-enabled iPad, they aren’t hoping that the stylus will be the only form of touch input, right?
You don’t recognise your own handwriting?
A stylus is perfect for note taking, and a requirement if said notes are going to include any kind of diagrams, drawings, charts, complex equations etc.
Styluses are also great for marking-up other documents such as PDFs.
You do know the Surface Pro 3 has capacitive multi-touch and a dedicated stylus digitiser? There’s no reason the two can’t co-exist on the same device. Adding proper active pen support to the iPad needn’t have an impact on its capacitive multi-touch.
You do understand that when people hope for a stylus-enabled iPad, they aren’t hoping that the stylus will be the only form of touch input, right?
You don’t recognise your own handwriting?
A stylus is perfect for note taking, and a requirement if said notes are going to include any kind of diagrams, drawings, charts, complex equations etc.
Styluses are also great for marking-up other documents such as PDFs.
You do know the Surface Pro 3 has capacitive multi-touch and a dedicated stylus digitiser? There’s no reason the two can’t co-exist on the same device. Adding proper active pen support to the iPad needn’t have an impact on its capacitive multi-touch.
+1, I've wanted a stylus for the iPad since it was introduced. Don't worry though, once Apple releases one they will change their mind. They always put down technology that Apple doesn't currently offer until they do, then it's the next best thing.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
He won't like them until Apple releases one themselves, it's the nature of the beast here on AI, hate everything that isn't Apple until it is.
Pardon? Apple][ mentioned how he doesn't like hybrid devices that combine multiple things. I found it funny as that's exactly what a smartphone is and we all love those.
He won't like them until Apple releases one themselves, it's the nature of the beast here on AI, hate everything that isn't Apple until it is.
You've been able to use stylii on the iPad for several years.
Why would that be? If Apple makes money selling you the new thing to replace the thing you used to have and still earn a healthy profit margin on the new thing, why would they be concerned if the new thing replaces the old thing? That's progress. I used to have an iPod, a flip phone, and a PDA. Now I just carry an iPhone. That's cannibalization. Apple doesn't care if you listen to music on your iPhone instead of your iPod.