You must be living in a cave if you think that surface line of computers has no traction. Not only has it become very profitable for Microsoft it has sparked a revolution in 2 in 1 devices that have arrived from all manufacturer, including apple (even if their attempt is extremelly por and doomed to fail). The Surface pro 4 and Surface book are in a completely different league to the toy that is the ipad "pro" (should have been called the ipad +) since it still runs a mobile os, has no real ports, lacks simple things like file management and compatibility with the great majority of peripherals, all of which are indispensable to any real professional.
Why would any "real" professional use a surface pro when they could use a more powerful laptop or desktop? Like it or not, people do "real" work on iPads. Maybe not your "real" work but it is "real" work nonetheless. Not all "real" work requires a mouse and desktop UI.
The ?$799 iPad Pro comes with 32GB of internal memory, while the $899 SP4 comes with 128GB. Bit of a difference there
If we're going to talk about accessories, it's worth noting that the Surface Pen (which has a dedicated OneNote button, an eraser and lasts for a 12 months with a single AAAA battery) is included for free, while the Apple Pencil (which is just a fancy stylus and lasts for 12 hours) is an extra $99. Also, the Type Cover (backlit with a glass trackpad and keyboard shortcuts) is $129, with the Smart Keyboard is $169 (no backlight)
Benchmarks don't matter, in this case. Of course the iPad Pro is faster. It doesn't have to run a full desktop OS. I have a phone from 2005 that can load apps faster than the iPad Pro. No big deal
Therefore if you want to put the iPad Pro and SP4 on a level paying field here's what it would look like this
$1350 for the 128GB iPad Pro with Smart Keyboard and Apple Pencil
$1130 for the 128GB (core i5) SP4 with Type Cover and Surface Pen?
Touch is a central feature of the WUA UI framework - just as it for iOS.
The topic of UI layout and usability, is not dependent on the ui framework a developer chooses to use. You can create garbage iOS apps just as easily as you can create a garbage WUA, Win32, or Java application.
I've got 30 years knee deep in windows, unix, very little experience designing in Apple environment.
I'm telling what I see in the real world. I see garbage. Not hypothetical garbage. Real one.
Putting the tools out, if they're even adequate, which remains to be proven, doesn't lead to good software by default.
Why? Because there is little money to be made on the touch side of windows.
No money, no resources, no devs, equals crap software.
I don't deal in theories or maybe's, deal in actual use.
IOS has a huge number of developpers familliar with designing with touch; MS cannot to have to the same anytime soon.
The question is not Surface vs iPad Pro, but whether either is worth the price. Mossberg is correct about the iPad Pro and I think the same applies Surface that, for the general user -- not worth it.
In particular, iOS and the limited inter-connectedness and functionality of the apps is fine for the iPhone and aTV and iPad mini. But, for production-capable devices, such as more recent iPads and certainly the iPad Pro, the whole infrastructure and driving philosophy behind iOS make these devices virtually brain-dead.
Neither the standard iPad nor the iPad Pro should be just bigger iPhones but that is what they are now.
Come on, give me a fracking break. You''re are an intellectually dishonest person. Simple as that.
What is dishonest about accepting that the iPad and the Macbook have use cases that they are more a tuned to. When the iPad first came out people tried to use it for tasks that it was not best at -- because the lightness of the iPad made trying to turn it into something it was not best designed for. The keyboard was added to try and turn the light portable iPad into a full fledged laptop.... The difference is that the new Macbook gives you the small form factor, light environment that many people were shoehorning the iPad into.... a compromise. Things the Macbook is better at are things like spreadsheets, word processing / formatting, software development, etc.
On the other hand if you are constantly in motion, where touch input is better, where you are not typically using it at a desk -- and are not focusing mostly on data entry. People generally fall mostly on one side or mostly on the other side.... Apple has devices for both camps. Areas where the iPad excels are things like inventory control / audit, hospitals / patient records, reading / lectures. Often a keyboard in these environments just get in the way, take the tablet out, disconnect the keyboard, put keyboard back in bag then use the bag... in these cases the keyboard often is more of an annoyance than an advantage and just gets in the way. In fact often having the keyboard becomes a crutch to finding out better ways to handle managing data (i.e. the software that is written is written to handle an existing process as opposed to taking a step back and re-engineering the process to be a stronger fit).
There are of course a few things that fit fine into both camps, but rarely do jobs / usages fit into 50% scenarios. There are always compromises to be made but focusing a device at the 50% / 50% split will actually end up fitting a small minority of overall job use cases.
Eventually IMHO, the iPad and Macbook will not replace each other -- but be seamless extensions of each other if you have both. Where the iPad is an extension of Macbook display, and the iPad is a natural extension as an input device. The problem is that touch is newer and people expect it to be a replacement for other device interactions but touch is almost as foreign in many cases to a natural interface as a mouse is. The problem is that we are still 10+ years away a more natural interface and that will require significant improvements in machine learning / AI. Until we have the computer being able to learn the context as you use or communicate with it, the user interface will not advance to a more natural interface. For example when you speak to someone and want them to do something you don't have to be detailed, you don't have to setup the context, you don't have to do a lot of things because you and the other person know each other, you know the context you know many things... and you can say what you need in a sentence whereas without the learning context you would spend days telling it everything / programming it for processes etc.
In 20 years people will be looking back at how we are using computers and be thinking how backward we really are....
Microsoft makes money not from the consumers. Ordinary consumers don't buy Windows OS, Word, Excel, Office. They copy from friends or office. Thus Microsoft makes most of its money from PC vendors and corporations. To analyze Surface Pro or Surface Book, you need to keep this in mind.
Microsoft makes money not from the consumers. Ordinary consumers don't buy Windows OS, Word, Excel, Office. They copy from friends or relatives. Thus Microsoft makes most of its money from PC vendors and corporations. To analyze Surface Pro or Surface Book, you need to keep this in mind.
There are two major and persistent revenue streams in Microsoft. Windows and Office. Windows makes most of their money from vendors and enterprises - but they would not have that if there was not a demand for Windows from customers.... without customers those vendors would not license Windows. Office is more diverse - and in my opinion better quality than the Windows division (especially Excel and Word) -- they make money from Companies and individuals that want those specific products. I did own 2008 version for Mac, but as of a year or two ago - it really did not make sense for me to continue and get the new version since it is not that important for me (work mostly has OpenOffice documents, and personally I am fine with Pages and Numbers).
So simply stating that it is not the consumers that have chosen it is not actually the reality of the situation....
The question is not Surface vs iPad Pro, but whether either is worth the price. Mossberg is correct about the iPad Pro and I think the same applies Surface that, for the general user -- not worth it.
In particular, iOS and the limited inter-connectedness and functionality of the apps is fine for the iPhone and aTV and iPad mini. But, for production-capable devices, such as more recent iPads and certainly the iPad Pro, the whole infrastructure and driving philosophy behind iOS make these devices virtually brain-dead.
Neither the standard iPad nor the iPad Pro should be just bigger iPhones but that is what they are now.
Huh! That's the whole Unix philosophy, smaller apps with simple functions that integrate, flow into each other. Its a well worn philosophy too, you know, that whole henry ford assembly thing. Actually, in a modern world where most people don't work on the whole thing in one go (if its even the same person touching it), it's Windows monolitic crap that makes no sense.
It makes apps, huge bloaty bugy messes than can't respond swiftly to market needs.
I find it hard to believe that thousands of people grinding away at their jobs day-in and day-out at Apple Inc. could do their jobs with only an iPad Pro and their iPhone.
They likely need full blown OSX computers.
Just a thought, again I don't know and could be totally wrong.
drop the straw man -- nobody believes or has stated that an iPad is going to replace ALL LAPTOPS FOR ALL PEOPLE ZOMG!!! jesus. its remains as Jobs said -- some people need trucks, most people need cars. those of us working in enterprise IT will require trucks for some time to come, duh.
ports? get real. expandable storage? get real. mobile OS? doesn't matter if the apps are there (hint: even MS Office is there). so....get real.?
Congratulations, you just won the "Dumbest comment of the week" award. If you can't see how vital it is for a professional to have ports that allow connection to peripherals (not to mention the obvious ability of being able to plug in a pen drive or external hard drive when needed), or being able to expand the extremely limited storage of the device (yes even 128 gb is limited) or not having to pay a ridiculous amount for more storage. And then you outdo yourself by saying that a mobile OS doesn't matter when you have apps... you seem to not even being able to grasp the difference between a mobile OS and a real OS. Let me give you a clue : File management, proper enterprise security, virtual machine, etc etc.
Congratulations, you just won the "Dumbest comment of the week" award. If you can't see how vital it is for a professional to have ports that allow connection to peripherals (not to mention the obvious ability of being able to plug in a pen drive or external hard drive when needed), or being able to expand the extremely limited storage of the device (yes even 128 gb is limited) or not having to pay a ridiculous amount for more storage. And then you outdo yourself by saying that a mobile OS doesn't matter when you have apps... you seem to not even being able to grasp the difference between a mobile OS and a real OS. Let me give you a clue : File management, proper enterprise security, virtual machine, etc etc.
dude, we've all heard your troll tropes a hundred times -- "No expandable storage!" "No file system!" "It's a toy OS!" your kind has been bemoaning the same old shit for thirty years. and you're wrong, every time.
nobody claims that cars are for every single person on earth. some people need trucks. but if you look at the original Mac, which similar trolls bemoaned as a toy computer lacking in ports, you'll see that it evolved over the years into both cars & trucks...just as iOS and iPad is evolving. the car use case is first.
1. Much bigger and much better display (higher resolution, more color gamut, higher refresh rate)
2. Much faster CPU/GPU
3. Double the RAM
4. Much better speakers
To many those features alone justify the extra $250.
Just for grins, I priced out my useful configuration for the iPad Pro: wifi+cellular, Pen, useable keyboard (Logitech CREATE), and apple care. Before taxes the iPad Pro costs $1426.95.
Just for grins, I priced out my useful configuration for the iPad Pro: wifi+cellular, Pen, useable keyboard (Logitech CREATE), and apple care. Before taxes the iPad Pro costs $1426.95.
for a fair comparison, please do the same w/ a Surface, including a Pen-rival accessory such as a Wacom.
Do any of you actually work in an enterprise? Do you know how much custom software - much of it legacy - a typical large enterprise runs? I work for a fortune 50 company and I can tell you we have hundreds of web applications (probably thousands, but, this just the small part of the company I am aware of) that can't be used on an ipad at all. Sites that require flash or Silverlight or java - or some ie specific behavior. Sure, we are trying to change that with new applications to make them more mobile friently - but, that doesn't do anything for all those hundreds of legacy 1st and 3rd party web applications that are used every day to get real work done. It will take a lot of time and most importantly lots of dollars to convert those legacy apps - making those conversions very much a non-priority for management. And I didn't even mention the hundreds of custom windows desktop applications.
The only users that use iPads are basically management types - who spend the majority of their day in meetings and reading/sending email and looking at dashboards.
Sounds like "basically management types" are way ahead then.
Flash? Silverlight? Java? Oh yeah, something to be real proud of.
The iPad Pro at its current form will greatly outsell the Surface and will again show growth in the iPad revenue. I think these users will love and buy the Pro:
1. Consumption users. The Pro is the ultimate consumption device for Photos, Videos, Streaming, Music, games, and Web. For a mere $250 more than the Air you get a massive awesome screen and awesome sound. Don't forget the adding speed for gaming and video editing.
2. Artist. No brainer with the Pencil and large format.
3. Photographers/Videographers. Large screen is ideal as a mobile device.
4. Basic office/personal use. Email, web, MS office.
But this is only the beginning. With partnerships already in place with Adobe, Microsoft, IBM, and Cisco you can bet your ass we will be seeing a ton of professional Apps being made for the Pro. I'd say in 3 years the Pro will replace the laptop for 90% of users.
All the comments you are making in this thread were the same comments and predictions made when the first iPad was released. Several year later and several models later it hasn't happened and it isn't going to happen here.
It's simple iOS is the limiting factor. Also being faster then a Core M processor is setting the bar fairly low. The iPad Pro is nothing more than a Plus which is why Apple didn't update the iPad Air 2 because there isn't anything in the Pro that couldn't have been put in the Air.
The Pro didn't sell out in preorders or release, you can still get it just about anywhere, if the rumors are true Apple didn't even have more than 2.5 Million on hand and that's with a 40 country release.
The weight of the iPad makes using the light keyboard cover uncomfortable in your lap, the pencil hasn't even been released and you are talking about this taking over laptops, thats a joke, your prediction is about as good as your Apple Watch and stock predictions.
There is no trackpad support and lets not pretend that was Apple trying to make some cutting edge move, force touch came before 3D touch and Apple is making force touch trackpads for the iMac. Clearly Apple isn't trying to get rid of the trackpad, iOS can't support a trackpad, thats the reason why there isn't on on the keyboard, the OS is the limiting factor.
All the comments you are making in this thread were the same comments and predictions made when the first iPad was released. Several year later and several models later it hasn't happened and it isn't going to happen here.
It's simple iOS is the limiting factor. Also being faster then a Core M processor is setting the bar fairly low. The iPad Pro is nothing more than a Plus which is why Apple didn't update the iPad Air 2 because there isn't anything in the Pro that couldn't have been put in the Air.
The Pro didn't sell out in preorders or release, you can still get it just about anywhere, if the rumors are true Apple didn't even have more than 2.5 Million on hand and that's with a 40 country release.
The weight of the iPad makes using the light keyboard cover uncomfortable in your lap, the pencil hasn't even been released and you are talking about this taking over laptops, thats a joke, your prediction is about as good as your Apple Watch and stock predictions.
There is no trackpad support and lets not pretend that was Apple trying to make some cutting edge move, force touch came before 3D touch and Apple is making force touch trackpads for the iMac. Clearly Apple isn't trying to get rid of the trackpad, iOS can't support a trackpad, thats the reason why there isn't on on the keyboard, the OS is the limiting factor.
Your three year prediction is laughable.
Well if the iPad Pro sells 2.5 million units this month.... that is still probably more than half the volume Microsoft has for the Surface in a complete year..... I would consider that a success for a niche product that the iPad Pro was aimed for.
I don't see why anyone would choose to buy a Surface. Makes absolutely zero sense. Its such a horrible touch device because:
1. There are virtually zero touch based Apps on it.
2. The OS is mainly built for mouse/keyboard use.
3. The touch sensor and OS is too small for accurate multi-touch, thus the need for stylus.
If you want a touch interface buy a device that has a touch OS.
If you want to run windows Apps get a laptop or Macbook.
If you want a light device get an ultra book.
I know several people who swear by them for business. They need to be able to demonstrate software at the drop of a hat, and it's really the best option for a tablet with that capability. In this case, they were demonstrating touch software. This is a pretty isolated case, but it's great for those folks.
So now spec-whoring IS acceptable then. Geesh. . .
Oh, that's rich.
Spec whoring is saying you should buy a quad-core device with 4GB RAM because it is "better" than Apple's dual-core device with 2GB RAM, it just is. I mean, it must be, right? 4 is bigger than 2, and 4 is bigger than 2.
People who like the *less powerfully specced* device say that it is more about the experience; and say that, by all accounts, there is something about the less powerful device that actually makes it perform very well thank you very much -- everything is smooth, there is no lag, etc., etc.; maybe its the integration between software and hardware, or between different hardware components that is important.
People who like the *more powerfully specced* device scoff at that notion and say, "impossible", show me the numbers.
So, the people who like the *less powerfully specced* device say, OK, here's some actual numbers that suggest the *less powerful one* really is doing more work, or faster work, in many cases and situations.
And then they get accused of "spec-whoring". Geesh.
Spec, and spec whoring is all about the several big numbers that get put on device packaging or on stickers all over a device. Apple doesn't do that, and very few Apple device users even know the specs of their devices.
Bench mark tests are designed to show precisely how irrelevant the specs are that are touted by the Spec Whores. So, when bench mark tests get appealed to, by either side, it's to cut through the spec-whoring. Geesh. The only ones complain are the ones that have invested themselves in 4 being bigger than 2.
Comments
Why would any "real" professional use a surface pro when they could use a more powerful laptop or desktop? Like it or not, people do "real" work on iPads. Maybe not your "real" work but it is "real" work nonetheless. Not all "real" work requires a mouse and desktop UI.
Ok...
But this article fails to mention some things
Therefore if you want to put the iPad Pro and SP4 on a level paying field here's what it would look like this
Touch is a central feature of the WUA UI framework - just as it for iOS.
The topic of UI layout and usability, is not dependent on the ui framework a developer chooses to use. You can create garbage iOS apps just as easily as you can create a garbage WUA, Win32, or Java application.
I've got 30 years knee deep in windows, unix, very little experience designing in Apple environment.
I'm telling what I see in the real world. I see garbage. Not hypothetical garbage. Real one.
Putting the tools out, if they're even adequate, which remains to be proven, doesn't lead to good software by default.
Why? Because there is little money to be made on the touch side of windows.
No money, no resources, no devs, equals crap software.
I don't deal in theories or maybe's, deal in actual use.
IOS has a huge number of developpers familliar with designing with touch; MS cannot to have to the same anytime soon.
The question is not Surface vs iPad Pro, but whether either is worth the price. Mossberg is correct about the iPad Pro and I think the same applies Surface that, for the general user -- not worth it.
In particular, iOS and the limited inter-connectedness and functionality of the apps is fine for the iPhone and aTV and iPad mini. But, for production-capable devices, such as more recent iPads and certainly the iPad Pro, the whole infrastructure and driving philosophy behind iOS make these devices virtually brain-dead.
Neither the standard iPad nor the iPad Pro should be just bigger iPhones but that is what they are now.
Come on, give me a fracking break. You''re are an intellectually dishonest person. Simple as that.
What is dishonest about accepting that the iPad and the Macbook have use cases that they are more a tuned to. When the iPad first came out people tried to use it for tasks that it was not best at -- because the lightness of the iPad made trying to turn it into something it was not best designed for. The keyboard was added to try and turn the light portable iPad into a full fledged laptop.... The difference is that the new Macbook gives you the small form factor, light environment that many people were shoehorning the iPad into.... a compromise. Things the Macbook is better at are things like spreadsheets, word processing / formatting, software development, etc.
On the other hand if you are constantly in motion, where touch input is better, where you are not typically using it at a desk -- and are not focusing mostly on data entry. People generally fall mostly on one side or mostly on the other side.... Apple has devices for both camps. Areas where the iPad excels are things like inventory control / audit, hospitals / patient records, reading / lectures. Often a keyboard in these environments just get in the way, take the tablet out, disconnect the keyboard, put keyboard back in bag then use the bag... in these cases the keyboard often is more of an annoyance than an advantage and just gets in the way. In fact often having the keyboard becomes a crutch to finding out better ways to handle managing data (i.e. the software that is written is written to handle an existing process as opposed to taking a step back and re-engineering the process to be a stronger fit).
There are of course a few things that fit fine into both camps, but rarely do jobs / usages fit into 50% scenarios. There are always compromises to be made but focusing a device at the 50% / 50% split will actually end up fitting a small minority of overall job use cases.
Eventually IMHO, the iPad and Macbook will not replace each other -- but be seamless extensions of each other if you have both. Where the iPad is an extension of Macbook display, and the iPad is a natural extension as an input device. The problem is that touch is newer and people expect it to be a replacement for other device interactions but touch is almost as foreign in many cases to a natural interface as a mouse is. The problem is that we are still 10+ years away a more natural interface and that will require significant improvements in machine learning / AI. Until we have the computer being able to learn the context as you use or communicate with it, the user interface will not advance to a more natural interface. For example when you speak to someone and want them to do something you don't have to be detailed, you don't have to setup the context, you don't have to do a lot of things because you and the other person know each other, you know the context you know many things... and you can say what you need in a sentence whereas without the learning context you would spend days telling it everything / programming it for processes etc.
In 20 years people will be looking back at how we are using computers and be thinking how backward we really are....
Are you kidding me? ALL SPs are MUCH faster than the shitty iPad's ARM CPU. Stop it with the GeekBench crap.
Microsoft makes money not from the consumers. Ordinary consumers don't buy Windows OS, Word, Excel, Office. They copy from friends or relatives. Thus Microsoft makes most of its money from PC vendors and corporations. To analyze Surface Pro or Surface Book, you need to keep this in mind.
There are two major and persistent revenue streams in Microsoft. Windows and Office. Windows makes most of their money from vendors and enterprises - but they would not have that if there was not a demand for Windows from customers.... without customers those vendors would not license Windows. Office is more diverse - and in my opinion better quality than the Windows division (especially Excel and Word) -- they make money from Companies and individuals that want those specific products. I did own 2008 version for Mac, but as of a year or two ago - it really did not make sense for me to continue and get the new version since it is not that important for me (work mostly has OpenOffice documents, and personally I am fine with Pages and Numbers).
So simply stating that it is not the consumers that have chosen it is not actually the reality of the situation....
The question is not Surface vs iPad Pro, but whether either is worth the price. Mossberg is correct about the iPad Pro and I think the same applies Surface that, for the general user -- not worth it.
In particular, iOS and the limited inter-connectedness and functionality of the apps is fine for the iPhone and aTV and iPad mini. But, for production-capable devices, such as more recent iPads and certainly the iPad Pro, the whole infrastructure and driving philosophy behind iOS make these devices virtually brain-dead.
Neither the standard iPad nor the iPad Pro should be just bigger iPhones but that is what they are now.
Huh! That's the whole Unix philosophy, smaller apps with simple functions that integrate, flow into each other. Its a well worn philosophy too, you know, that whole henry ford assembly thing. Actually, in a modern world where most people don't work on the whole thing in one go (if its even the same person touching it), it's Windows monolitic crap that makes no sense.
It makes apps, huge bloaty bugy messes than can't respond swiftly to market needs.
drop the straw man -- nobody believes or has stated that an iPad is going to replace ALL LAPTOPS FOR ALL PEOPLE ZOMG!!! jesus. its remains as Jobs said -- some people need trucks, most people need cars. those of us working in enterprise IT will require trucks for some time to come, duh.
but my family only need cars.
ports? get real. expandable storage? get real. mobile OS? doesn't matter if the apps are there (hint: even MS Office is there). so....get real.?
Congratulations, you just won the "Dumbest comment of the week" award. If you can't see how vital it is for a professional to have ports that allow connection to peripherals (not to mention the obvious ability of being able to plug in a pen drive or external hard drive when needed), or being able to expand the extremely limited storage of the device (yes even 128 gb is limited) or not having to pay a ridiculous amount for more storage. And then you outdo yourself by saying that a mobile OS doesn't matter when you have apps... you seem to not even being able to grasp the difference between a mobile OS and a real OS. Let me give you a clue : File management, proper enterprise security, virtual machine, etc etc.
dude, we've all heard your troll tropes a hundred times -- "No expandable storage!" "No file system!" "It's a toy OS!" your kind has been bemoaning the same old shit for thirty years. and you're wrong, every time.
nobody claims that cars are for every single person on earth. some people need trucks. but if you look at the original Mac, which similar trolls bemoaned as a toy computer lacking in ports, you'll see that it evolved over the years into both cars & trucks...just as iOS and iPad is evolving. the car use case is first.
dumbest comment award? try your 5-post history.
iPad Air2 128GB $699
iPad Pro 128GB $949
So what do you get for an additional $250?
1. Much bigger and much better display (higher resolution, more color gamut, higher refresh rate)
2. Much faster CPU/GPU
3. Double the RAM
4. Much better speakers
To many those features alone justify the extra $250.
Just for grins, I priced out my useful configuration for the iPad Pro: wifi+cellular, Pen, useable keyboard (Logitech CREATE), and apple care. Before taxes the iPad Pro costs $1426.95.
for a fair comparison, please do the same w/ a Surface, including a Pen-rival accessory such as a Wacom.
Sounds like "basically management types" are way ahead then.
Flash? Silverlight? Java? Oh yeah, something to be real proud of.
The iPad Pro at its current form will greatly outsell the Surface and will again show growth in the iPad revenue. I think these users will love and buy the Pro:
1. Consumption users. The Pro is the ultimate consumption device for Photos, Videos, Streaming, Music, games, and Web. For a mere $250 more than the Air you get a massive awesome screen and awesome sound. Don't forget the adding speed for gaming and video editing.
2. Artist. No brainer with the Pencil and large format.
3. Photographers/Videographers. Large screen is ideal as a mobile device.
4. Basic office/personal use. Email, web, MS office.
But this is only the beginning. With partnerships already in place with Adobe, Microsoft, IBM, and Cisco you can bet your ass we will be seeing a ton of professional Apps being made for the Pro. I'd say in 3 years the Pro will replace the laptop for 90% of users.
All the comments you are making in this thread were the same comments and predictions made when the first iPad was released. Several year later and several models later it hasn't happened and it isn't going to happen here.
It's simple iOS is the limiting factor. Also being faster then a Core M processor is setting the bar fairly low. The iPad Pro is nothing more than a Plus which is why Apple didn't update the iPad Air 2 because there isn't anything in the Pro that couldn't have been put in the Air.
The Pro didn't sell out in preorders or release, you can still get it just about anywhere, if the rumors are true Apple didn't even have more than 2.5 Million on hand and that's with a 40 country release.
The weight of the iPad makes using the light keyboard cover uncomfortable in your lap, the pencil hasn't even been released and you are talking about this taking over laptops, thats a joke, your prediction is about as good as your Apple Watch and stock predictions.
There is no trackpad support and lets not pretend that was Apple trying to make some cutting edge move, force touch came before 3D touch and Apple is making force touch trackpads for the iMac. Clearly Apple isn't trying to get rid of the trackpad, iOS can't support a trackpad, thats the reason why there isn't on on the keyboard, the OS is the limiting factor.
Your three year prediction is laughable.
Everyone should read this and then comment.
http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2015/11/7/mobile-ecosystems-and-the-death-of-pcs
All the comments you are making in this thread were the same comments and predictions made when the first iPad was released. Several year later and several models later it hasn't happened and it isn't going to happen here.
It's simple iOS is the limiting factor. Also being faster then a Core M processor is setting the bar fairly low. The iPad Pro is nothing more than a Plus which is why Apple didn't update the iPad Air 2 because there isn't anything in the Pro that couldn't have been put in the Air.
The Pro didn't sell out in preorders or release, you can still get it just about anywhere, if the rumors are true Apple didn't even have more than 2.5 Million on hand and that's with a 40 country release.
The weight of the iPad makes using the light keyboard cover uncomfortable in your lap, the pencil hasn't even been released and you are talking about this taking over laptops, thats a joke, your prediction is about as good as your Apple Watch and stock predictions.
There is no trackpad support and lets not pretend that was Apple trying to make some cutting edge move, force touch came before 3D touch and Apple is making force touch trackpads for the iMac. Clearly Apple isn't trying to get rid of the trackpad, iOS can't support a trackpad, thats the reason why there isn't on on the keyboard, the OS is the limiting factor.
Your three year prediction is laughable.
Well if the iPad Pro sells 2.5 million units this month.... that is still probably more than half the volume Microsoft has for the Surface in a complete year..... I would consider that a success for a niche product that the iPad Pro was aimed for.
I don't see why anyone would choose to buy a Surface. Makes absolutely zero sense. Its such a horrible touch device because:
1. There are virtually zero touch based Apps on it.
2. The OS is mainly built for mouse/keyboard use.
3. The touch sensor and OS is too small for accurate multi-touch, thus the need for stylus.
If you want a touch interface buy a device that has a touch OS.
If you want to run windows Apps get a laptop or Macbook.
If you want a light device get an ultra book.
I know several people who swear by them for business. They need to be able to demonstrate software at the drop of a hat, and it's really the best option for a tablet with that capability. In this case, they were demonstrating touch software. This is a pretty isolated case, but it's great for those folks.
So now spec-whoring IS acceptable then. Geesh. . .
Oh, that's rich.
Spec whoring is saying you should buy a quad-core device with 4GB RAM because it is "better" than Apple's dual-core device with 2GB RAM, it just is. I mean, it must be, right? 4 is bigger than 2, and 4 is bigger than 2.
People who like the *less powerfully specced* device say that it is more about the experience; and say that, by all accounts, there is something about the less powerful device that actually makes it perform very well thank you very much -- everything is smooth, there is no lag, etc., etc.; maybe its the integration between software and hardware, or between different hardware components that is important.
People who like the *more powerfully specced* device scoff at that notion and say, "impossible", show me the numbers.
So, the people who like the *less powerfully specced* device say, OK, here's some actual numbers that suggest the *less powerful one* really is doing more work, or faster work, in many cases and situations.
And then they get accused of "spec-whoring". Geesh.
Spec, and spec whoring is all about the several big numbers that get put on device packaging or on stickers all over a device. Apple doesn't do that, and very few Apple device users even know the specs of their devices.
Bench mark tests are designed to show precisely how irrelevant the specs are that are touted by the Spec Whores. So, when bench mark tests get appealed to, by either side, it's to cut through the spec-whoring. Geesh. The only ones complain are the ones that have invested themselves in 4 being bigger than 2.